larry

I believe, that the schools, have abandoned the idea of chivalry because of the many female teachers filling the schools. Not to say that female teachers are a bad thing, but they seem to congregate together, and the need for chivalry among them is not noted as such. They give and take as equals, the kids see this, and copy the behavior. Woman do not when they are a majority think of that kind of behavior, They are just a bunch of equally rated persons. So chivalry is a non issue. Unless kids are exposed to chivalrous behavior, they do not learn it. And it seldom is necessary among the students, They are all in competition. It would be a good thing to teach social culture since it is very seldom experienced. Too much fast food, grab and go, and less formal organizational groupings where it is necessary. The only place to learn about it, is in the home. It should be taught as a foundation of society. The family is no longer a learning area, it is dog eat dog. If you want chivalry, you must start teaching it, it is not a natural function.

You can see by the article, that just the opposite atmosphere is being developed in the school system. It is these kind of incidents that are planned to rip the classical morality out of our population. It is how morality and decency is destroyed. We are all at fault, for depending on the education system for maintaining morality and chivalry, and decency. It no longer exists as a requirement. You should always complain to the school board if you do not like the way or ideas your child is being taught. Good luck.

AuntiE Loc: 45th Least Free State

I must interject a comment. Society does not encourage chivalry. As an example from years ago, I was shopping with a neighbor and her son. Her son, aged nine at the time, held the door open for an older lady. She looked at him, sailed on into the store and nary a word of thank you escaped her lips. He looked at his mother and very quietly asked why if he had to say thank you for courtesies adults did not. His mother lite up like a bomb. She tracked the woman down and dressed her down to the effect she was probably someone who complained about youth having no manners; however, it was her (the lady) who had none. The woman turned fire engine red. To give her credit, she went to my neighbor's son, apologized for not acknowledging his courtesy and further said she would not forget again. As a society, it is incumbent upon us to acknowledge when an individual, especially a young person, performs a courtesy. By positively acknowledging the behavior, we reinforce the behavior.

Ve'hoe

Exactly my point,,,, so what part, of your part didn't you get?? (quick to anger, and take offense,,, quick to smart off) Sounds like it was written for you,,,, and here is what that book says deary,,,,,

"What causes quarrels and what causes fights among you? Is it not this, that your passions are at war within you? You desire and do not have, so you murder. You covet and cannot obtain, so you fight and quarrel. You do not have, because you do not ask. You ask and do not receive, because you ask wrongly, to spend it on your passions. You adulterous people! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God. Or do you suppose it is to no purpose that the Scripture says, “He yearns jealously over the spirit that he has made to dwell in us”? "

What spirit dwells in you????

Searching Loc: Rural Southwest VA

One that recognizes the spirit in you. I will not deny that sometimes my spirit is dark, but it is rare that I see you without a dark spirit. All I can say is that I am sorry for wh**ever pain is in your life that allows your anger to almost always be front and center, that you feel so alienated and your pain is so great. I do not say this lightly either -- no sarcasm, no anger.

Ve'hoe

My pain is "REAL" but it is not "GREAT" in my life.
My point to you is that you look for answers in others, as though you actions are justified to their behaviors, the answer is NEVER in someone else....nor is the reward. If you get your reward from humans, then you have been paid, you have reaped the benefit you sought. The "reward" of man is finite, and hardly worth going after.... that is not dark, it is a very sublte difference.

I dont need to go deeply into the bible to understand (not all the way to ephesians or anywhere else) the point is perfectly covered in Adam and Eve. God asked adam what he had done,,, Adam said "She gave it to me" Eve said, "The Serpent,, HE fooled me!"
Neither took responsibility for their actions.

Quite the contrary, I am a loving and very affectionate father and grandfather. I teach my daughters not to be combative with their men, but instead to find and nurture those virtues that make their man, a man. Likewise I teach my sons to be the men, not a loud and abusive man, but to find what their wives, daughters, mothers need, and strive to achieve that!!

It gets VERY complicated when someone elses son comes into the mix,, selfish and angry he has to fight his way to respect and domination. In reality, that cannot be achieved,,, you only win by giving up, you "die" and release what YOU want for what is best for "US." Then you win.

I told my son in law, after he and his wife had a huge fight, that he cannot be the man and be at peace until his relationship with his wife was at peace. The problem he has was that not a single relationship he had with women gave him any contribution, no peace, no comfort. He needed that comfort, without it he is drving troops, like I did in war. War and a family are not the same thing.

He was raised by a single mom,,, no father. His problem is fear,, fear of rejection, fear of loneliness, and fear of connection.
I told him, to be the change he wanted, first, and as the father the family will follow,,,, you cannot drive them.

It is working.

Ve'hoe

The schools have not just "kicked God out" they have become him in their own minds,,,, that is the problem,,There IS a God in schools and a religion,, it is "l*****t f*****m" and yet they wonder why it doesnt work???

Makes me laugh. Like, "How the hell did you think it was going to work!?!"
Professing themselves wise,,,,,,,,,,,,

Searching Loc: Rural Southwest VA

I do understand the message you are giving here. I actually read it several times to make sure I did not misunderstand. It sounds as if you are quite a guy, seriously. I am glad that your sage words have had the results one could only hope for.

Perhaps, it is a flaw of mine, but I react to what is said on OPP when it "seems" to be said in "anger." I was raised in an extremely angry household. When an item coms up in topic and I hear what I "perceive" (remember I say "I" perceive) is either an affront to something "I" said or I consider (yes, a lot of "I's" here) outrageous, I react. I have convictions as well as anyone else, entrenched convictions, and baggage, just like everyone else. I am asking you here, and please absolutely know that I mean no disrespect AT ALL, how does one in virtuous fashion find a way to bring out "manly best" when 1) a gentleman is practically screaming "his T***h" and 2) since for most of us, there has been no bridge of trust built, how does one counter what one perceives as pure anger that does not necessarily sound rational? I am asking because I do not know. Your thoughts?

Ve'hoe

I was a pilot a long time ago,,,, and I fought investigators who always said that wh**ever happened was the pilots fault.

Then I became an investgator....... "It is ALWAYS pilot error!!"

I mix war and life in my politics, NEVER in my family. I too was rasied in anger,,, and I broke from it!! You can too, but you will wear the scars forever,,,, the only thing you can determine is NOT to pass the scars onto the next generation!!

I wear my scars (and some I worked REALLY hard to get!!),,, they are NOT genetic!! They do NOT have to go to the next generation.

Ve'hoe

The question on Chivalry, was simple. The answer direct.

I will think on what you ask,,, it is not a simple question,,,

Searching Loc: Rural Southwest VA

Well said, points taken, but then "HOW" do I give myself a voice?

larry

Remember, when you point a finger, there are three pointing back at you. And when you shout, the noise of your voice clogs your mind to reality. All you hear is yourself. But a whisper or gently spoken word, forces attention.

Ve'hoe

Freud asked: "What does a woman want?"

What is it, that you want? Many women have said to me, "I can say what I want!" I say why not?

Answer: Cause what you want, can be ugly, and it is part of an old weakness, and you feel weak for asking for it. Sometimes it is the missing piece, often it isnt, (it is just something you THINK will make the difference) Likely it will not because the "hurt" or wh**ever it was that cost you that "thing" happens at a very young age. Now when you grow old, and your adult cognitive sense takes over, it tells you a couple things: 1. It is dumb to demand that silly little thing 2. It is too simplistic to think that that silly little thing will fix all that is wrong with you. It is too simple to be the t***h.

For example: My son in law and daughter.. he came to me and said he cant stand her yelling at him. He was becoming afraid that he h**ed her.
I asked why he thought she yelled? "To get her point accross." he said. I suggested "perhaps, she thinks you didnt hear it, since it doesnt appear to do any good?" "Maybe." he said. I said, "What evidence, that you heard her, was there in you, that she could recognize?" "None, I guess." he said.
"So, what was the point of that fight?" I asked. he said, "I cant recall."
"So why dont you ask her what she wants?" I said.

He did, and she told him,,, and it hurt him, cause she wanted to love him and he was purposefully ignoring what she asked for because that is what he had experienced.....it was a learned response, that really c***ted him out of what he wanted too.
Still it doesnt just go away, when you get it, it takes a while to understand, and a while to adjust, and a while to be satisfied, that it wasnt f**e,,, it is a wierd thing to feel, when someone actually does GIVE you, exactly what you asked for.

Back to your questions:

When I am "yelling my point of view" it is how you receive it.

I was asked about chivalry, and I answered.

Women CANNOT fight men,, it doesnt work, it sets up the relationship in a light that it was not meant to be in.


I stopped doubting my faith, so I see very secure in my beleif, but I am not what I would classify as a "good christian" (there are many here, better than me) some think that is arrogance.

"From your background already it "MAY" be that you dont find many men worthy of respect,( I agree too, you dont know me from Adam) "Women respect your husbands.." (It doesnt say, respect him if, and only if, you think he is right)

I "think" it is the respect thing for you, that you struggle with. No one, or no man, has the authority to tell you anything. So you argue (or chaffe) or dont like his opinion. So, If I cant answer, did you actually ask me anything? I learned this in speaking with my adult kids,,,, they were smart. And then I began to listen to my little kids,,, who still knew what they wanted and needed (before somebody did a number on them) Before that , I thought I knew everything and would just tell them. As I got that concept down, I was amazed at how smart some of the younger kids were,,, the t***h is, they hadnt changed,,,, I was finally listening. Then things they said, didnt come as affronts, or problems for me... I just listened and did what they asked. Once the things they wanted were "done" I got the peace and happiness I desired.
Everything calmed down,,,, even the son in law, relaxes now, and he is finally able to let his wife cater to him... you have to give AND take,,, no man is an island, you must allow contribution to you, so that you can give it too.

Searching Loc: Rural Southwest VA

Well, it is rare that I yell, particularly on OPP, but okay.

Searching Loc: Rural Southwest VA

You make a lot of valid points, yes you do, and yes, you are "right" and I did love the way (in fact, you made me laugh a little) you said it -- there aren't a lot of men, in or out of my life, that I have respect for. From my father, the first man in my life and someone I truly loved and miss, to present day -- I figuratively hold my hands up in front of me -- to protect myself, more, I might add, from verbal abuse than physical abuse. I will have to go back and ponder some more on what you have said. Thank you.

Ve'hoe

I'm gonna get in trouble for this,,,, but,,,, Remember Men are simple (one celled creatures) they take orders and do,,,, "STUFF" they have few feelings,,, hungry, hot/cold,
scared, and then anger/attack/fight,,,,,kind of all jumbled together.

The feminists are smart, they realize that the man is uncomfortable in that scared thing,,, and it defaults to anger/ fight/attack and that is a weakness that can be exploited.

When I came to talk to my son in law, he was angry and ready to fight,,, (Not funny either, cause he is a foot taller than me and has 60 lbs on me)
What he didn't expect was a father who gave a damned about what he was feeling. Getting liquored up, getting angry, yelling are all cries of exasperation.

Somebody already said it here,,,(that is what is cool to be around really good Christians,,, they can patch up the holes of an amateur, like me) a Kind word turneth away wrath. I finally got the son in law to realize how scary he was when angry,,, and he was scaring the women in his life,,,, seems simple, but when you are caught up in this stuff it is hard to see. He calmed down, and wanted me to come with him,,, I just said, no,, you are the man in this family,,, now go be it!! You can do this. (It is the curse on women, that they are so forgiving) and he was,,, things are better, still have a blow up, but all the little signs of upset children, fighting, angry outbursts and tension are disappearing,,,,

For you, you need to see the Man in your life as the image of god,,, (Notice that I didn't say a GOOD image of God, we screw up too) But man is different than God, in that he needs woman, to be whole and think whole. You have to learn to think with your man,,,, the results will amaze you,,, besides you women are smarter than us,,, I have confidence you will get what you want. Just don't get scared,,,, drop the hands,,,, be a friend and help him think about feeling,,,, and he will contribute what you want to you,,, it is best though if you know what it is,,, like I said, we are simple......