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American Christians See A Rapid Decline In Numbers Over Past Decade: Study
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Oct 17, 2019 22:03:37   #
rumitoid
 
Why? Their lack of love for all the world. Speak out against gays but silent on the divorced members of the congregation that tithe. Jesus spoke out against divorce 6xs, not once about homosexuality. Does your pastor ever say this? "Whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery." Of course not, divorce is now as common as eating shellfish or wearing different fabrics to church. And the divorced are accepted into the fold, without question. This is almost as bad as Evangelicals backing Trump, who has proven himself to be a sexual offender in contradiction of the Bible. Christians no longer care about values?

And worse the acceptance of bankers.

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Oct 17, 2019 23:07:56   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
rumitoid wrote:
Why? Their lack of love for all the world. Speak out against gays but silent on the divorced members of the congregation that tithe. Jesus spoke out against divorce 6xs, not once about homosexuality. Does your pastor ever say this? "Whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery." Of course not, divorce is now as common as eating shellfish or wearing different fabrics to church. And the divorced are accepted into the fold, without question. This is almost as bad as Evangelicals backing Trump, who has proven himself to be a sexual offender in contradiction of the Bible. Christians no longer care about values?

And worse the acceptance of bankers.
Why? Their lack of love for all the world. Speak o... (show quote)


There are churches that ban gays from attending?

That is disgusting

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Oct 18, 2019 07:24:39   #
Rose42
 
What study are you referring to?

God did indeed tell us that the act of homosexuality was an abomination. Christ never negated that. The verses are easy to find in both the Old and New Testament. There is no ambiguity.

A church can’t condone its members living in open defiance though we are to encourage them to repent.

Galations 6:1 - Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted.

Matthew 18:15-17 tells us how to deal with sin in the Church.

15 “If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

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Oct 18, 2019 08:07:08   #
Peewee Loc: San Antonio, TX
 
rumitoid wrote:
Why? Their lack of love for all the world. Speak out against gays but silent on the divorced members of the congregation that tithe. Jesus spoke out against divorce 6xs, not once about homosexuality. Does your pastor ever say this? "Whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery." Of course not, divorce is now as common as eating shellfish or wearing different fabrics to church. And the divorced are accepted into the fold, without question. This is almost as bad as Evangelicals backing Trump, who has proven himself to be a sexual offender in contradiction of the Bible. Christians no longer care about values?

And worse the acceptance of bankers.
Why? Their lack of love for all the world. Speak o... (show quote)


Why do you love judging others? Clean your own house (heart, mind, and soul) and you shall be clean. You seem to be divided in most all things. The story of Sodom and Gemorah should be enough of an explanation to satisfy most people of the sin of homosexuality. Angels are always referred to as males and those banging on Lot's door were males. Lot had already offered them his two daughters and they weren't interested in them. I hope that's understandable to you. God hates divorce but allowed Moses to grant them due to the hardness of men's hearts. Keep reading the scriptures and ask God to reveal what you don't understand. Because of sin everyone dies, even the two who were taken by God and haven't tasted death will return during the end times and die in the streets of Jerusalem and the world will send each other gifts celebrating their deaths. There are no escape clauses in the Bible but one, Jesus, you can look for others as long as you like but you'll be wasting your time. God will judge each one according to their acts, not someone else's. Before Jesus, you could be saved if God considered you righteous.

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Oct 18, 2019 08:26:46   #
Peewee Loc: San Antonio, TX
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
There are churches that ban gays from attending?

That is disgusting


Why? A little leaven (sin) spoils the bread batter. Until they repent first, why should they allow them into the congregation? Might be why so many are leaving the churches. The word is being watered down and of no effect. No walls, no borders, no absolutes. Kind of like fuzzy math. The dumber we get, the easier it will be to convince people with need to merge with AI and machines. That's why the world is growing darker and more violent, Satan is running out of time and so are we, IMHO.

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Oct 18, 2019 08:51:36   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
Peewee wrote:
Why? A little leaven (sin) spoils the bread batter. Until they repent first, why should they allow them into the congregation? Might be why so many are leaving the churches. The word is being watered down and of no effect. No walls, no borders, no absolutes. Kind of like fuzzy math. The dumber we get, the easier it will be to convince people with need to merge with AI and machines. That's why the world is growing darker and more violent, Satan is running out of time and so are we, IMHO.


Why allow anyone into the congregation?

We are all sinners...

The fact that they are seeking God seems an act of repentance to me...

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Oct 18, 2019 09:05:21   #
Peewee Loc: San Antonio, TX
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
Why allow anyone into the congregation?

We are all sinners...

The fact that they are seeking God seems an act of repentance to me...


True, but most sins are private, like cheating on a test. Being gay is a bit overt by some. Gays have been around forever but kept it private and no one but the people involved and God knew. Maybe molesting children by the clergy is a better example. Repent first before you can be around children again. Most clergy who harmed children are not even on a sex offender list anywhere.

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Oct 18, 2019 09:09:56   #
Rose42
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
Why allow anyone into the congregation?

We are all sinners...

The fact that they are seeking God seems an act of repentance to me...


Merely going to church isn’t repentence. Continuing to live in open defiance and all knowing it has to be dealt with or the church will be opening its door to all kinds of new problems.

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Oct 18, 2019 09:26:26   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
Peewee wrote:
True, but most sins are private, like cheating on a test. Being gay is a bit overt by some. Gays have been around forever but kept it private and no one but the people involved and God knew. Maybe molesting children by the clergy is a better example. Repent first before you can be around children again. Most clergy who harmed children are not even on a sex offender list anywhere.


So as long as they are subtle about the sin they should be allowed to worship in church?

We are commanded to forgive... That doesn't come through ostracism...But through acceptance of the weakness of our brothers...

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Oct 18, 2019 09:27:36   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
Rose42 wrote:
Merely going to church isn’t repentence. Continuing to live in open defiance and all knowing it has to be dealt with or the church will be opening its door to all kinds of new problems.


Agreed...

Seeking God is...

We all live in defiance...

Being open about it doesn't make it worse...

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Oct 18, 2019 09:51:58   #
Parky60 Loc: Champaign, IL
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
Why allow anyone into the congregation?

We are all sinners...

The fact that they are seeking God seems an act of repentance to me...

In our church all sinners are allowed in if they repent and are working to change their ways. Jesus said you can tell a tree by its fruits.

If not...no.

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Oct 18, 2019 10:00:35   #
Rose42
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
Agreed...

Seeking God is...

We all live in defiance...

Being open about it doesn't make it worse...


No, but we are directed to confront sin. If there is no change in behavior after confronting them three times are no longer welcome at church. That is biblical.

Going to church isn't repentance nor is seeking God.

The biblical definition of repentance is a change of the mind that leads to a change in actions.

One example - Acts 26:20 -
...but declared first to those in Damascus, then in Jerusalem and throughout all the region of Judea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds in keeping with their repentance.

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Oct 18, 2019 10:12:27   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
Rose42 wrote:
No, but we are directed to confront sin. If there is no change in behavior after confronting them three times are no longer welcome at church. That is biblical.

Going to church isn't repentance nor is seeking God.

The biblical definition of repentance is a change of the mind that leads to a change in actions.

One example - Acts 26:20 -
...but declared first to those in Damascus, then in Jerusalem and throughout all the region of Judea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds in keeping with their repentance.
No, but we are directed to confront sin. If there... (show quote)


Seeking repentance... Emphasis on the "seeking"

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Oct 18, 2019 10:13:57   #
Rose42
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
Seeking repentance... Emphasis on the "seeking"


Seeking it isn't doing it. Its not worldly sorrow. Everyone is sorry for doing something wrong. Well, most are....

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Oct 18, 2019 10:18:05   #
Peewee Loc: San Antonio, TX
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
So as long as they are subtle about the sin they should be allowed to worship in church?

We are commanded to forgive... That doesn't come through ostracism...But through acceptance of the weakness of our brothers...


If they are subtle how would anyone know except God? I have forgiven many people who have sinned against me, but not before they apologized or made amends. Can I know if they are sincere or not? Nope, just have to use my best judgment and their past behavior as a guide. If I was a pastor or priest I would err on the side of protecting my flock versus allowing a wolf into the sheep pen. They can always read their Bible at home or listen to the radio or watch a tv sermon. They won't die if they don't come to my church. Many church employees have run off with church funds. Would I press charges against someone who did that? In a heartbeat after giving them the chance to return all the money.

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