One Political Plaza - Home of politics
Home Active Topics Newest Pictures Search Login Register
Faith, Religion, Spirituality
Is The Lord Making Something We Don't Expect???
Page <<first <prev 5 of 5
Mar 13, 2021 03:08:14   #
Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...
 
The occasion of Tyndale's statement was not Bible translation, the statement occurred as part of the debate about whether the pope or the Bible is the ultimate authority for religious belief and practice.

Upon graduating from Oxford University, Tyndale returned to his native Gloucestershire and assumed the position as the schoolmaster in the Catholic household of Sir John Walsh.

Tyndale was an early Reformer whose views brought him into heated debates with the local clergy. Tyndale was appalled at the ignorance of the Catholic clergy. He was convinced of the Protestant doctrine of sola scriptura on the question of religious authority.

These two things, the biblical ignorance of the Catholic clergy and the question of biblical authority, are the context for Tyndale’s statement about the plowboy.

The subject of debate at this early stage in Tyndale’s career was the question of papal authority vs. scriptural authority. When the priest asserted a strong view of papal authority and denigrated the authority of the Bible, Tyndale responded by making an implied case for the Bible as the authority for Christian belief and conduct.


olegig wrote:
Zemirah "Nowhere does the Bible proclaim that the mysteries Paul revealed in his epistles were being revealed for the very First Time to the exclusion of God, Jesus or other prophets or apostles having already touched upon them, as they are progressively revealed, and certainly not "written in stone" as you insist as your article of faith."
I am not asking for a long-winded explanation of a mystery, the definition of a mystery given by the Lord Jesus Christ through Paul is quite sufficient for His use of the term. If you wish to exclude the writings of Paul from the thoughts of God and Jesus, that's your business; but not I.

But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: 1 Corinthians 2:7 KJV

Once again I ask you to zero in on this one and only mystery found in 1 Cor 15.
Then perhaps you would take a deep breath and explain why contributing John 14 as Jesus revealing the Rapture of the Church does not make Paul a liar when he said he was the first to reveal same.
And then perhaps you might address the Num 14:30 vs Heb 3:16 issue.

If you need help in the above please feel free to consult those scholars who are your trainers.

Zemirah "If you see Biblical contradictions, explain them, with references from respected Church leaders and authors as validation."
Although many have been presented by you, this one of your simplest and most outlandish examples of your condescension.
You sir along with any respected Church leader or validated author are not and never will be my nor the readers priest.
I am quoting from one of the most famous authors on record the Word of God! If you have a problem with validation, your argument is with Him, not me.
Your assumptions are overwhelming of me, your dressing downs are numerous. I am only and simply quoting the words of the KJB, either pronounce it a fake or address it's doctrines.
How about this one:
The most famous statement that Tyndale made about Bible translation, next to his dying prayer that God would open the king of England’s eyes, is a comment that he made about wanting the plowboy to know the Bible better than the Catholic priests.
Zemirah "Nowhere does the Bible proclaim that... (show quote)

Reply
Mar 13, 2021 07:38:51   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
olegig wrote:
But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire. Matthew 5:22 - KJV
And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire. Matthew 18:9 - KJV
And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Mark 9:43 - KJV
And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell. James 3:6 - KJV

Sounds a little hot to me, but of course your definition of fire might be different than mine.
But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with h... (show quote)


"Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire. Matthew 5:22 - KJV
And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire. Matthew 18:9 - KJV
And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Mark 9:43 - KJV
And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell. James 3:6 - KJV"

My point exactly.
olegig; You attempt to take sentences in the Bible literally?
A warning; That is what unbelievers do.

Reply
Mar 13, 2021 07:49:19   #
olegig Loc: Texas panhandle
 
eagleye13 wrote:
olegig; You attempt to take sentences in the Bible literally?
A warning; That is what unbelievers do.


Eagleye13 you seem like a nice unpretentious man who has been caught up in something. I will let you think on your words in reconsideration before commenting.
But let me ask you this: if we do not take the Bible literally as it stands, who or what is our authority?

Reply
 
 
Mar 13, 2021 07:56:17   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
olegig wrote:
Eagleye13 you seem like a nice unpretentious man who has been caught up in something. I will let you think on your words in reconsideration before commenting.
But let me ask you this: if we do not take the Bible literally as it stands, who or what is our authority?


If you want to use the Bible as your authority, I hope for you to understand the words/sentences written, in what context, and for what purpose.
ie; Parables, and symbolisms.
The Parable of the Fig Tree.
Fig Trees, Cedar Trees, etc.

I am not trying to be "arrogant", I just have spent many years of study, looking for truths.

Reply
Mar 13, 2021 08:01:43   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
olegig wrote:
Eagleye13 you seem like a nice unpretentious man who has been caught up in something. I will let you think on your words in reconsideration before commenting.
But let me ask you this: if we do not take the Bible literally as it stands, who or what is our authority?


"But let me ask you this: if we do not take the Bible literally as it stands, who or what is our authority?" - olegig

The Bible of course.
It seems you could use some help in understanding the Word
That takes a lifetime, and some good instruction.

I suggest Shepherd's Chapel for one.

Reply
Mar 13, 2021 08:49:04   #
olegig Loc: Texas panhandle
 
eagleye13 "I am not trying to be "arrogant", I just have spent many years of study, looking for truths.
I suggest Shepherd's Chapel for one."

I do not consider you arrogant at all. You have made shephard's chapel your authority and are honest about it.

What I strongly detest in a man is him claiming one thing while doing the opposite.
One cannot claim to be a Bible believer while totally ignoring the plain reading of their un-chosen scriptures.
They have developed a private theology based on but a few chosen passages, but when scriptures are given in contradiction they simply resort to attacking the messenger while totally ignoring the message.
They are very pharisaical.

Reply
Mar 13, 2021 10:21:08   #
olegig Loc: Texas panhandle
 
Zemirah wrote:
The occasion of Tyndale's statement was not Bible translation, the statement occurred as part of the debate about whether the pope or the Bible is the ultimate authority for religious belief and practice.

Upon graduating from Oxford University, Tyndale returned to his native Gloucestershire and assumed the position as the schoolmaster in the Catholic household of Sir John Walsh.

Tyndale was an early Reformer whose views brought him into heated debates with the local clergy. Tyndale was appalled at the ignorance of the Catholic clergy. He was convinced of the Protestant doctrine of sola scriptura on the question of religious authority.

These two things, the biblical ignorance of the Catholic clergy and the question of biblical authority, are the context for Tyndale’s statement about the plowboy.

The subject of debate at this early stage in Tyndale’s career was the question of papal authority vs. scriptural authority. When the priest asserted a strong view of papal authority and denigrated the authority of the Bible, Tyndale responded by making an implied case for the Bible as the authority for Christian belief and conduct.
The occasion of Tyndale's statement was not Bible ... (show quote)


Your right, Tyndale was not bothered by these modern versions which corrupt the word of God. He was bothered by authority, however the two go hand in hand today.
The question today has become one of scholarship authority vs. scriptural authority. Again and again, over and over you have referred me to various scholars' writings in the hopes of "straightening" me out. No doubt in your own mind you are a member of same scholarly class, however a simple reading of scripture gives you great pause, a stumbling block as it would to all scholars of your liking.
How daring of you.

I have no doubt this discussion as do all discussions will end up at the version controversy just as did Jesus' encounters with the pharisees, the question is and always has been one of authority.
We see in Eze 14 God had given a word to Israel passed through Ezekiel, but the scholars of that day did not like the words of God and asked for an audience with Ezekiel. Ezekiel asked God if he should indulge them to which God answered: go ahead, I will look in their hearts and see who or what is their authority and then spiritually re-enforce their belief in idols.
Has God changed? I think not. Today when a man rejects the Word of God by forming different doctrine, God still gives man re-enforcement to man's destruction.

Ok, let us get back on topic.
Using the version of your choice please show us why if Jesus spoke of the Rapture of the Church it does not make Paul a liar when he said he was the first to speak of the mystery.

Reply
 
 
Mar 13, 2021 14:24:05   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
olegig wrote:
eagleye13 "I am not trying to be "arrogant", I just have spent many years of study, looking for truths.
I suggest Shepherd's Chapel for one."

I do not consider you arrogant at all. You have made shephard's chapel your authority and are honest about it.

What I strongly detest in a man is him claiming one thing while doing the opposite.
One cannot claim to be a Bible believer while totally ignoring the plain reading of their un-chosen scriptures.
They have developed a private theology based on but a few chosen passages, but when scriptures are given in contradiction they simply resort to attacking the messenger while totally ignoring the message.
They are very pharisaical.
eagleye13 "I am not trying to be "arroga... (show quote)


Oh My little little Black Pot
Nothing else to add.
Other than Shepherd's Chapel is just one source.
I kinda get a feeling you may be a preacher yourself.
Any particular denomination?

https://www.onepoliticalplaza.com/t-159872-114.html#

Reply
Mar 13, 2021 15:40:22   #
olegig Loc: Texas panhandle
 
eagleye13 wrote:
Oh My little little Black Pot
Nothing else to add.
Other than Shepherd's Chapel is just one source.
I kinda get a feeling you may be a preacher yourself.
Any particular denomination?


Nope, just one of Tyndale's plowboys who reads and studies the KJB. The problem with commentaries is the author always has an agenda. They freely present scriptures that agree with and support their agenda while neglecting the passages that disagree.
I can give passages that support catholism, church of Christ, fundamentalism, or any other so-called Christian denomination because they are all based in scripture.
The trick is in the proper placement of doctrine to the audience and proper time frame.
As ex: Matt 5:42 where Jesus instructions say to give to everyone whatever they ask. I have encountered many who say Jesus' words in the flesh are doctrine for us today, but they never agree to send me money.
Go figure.....

Reply
Mar 25, 2021 20:52:54   #
Armageddun Loc: The show me state
 
eagleye13 wrote:
Is The Lord Making Something We Don't Expect???

A while back a friend shared a story of a visiting pastor who attended a men's breakfast in the middle of a rural farming area of the country. The group had asked an older farmer, decked out in bib overalls, to say grace for the morning breakfast...


"God, I hate buttermilk", the farmer began...

The visiting pastor opened one eye to glance at the farmer and wonder where this was going...

The farmer loudly proclaimed, "God, I hate lard."...

Now the pastor was growing concerned...

Without missing a beat, the farmer continued, "And God, you know I don't much care for raw white flour."...

The pastor once again opened an eye to glance around the room and saw that he wasn't the only one to feel uncomfortable...

Then the farmer added, "But God, when you mix them all together and bake them, I do love warm fresh biscuits...

So, God, when things come up that we don't like, when life gets hard, when we don't understand what you're saying to us, help us to just relax and wait until you are done mixing...


It will probably be even better than biscuits... Amen.”


Within that prayer there is great wisdom for all when it comes to complicated situations like we are experiencing in the world today...

Stay strong, dear friends, because God is mixing several things that we don't really care for, but something even better is going to come...
Is The Lord Making Something We Don't Expect??? br... (show quote)


Amen

Reply
Mar 26, 2021 09:46:09   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
olegig wrote:
eagleye13 "I am not trying to be "arrogant", I just have spent many years of study, looking for truths.
I suggest Shepherd's Chapel for one."

I do not consider you arrogant at all. You have made shephard's chapel your authority and are honest about it.

What I strongly detest in a man is him claiming one thing while doing the opposite.
One cannot claim to be a Bible believer while totally ignoring the plain reading of their un-chosen scriptures.
They have developed a private theology based on but a few chosen passages, but when scriptures are given in contradiction they simply resort to attacking the messenger while totally ignoring the message.
They are very pharisaical.
eagleye13 "I am not trying to be "arroga... (show quote)


"They are very pharisaical"

I am afraid you being the Black Pot, are calling me a Black Kettle.
You know what Christ had to say about the Pharisees; you best be careful.
BTW;
Are you aware that the Pharisees of Christ's time were impostors.
Not Jewish Hebrews.
They infiltrated the priesthood.
Christ called them Vipers and Snakes.
As I recall; The only ones Christ ever busted for being hypocrites.

Reply
 
 
Mar 27, 2021 10:03:11   #
olegig Loc: Texas panhandle
 
eagleye13 wrote:
"They are very pharisaical"

I am afraid you being the Black Pot, are calling me a Black Kettle.
You know what Christ had to say about the Pharisees; you best be careful.
BTW;
Are you aware that the Pharisees of Christ's time were impostors.
Not Jewish Hebrews.
They infiltrated the priesthood.
Christ called them Vipers and Snakes.
As I recall; The only ones Christ ever busted for being hypocrites.


Well I wouldn't call them impostors, but I agree they twisted and ignored God's word to suite themselves.
Many here should be very glad they are after the cross when God's Grace covers their twisting and ignoring the whole council of God in support of their fundamentalism because the Pharisees were before the cross and on their way to HELL, the outer darkness for their sins.

Seems I use the word "fundamentalist" often, maybe I should define it.
Their are those who take one passage which is the fundamental passage of their treasured religion.
The church of Christ hang their hats on Act 2:38, the Baptist hang onto Eph 2:8, the Roman catholic church hangs its hat on passages from Matthew, James, as well as Hebrews.
The fundamentalist believes their chosen passages speak doctrine to everyone in the Bible and to make that doctrinal application they must twist and ignore unliked scripture.

One should rightly divide the word of truth and give doctrinal instructions to whomever God gives it.

Reply
Mar 27, 2021 10:22:16   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
olegig wrote:
Well I wouldn't call them impostors, but I agree they twisted and ignored God's word to suite themselves.
Many here should be very glad they are after the cross when God's Grace covers their twisting and ignoring the whole council of God in support of their fundamentalism because the Pharisees were before the cross and on their way to HELL, the outer darkness for their sins.

Seems I use the word "fundamentalist" often, maybe I should define it.
Their are those who take one passage which is the fundamental passage of their treasured religion.
The church of Christ hang their hats on Act 2:38, the Baptist hang onto Eph 2:8, the Roman catholic church hangs its hat on passages from Matthew, James, as well as Hebrews.
The fundamentalist believes their chosen passages speak doctrine to everyone in the Bible and to make that doctrinal application they must twist and ignore unliked scripture.

One should rightly divide the word of truth and give doctrinal instructions to whomever God gives it.
Well I wouldn't call them impostors, but I agree t... (show quote)


That is why I have strayed away from any church/Pastor tied to a "church" organization.
It limits them to a teaching of their doctrine.

Reply
Mar 27, 2021 19:59:55   #
olegig Loc: Texas panhandle
 
eagleye13 wrote:
That is why I have strayed away from any church/Pastor tied to a "church" organization.
It limits them to a teaching of their doctrine.

I understand and agree. Just remember each and every verse speaks the truth. All we have to do is discern first is to whom it is addressing doctrinally, then based on the "who" we can discern the when.
Below is an example of timing of application:

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Isaiah 9:6 KJV
Was a child born? Yes
Was a son given? Yes
Is the government on his shoulders? Not yet, but it will be during the coming Millennium Reign.

There can be a dispensational change in the middle of a sentence.
Jesus Himself demonstrated this principle when He read at Luke 4:16 and cut the verse from Isa 61:2 in half.

Reply
Page <<first <prev 5 of 5
If you want to reply, then register here. Registration is free and your account is created instantly, so you can post right away.
Faith, Religion, Spirituality
OnePoliticalPlaza.com - Forum
Copyright 2012-2024 IDF International Technologies, Inc.