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Who really caused the government shutdown?
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Nov 24, 2013 11:13:52   #
Bigmac495 Loc: Indiana
 
Not-a-RINO wrote:
To them and the Democrat Party, they rely on dumb people - the dumber, the better. Go into any major inner-city where the graduation rates are 30% or less and you will see who has a lock on the electorate (around 96% Democrat);

If you vote Democrat, you don't have to be dumb, just gullible enough to believe the leadership's line of crap and lazy enough to not verify their claims;

If you vote Democrat, you don't have to be dumb, but you won't bite the hand that feeds you. The Democrat Welfare Plantation provides a great existence if you turn a blind eye to blight, gangs, crime, murder, drugs, illegitimacy, corruption, deplorable schools and misery. You teach your kids how to access the welfare rolls instead of teaching them to reach for the ladder of success. Schools could be deplorable, but you know you don't have to have a PHd to fill out the forms to get free housing, food stamps, medical, etc.

If you vote Democrat, you could be a member of the uber-wealthy class of people and/or a member of the academe. Somehow in your twisted view of the world, you think someday you will be appointed as one of the taskmasters who will help the government control the masses. You teach young people a world-view based on communism where everyone is equal, America is evil and the god of big government knows best for society.

If you have voted Democrat in the past and have come to realize you have been played for being a fool, you will find many Republicans and Tea Party members who would welcome you to their meetings. Chances are many of the people who welcome you at the door have done the same thing as you, but came to understand they were taught a failed mindset which not only destroys families, it also wrecks communities and our country. You can help them change things for the better (most polls show some 80% or more believe we are headed in the wrong direction).
To them and the Democrat Party, they rely on dumb ... (show quote)


Couldn't agree more with you ! And this is one of those things that is not going away if you ignore it !

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Nov 24, 2013 11:24:30   #
Bigmac495 Loc: Indiana
 
faithistheword wrote:
You mean like the democrats now want barry to do?? Sorry, but we're not the paranoid, delusional ones in this mess.


Hey Bluejacket! How is Obama care going ? It only cost a few hundred billion dollars so far . That's hundreds of billions of our dollars , the government has no job that makes them money !
Somebody is going to pay that money and it's not the government !
Maybe that's why the House didn't want to fund ACA .
Wait until that trillion dollar's worth of taxes in the ACA bill takes effect . Eventually that will come out of your pocket also . Nothing is free , especially when it comes from the government.

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Nov 24, 2013 11:48:24   #
Bigmac495 Loc: Indiana
 
Blue jacket ! What world have you been living on ?
The ACA in one state has insured a few people at a cost of over 1 million dollars per person !
ACA is a middle man added in between you and your insurance companies , the same insurance companies you are using right now if you have any insurance !

And you are praising this Affordable Care Act . Jobs are so great now ? How many are government jobs not are not creating any tangible products?
How many people are out of work that are not counted any more because they have ran out of unemployment !
Groceries (if you go to the stores) are skyrocketing , but our government says the cost of living is NOT going up ! Why is that ?
A few years ago they decided that Gasoline and Groceries would not be counted in the Cost Of living Index !
I just don't see us going in the right direction and about 80% of the rest of the people don't either .

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Nov 24, 2013 14:37:35   #
Bigmac495 Loc: Indiana
 
maelstrom wrote:
A budget does not originate in the white house, it goes through the office of Management and budget, and Government of Accountability Office,and the congressional office.

The Constitution designates the “power of the purse” as a function of Congress.1 That includes the authority to create and collect taxes and to borrow money as needed.


maelstrom : F.Y.I. Thomas law Library

In H.R. 1654.IH - Section 201 Revision of Section 300 , Budget Act of 1974 is amended as follows:
" On or before the 1st Monday of February the President submits budget recommendations to the Congressional Budget Office " .
It goes from the Budget Office to a Budget Committee and from the Budget Committee to the House to act on .

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Nov 24, 2013 14:59:59   #
faithistheword
 
bluejacket wrote:
I am going to explain this to you in a reasonable way , one there are more people working now than any time since the crash of 2008 , the economy is much better than since that time, yes the ACA has some glitches on the internet but other means are working and all aspects are getting better , the ACA is the only plan put forward that allowed the uninsured access to health insurance , 44 million were priced out of the market , and those freeloaders you mentioned over 90 percent of them have jobs and a goodly percentage have two jobs so they are not freeloaders just poor. Even now it looks as though the ACA is containing costs and is accelerating enrollment , in a year or better it will be running fairly smoothly , so please gentle down your words
I am going to explain this to you in a reasonable ... (show quote)




1. It's still a bloody mess, and always will be.
2. The actual unemployment rate is about 16%, when factoring in all the people who have given up, and the people who were cut to part-time.
3. We HAD the best Health Care system in the world before this debacle. If you were uninsured, you still got taken care of.
4. obamacare will never work without breaking the back of the American public. PERIOD!!

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Nov 24, 2013 16:35:17   #
comcash1 Loc: the UK
 
Hello there Dave....


Be advised here that based on the strong
verbal recommendation of Obama's office
aide and close friend, Varlier Jarrett, that
Obama and Harry Reid created and forced
the recent gov't shutdown to punish the
republicans and american ciitzens.It was
Valerie Jarriett who advised the Obama
'not to negociate' with the republicans on
anything.


As president..Obama is fully out of his
league and incompetent.He has no clue
what he's doing.Valeri Jarrett is well
connected in nationwide politics & global
finance and is the actual 'power person'
behind Obama.


WND.com recently found out and confirmed
thru their sources that the Obama is secretly
gay but is legally married to Michelle to be
able to become POTUS. WND.com has the
goods & the 'stink' on Obama.You can read
all the dirt & stink on Obama & Michelle
@ wnd.com. The american citizens will be
able to take back their country and their
gov't thru the coming 3yr 2nd revolution..
starting in 2014.



regards,
Mr Scott
The MoneyWorkz [tm]
E2 Systems LLC [tm]
usa
comcash1@gmail.com






















Dave wrote:
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/al-franken-we-have-consider-extending-deadline-mandate_768090.html

Remember when the House passed a CR that extended the mandate but Obama and Reid wouldn't even discuss it.

They were bound and determined to foist this debacle on the American public, confident that enough of us were dumb enough to not be able to connect the dots.

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Nov 24, 2013 16:39:56   #
bmac32 Loc: West Florida
 
http://money.cnn.com/2009/01/09/news/economy/jobs_december/

Who controlled Congress, democrats both House and Senate since 2006. Yes Bush signed it but troops needed to be funded, now you talk about holding a president hostage. The Dodd-Frank bill ended up being the problem.

Some glitches, the whole damn thing is one bog glitch.

It should well contain costs, people are paying through the nose that can afford it.


bluejacket wrote:
I am going to explain this to you in a reasonable way , one there are more people working now than any time since the crash of 2008 , the economy is much better than since that time, yes the ACA has some glitches on the internet but other means are working and all aspects are getting better , the ACA is the only plan put forward that allowed the uninsured access to health insurance , 44 million were priced out of the market , and those freeloaders you mentioned over 90 percent of them have jobs and a goodly percentage have two jobs so they are not freeloaders just poor. Even now it looks as though the ACA is containing costs and is accelerating enrollment , in a year or better it will be running fairly smoothly , so please gentle down your words
I am going to explain this to you in a reasonable ... (show quote)

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Nov 25, 2013 08:21:34   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
bluejacket wrote:
if the republicans had not added defunding the ACA to the appropriations bill this whole dust up would have never happened , so use basic logic not paranoid delusion


You are obviously minimally informed. The first CR defunded the ACA. The one I'm talking about was an offered compromise and did fund the ACA but only wanted a delay in the individual mandate.

You need to widen your sources to avoid indoctrination and obtain information.

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Nov 25, 2013 08:22:30   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
bluejacket wrote:
chief I know I am not the only one who posts here that understands causal effect relationships , and this causal relationship is so obvious , why can't people see it and why deny it


Interesting that you see yourself being minimally informed as some kind of advantage.

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Nov 25, 2013 08:26:30   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
RetNavyCWO wrote:
It looks like you are completely unaware that under the ACA, insurance companies must spend at least 80% of all premiums collected on actual health care. If they don't, they must refund excess premiums to the insureds. In 2011, they refunded $1.1 billion. In 2012, they refunded over $500 million (because they adjusted their rates to avoid having to repay so much).

"Absurd profits" are what the industry used to be able to make BEFORE ACA. Back then, the average annual increase in health insurance premiums was more than 9%. That was one of the reasons for ACA in the first place!
It looks like you are completely unaware that unde... (show quote)


How do you define "absurd profits" ?

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Nov 25, 2013 08:29:21   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
RetNavyCWO wrote:
I like some of those ideas, such as tort reform and tax-deductible premiums for individuals (employer plans that cover most Americans are already tax-deductible). Crossing state lines doesn't help much; health insurance is priced based on state morbidity risks. Companies would just have to price for all states and even counties. OR raise everyone's premiums. Increasing HSA's helps mostly those with high incomes who want another tax-free account to stash money in; doesn't help the poor or middle class much. Subsidizing premiums for the working poor is a good idea. But,

Where are the provisions that don't deny coverage for pre-existing conditions?

Where are the provisions that allow "children" to stay on their parents' plans until age 26?

Where are the provisions that limit insurance companies' profits and expenses to 20%?

Where are the provisions that require insurance companies to refund excess premiums to the insureds?

Where are the unlimited caps on what policies will pay?

Put all those things together, and maybe we would have something as good as or better than Obamacare. Maybe Republicans should propose legislation to make those changes to Obamacare. No? Oh, that's right. Republicans are only interested if they can make themselves look good by repealing Obamacare. They have little interest in actually helping American citizens by continuing those provisions that do so.
I like some of those ideas, such as tort reform an... (show quote)


Obamacare does not allow 20% profit- it requires 80% to be spent on healtcare - and confines SGA and profits to 20% - as a retired military guy I can understand you not knowing the difference, but for one to believe restricting profits for any business to any number being a government function one needs to favor socialism over markets economics.

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Nov 25, 2013 08:31:15   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
RetNavyCWO wrote:
The House had no reason to tack on repealing Obamacare to the CR in the first place. It was all just political theater by the Tea Party, and Boehner didn't have the cajones to stop them.


The House has the authority to pass whatever the majority wants to - just like it did when Democrats were the majority.

As to political theater, as a retired military I'd think using the families of those KIA for political theater by Obama would be more than a little disgusting to you.

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Nov 25, 2013 08:37:48   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
jdavisnburton wrote:
It seems as though you are trying to reason with people who are unreasonable.
Their objective is to heap as much criticism on the president (and everyone who supports ACA), and hope that they can eventually move legislation to get their repeal.


It takes recognition of facts in order to reason -and denial of fact hardly supports reason. The House did pass a CR that defunded the ACA. When Reid and Obama ignored it, they passed another. In that, they funded the ACA but delayed the individual mandate. Reid and Obama refused to consider it. Now it is apparent that thier position was either based on ignorance or politics.

See, I'm just trying to reason with complete information - hope that helps you

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Nov 25, 2013 08:38:40   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
jdavisnburton wrote:
. . .-that's because you refuse to consider all of the facts.
It's called being unreasonable, and it indicates that your motives are less than honorable.


I suspect it is you who lacks a complete set of facts

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Nov 25, 2013 08:40:34   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
bluejacket wrote:
the primary reason for the shut down was the issue with the ACA and if you refuse to realize that you should study cause and effect , if the republicans had not added defunding the ACA , and left the defunding issue out there would have been no problem , and to think otherwise is not facing reality


Again, you are missing the very important fact that subsequent votes by the House did exactly that - it funded the ACA but included a one year delay on the individual mandate. Are you ignoring that fact out of ignorance or for a purpose.

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