RockKnutne Loc: Valhöll

Jesus Christ was handed over to Pilate for judgement because he was accused of treason, not because He performed a healing Betta.

Now Jesus stood before the governor. And the governor asked Him, saying, “Are You the King of the Jews?”

Jesus said to him, “It is as you say.” And while He was being accused by the chief priests and elders, He answered nothing.

Then Pilate said to Him, “Do You not hear how many things they testify against You?” But He answered him not one word, so that the governor marveled greatly.

- Matthew 27:11-14

The death and resurrection of Christ was prophesied about in Isaiah and, Jesus fulfilled them by obeying God until death. Jesus suffered because men are evil and this to was foretold about in Isaiah 53:3.

He was despised and forsaken of men, A man of sorrows and acquainted with grief; And like one from whom men hide their face He was despised, and we did not esteem Him.

So in reality, His death was by capital punishment, because the Jewish leadership were conspiring cowards and hypocrites...

"Delivered Him to Pilate: The Jewish leaders took Jesus to Pilate because they did not have the legal right to execute their own criminals."

"There were times when the Jews disregarded this prohibition of the Romans and executed those they considered criminals, such as at the stoning of Stephen (Acts 7:57-60). Yet they did not take things into their own hands regarding Jesus because they knew the multitudes had a favorable opinion of Jesus and if Pilate executed Him, they could distance themselves from the political fallout."

Okay?

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Betta

And you are correct. We can lose our salvation by continuing in r*******n.

Case in point:

I read an article yesterday about the country singer who has come out of the closet. In the same sentence he says his homosexuality is not a sin and that he is a "practicing" Christian. This guy thinks he can sit up in church on Sunday then go home and continue in his homosexuality and God will just accept his continued r*******n.

He thinks he is saved, his salvation will be lost if he doesn't turn from his sin. Yes, God loves him. No, God doesn't want him to perish. But if he thinks God sanctions his homosexuality and continued r*******n, he has already been sorely deceived by his reprobate mind.

Betta

No, okay. One of the reasons they sought to k**l Him was because he performed a healing on the Sabbath. The law was no work on the Sabbath. He healed someone of a disease on the Sabbath and they used it as an excuse against Him. Blasphemy was another reason they conspired to k**l him.

There were many attempts on His life and not all were about treason. All this info and more is in the New Testament.

RockKnutne Loc: Valhöll

You can only NOT receive the gift of salvation by rejecting Jesus Christ. We don't have to keep earning it over and over. What I mean is, a tree is know by the fruit it bears and, our faith causes us to want to repent. We fail quite miserably at this repenting thing, would you not agree?

How many sinless men and women will there be in heaven? If you said only one, you would be correct and, it won't be me or you. Do you claim to have repented from all your sins and now, are justified by works by what you have done?

Come on, I h**e to seem argumentative with a believer but, you make things complicated.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--

- Ephesians 2:8

How many gifts have you earned in your lifetime?

People repent of sin when the Holy Spirit convicts them of it, not you, not Jerry Falwell, only God's Spirit, PERIOD!

Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand.

- Romans 14:4

That pinprick of conviction you might be feeling, it's not from me, okay?

RockKnutne Loc: Valhöll

Jesus was not put to death by the Jews, was I not clear enough about that?

"Are you the King of the Jews?", He was crucified for that or if not, give me your New Testament verse and convince me otherwise...


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Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

Well.... If you read the whole NT instead of what is read to you from the pulpit, you might see a difference in the teachings of Jesus and Saul. And Saul was not that well received with the real apostles of Jesus. Just saying. And his timing .... and how he got himself nominated to replace Judas.... Almost an Obama move!! Also, note who you are quoting....not Mathew, Mark, Luke, John, Simon, Andrew, James...... but who????? Would that be Saul????

Betta

You'd just be arguing with yourself actually. I don't do a back and forth about this. You're not understanding what you're reading or what I'm writing.

We can never be good enough. God is always ready to forgive no matter the vilest thing we do. We can live a Godly life if we choose. Not easy in the least and find we are asking forgiveness daily. I know I do. I mess up and disappoint God every day in something I said, thought or some action I did that was contrary to Him.

I am a sinner who believes in the saving Grace of the Lord Jesus Christ. I have faith and trust in Him implicitly. I don't wait until I'm in trouble to call upon Him. I make sure I have contact with Him each and everyday whether offering up prayer, praising Him or reading His word. Keeps me from going off on folks.

See, I fight the spiritual battle of good and evil every day and it ain't easy. Now, if you want to argue about that then you just go right ahead but, count me out.

Iggy Rat Loc: Lost in America

I think you need to re-read that Book. You misunderstood it.

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

Betta,

Please forgive me for jumping into your discussion.....but, who told you that you are not good enough and you are a sinner or bad. Ponerou is the Greek word most commonly t***slated as wicked, and it refers to those who are willfully bad.... do you get up in the morning planning to do something bad? If not, then you are not wicked. And who on earth told you that you can never be good enough? Whomever that individual is or was is wrong. God is your judge as He is mine. God found many of his people good and righteous, and those people were only humans! So, open your heart and eyes, God loves you, you are good enough, and you can be righteous. You have free will, plan to do good and you will do good. When you make a mistake, accept it ask for forgiveness and don't do it again. Is that not what Jesus taught... go your way and sin no more! It is not that difficult, put your faith in God and stop listening to preachers that make a living from making people feel as though they are worthless sinners.

RockKnutne Loc: Valhöll

First assume nothing about me and we'll get along much better. If you want to get Bible with me, you better log off and go pack a lunch and bring your Bible back with you, understand?

Give me your references ginny, your opinions matter squat to me regarding God's Word! Just sayin'...

So, I should tear out any reference to Jesus made by the Apostle Paul becauseeeeeeeeeeeeee why again?

You're out of your depth lady...

"Paul the Apostle (Greek: Παῦλος Paulos; c. 5 – c. 67), original name Saul of Tarsus (Greek: Σαῦλος Ταρσεύς Saulos Tarseus), was an apostle (though not one of the Twelve Apostles) who taught the gospel of Christ to the first-century world. [b]He is generally considered one of the most important figures of the Apostolic Age. In the mid-30s to the mid-50s, he founded several churches in Asia Minor and Europe. Paul used his status as both a Jew and a Roman citizen to advantage in his ministry to both Jewish and Roman audiences."

"According to writings in the New Testament, Paul was known as Saul before his conversion, and was dedicated to the persecution of the early disciples of Jesus in the area of Jerusalem. In the narrative of the book of Acts, while traveling on the road from Jerusalem to Damascus on a mission to "bring them which were there bound unto Jerusalem", the resurrected Jesus appeared to him in a great light. He was struck blind, but after three days his sight was restored by Ananias of Damascus, and Paul began to preach that Jesus of Nazareth is the Jewish Messiah and the Son of God. Approximately half of the book of Acts deals with Paul's life and works."

I never quoted Saul, that was your first mistake, try again?


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RockKnutne Loc: Valhöll

:shock: :shock: :shock:

Your sins are forgiven, go in peace...

missinglink Loc: Tralfamadore

I am not a biblical scholar by any means but there are some references to god's sanctioning violence in the New Testament as below. My posting was in response to rumitoids blanket final line statement in the original post which reads:
All violence is thoroughly anathema to the kingdom of God--ALL VIOLENCE!
Just thought this statement is an over reach. Nice perspective but not factual.

Example
New Testament:
"Joshua 11:20, 'For it was the Lord himself who hardened their hearts to wage war against Israel, so that he might destroy them totally, exterminating them without mercy, as the Lord had commanded Moses.' "

There are several other New Testament references to violence go here:
http://www.biblica.com/en-us/bible/bible-faqs/why-so-much-war-in-the-old-testament/

RockKnutne Loc: Valhöll

I can answer that ginny, God tells us that.

for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

- Romans 3:23

Hence, the need for a Savior...

Note in Isaiah 64:6 it tells us,

For all of us have become like one who is unclean, And all our righteous deeds are like a filthy garment; And all of us wither like a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, take us away.

Again in Romans it states,

even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction; for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

- Romans 3:22-23

Tell me madam, you seem to be an expert on Christian preachers and where they get their crazy ideas from, tell me where you have previously or where you do now hear them at and, if it's TV I will begin laughing now.

Do you belong to a Christian church, if so which one?

You have no learned Christian teaching I know of but, you're free to ask and I would encourage you to, VERY MUCH!

Coos Bay Tom Loc: coos bay oregon

Nice of you to say this

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RockKnutne Loc: Valhöll

ML, no offense but, all your references are to the Old not New Testaments, okay? That would include your link also.

Pretty much all the accounts of violence in the New Testament can be found in the Book of Revelation. It speaks more to God's impending judgments on the inhabitants of earth than to man v. man conflict. Jesus did tell us in Matthew 5:44,

But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

Government was covered in another comment by me earlier.

God bless!

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