I am not twisting anything, and had I known that you are unable to discuss this subject without making personal attacks, I would have just read your input and not responded. The Greek Philosopher, Plato, said, "If you would converse with me, please, first, define your terms." In any discussion, I find it very necessary to follow his lead. So, we are dipping our toes in water that is very deep. So, what exactly is a sin? Most theologians accept that a “Sin” may be defined as a behavior that is unacceptable to a deity or supernatural being and subject to punishment by him. I can transgress against you without offending G*d. As an example, it is apparent that I offended you by my question.... was this an offense against G*d? Or if I frown and someone sees it and mistakes it as displeasure with them, regardless of what I was thinking, and they become offended.... have I sinned against G*d? True, in your view I transgressed against you and therefore you were 'righteously' offended.... but, my act was not intentional. And here lies the problem.... one must first separate out what exactly is a 'sin' in the eyes of G*d.... and He made it clear in Exodus chapter 20... and this is why G*d Himself went on defining judgments in chapters 21 through 40. My point... not all 'sins' are against G*d and indeed some sins may not be forgiven.... this is not to say that G*d can not forgive all sins, it means that He may consider the context of your life... in other words, repeated offenders or the matter of intent...

I use the term "unwashed masses" not as a dig or put down, but meaning those outside of the selected one or few. It is a common expression, not intended to upset you or anyone.

And... my question still remains.... did Jesus teach anything that was/is not contained in the Old Testament?

What is sin? The word comes from a Greek archery term (hamartia) that literally means to miss the mark, to miss the target. All humans are sinners who miss the mark of perfection that God has set for His people, resulting in alienation from God. How do we sin? We sin in what we say, what we think, what we do and the good we fail to do. Sin separates man from God. If I sin against you I also sin against God. Does this answer your question? I was not offended by you - my observation is that you are trying to apply Old Testament scripture and Covenant to the New Testament revelation/covenant of the Incarnation of the Messiah.

This is off subject, however I understand that your question is honest, so I will give you my opinion....now keep in mind that I am a Jew, Israelite.... however you wish to title me so my view may not fit well with Christian views. Envision a hamster in his wheel... his little legs pumping and he is doing his best to go someplace, anyplace...but each revolution is just like the last, nothing new to see and nothing new to do, no reward and no punishment. So it seems at times with human kind, for thousands of years men and women have been born.... and each generation there are the exact same things... war with all it butchery, spouses cheating on each other, money made and money spent.... a hamster wheel that we all seem to be trapped... The sun comes up and then it goes down, the seasons come and go... rivers rush to the sea, but the sea never fills up.... So at times we ask... why was I born... why am I alive, what is my purpose.

At the beginning of this book, in verses 1-3 we are introduced to the author; "The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem." And with this, we know that this is King Solomon... no longer worthy of the title king. King David had many sons, but Solomon alone was prepared and groomed to be the king. And if you look back in 1 Kings you will see a curious passage... G*d came to Solomon in a dream and asked him what was his heart's desire...what did he want for his life and future as a man and king. Solomon asked for one thing, not riches or wives, not glory or comfort... he asked for wisdom. G*d granted his request along with a few other perks such as riches and wives... success in all he attempted.

He had it all... then he broke the covenant.... he married a foreigner... one who worshiped idols and other gods. He married this foreign woman to negotiate better trade and thereby increasing his wealth. So one would think, nearing the end of his life he would write an autobiography of how to become successful... after all, he was considered very wise, patient, thoughtful, virile (as he had over 700 wives and 300 concubines), and ships arrived often filled with wealth. What more could he ask for.....

But, how does he begin to tell of his last days.... no fireworks, no appearance of our Father in flame and smoke.... no revelations of things to come... no he simply says... "Vanity of vanities! All is vanity." More appropriately he uses the Hebrew word hebel ...simply meaning it is temporary or at best meaningless. What he is saying is no person or pursuit in and of itself will bring lasting satisfaction. This verse is blunt... harsh and I think he intended to shock people out of their complacency about life.

He follows this up with a question that all logic directs you to respond in a negative way... he asks: “What advantage does man have in all his work which he does under the sun?” We all know if we had a choice, we would be on the beach, at least at our favorite fishing hole, perhaps climbing a mountain, or whatever we want to do... other than going to work...especially in the field with the sun burning our skin and our backs stiff and sore from labor. The logical response to his question is there is no advantage... what you did today at work, you will do tomorrow... names may change or location...but the job never is complete... day in and day out... what really changes in one's life? If you read on, Solomon actually answers his own question... There is no advantage for one to work from earth’s perspective because everyone is caught in the unending and unalterable cycles of life.

You see the point he was driving home to us, life on earth is transit.. "A generation goes and a generation comes, but the earth remains forever.” You are born into the world, you live your life, and then you die, but the earth keeps right on going. Sure we mourn the passing of a relative or friend, but sooner for some and later for others we do not feel the teeth of the death....we think of the departed less and less until one day, perhaps by the time grandchildren are in school... the memory fades and becomes an occasional thought or prayer... even graves are left unattended.

He goes on to the verses you quoted.... Also, the sun rises and the sun sets; and hastening to its place it rises there again. And the interesting word here is hastening... which if translated correctly would read the sun pants.... like a runner stuck on a track...around and around... no beginning or end in sight... just one step leading to the next. The wind, he writes, “Blowing toward the south, then turning toward the north, the wind continues swirling along; and on its circular courses the wind returns.” The repetition in “going round and round” heightens the sense of monotony and purposelessness. To drive his point home he goes on, “All the rivers flow into the sea, yet the sea is not full. To the place where the rivers flow, there they flow again.”

It is almost like he feels that the Universe is indifferent toward us. The universe and this world was here before we were born and will be here after we turn to dust... unless we really screw things up and explode the world in one of our constant wars... then perhaps there is an end in sight, but we pray this does not happen and most of us prefer not to think about this eventuality. From this point, he goes further into his depressive views; “All things are wearisome; man is not able to tell it. The eye is not satisfied with seeing, nor is the ear filled with hearing."

Keep in mind... Solomon was not talking about G*d, but the conditions of humankind... humans are never satisfied and humans stopped inventing things a long time ago... now we take old ideas bush them off and add a modern day twist... it does not make it new... just spray painted and tweaked. Continuing on, Solomon says "There is no remembrance of earlier things; and also of the later things which will occur, there will be for them no remembrance among those who will come later still." I find some humor in this... all my friends worry about what others think about them, their homes, cars, wealth, spouse or child... but Solomon says... you will be forgotten... no one will even remember your name in a hundred years!

Depressed yet? Well the last part of this book brings it all home... if you seek satisfaction and purpose in life... it is not evasive, out of reach. The last few verses of chapter 12 advises "Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear G*d, and keep His commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For G*d shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil."





"9 What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun."

I've been interested in hearing your thoughts on the subject, PL.

This is off subject, however I understand that your question is honest, so I will give you my opinion....now keep in mind that I am a Jew, Israelite.... however you wish to title me so my view may not fit well with Christian views. Envision a hamster in his wheel... his little legs pumping and he is doing his best to go someplace, anyplace...but each revolution is just like the last, nothing new to see and nothing new to do, no reward and no punishment. So it seems at times with human kind, for thousands of years men and women have been born.... and each generation there are the exact same things... war with all it butchery, spouses cheating on each other, money made and money spent.... a hamster wheel that we all seem to be trapped... The sun comes up and then it goes down, the seasons come and go... rivers rush to the sea, but the sea never fills up.... So at times we ask... why was I born... why am I alive, what is my purpose.

At the beginning of this book, in verses 1-3 we are introduced to the author; "The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem." And with this, we know that this is King Solomon... no longer worthy of the title king. King David had many sons, but Solomon alone was prepared and groomed to be the king. And if you look back in 1 Kings you will see a curious passage... G*d came to Solomon in a dream and asked him what was his heart's desire...what did he want for his life and future as a man and king. Solomon asked for one thing, not riches or wives, not glory or comfort... he asked for wisdom. G*d granted his request along with a few other perks such as riches and wives... success in all he attempted.

He had it all... then he broke the covenant.... he married a foreigner... one who worshiped idols and other gods. He married this foreign woman to negotiate better trade and thereby increasing his wealth. So one would think, nearing the end of his life he would write an autobiography of how to become successful... after all, he was considered very wise, patient, thoughtful, virile (as he had over 700 wives and 300 concubines), and ships arrived often filled with wealth. What more could he ask for.....

But, how does he begin to tell of his last days.... no fireworks, no appearance of our Father in flame and smoke.... no revelations of things to come... no he simply says... "Vanity of vanities! All is vanity." More appropriately he uses the Hebrew word hebel ...simply meaning it is temporary or at best meaningless. What he is saying is no person or pursuit in and of itself will bring lasting satisfaction. This verse is blunt... harsh and I think he intended to shock people out of their complacency about life.

He follows this up with a question that all logic directs you to respond in a negative way... he asks: “What advantage does man have in all his work which he does under the sun?” We all know if we had a choice, we would be on the beach, at least at our favorite fishing hole, perhaps climbing a mountain, or whatever we want to do... other than going to work...especially in the field with the sun burning our skin and our backs stiff and sore from labor. The logical response to his question is there is no advantage... what you did today at work, you will do tomorrow... names may change or location...but the job never is complete... day in and day out... what really changes in one's life? If you read on, Solomon actually answers his own question... There is no advantage for one to work from earth’s perspective because everyone is caught in the unending and unalterable cycles of life.

You see the point he was driving home to us, life on earth is transit.. "A generation goes and a generation comes, but the earth remains forever.” You are born into the world, you live your life, and then you die, but the earth keeps right on going. Sure we mourn the passing of a relative or friend, but sooner for some and later for others we do not feel the teeth of the death....we think of the departed less and less until one day, perhaps by the time grandchildren are in school... the memory fades and becomes an occasional thought or prayer... even graves are left unattended.

He goes on to the verses you quoted.... Also, the sun rises and the sun sets; and hastening to its place it rises there again. And the interesting word here is hastening... which if translated correctly would read the sun pants.... like a runner stuck on a track...around and around... no beginning or end in sight... just one step leading to the next. The wind, he writes, “Blowing toward the south, then turning toward the north, the wind continues swirling along; and on its circular courses the wind returns.” The repetition in “going round and round” heightens the sense of monotony and purposelessness. To drive his point home he goes on, “All the rivers flow into the sea, yet the sea is not full. To the place where the rivers flow, there they flow again.”

It is almost like he feels that the Universe is indifferent toward us. The universe and this world was here before we were born and will be here after we turn to dust... unless we really screw things up and explode the world in one of our constant wars... then perhaps there is an end in sight, but we pray this does not happen and most of us prefer not to think about this eventuality. From this point, he goes further into his depressive views; “All things are wearisome; man is not able to tell it. The eye is not satisfied with seeing, nor is the ear filled with hearing."

Keep in mind... Solomon was not talking about G*d, but the conditions of humankind... humans are never satisfied and humans stopped inventing things a long time ago... now we take old ideas bush them off and add a modern day twist... it does not make it new... just spray painted and tweaked. Continuing on, Solomon says "There is no remembrance of earlier things; and also of the later things which will occur, there will be for them no remembrance among those who will come later still." I find some humor in this... all my friends worry about what others think about them, their homes, cars, wealth, spouse or child... but Solomon says... you will be forgotten... no one will even remember your name in a hundred years!

Depressed yet? Well the last part of this book brings it all home... if you seek satisfaction and purpose in life... it is not evasive, out of reach. The last few verses of chapter 12 advises "Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear G*d, and keep His commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For G*d shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil."





"9 What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun."

I've been interested in hearing your thoughts on the subject, PL.

This is off subject, however I understand that your question is honest, so I will give you my opinion....now keep in mind that I am a Jew, Israelite.... however you wish to title me so my view may not fit well with Christian views. Envision a hamster in his wheel... his little legs pumping and he is doing his best to go someplace, anyplace...but each revolution is just like the last, nothing new to see and nothing new to do, no reward and no punishment. So it seems at times with human kind, for thousands of years men and women have been born.... and each generation there are the exact same things... war with all it butchery, spouses cheating on each other, money made and money spent.... a hamster wheel that we all seem to be trapped... The sun comes up and then it goes down, the seasons come and go... rivers rush to the sea, but the sea never fills up.... So at times we ask... why was I born... why am I alive, what is my purpose.

At the beginning of this book, in verses 1-3 we are introduced to the author; "The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem." And with this, we know that this is King Solomon... no longer worthy of the title king. King David had many sons, but Solomon alone was prepared and groomed to be the king. And if you look back in 1 Kings you will see a curious passage... G*d came to Solomon in a dream and asked him what was his heart's desire...what did he want for his life and future as a man and king. Solomon asked for one thing, not riches or wives, not glory or comfort... he asked for wisdom. G*d granted his request along with a few other perks such as riches and wives... success in all he attempted.

He had it all... then he broke the covenant.... he married a foreigner... one who worshiped idols and other gods. He married this foreign woman to negotiate better trade and thereby increasing his wealth. So one would think, nearing the end of his life he would write an autobiography of how to become successful... after all, he was considered very wise, patient, thoughtful, virile (as he had over 700 wives and 300 concubines), and ships arrived often filled with wealth. What more could he ask for.....

But, how does he begin to tell of his last days.... no fireworks, no appearance of our Father in flame and smoke.... no revelations of things to come... no he simply says... "Vanity of vanities! All is vanity." More appropriately he uses the Hebrew word hebel ...simply meaning it is temporary or at best meaningless. What he is saying is no person or pursuit in and of itself will bring lasting satisfaction. This verse is blunt... harsh and I think he intended to shock people out of their complacency about life.

He follows this up with a question that all logic directs you to respond in a negative way... he asks: “What advantage does man have in all his work which he does under the sun?” We all know if we had a choice, we would be on the beach, at least at our favorite fishing hole, perhaps climbing a mountain, or whatever we want to do... other than going to work...especially in the field with the sun burning our skin and our backs stiff and sore from labor. The logical response to his question is there is no advantage... what you did today at work, you will do tomorrow... names may change or location...but the job never is complete... day in and day out... what really changes in one's life? If you read on, Solomon actually answers his own question... There is no advantage for one to work from earth’s perspective because everyone is caught in the unending and unalterable cycles of life.

You see the point he was driving home to us, life on earth is transit.. "A generation goes and a generation comes, but the earth remains forever.” You are born into the world, you live your life, and then you die, but the earth keeps right on going. Sure we mourn the passing of a relative or friend, but sooner for some and later for others we do not feel the teeth of the death....we think of the departed less and less until one day, perhaps by the time grandchildren are in school... the memory fades and becomes an occasional thought or prayer... even graves are left unattended.

He goes on to the verses you quoted.... Also, the sun rises and the sun sets; and hastening to its place it rises there again. And the interesting word here is hastening... which if translated correctly would read the sun pants.... like a runner stuck on a track...around and around... no beginning or end in sight... just one step leading to the next. The wind, he writes, “Blowing toward the south, then turning toward the north, the wind continues swirling along; and on its circular courses the wind returns.” The repetition in “going round and round” heightens the sense of monotony and purposelessness. To drive his point home he goes on, “All the rivers flow into the sea, yet the sea is not full. To the place where the rivers flow, there they flow again.”

It is almost like he feels that the Universe is indifferent toward us. The universe and this world was here before we were born and will be here after we turn to dust... unless we really screw things up and explode the world in one of our constant wars... then perhaps there is an end in sight, but we pray this does not happen and most of us prefer not to think about this eventuality. From this point, he goes further into his depressive views; “All things are wearisome; man is not able to tell it. The eye is not satisfied with seeing, nor is the ear filled with hearing."

Keep in mind... Solomon was not talking about G*d, but the conditions of humankind... humans are never satisfied and humans stopped inventing things a long time ago... now we take old ideas bush them off and add a modern day twist... it does not make it new... just spray painted and tweaked. Continuing on, Solomon says "There is no remembrance of earlier things; and also of the later things which will occur, there will be for them no remembrance among those who will come later still." I find some humor in this... all my friends worry about what others think about them, their homes, cars, wealth, spouse or child... but Solomon says... you will be forgotten... no one will even remember your name in a hundred years!

Depressed yet? Well the last part of this book brings it all home... if you seek satisfaction and purpose in life... it is not evasive, out of reach. The last few verses of chapter 12 advises "Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear G*d, and keep His commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For G*d shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil."


I don't know how anyone could have interpreted it better, be they Jew or Christian. Thank you. BW


"9 What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun."

I've been interested in hearing your thoughts on the subject, PL.