Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...

Big whoop! - I do indeed.

No celebration over my library was solicited, expected or required, Walt.

I was responding to the admonition:



My point was and is, I've spent decades of my life studying the Word of God.

My son also has books on Atmospheric Science and Atmospheric Physics, including U.S. Weather Satellites, which are on duty world wide, as well as Chemistry, and every form of Mathematics known to man, - which he studied, and sometimes taught.

They litter various rooms throughout my country home, which I am not occupying at present. They are to be avoided at all cost.

My library consists of books on Ancient Religion, World History, Judaism, Israel, Christianity, and just about every religion, religious sect, and religious cult known to man, in addition to approximately seventy five (75) different versions, and yet all the same in meaning, Bibles.

Again, my purpose in mentioning my books was to refute the contention that I need further study from Arnold Murray's personal belief system, a system that contradicts Almighty God's belief system.

Thank you, however, for your suggestion.

My suggestion to you would be to teach what you know, which from your own list, does not appear to be Scripture.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

You have backed up your position on this verse (Genesis 4:1) that Adam was the father of Cain, very well.
Thanks for taking the time.

How about the progeny of Cain, the Cainites, and God's prophesies on them verses Israelites/Hebrews?

Then there is the Essau/Edom and Ashkenazim Mongol Turks mix.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

A keeper, thanks for the lesson.

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

I appreciate your offer to participate in this thread. The "Demon Seed" theory is not in keeping with the bible, Hebrew or Christian. There are so many issues with this theory that it is difficult to find a starting point. In short, it is a theory that asserts that all Jews are a subclass of humans, all are "satin's children" along with all blacks. Murray goes into detail about Europeans are THE only real Jews and are the 10 tribes. He does not address how Jesus, a Jew, could then become the Christian Messiah....I do not know if he, Murray, may be implying that Jesus was a false prophet. To me, Murray was (he is dead) a racist who twisted the bible to fit his own worldview. He had zero understanding of the Hebrew or even Latin languages. Having said that.... watch his videos or read his sermons, keeping your own Bible at hand to check his teachings.....and pray that G*D will provide you with knowledge and protection.

Again, thank you for the invitation although I feel I let you down by not going into detail.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

Not going into details either, but you misrepresent basic "identity" positions.

"Murray goes into detail about Europeans are THE only real Jews and are the 10 tribes" - Penny
No lessons today.

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

no lesson, I encourage all people, regardless of belief, to read their bible and with G*d's guidance will be able to understand. No hard feeling, but no matter what I write you will believe me wrong, possessed, or a child of the satin. So, what is the use of wasting my time in trying to show you or anyone how they may be mistaken? On judgement day....we stand alone, we can not say we were beguiled (which does not mean sex) by the satin....it will be a solo experience and our beliefs and actions will stand as witness.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

"No hard feeling, but no matter what I write you will believe me wrong, possessed, or a child of the satin" - pennylyn

I think no such thing, and you should know that. We have conversed for years Pennylynn.
Why do you make false statements like that?

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

Yes, we have conversed for many years. If you buy into the Demon Seed theory, then that belief makes me subhuman, a carrier of satin's DNA. Enough said.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

I don't buy into the "demon seed"
But I do follow the bloodlines and the prophesies on those blood lines.
Every one/soul has the ability to choose sides.
Lineage and environment can affect the perceptions and decisions of what to believe, and who to follow.
Being the daughter of a Rabi influences you. I am not diminishing your beliefs, they are just what they are.
Some Rabis actually become Christians.
A choice to be made.

Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall

I am grateful for this addition to the thread...

I have little knowledge of Murray or his interpretations...

Appreciation

Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...

I have researched and posted much of this same information over the last two or three years several times.

If you want more information than is below, go back through my posts. Everything any of us have ever written is kept online by OPP.

Better yet, go through your own Study Bible.


Cain settled in the land of Nod, east of Eden, married a sister (or cousin or niece), and had descendants that are listed in the Bible to the sixth generation. Cain built a city (Genesis 4:17), and his descendants included nomadic herdsmen, musicians, and blacksmiths (Genesis 4:20–22). They all perished in Noah's flood, every last one of them.

Noah was descended from Seth.

Cain illustrated the effects of anger and jealousy. The willfulness and disobedience of Cain are a caution to others who might follow in his steps. 1st John 3:12 warns us against a lack of brotherly love: “Do not be like Cain, who belonged to the evil one and murdered his brother."

"And why did he murder him? Because his own actions were evil and his brother’s were righteous.”

Those who welcome evil into their hearts have a natural hatred for those who are righteous.


Why are people saying that Jews are descendants of the mongols ? Is there a proof for this claim?

Dan Galilee, Advanced Torah-studies
Updated Sep 5, 2018

No. That is an anti-Semitic slur made and kept popular by ignorant haters.

1) We have an unbroken tradition of 3800 years with thousands of names and dates, which among other things identifies us (the Jews) as the descendants of the ancient Israelites. American and Russian Jews have precise names, dates and bloodlines of our families' Ashkenaz Jewish ancestors for over eleven centuries. The early Ashkenaz families were brought to the Frankish empire over 1200 years ago by Charlemagne from the Jewish communities of Italy (Bari, Lucca and Otrento). Note also that converted groups do not contain any Kohens or Levites, whereas the Ashkenazim and Sephardim all have good percentages of them.

2) Non-Jewish tradition and scholarship: here too, the vast majority (ancient historians and recent scholarship) verify that the Jewish people are who they say they are.

3) Science: recently, DNA analyses of Jewish communities worldwide have confirmed that today's Jews are related to each other and originated in the Middle East. Among other things, the "from the Khazars" canard has been conclusively debunked. A 2013 study of Ashkenazi mitochondrial DNA found no significant evidence of Khazar contribution to the Ashkenazi Jewish DNA, as would be predicted by the Khazar-canard. Although there is no historical or DNA evidence to support the Khazar idea, it (of course) stays popular among anti-Semites.

In 2000, the analysis of a report by Nicholas Wade "provided genetic witness that Jewish communities have, to a remarkable extent, retained their biological identity separate from their host populations, showing relatively little intermarriage or conversion into Judaism over the centuries. The results accord with Jewish history and tradition and refute theories which would allege that Jewish communities consist mostly of converts."

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

Interesting.
How does the Zionist money changers and Pharisees fit into all of this?

Christ sure had some strong things to say about them.

How is it they still do not recognize Jesus as their Messiah?

Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...

Jesus condemned using worship of His Father as a method of enriching oneself, as the money changers were doing in God's Temple; furthermore, He would do so today, as did the Apostles when Simon the Sorcerer wanted to buy the anointing of the Holy Spirit, believing he could use His power to enrich himself in his magic act. (Acts 8th chapter)

The antisemitic condemnation of Jews with money is deeply embedded within contemporary literature and culture. It is also a fundamental component of antisemitic conspiracy theories, including those that employ the word “Zionist” where the word “Jew” once appeared.

Blatant antisemitic language incorporating the premise that "Jews in control of money is a cunning world wide conspiracy on their part" remains rampant, as insidious forces using the same language and age-old lying myths arise century after century, inspired by Satan.

These forces, whether Islamist, far right, far left, or New Age, are not offering admiration for the Jewish people. They use it as antisemites always have — to explain the invisible hands they believe are running the world (unfortunately, they do not believe it is God), and as a means of excusing their own failures, while attempting to justify their hatred and jealousy of the Jews, a.k.a., “Zionists.”

Zionism is a movement founded by an English Jew, Theodor Herzl in 1896 with the goal of the return of Jews to "Eretz Yisrael" [land of Israel], or Zion, the Biblical Jewish synonym for Jerusalem and the Land of Israel.

The true meaning of Zionist is: "Zionism is the nationalist movement of the Jewish people that espouses the re-establishment of and support for a Jewish state in the territory defined as the historic Land of Israel."

By that definition, I am in full support of Zionism, always have been and always will be.

Can you imagine what would happen if Christians today exuded the love, truth, grace and mercy of Christ?

I think the church would be different.

The Pharisees were, to some extent, well-meaning people. They studied the law and knew it better than most.

Their downfall, to a large decree, centered on their prideful self-justification and self-importance.

But there’s evidence that some Pharisees were sincerely seeking God. Nicodemus and Joseph of Arimathea, both Pharisees, arranged for Jesus’ burial. They were sympathetic to Christ and, from what we can tell, ultimately ended up following him.

Similarly, the mission of the early church was radically advanced by a converted Pharisee — Paul.

And yet Jesus condemned the Pharisees for their pride, lack of compassion and hypocrisy.

The irony, of course, is this: the people who purported to love God most ultimately killed him when he showed up.

This isn’t about Jews and Gentiles. It’s about religious people (like you and me) who in the name of God deny who God really is.

Denying God is exactly what we do when our attitudes justify us more than they reflect the heart and love of Christ.

On a bad day, there is a Pharisee living in me.

The amount of Pharisee living in many of us is crippling the mission and effectiveness of the church.

Paul in Romans 11 is dealing with the thesis of the rejection of the Jews. "I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the tribe of Benjamin . . . Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace" (vv. 1, 5).

No, God has not cast away the Jewish people.

Paul has clearly shown, that by faith in Christ, is the way the Jews (or Gentiles for that matter) can be saved. Romans 11:23, "And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again" (cf. Rom.1:16-17).

Believing Gentiles were grafted in as wild olive branches. The natural branches were not broken off so these wild olive branches could be grafted in. The Gentile brethren did not need to get high-minded and boastful about the situation, but fear, for they could be cut off also! The Jews could be grafted back in, if they would leave their unbelief. For surely if wild olive branches can be grafted in, how much more the natural branches!

Then in verse 25 Paul says, "For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in."

Peter said, [Acts 15:11] "We believe that we are all saved the same way, by the undeserved grace of the Lord Jesus."

As of 23 June 2018, There are about one million, five hundred thousand (1,500,000) Messianic Jews or Netzarin Jews who believe in Jesus, and another million believers not associated with any organization worldwide.

Messianic Jews are Jews who accept the Messiahship of Yeshua (Jesus) of Nazareth, and believe in His act of atoning sacrifice for the sins of the Jewish nation and all mankind.

The Messianic Jewish Alliance of America (MJAA) represents the interests of approximately one hundred thousand (100,000) Messianic Jews in the United States.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

"Paul has clearly shown, that by faith in Christ, is the way the Jews (or Gentiles for that matter) can be saved. Romans 11:23, "And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again" (cf. Rom.1:16-17).

Believing Gentiles were grafted in as wild olive branches. The natural branches were not broken off so these wild olive branches could be grafted in. The Gentile brethren did not need to get high-minded and boastful about the situation, but fear, for they could be cut off also! The Jews could be grafted back in, if they would leave their unbelief. For surely if wild olive branches can be grafted in, how much more the natural branches!" - Zemirah

IMO; Here is a big problem with a lot (most?) of Christian churches.
They teach the word "Gentile" as being non Jew/Hebrew.
That teaching causes a lot of confusion.
In the New Testament the Greek word is "ethnos" and a more less confusing translation is "Nations" in most cases.
Under this misunderstanding, churches teach that Western Europeans/Caucasians are not of 10 tribed Israel. And ignore that America and the UK fulfill the prophesies pertaining on Joseph seed line; Ephraim and Manasseh.
It is those Christians that have carried the Word to the rest of the Earth.

Everyone that has not studies the word "gentiles" should.

Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...

Western Europeans/Caucasians are not of the ten tribes of Israel???

They never have been, they never will be.

Actually, there are twelve tribes, and they are not lost.

God is resettling all of them in Israel, as He promised.

Gentile:

adjective (sometimes initial capital letter)
O.T., of or relating to any people not Jewish.
N.T., Christian, as distinguished from Jewish.
LDS-Mormon Church. not Mormon.
heathen or pagan.

noun
a person who is not Jewish, especially a Christian.
(among Mormons) a person who is not a Mormon.
(Hebrew is goy, usually in plural, goyim), meaning all nations except the Jews.

Have you actually read the teachings of "a lot of churches?" - by which I assume you mean different denominations.

The western Europeans and Caucasians are not Semitic, they are descendants of Japheth, one of Noah's three sons.

The Table of Nations is in the Word of God, in Chapter 10 of the Book of Genesis in the Bible. The question of how all the nations and races began and the origin of all civilization is answered in Genesis chapter 10. Every race upon the earth originated with the three sons of Noah; Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

Genesis 10 lists a total of 70 original founders of the nations of the world or racial groups. They are all divided into 3 primary classifications: Shem, Ham, and Japheth. Although the subject of the classification of the nations and the origin of languages is controversial, ethnologists do agree on one key point: that all of mankind can be divided into three basic groups.

The sons of Noah were Shem, Ham, and Japheth... these three sons of Noah represented the three great races of mankind. The map below shows a table of God's dispersion of the nation's after they migrated from the Tower of Babel.

Shem (Asia)

Shem (Heb. "Name") was Noah's oldest son and was father to five sons who became the fathers of the five Semitic nations as shown below. Shem was the father of the nations of the ancient Near East including the Israelites (Hebrews) and the Jewish religion, and therefore Judaism, Islam, and Christianity sprang from the line of Shem. The Semites were particularly known for their religious zeal.

The Five Semitic Nations:

1. Elam (The Persians) settled northeast of the Persian Gulf.
2. Asshur (The Assyrians) the Biblical name for Assyria, settled between the Euphrates and Tigris Rivers.
3. Arphaxad (The Babylonians) settled in Chaldea.
4. Lud (The Lydians) settled in Asia Minor, but some of them sailed across the Mediterranean and settled in northern Africa.
5. Aram (The Syrians) the Biblical name for Syria, located north and east of Israel.

Ham (Heb. "hot" or "Black") was Noah's second oldest son and part of the family of eight who survived the great flood. Ham and his wife bore 4 sons who became the fathers of the nations of Africa. Ham's fourth son Canaan was prophetically cursed because he gazed at his fathers nakedness while he was drunk. This curse would mean later that Canaan would lose his land to the Hebrews and would be subservient to the descendants of Shem. The Hamites were known for their physical endurance.

The Four Hamitic Nations:

1. Cush (The Ethiopians) settled in Ethiopia south of Egypt, also early in their history some of them migrated to an area north of the Persian Gulf (Gen. 10:8-10).

2. Mizraim (The Egyptians) the Bible name for Egypt, settled in northeastern Africa.

3. Phut (The Libyans) sometimes translated Libya, settled in northern Africa.

4. Canaan (The Canaanites, later Israel) settled above Africa east of the Mediterranean (Later was given to the Hebrews).

Japheth (Europe)

Japheth (Hebrew means "God will Enlarge)") was Noah's third oldest son and part of the family of eight who survived the great flood. Japheth and Shem were both greatly blessed for respecting their father Noah. Noah's blessing on Japheth was far reaching for all of his descendants being the European (Caucasian) nations that were mentioned in Genesis 10. The Japhethites were known for their intellectual activity.

The Seven Japhetic Nations:

I. Gomer (The Cimmerians) settled north of the Black Sea, but afterwards his descendants occupied Germany, France, Spain and the British Isles.

2. Magog (The Scythians) lived north of the Caspian Sea.

3. Madai (The Medes, now the Kurds) settled south of the Caspian Sea.

4. Javan (The Ionians or Greeks) Javan is the Hebrew name for Greeks, they settled in Greece.

5. Tubal (The Turks) lived south of the Black Sea.

6. Meshech (The Slavs) lived between the Black and Caspian Seas,

7. Tiras (The Etruscans) located west of the Black Sea.


Shem-Asia. (Religious fervor) Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, Aram,

Japheth-Europe. (Intellectual activity) Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, Tiras.

Ham-Africa. (Physical endurance) Cush, Mizraim, Phut, Canaan,

Shem in Easton's Bible Dictionary a name; renown, the first mentioned of the sons of Noah (Gen. 5:32; 6:10). He was probably the eldest of Noah's sons. The Israelite nation sprang from him (Gen. 11:10-26; 1 Chr. 1:24-27) Genesis 7:13; Genesis 9:18; Genesis 10:1; 1 Chronicles 1:4). Usually named first, but in Genesis 10:21 last, because from that point forward Scripture traces the history of his descendants.

His descendants dwelt chiefly in western Asia, Shem of the Asiatic Japhethites, in an uninterrupted line from the Mediterranean to the mountains of Luristan and the Indian Ocean, Lydia, Israel, Syria (Aram), Chaldaea (Arphaxad), Assyria (Asshur), Persia (Elam), northern and central Arabia (Joktan). Shem means "name" in Hebrew, and may have been a designation subsequently given him among Noah's sons; as Ham, the settler in the warm regions of Africa; Japheth, the one whose descendants spread most abroad (Genesis 9:18-27). Noah's words (compare the blessing, Exodus 20:12), "blessed be Jehovah, the God of Shem, and Canaan shall be his servant," prophesy that Jehovah should be especially the God of Shem, which was fulfilled in choosing Abraham and Israel his descendants as God's peculiar people.

The Hamitic Babel tower builders perhaps sneered at the religion of Shem the father of the faithful, the worshipper of "Jehovah God of Shem."...

Shem (Hebrew: שם, Sēm; "renown; prosperity; name") was one of the sons of Noah in the Hebrew Bible. He is most popularly regarded as the eldest son, though some traditions regard him as the second son.

Shem, who is called "the father of all the children of Eber, (the Hebrews, later called Jews). The eldest son of Noah, from whom the Jews, as well as the Semitic Arabic ("Shemitic") nations in general have descended. When giving the names of Noah's three sons, Shem is always mentioned first (Gen 9:18; 10:1, etc.); His five sons peopled the greater part of West Asia's finest tracts, from Elam on the East to the Mediterranean on the West.

After the Flood, he, with his father, brothers, sisters-in-law and wife, received the blessing of God, Ge 9:1 and entered into the covenant. The portion of the earth occupied by the descendants of Shem, Genesis 10:21,31 begins at its northwestern extremity with Lydia, and includes Syria (Aram), Israel (Canaan), Chaldaea (Arphaxad), parts Of Assyria (Asshur), of Persia (Elam), and of the Arabian peninsula (Joktan). Modern scholars have given the name of Shemitic or Semitic to the languages spoken by his descendants. [Aramaic, Hebrew, Arabic are the most prominent.]

Egypt is the land of Ham, Psalm 78:51; Psalm 105:23, "black"; the sun- burnt and those whose soil is black, as Ethiopia means. Father (i.e. ancestor) of Cush (Ethiopia), Mizraim (Egypt), Phut (Libya), and Canaan (Israel). These are races, not individuals. The Hamitic or Cushite origin of Babylon is alleged by Scripture and confirmed by the vocabulary in ancient remains.

The curse pronounced by Noah against Ham, properly against Canaan his fourth son, was accomplished when the Jews subsequently exterminated the Canaanites. Recorded in Genesis 10 is the foundation of the world's earliest tyrannical dictatorship, in Babylonia by Nimrod, the grandson of Ham (6, 8, 10).

Japheth (meaning "enlargement"), is one of the three sons of Noah. "Japheth shall dwell in the tents of Shem," fulfilled in part now, more fully hereafter (Isaiah 60:3; Isaiah 60:5; Ephesians 3:6). Almost all the Japhetic nations are believers in the God of Shem.

Genesis 9:27 refers to Japheth's future rather than Shem's), "God shall dwell in the tents of Shem" (compare John 1:14, the Son of God "tented (eskeenosen) among us".)

The descendants of Japheth occupied the "isles of the Gentiles," Ge 10:5 - i.e. the coast lands of the Mediterranean Sea in Europe and Asia Minor - whence they spread northward over the whole continent of Europe and a considerable portion of Asia. After the discovery of the New World, they settled most of the U.S., and its neighboring nations beginning in the 16th century, A.D.