Ve'hoe

And you are a moron who cant keep your own drivel separated,,,, the Hyppocratic oath says nothing about being bilked out of your money by bureaucrats you left wing i***t. Stick to the point if your limited intelligence allows, which it apparently doesn't. Empathy??? How many lives have you save dimwit???
I know you are an i***t, from your lack of logic, subordination and parallel thought,, what else is there about you that is remarkable??? Certainly nothing that you have revealed here.

Here is the hypocratic oath,,, please outline your ridiculous points so that I can more accurately tell you what an imbecilic ass you are:

I swear by Apollo, the healer, Asclepius, Hygieia, and Panacea, and I take to witness all the gods, all the goddesses, to keep according to my ability and my judgment, the following Oath and agreement:

To consider dear to me, as my parents, him who taught me this art; to live in common with him and, if necessary, to share my goods with him; To look upon his children as my own brothers, to teach them this art; and that by my teaching, I will impart a knowledge of this art to my own sons, and to my teacher's sons, and to disciples bound by an indenture and oath according to the medical laws, and no others.

I will prescribe regimens for the good of my patients according to my ability and my judgment and never do harm to anyone.

I will give no deadly medicine to any one if asked, nor suggest any such counsel; and similarly I will not give a woman a pessary to cause an a******n.

But I will preserve the purity of my life and my arts.

I will not cut for stone, even for patients in whom the disease is manifest; I will leave this operation to be performed by practitioners, specialists in this art.

In every house where I come I will enter only for the good of my patients, keeping myself far from all intentional ill-doing and all seduction and especially from the pleasures of love with women or men, be they free or s***es.

All that may come to my knowledge in the exercise of my profession or in daily commerce with men, which ought not to be spread abroad, I will keep secret and will never reveal.

If I keep this oath faithfully, may I enjoy my life and practise my art, respected by all humanity and in all times; but if I swerve from it or violate it, may the reverse be my life.

permafrost Loc: Minnesota

It is a fine oath, in any of its forms...While it has no legal binding it must have a strong hold on the ethics of all those who have taken it...I now believe your concern with the ACA is that it may decrease the amount of money you can receive, and that is common..I believe the ACA will get ironed out and be the norm for our nation..About me, your right, little of note..USMC vet. Nam combat, college grad, U of MN, saved one guy maybe, he was drowning but may of made it without me..never been in the life saving biz..Now a retired guy who had my own biz, live a very nice life, 45 acres on a Minnesota lake...comfortable..It is seldom I toss a rant on this forum, I find it entertaining and interesting, injoy the levels of opinion... I am sorry that I gave in to name calling and insults..It is a poor reflection on myself...enjoy and have a good night...

Ve'hoe

And about me,,, 10 years acvtive in the marine corps (Combat arms not medical) where I saved 4 lives 2 heart attacks and 2 strokes,,, delivered one baby in the PI, and evacuated the palace during c**ps, and evac'd civlians during Pinatubo,,,,, back to the states to 2 hurricanes, another volcano and the la r**ts,,,, then over to the AF after getting my medical degree in the early 90's and incurring $150000 educational debt which I have paid on for 14 years and still owe $150000. After that I went to Iraq and Afghanistan twice, where I saved more lives,,including Iraqi civilians and afghans. Then I returned home and had 2 more stroke victim saves at lowes and one in the mall,,, my motivation has never been money, and I resent the insults that, that is all I am about,, that is beneath you or should be. I gave up my rather lucrative practice to go back to war as a combat arms guy because that is what I was trained as,,, I have "given" a lot to this nation, and all I ask in return is the ability to EARN what I need to pay my way,,, the ACA is robbing me and making sure that I don't make the money I deserve, and yet wont reduce what I owe,,, how is that a good deal? How does that make me mean spirited and petty? HMMMMM??? Jarhead?

Hungry Freaks

The first four I don't quite understand-"your and you insurance companies attempt at "price fixing" is really a hard one to decipher. Number two is equally incoherent so a reply is difficult. And what is the "the cost of your excess"? What in the world are you talking about?

yes i was drafted but where do you get the quotes on 'forced to defend the country?'' I've never said that and don't believe it. What I did, and what the US military did, in Vietnam in no way defended the country. I fought to defend the marines I served with, men whose boots you are not worthy to clean.

I fought under two Commanders in Chiefs-Johnson and Nixon. I was wounded in the A Shau Valley in February 1969 where the 9th marines attacked, took every objective we were ordered to and left it for the NVA to re-occupy within weeks, if not days. I still have less than full function of my left hand and shrapnel in my left arm and body from where a Chinese potato masher grenade landed near me and my platoon leader and I attempted to throw it back. I also have a Silver Star for that act of of desperate survival instinct.

And you must not know all that much about how we got into Vietnam-through a plan devised by the Dulles boys under Ike Eisenhower, a plan warily followed by Kennedy and blindly escalated by Johnson. Nixon stalled our pullout for four years, during which another 24,000 US soldiers and marines died, so he could announce an October surprise' peace treaty on the eve of the 1972 e******n, a treaty that was the same one offered by the North Vietnamese in 1955 and when Nixon took office in 1969.

You must really be an insensitive jerk to reply in such a manner to a war vet's attempt to engage in honest political dialogue, however much you disagree with my point of view. Don't try and wave the f**g in my face-I've bled for it, albeit as a draftee. And you?

VladimirPee

perm

You sound like an educated person. Now let me try to appeal to that intelligence. How is it possible to insure 30 Million uninsured ( 41.7 after amnesty) add pre-existing conditions and other value added items and expect the average family to save $2500 and the deficit doesn't go up? I have always thought this was a dishonest pipedream or a blatant lie and I am being proven correct with each passing moment.

If Obama wanted to simply sell ACA on the moral issue of insuring the uninsured then he should have done it instead of all the lies.

Ve'hoe

That is the problem, I am a war-vet too and that doesn't excuse you from telling the t***h. You need to reply to the falsehoods you have laidout above... also you can read my mil history above,, I too am recovering from surgery to restore full use of my hands from an IED incident,, no I didn't get blown up. And you can shove your insult about not cleaning some jerks boots,,, I volunteered and went nobody had to force me, like they did you, and I didn't lose any wars, like you did.
For the sake of your service I will explain once more but only once more...

1. YOUR insurance is a contract between YOU and the Insurance company,,,, a Doctor (which I am one) doesn't have to accept the terms the two of you agreed to,,, if your care costs more, and he doesn't accept your insurance's deal, you have to pay the rest of the fee,,same will go for ACA unless the govt turns full c*******t and forces the Doctor to accept only what they pay. That is unconstitutional.
2. When you and an insurance company agree on what you two will pay, you are technically price fixing,,,, then the insurance company further takes the medicare rates and insists on paying the "govt rate" which isn't fair either, it is stealing

I will have to go back and read the other two cause I cant see them from here

VladimirPee

As ignorant as a hyper partisan post gets. Ike sent 200 advisors to Vietnam. JFK sent 16,000. LBJ sent 600,000. Nixon did not campaign on immediate complete withdrawal. McGovern did and got his ass kicked. As soon as Nixon took office the troop reductions began and the US Death rate slowed. Nixon ended the Dem war. Period. End of story.

Ve'hoe

3 was covered,,, if the dr doesn't want to take the price that you and the insurance company want to pay, he is free to refuse you service,,,, it appears you don't understand c*******m and think you can make him accept only what you want to pay
4. When that hasn't worked you v**e in a politician who tells you he will give you insurance below even the medicare rates,,, and it will be free,,, but it actually comes out of the taxpayers pockets, which you have demonstrated that you understand..... however, once again just like medicare, if the Dr's don't accept assignment the govt pays a few pennies and you have to pay the rest. What you are trying to do through ACA is to spread the cost of the difference between what you say is fair and what the Doctor demands to my kids and grandkids and that I don't like and wont agree to without a fight.

Besides,,,, if you were truly wounded are you not on VA healthcare??? You get your medical completely paid for do you not??

rumitoid

I posted two threads that support your idea. Some of his biggest supporters are challenging his way of handling things. "Plausable deniability" is no way to govern. Not with all that is going on right now.

Hungry Freaks

1969 was the peak you for KIAs in Vietnam. And read the history-yes, as I said Johnson "blindly escalated" the plan put in place by the Dulles boys-Allan and John Foster if your looking to google them. And so what? the war was a bi-partisan effort-there really not, not now or them, much difference between the two.

Ve'hoe

Do your war injuries prevent you from answering questions and telling the t***h???
I mean you even attributed marx-isms to jesus,,, and just keep on foaming at the mouth....

Answer the points that I called you on,,, you have not been t***hful in your political discussion.

Your medical facts, may be facts but how do they relate to the ACA???? Are you saying that the ACA is going to improve the infant mortality rate???? If so HOW!?!

Ve'hoe

Do your war injuries prevent you from answering questions and telling the t***h???
I mean you even attributed marx-isms to jesus,,, and just keep on foaming at the mouth....

Answer the points that I called you on,,, you have not been t***hful in your political discussion.

Your medical facts, may be facts but how do they relate to the ACA???? Are you saying that the ACA is going to improve the infant mortality rate???? If so HOW!?!

VladimirPee

No actually 1968 was the peak. Dropped down almost immediately



1968

16,899


1969

11,780


1970

6,173


1971

2,414


1972

759


1973

68

Quizzal Loc: TN

Instead of everyone having insurance on their minds, maybe we could think in reverse sometimes (not all of the time). Example-If the doctors and hospitals would reduce their costs, things could be cheaper. If lawyers would reduce their fees (overpriced and a lot unnecessary), things could be cheaper. If medicine was not so costly (do away with all brand names and go generic completely), things could be cheaper. If hospital equipment prices were better (some greed here), things could be cheaper. I somewhat support the cost of science because they help keep us alive. But, if the cost of lawyers, doctors, hospitals, equipment, medicine which should be reduced an awful lot, insurance just might be cheaper (but they are crazy also).

Hungry Freaks

Let me get this straight-

You are a doctor, an MD or DO, who served as a marine for 10 years, not in the navy medical corps. For 10 years. Well, I'm not saying it ain't true, but I never saw anyone called "doc' in the USMC, which, you probably know, doesn't have any medical corps or medics corps. That's the job of the Navy medical corpsmen who served right along side us and who died in copious numbers while trying to save the lives of wounded marines-running right into the incoming without regard for their own personal safety. But, hey, I don't know under what kind of circumstances you served.

And you have the nerve to say to a fellow marine, draftee or not "...your lying dope smoking ass.." Wow, the empathy of the oath is knocking me over. Semper fi to you, too. You call other morons and your writing is at times as coherent as...well not very coherent at all. Where did you do your undergraduate work, anyway?

I've heard doctors complain about insurance companies. I empathize (which you apparent are unable to do) with the way the medical profession has been undermined by insurance companies and the fixing of rates by the companies. Someone or some agency should RICO their butts.

I've also seen good doctors and bad doctors-my GP of 35 years is a great guy who doesn't deal with that many insurance companies and won't let a drug salesman into his office. I don't know what I'm going to do when he retires.

but for every good doctor I've seen a half dozen greedy insensitive jerks who couldn't spell ethics or empathy without wetting his pants in guilt. (I've seen one jerk woman doctor-the others women doctors who have treated me were all great) One guy, while I was hospitalized for multiple operations for an auto accident, would come in my room and shake my hand and ask how I felt. thats it, nothing else. Every day as part of a consult ordered by my orthopedic surgeon. When I was able to get out of my bed, i wheeled myself out to the nurses stations and read my chart-the jerk charged $300 bucks (and this was in the 1980s) for every time he came in and shook my hand. I fired him and called my insurance company to try and have all bills from this guy not paid-we'd all be better off if people weren't so intimidated by doctors.

I'm not saying what type of doctor you are. But from your general attitude-the incoherent writing, the "lying dope smoking ass" thing and calling others moron, etc. I can only guess.

Besides, I got to wonder what kind of doctor has the time to skate around these forums as much as you do. Most doctors I know-the good ones-work six or seven days a week, 10, 12 16 hours a day. They have little interest in cruising the Internet looking to call people names and generally defame there character. Being a good doctor is hard, hard work that few people truly understand, an all consuming passion and a life's vocation that allows little time for anything but being a healer of the human body and mind. Unless your secretary is point for you.

I'm not saying your a good doctor or a bad one, or questioning whether you are a doctor and/or a former marine at all. I'm just saying I gotta wonder.