The verses that prove Christ is the rock are also in the Catholic version of the Bible.

Here they are again.

1 Peter 2:6
For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."

1 Corinthians 10:4
"and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they were drinking from a spiritual rock which followed them; and the rock was Christ.


Psalm 118:22
The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief corner stone.

Matthew 21:42
Jesus said to them, "Did you never read in the Scriptures, 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone; THIS CAME ABOUT FROM THE LORD, AND IT IS MARVELOUS IN OUR EYES'?

Mark 12:10
"Have you not even read this Scripture: 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone;

Luke 20:17
But Jesus looked at them and said, "What then is this that is written: 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone'?

1 Peter 2:7
"This precious value, then, is for you who believe; but for those who disbelieve, "THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE VERY CORNER stone,"

Acts 4:11
"He is the STONE WHICH WAS REJECTED by you, THE BUILDERS, but WHICH BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone.

Isaiah 8:14
"Then He shall become a sanctuary; But to both the houses of Israel, a stone to strike and a rock to stumble over, And a snare and a trap for the inhabitants of Jerusalem.

Romans 9:33
"just as it is written, "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A STONE OF STUMBLING AND A ROCK OF OFFENSE, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."

1 Peter 2:8
and, "A STONE OF STUMBLING AND A ROCK OF OFFENSE"; for they stumble because they are disobedient to the word, and to this doom they were also appointed.

Matthew 21:44
"And he who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces; but on whomever it falls, it will scatter him like dust."

Isaiah 28:16
Therefore thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a tested stone, A costly cornerstone for the foundation, firmly placed. He who believes in it will not be disturbed.

Daniel 2:34
"You continued looking until a stone was cut out without hands, and it struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay and crushed them.

Daniel 2:45
"Inasmuch as you saw that a stone was cut out of the mountain without hands and that it crushed the iron, the bronze, the clay, the silver and the gold, the great God has made known to the king what will take place in the future; so the dream is true and its interpretation is trustworthy."

Daniel 2:35
"Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver and the gold were crushed all at the same time and became like chaff from the summer threshing floors; and the wind carried them away so that not a trace of them was found But the stone that struck the statue became a great mountain and filled the whole earth.

1 Peter 2:4
And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God,

Jack,

The NIV nor is the KIV Biblical translations are incorrect. Either is the Aramaic, Greek, Latin or English words used are incorrect.

It is the interpretive manner of those biblical words are translated from one word to another language.

There are 1,442 bible languages. And parts of the Bible has been translated into 3,233 languages.

The BibleGateway has 208 bibles in 68 languages. From the original Greek Septuagint Bible and Hebrew Torah’s languages and translations to those languages such as English.

The problem is you’re biblical Interpretation ? which is in question, and not the richness of the Greek language.

We know that Jesus and the Apostles spoke Aramaic.

In Matthews Gospel which was originally written in the Aramaic language and was later translated to the Greek.

We have factual evidence of this Aramaic to Greek translations.

The people of the Mideast spoke Aramaic as a primary language, Hebrew was for the priests, scribes, Pharisee and the Sadducees Jewish Religious factions.

The Jews said the prayers in the Jewish temple sacrifice was said in Hebrew.

Hence the great division between the pharisee scribes and the Sadducees, and what separated the common peasant common Jewish people and samaritan folk.

There is actual evidence of this.

The biblical indisputable evidence is in Matthew 16:17-19.

This Is the Jesus, commissioning of Simon to receive the Holy Spirit to forgive sins or retain them. Jesus also changed his name to caphas or kaphas rock-stone.

Jesus also said upon you I will build my church.

Here is the Jesus’s religious and biblical emphasis jack.

“Upon Caphas-kephas or Peter, I will build my Church.”
Matthew 16:17-18.

We know Jesus, is the cornerstone the foundation stone of the Church, but the next stone that the Church is built upon is caphas-kaphas or Peter.

Bible references to the cornerstone foundation stone, the rejected stone.
Acts of the Apostles 4:10-12
1 Corinthians 3:11
Ephesians 25:19-22
1 Peter 2-6
Isaiah 28-16
Romans 9:33

This is your conjecture your misunderstanding to Matthew 16:17-19 and you’re inability to describe Discern and understand the implications of what Jesus Christ actually said.

How much more explicit is this biblical passage.

Obviously you care more about the Greek Petros and Petras controversy which are two completely different subjects.

But you skillfully try to combine you’re non-Catholic biblical self-interpretations into the mix and religious fray.

Get you’re simpleton argument of Petros and Petra’s words away from . . . Jesus’s actual words.

“Upon you Caphas-Kaphas “Rock-Stone” Peter I will build my Church.”

That is what is not in question here.

It is about only what Jesus said. “Upon you do I build my Church.”

There is no misinterpretation on what Jesus Christ said, to cephas-kaphas-Peter in these biblical verses.

Jesus then said and the gates of hades will not over come it. And I will give you the keys to heaven.

Yeah jack, why all the quarreling and religious dithering, on word verbiage & semantics ? Why ?

You still have yet to give a correct answer to my Catholic liking and understanding?

There in lies the word translation problem.

I accept the word of God and I also look at all the other translations of the Bible also, and don’t get fixated on one bible.

As you do, that’s the problem with Protestantism it’s either - or mentality’s.

Whereas the Catholic understanding is “both” “and - or.” And looking st the totality.

Your Protestant understanding is the brain thinking intellectual component.

The Catholic understanding is intellectual, spirituality and a prayfull component.

Which is a more totality understanding as with this same conflict with non-Catholics on other issues of Catholicism.

Jack we catholics can draw on 1,987 years of the intersession of the Holy Spirit, because Jesus Church is a living breathing alive church with its doctrine, liturgy, theology, philosophy, history, religious Church literature, Church Cannon, Church magisterial teaching, Papal encyclicals, Church councils rulings, Bishop writers, doctors of the church writings, Church miracles, the Church catechism.

The list can go on in the fullness of the Catholic Church.

Your form and differences of Christian doctrine is what is the biblical rub.

Your not a complet Christian and do not know of the fullness of the 7 sacraments that jesus has Given his Catholic Church as with the Eastern Orthodox Church.

Catholics are slow to move and have a traditional religious patter do you have to focus on church tradition church history oral and written and the Cannon e.g the Bible.

That’s the major division and spiritual difficulty that the Protestant faith has.

Catholics understand and only use Church authority and biblical scripture church guidance to interpreting scripture.

Protestants follow their hearts and mental desires when they do biblical self-interpreting, shure you can ask guidance

Do jack when you name call, use Words like, Cults, pagan Idolatry, satanic worship etc.

You have no footing or have sway of my Catholic doctrineal biblical beliefs.

Start watching the coming home network with host former minister on EWTN, every Monday night.

Or watch it on YouTube, and watch the deep in history episodes.

I’m shure you will be surprised how his guests have come home to the fullness of the Catholic faith.

This has Zero to do with interpretation.

Before one can even argue interpretation first we have to know what the "Words are" then move forward with wgat a word means.

The problem with the Roman Catholic doctrine of "Peter the rock, and what Jesus meant by church" they don't match up.

I would 100% agree that interpretation does differ from the reader in some scripture, however there a few scriptures that are not self explanatory and this is not one of them.

So far Doc110 several have forwarded the correct application of Sola, but...... Ignoring and repeating a false will never make it what you want it to be.

Rose42,

Youre talking about two separate issues here and taking things out of biblical context.

You are hell bent on making an issue here which it should not be a religious issue.

1. Jesus called Simon bar jona “Cephas-Kaphas, Stone-Rock or Peter in Aramaic.
Yes or NO ?
Matthew 16:17-19

2. You are talking about Jesus as the Cornerstone or the Foundation stone or the stone the builders rejected and building his Church.
Yes or No ?

For some strange reason you are combining these two separate ideas into the same problematic difference and your limited understanding of the two Separate biblical issues.

1. Jesus called cephas-kaphas a rock-stone for what reason ?

Because Simon bar Joana was full of faith and strength and conviction in Jesus question to the apostles.
Matthew 16:13

Who do you and others say that I Am ?

Simon bar jona said to Jesus.

You are the Messiah, The Son of the living God.

There is no contradictions in what Jesus. Said in Matthew 16:17-18

Cephas-Kephas upon you will I build my church.

What does this have to do with the cornerstone or the builders foundation stone.

What is wrong with you’re thinking non-Catholic brain ?

Can’t wait for your next reply as you get more confused in every reply.

Hello these are two separate biblical issues.

quote=Rose42]Not for nothing. Your doctrine is false and scripture proves it to be false. All you're doing is perverting scripture to make it mean something it doesn't.

Scripture itself proves Catholic doctrine to be wrong.

Jack,

What part can't you understand ?

The problem is with the 30,000 thousand Protestant doctrines, is that you're faiths and people can't agree upon anything.
Herding Cat's, comes to mind.

It is the interpretive manner of those biblical words are translated from one word to another language. There are 1,442 bible languages. And parts of the Bible has been translated into 3,233 languages.

The BibleGateway has 208 bibles in 68 languages.

The problem is from the original Greek Septuagint Bible and Hebrew Torah’s languages and translations to those languages such as English.

Guess we are going have to do, a + b = thing.

The problem is you’re biblical Interpretation ? Which is in question, and not the richness of the Greek language.
Yes or No ?

Do you think they could have gotten it wrong ? Lost in Translation ? From the Aramaic to the Greek ?
Yes or No or Maybe ?

Matthew was originally written in the Aramaic vernacular language, 150 years later it was transcribed into the greek, vernacular language Lost in Translation ?
From the Aramaic to the Greek ?
Yes or No or Maybe ?


Matthew 16:17-19
Cephas or Kephas ? Stone or Rock ? or Peter in Greek ?
Yes or No ?

Petros vs Petras ?
Yes or No ?

Jesus,'s commissioning of Simon bar jona, and changed his name to Caphas or Kaphas "stone or rock" and is the first to receive the Holy Spirit to forgive sins or retain sins.
Yes or No ?

Jesus, said upon you I will build my church.
Yes or No ?

Is Jesus talking about the cornerstone, foundation stone.
Yes or No ?


Here is the Jesus’s religious and biblical emphasis jack.

“Upon Caphas-kephas or Peter, I will build my Church.”
Matthew 16:17-18.

There is no misinterpretation on what Jesus Christ said, to cephas-kaphas-Peter in these biblical verses.

Jesus then said and the gates of hades will not over come it. And I will give you the keys to heaven.
Yes or No ?

Jesus, is the cornerstone the foundation stone of the Church, but the next stone that the Church is built upon is caphas-kaphas or Peter.
Yes or No ?

Bible references to the cornerstone foundation stone, the rejected stone.
Acts of the Apostles 4:10-12
1 Corinthians 3:11
Ephesians 25:19-22
1 Peter 2-6
Isaiah 28-16
Romans 9:33

Jesus's common vernacular language was Aramaic.
Yes or No ?

The Apostles common vernacular language was Aramaic.
Yes or No ?

The Common language in the Middle-eastern people was Aramaic.
Yes or No ?

The Priests, Scribes, Sadducee and Pharisees spoke Hebrew and Aramaic.
Yes or No ?

Jack,

What part can't you understand ?

The problem is with the 30,000 thousand Protestant doctrines, is that you're faiths and people can't agree upon anything.
Herding Cat's, comes to mind.

It is the interpretive manner of those biblical words are translated from one word to another language. There are 1,442 bible languages. And parts of the Bible has been translated into 3,233 languages.

The BibleGateway has 208 bibles in 68 languages.

The problem is from the original Greek Septuagint Bible and Hebrew Torah’s languages and translations to those languages such as English.

Guess we are going have to do, a + b = thing.

The problem is you’re biblical Interpretation ? Which is in question, and not the richness of the Greek language.
Yes or No ?

Do you think they could have gotten it wrong ? Lost in Translation ? From the Aramaic to the Greek ?
Yes or No or Maybe ?

Matthew was originally written in the Aramaic vernacular language, 150 years later it was transcribed into the greek, vernacular language Lost in Translation ?
From the Aramaic to the Greek ?
Yes or No or Maybe ?


Matthew 16:17-19
Cephas or Kephas ? Stone or Rock ? or Peter in Greek ?
Yes or No ?

Petros vs Petras ?
Yes or No ?

Jesus,'s commissioning of Simon bar jona, and changed his name to Caphas or Kaphas "stone or rock" and is the first to receive the Holy Spirit to forgive sins or retain sins.
Yes or No ?

Jesus, said upon you I will build my church.
Yes or No ?

Is Jesus talking about the cornerstone, foundation stone.
Yes or No ?


Here is the Jesus’s religious and biblical emphasis jack.

“Upon Caphas-kephas or Peter, I will build my Church.”
Matthew 16:17-18.

There is no misinterpretation on what Jesus Christ said, to cephas-kaphas-Peter in these biblical verses.

Jesus then said and the gates of hades will not over come it. And I will give you the keys to heaven.
Yes or No ?

Jesus, is the cornerstone the foundation stone of the Church, but the next stone that the Church is built upon is caphas-kaphas or Peter.
Yes or No ?

Bible references to the cornerstone foundation stone, the rejected stone.
Acts of the Apostles 4:10-12
1 Corinthians 3:11
Ephesians 25:19-22
1 Peter 2-6
Isaiah 28-16
Romans 9:33

Jesus's common vernacular language was Aramaic.
Yes or No ?

The Apostles common vernacular language was Aramaic.
Yes or No ?

The Common language in the Middle-eastern people was Aramaic.
Yes or No ?

The Priests, Scribes, Sadducee and Pharisees spoke Hebrew and Aramaic.
Yes or No ?

==================
You can recite several pages of all your revised- falsified Scriptures, but there is no way to reconcile your Sola Scriptura Scriptures with the True Scriptures of the Church which God created through Peter, almost 2000 years ago. There is no historic connection between Christ and Protestants. Jesus lived 1500 years before the Protestant Reformation.

Protestantism is a reformed movement. When it becomes an end in itself it becomes unintelligible to itself. Protestants who don’t long for Christian unity are not Protestant. There is also the ongoing problem that Catholics have responded to the Protestant critique in a way that the Protestant critique no longer makes much sense.

I would suggest all should read historical Christian works by Justin Martyr, the Didache, St. Agustine, St., ect... They all espouse back as far as 70-100 AD the teachings of the Catholic Church. Where is Sola Scriptura before the Reformation?

If anyone would take the time to research the hundreds of years of writings of the Church Fathers, and their successors, they would see a rich treasure of the history of the Catholic Church from the very beginning of its founding, and continuing on through today.

From Cardinal Newman:
From what Cardinal Newman said, you can readily see why they are taught this. What a waste to disregard such a goldmine of truth.
01. The Catholic Church is the guardian and the dispenser of truth, because the Bible said so.
02. Truth is one. There can be only one truth.
03. The Church is the final authority on earth, because Jesus Christ said so.
04. Jesus Christ gave authority to His Apostles.
05. The Apostles in return passed on this authority to their successors through 'Apostolic Succession'.
06. The Church is the mother of the Bible, and not the daughter.
07. The Bible is a product of the Church, therefore it is a Catholic book.
08. Catholic Bishops in Catholic Councils decided which books were to be included in the Bible.
09. The Papacy is well represented by Holy Scripture
10. Sola Scriptura is a man made doctrine and is therefore condemned by Holy Scripture.
11. False charges against the Mother of GOD, fall away like dead leaves when the truth is manifest.
12. Writings of Church Fathers are a wealth of information about the Catholic Church.

Per Cardinal Newman:
My conclusion is Protestantism has the extreme changes, and a substitution which is certainly, in idea, supposable of a counterfeit Christianity,—superseding the original, by means of the adroit innovations.

Thus I call Sola Scriptura, FAKE DOCUMENT. Please don't recite all your Scriptures again. You are so confused.

Thank you.

I'm beginning to think your just not very smart.
Fully incapable of understanding Sola scripture is not interpretation, it's a meaning proven over and over.
Seriously a very dim witted person would have gotten it by the 7th or 10th time.

The only other explanation is you are incapable of defending the Satan false catholic doctrine leaving you the only option to continue the dishonestly of repeating the false claim of 30000 denominations and Sola scripture.

Stupidity or dishonesty?.

Gotta be one, stupid or dishonest.

You shared a window into your personal life, so I will do likewise! I attempted to share a wonderful funny memory of mine, but you returned it with a nasty reference about my butt, of which you know nothing about and my lack of intelligence! I never claimed to be anything other than exactly who I am, however, I finished high school with straight A’s! You say that we make the claim that you are going to Hell........how many times have you three stated that all are going to Hell that are not a member of the Catholic Church? You exaggerate in your comments about what I said about the Holy Spirit! A good lesson on what the Holy Spirit does for us is in 1 Cor 2:6-16 ! The best scripture is 1 John 2:20,27 these verses state that the Holy Spirit abides in us and that he teaches us in all things! We don’t have to summon the Holy Spirit.....He abides in us! These are not my words! If you don’t agree, you’ll have to take your argument to the one who sent us the Holy Spirit! Padre! Many of your comments were exaggerated! As a Priest, do you not think that that is almost as bad as an actual lie? I personally think that when a man constantly exaggerates, he soils his reputation as a reliable person. IMHO. You know if you three want more for us than we want for ourselves, you sure have a strange way of showing it. When we use Bible verses, we do not consider them to be magic charms, but then we don’t rely on a mere man to tell us what we can read, believe, interpret or to teach. If anyone is compared to a bunch of monkeys, it would have to be Catholics not All of those Sola Scripturas, you are the ones that are not allowed out of your cage or not obey their leader! Remember! I am answering your comments, using your words ! And why do you find it necessary to bring in a gross sexual analogy like ‘monkeys molesting a football’ for Protestants!
You know,I’d much rather be with a group of people who has the courage and faith to use their own intelligence than rely on the person directly in front of him, following inlock step, not knowing if they will go right or left or off the Clift!
What a waste of intelligence for the Catholics..... to always rely on someone else to do your thinking. You say I have no authority to interpret scripture!! You of all people should understand that men and women have died to assure me the freedom to believe as I chose, even to interpret scripture! My Daddy, my husband, my son, all fought in wartime that gave me that right! And Jesus Christ dictated an instruction manual for each and every one of us to follow! All we had to do is follow the instructions to be assured of a place in Eternity with Him!

And now for your second part! You state that you know more than I will ever know about !!!! Let’s just cut to the chase and say what you actually would have liked to have said!!!!! EVERYTHING! That means a lot more to you than me, I’m sure! I don’t know what that has to do with anything!i can assure you that there will always be someone smarter than each if us at any given time!!?!? It sounds like you have had a successful and satisfying life! Your conservative view in life is the same as mine, there would little to no differences! I won’t bore you again with my life, I’ll just say I had a wonderful, magical childhood with loving parents! I had a friend one time tell me that I should write a book because I had so many wonderful stories to tell! I’ve been married for 43 years to a wonderful husband that picked me up and dusted me off , after a tumultuous abusive marriage and raised my son as his own! Not only was I his partner in life, I was also his partner in business! I have been more than blessed!

You know if I made a list of all the insults and name-calling from both sides, Doc’s alone would fill a notebook! There is absolutely no comparison between the two, and you know it! So! Don’t even attempt to exaggerate your way out of that one! You say that those Protestants think they know everything! That is 😂 funny! Do you not realize that you Catholics or Mormans or Muslims or whoever!!!!.......... think the same! If you don’t understand the human any better than this, you’re not as intelligent as I thought you were! Every faith is convinced that they are right! Why else would they believe what they believe?

You and Doc and Radiance can claim that we personally attack you all day long, but it doesn’t make it true! We do not hate, we don’t constantly call you childish names! Radiance has become the perpetual Victim all by herself! We don’t demand you to SHUT UP or walk into the ocean and drown or ‘to not put this on my head’ or Stop it or etc. etc. etc. !
I tried to make it a little lighter, but you went straight to the ‘nasty’ little boy Butt comments or the ‘nasty’ old man’ comment, I don’t know which! What kind of man does that on a public forum? What kind of Priest says that?
Again a comment about magic Bible Verses! It has become evident that Catholics don’t actually study the Bible in the same way we do, book-chapter-verse! Every word in the Bible to us is sacred, Precious and is exactly the way Jesus intended! He is God , after all! We don’t change it nor do we twist it to make it mean what we want it to! We don’t add to the Bible with another book written by man nor do we depend on a group of men to dictate what we are to believe or how to live!

I belong to a Baptist Church! We have a preacher that preaches a message of his choice. We have Sunday School that we study scriptures lead by a teacher. The difference between my Church and a Catholic Church is that I am not obligated to accept their interpretation. We even discuss our differences in our interpretation of the scriptures.

I understand that as a Catholic, you just can’t accept the fact that we don’t depend on a leader to tell us what to believe! We can’t understand how a person would give up the freedom to read the Bible and with the guidance of the Holy Spirit interpret the scriptures!

And that’s where I will leave it!

I sincerely hope you won’t answer my sincere answer to your post with insults, but the choice is yours! I won’t demand anything from you!

MARANATHA

==============
Rose42, the fact is your Sola Scriptura is man-made. It does not represent the true Gospel of Christ.
There were revisions and omissions designed soley for the Simplistic Sola Scriptura, but in violations of the true Scriptures that Christ had created thru Saint Peter 2000 years ago.

The true Scripture was created by Christ, and ordered Saint Peter that the Catholic Universal Church has the sole authority to keep, to share, to spread, and to create for the people of God. From Saint Peter to the Apostles, and to the Saints and to the Pope, Cardinals, etc. The 2000 year-old Gospel has the Scriptures, the Sacred Traditions, and the Magisterium.

Sola Scriptura was copied from the true Gospel of Christ. You can claim that the Scriptures are the same. Some are the same, but described differently. Your Scriptures on Sola are simplified, solely by the Scriptures alone.

The true Gospel of Christ consist of so many historical events not carried in your Gospel.

Jack Sequim, in desperation to protecting the integrity of his Gospel, labeled the True Gospel of Christ, the Catholic Church as Pagan, Cult, and all kinds of filthy language coming from his filthy mouth.
Matthew 15:11 What goes into someone's mouth does not defile them, but what comes out of their mouth, that is what defiles them."

There will be no end to this debate because the sources have variances that don't reconcile with each other.

Like the 33,000 Protestant denominations worldwide, you compete with each other your same Sola Scriptura, with different directions, each one claiming they are right.

Thank you.

Rose, you have presented scripture according to God's word with explanations that remove any other "interpretation".

Over the last few months several have (in detail) explained to both Doc110 and Radiance3 the definition of "Sola scripture" and how/why the Catholic apologists have misused the meaning and application.
Also several have demonstrated in detail the false claim of 30000 Protestant denominations even providing links to catholic publications asking Catholics to stop using the false number. Also in detail explained why demoninaions (names) are (within the body of Christ) just names not gospel differences.

Given the number of several Christians that have posted the above to Doc110 and Radiance3, many several times yet we continue to see them using this false information in their replies in a desperate effort to discredite anyone providing evidence of the many false teaching including salvation of the Catholic church, this in itself speaks loudly to Ephesians 6:12
I have learned most all Catholics are completely unaware of the false teachings and when given evidence, presented as you have done their reactions, actions are nothing like these two.

As a last effort my post "are you stupid or dishonest" in hopes to see at least a flicker of effort from Radiance3 to stop using the false sola/30000 to no avail, instead the hypocrisy of "insults".

I suggest dark powers (oppression) is at work, this is not a battle of words, logic but of prayer.

God Bless