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Jun 27, 2019 08:25:18   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
rumitoid wrote:
Describing the likely scenario of nationalism initiated in America by Trump.


Whats wrong with it?? Patriotism is a form of nationalism, is it not?? They are ideological citizens with like intent to a united America, no??

Or do you mean another form of Nationalism since there are many?? Perhaps I misunderstood this comment??

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Jun 27, 2019 08:54:53   #
Jakebrake Loc: Broomfield, CO
 
lindajoy wrote:
Whats wrong with it?? Patriotism is a form of nationalism, is it not?? They are ideological citizens with like intent to a united America, no??

Or do you mean another form of Nationalism since there are many?? Perhaps I misunderstood this comment??


Globalists certainly hate it~



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Jun 27, 2019 11:58:37   #
Louie27 Loc: Peoria, AZ
 
Morgan wrote:
That may be true, maybe other states should be better at balancing a budget.


Most of the blue states you have mentioned have higher wage's, so that being the case they should have paid more in federal tax's. That being the case the state would receive a lessor amount of money returned, for their state. So that would ab why their was such a discrepancy in funds returned to the state.

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Jun 27, 2019 12:14:12   #
son of witless
 
Louie27 wrote:
Most of the blue states you have mentioned have higher wage's, so that being the case they should have paid more in federal tax's. That being the case the state would receive a lessor amount of money returned, for their state. So that would ab why their was such a discrepancy in funds returned to the state.


You are right. The rich liberals need to pay more taxes.

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Jun 27, 2019 16:42:36   #
Morgan
 
Louie27 wrote:
Most of the blue states you have mentioned have higher wage's, so that being the case they should have paid more in federal tax's. That being the case the state would receive a lessor amount of money returned, for their state. So that would ab why their was such a discrepancy in funds returned to the state.


They may have higher wages, but that usually coincides with a higher expense for living, not to mention very high property tax, but they still have the burden of supporting a greater percentage of people on assistance, which means they know how to balance their budget.

The first budget Trump approved had us overspending and in the red, not a good move, some things should have been pushed off until we could afford it and not dig a deeper hole in debt.

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Jun 27, 2019 18:34:03   #
dtucker300 Loc: Vista, CA
 
Morgan wrote:
They may have higher wages, but that usually coincides with a higher expense for living, not to mention very high property tax, but they still have the burden of supporting a greater percentage of people on assistance, which means they know how to balance their budget.

The first budget Trump approved had us overspending and in the red, not a good move, some things should have been pushed off until we could afford it and not dig a deeper hole in debt.


That's for sure. But since it is Congress that writes the budget...yada, yada, yada! This, to me, is our existential crisis in America. Our money is becoming worthless since we went off the gold standard (Thanks, Nixon!), and took silver out of the coins in 1965 (Thanks, Johnson: they had to pay for the Great Society and Vietnam somehow; neither of which helped any). We also need to audit the Federal Reserve. Money comes and money goes thanks to the exponential growth of government. They think they have a vast reserve of financial resources; the taxpayer! CA manages to balance their budget because they keep raising taxes so that they can spend money on leftists pipe-dreams. Yet, everything is worse! More homelessness, more mentally ill on the streets, more illegals, more college expense that increases faster than a COLA, and fewer students graduating, worse roads even though they passed a new gas tax making CA's gas taxes the highest in the nation starting this July 1. We are at $22 Trillion in debt with no slowdown in sight. Hey, we can always tax the wealthiest individuals and corporations even though they pay the lions share of the budget already. It doesn't matter if more than half the people pay no income tax. When it was instituted it was supposed to only be a few percentages of our income. The progressives screwed the pooch so that we are all left with the repercussions of their utopian vision. If that doesn't bother you, go ahead and elect more Democrats and RINOs who will give everyone free college and healthcare. If you think healthcare is expensive now, wait until you see how expensive it is when it's free!
No wonder Facebook is considering creating a crypto-currency. China would love to displace the dollar as the world's reserve currency, and at this rate the way we are going, they will.

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Jun 27, 2019 19:04:50   #
rumitoid
 
lindajoy wrote:
Whats wrong with it?? Patriotism is a form of nationalism, is it not?? They are ideological citizens with like intent to a united America, no??

Or do you mean another form of Nationalism since there are many?? Perhaps I misunderstood this comment??


For me, first, a true patriot does not call him- or herself or align him-or her-self with patriotism; that is like declaring oneself humble and holy. How can one trust such a pronouncement? Why make it?

Nationalist, defined: "a person who strongly identifies with their own nation and vigorously supports its interests, especially to the exclusion or detriment of the interests of other nations." From that definition, I get that nationalism is more about pride than principle. It is a glaring statement that we are better than all other nations, which we may feel but acting on it as policy .

Patriotism, defined: "love of country." For me, it is more about principle than pride. The patriot is dedicated to the values and laws and ideals of what his country stands for as being right and just, willing to live and die for them, but not that this makes the country better than all others, or of superior worth.

Yet we do not have the parameters of this love.

Reply
 
 
Jun 28, 2019 07:13:27   #
Morgan
 
dtucker300 wrote:
That's for sure. But since it is Congress that writes the budget...yada, yada, yada! This, to me, is our existential crisis in America. Our money is becoming worthless since we went off the gold standard (Thanks, Nixon!), and took silver out of the coins in 1965 (Thanks, Johnson: they had to pay for the Great Society and Vietnam somehow; neither of which helped any). We also need to audit the Federal Reserve. Money comes and money goes thanks to the exponential growth of government. They think they have a vast reserve of financial resources; the taxpayer! CA manages to balance their budget because they keep raising taxes so that they can spend money on leftists pipe-dreams. Yet, everything is worse! More homelessness, more mentally ill on the streets, more illegals, more college expense that increases faster than a COLA, and fewer students graduating, worse roads even though they passed a new gas tax making CA's gas taxes the highest in the nation starting this July 1. We are at $22 Trillion in debt with no slowdown in sight. Hey, we can always tax the wealthiest individuals and corporations even though they pay the lions share of the budget already. It doesn't matter if more than half the people pay no income tax. When it was instituted it was supposed to only be a few percentages of our income. The progressives screwed the pooch so that we are all left with the repercussions of their utopian vision. If that doesn't bother you, go ahead and elect more Democrats and RINOs who will give everyone free college and healthcare. If you think healthcare is expensive now, wait until you see how expensive it is when it's free!
No wonder Facebook is considering creating a crypto-currency. China would love to displace the dollar as the world's reserve currency, and at this rate the way we are going, they will.
That's for sure. But since it is Congress that wr... (show quote)


I agree it is Congress but we're still under Trump and his regime and can't get anything done once again under Senate obstruction. There is no longer reason and compromise in our Congress. That's a crisis in of itself but people don't see it that way.

California may raise its taxes as NY does also, but everyone has the option to leave. Both blue states have maintained better than the red states. People are too far off the mark rejecting social programs, that does not make us socialists. Unfortunately, we have programs that give out... while not using programs that "Give Back"! If people are getting benefits why not have them do work for it, this can even allow them to build a skill. But we don't do it because people scream Socialism, give me a break how stupid do we want to be? Labor costs money, men and women should be working for their stipends. From child care to building roads.

Education is never free no matter how you slice that bread. If you take money that corporations give out to both those things, along with money from private citizens from part of their expenses that leaves, that creates a pool to give for education and health care. Many countries do this and their people are happy with it, they're glad they don't have to worry about those expenses and not being able to afford them and then not getting it for their family's, especially health care. Health care in our country literally bankrupts families, I know this as I know how it feels to struggle to keep your head above the water and treading it for years is exhausting.

In this world currency chess game China is waiting to lay the boom at the right time. Timing is everything and believe me, they are maneuvering to put things in place. From where they're building military bases on down to buying US property, to educating their youth in US law and businesses and lest we not forget building themselves up in every aspect. You want to talk about world dominance, look there. We need to wake up and stop fighting amongst ourselves and dividing ourselves making us a weaker country from within.

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Jun 28, 2019 07:36:03   #
Morgan
 
rumitoid wrote:
For me, first, a true patriot does not call him- or herself or align him-or her-self with patriotism; that is like declaring oneself humble and holy. How can one trust such a pronouncement? Why make it?

Nationalist, defined: "a person who strongly identifies with their own nation and vigorously supports its interests, especially to the exclusion or detriment of the interests of other nations." From that definition, I get that nationalism is more about pride than principle. It is a glaring statement that we are better than all other nations, which we may feel but acting on it as policy .

Patriotism, defined: "love of country." For me, it is more about principle than pride. The patriot is dedicated to the values and laws and ideals of what his country stands for as being right and just, willing to live and die for them, but not that this makes the country better than all others, or of superior worth.

Yet we do not have the parameters of this love.
For me, first, a true patriot does not call him- o... (show quote)


People ask "are you a patriot" which I believe what they are really asking is, do you love this country, are you loyal to it and willing to fight for it. Which is fine, and for some people they see that definition as equal to, being called a Nationalist, but since the Nazi regime, who became Nationalist to the extreme, many people don't like that connotation, or connection to it, the same with socialism. Loyalty which is a good trait can go awry when it involves unreasonable extremism, the same with Nationalism.

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Jun 28, 2019 08:26:50   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
Jakebrake wrote:
Globalists certainly hate it~


Globalist hate anything that stands in the way off their One World Order~~~
Look at the hate exhibited to Trump~~ there’s your proof~~

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Jun 28, 2019 08:48:23   #
Jakebrake Loc: Broomfield, CO
 
lindajoy wrote:
Globalist hate anything that stands in the way off their One World Order~~~
Look at the hate exhibited to Trump~~ there’s your proof~~



Reply
 
 
Jun 28, 2019 08:51:47   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
rumitoid wrote:
For me, first, a true patriot does not call him- or herself or align him-or her-self with patriotism; that is like declaring oneself humble and holy. How can one trust such a pronouncement? Why make it?

Nationalist, defined: "a person who strongly identifies with their own nation and vigorously supports its interests, especially to the exclusion or detriment of the interests of other nations." From that definition, I get that nationalism is more about pride than principle. It is a glaring statement that we are better than all other nations, which we may feel but acting on it as policy .

Patriotism, defined: "love of country." For me, it is more about principle than pride. The patriot is dedicated to the values and laws and ideals of what his country stands for as being right and just, willing to live and die for them, but not that this makes the country better than all others, or of superior worth.

Yet we do not have the parameters of this love.
For me, first, a true patriot does not call him- o... (show quote)


I don’t care for “labels” period, but I do consider our citizens patriots, well, the majority anyway..

For most their love of country is why they feel an affinity to protect her...In some ways patriot and Nationalist are viewed one in the same..

You point out perhaps the nationalist takes it beyond the purview of simple love of country and to the exclusion or detriment of the interests of other nations... Perhaps so but is this an overstatement based on the will of the people to ensure nothing and no one jeopardizes the Nation?? How much is too much love??
Example: I love you or my son, ( our nation)if I see someone attacking you I will do whatever it takes to be sure they do not and I don’t care who (other nation) gets in the way of that...My love for you is just that, motivated by it~~ Am I wrong?? Am I a hater because of it??

I do understand what you are saying rumi and I suppose because I view patriotism as I do and don’t carry the label of Nationalist in place of it I can not agree..But I still luvs ya!!

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Jun 28, 2019 09:17:39   #
Jakebrake Loc: Broomfield, CO
 
Morgan wrote:
People ask "are you a patriot" which I believe what they are really asking is, do you love this country, are you loyal to it and willing to fight for it. Which is fine, and for some people they see that definition as equal to, being called a Nationalist, but since the Nazi regime, who became Nationalist to the extreme, many people don't like that connotation, or connection to it, the same with socialism. Loyalty which is a good trait can go awry when it involves unreasonable extremism, the same with Nationalism.
People ask "are you a patriot" which I b... (show quote)


Obviously my dear Morg, you are a socialist. But I can live with that because you make no bones about who you are~



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Jun 28, 2019 09:21:00   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
Jakebrake wrote:



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Jun 28, 2019 09:49:20   #
bylm1-Bernie
 
Morgan wrote:
People ask "are you a patriot" which I believe what they are really asking is, do you love this country, are you loyal to it and willing to fight for it. Which is fine, and for some people they see that definition as equal to, being called a Nationalist, but since the Nazi regime, who became Nationalist to the extreme, many people don't like that connotation, or connection to it, the same with socialism. Loyalty which is a good trait can go awry when it involves unreasonable extremism, the same with Nationalism.
People ask "are you a patriot" which I b... (show quote)



That's quite a jump, Morgan, from Loving one's Country to being a Nationalist and on to the Nazi regime. Even worse, it's saying that because the Nazi regime allegedly loved their country, that means the people in the US who love their Country are the equivalent to Nazi's. Maybe that's not what you're trying to say but that's the way I read it. I do appreciate the "slippery slope" argument in most cases. If you look closely at today's politics, you will find that the Democrats are the ones who more closely track with the beliefs of the Nazi's(National Socialists), they just aren't quite there yet. Bernie Sanders and AOC, et al, have just slapped a "Democratic" in front of "Socialist" and they are good to go. I'm hoping that most people will see through that ploy and reject this nefarious attempt to get a toe-hold for Communism.

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