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Question, do we have a right to see any evidence against us before we are even charged?
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May 22, 2018 15:27:41   #
woodguru
 
vernon wrote:
In this case I think they should have to produce there evidence .There is a great fear
Muller is going to drag this out until the election and then come up with some headline
grabbing crap to help influence the election.


It's a good thing your opinion doesn't mean anything, because Mueller has no need to produce anything until he is prepared to produce reports and evidence. My guess is he already has a full obstruction case, but is using witnesses involved to go after other things

Reply
May 22, 2018 15:31:16   #
woodguru
 
Carol Kelly wrote:
Why haven’t they used all of the information about Hillary and Bill to send them to prison for Life? Bill lied to a grand jury and walked away unscathed. Michael Flynn who served his country honorably for most of his life was accused of lying to the FBI, and even the agents said he didn’t lie but now he is a ruined man. Not ruined in my opinion and the opinion of many others, but what will history say about him? That depends on what we do now. It appears that trailer trash is above reproach, but the honorable man is vulnerable. What is wrong with this picture?
Why haven’t they used all of the information about... (show quote)


Lying to the FBI is a minor part of Flynn's problems. And the FBI has not said he didn't lie, he did in fact lie on his security application when he neglected to list contacts with Russians.

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May 22, 2018 15:35:18   #
woodguru
 
buffalo wrote:
All a dog and pony show for the little sheople. A few underlings' heads may roll but nothing will come of it this. It is ALL politics costing MILLIONS in taxpayer money por nada.

Keep your eye on the red ball and pay no attention to the man behind the curtain...


Getting more out of it than any of the Benghazi/email circle jerks that produced nothing. Plus the most damaging things so far are coming out, if the right would stop listening to FOX and pay attention to how much is coming out and how it fits with other things you'd see there is definitely something there.

Reply
 
 
May 22, 2018 15:37:32   #
woodguru
 
Blade_Runner wrote:
In the pitifully blind and ideological biased eyes of liberals, the defeat of their precious queen is the only "crime". Out of a field of 16 Republican candidates, one man stood out as a major threat, so in early 2016, the Obama administration weaponized its DOJ and FBI to surveill and investigate him in an attempt to prevent the worst "crime" in American history. Then, when American voters chose Trump as their nominee, this was evidence that a "crime" was definitely in progress, so Obama's high level operatives in the DOJ and FBI, in the Hillary campaign, and in the MSM ramped up their efforts. Yet, in spite of this subterfuge, the American voters violated the liberal laws of entitlement and elected Trump as POTUS. This was worse than a felony, this was treason, So again the Obama and Hillary operatives, and the MSM ramped up their campaign to unprecedented levels in their effort to undermine a duly elected president, to destroy him, his family, and his administration.

Trump did not elect himself, the Americans who elected him are the ones who committed the "crime". Trump is not the criminal, he is the evidence that a crime was committed.

This attempt by a sitting adminstration, the democrat nominee campaign, and the MSM to undermine and defeat its opposition and, in the process, destroy the American electoral process is the greatest political scandal in American history.

Yet, in spite of it all, both the Constitution and the law are fully on the side of the president. This is indesputable. Trump knows this and he isn't backing down, not by a long shot.
In the pitifully blind and ideological biased eyes... (show quote)


He's charging right into obstruction charges

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May 22, 2018 16:32:48   #
buffalo Loc: Texas
 
woodguru wrote:
Getting more out of it than any of the Benghazi/email circle jerks that produced nothing. Plus the most damaging things so far are coming out, if the right would stop listening to FOX and pay attention to how much is coming out and how it fits with other things you'd see there is definitely something there.


Just like nothing came out of the criminal Benghazi fiasco and other bitch clinton crimes, yet she still walks free, nothing will come from this witch hunt except a few minor expendables' heads will roll and the sheople will again have had the wool pulled over their eyes.

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May 22, 2018 16:39:48   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
woodguru wrote:
He's charging right into obstruction charges
Like hell he is.

Reply
May 22, 2018 16:49:51   #
nwtk2007 Loc: Texas
 
lpnmajor wrote:
Nope, nor do we have a right to know we're under investigation either. I'm sure Trump and his cast of clowns think there's some magic out there that will absolve them of all wrong doing, but that is as unrealistic and delusional as Trumps agenda.

Law enforcement has used confidential informants for centuries, and as long as they are not used to entice a citizen into breaking the law are perfectly legal. In this case, however, there was no confidential informant..................only a witness.

What I find most amusing about Trump's desperate attempts to create an alibi, extenuating circumstances, or a "get out of jail" card, is that it is a tacit admission of guilt. The innocent need not try to recreate history, try to influence potential jurors, try to hide evidence, or try to create conflicts of interest amongst investigators. Another amusing component to Trump's pathetic attempts to appear innocent, are the claims that Obama and the FBI were clairvoyant - and knew that Trump would win the GOP nomination and go on to win the Presidency. If that were somehow true...................why didn't they use that information to help Hillary win?
Nope, nor do we have a right to know we're under i... (show quote)


But then again, the investigators have to have good cause. If it's shown that an investigation is not proceeding appropriately, then the "evidence" can be reviewed and must be reviewed.

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May 22, 2018 16:54:56   #
Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone
 
You apparently need to go find someone to explain what it means when an individual says they "stand corrected."
woodguru wrote:
You are not entitled to any such thing, until After you are charged and the investigation is done, not while it is in progress.

The president doesn't even have any right directly questioning or being involved with the DOJ in a matter that is even close to his administration.

Nunes should have been investigated and charged with taking secrets the intelligence committee got straight to the white house, he even said he thought it was information the president should have...

Reply
May 22, 2018 16:58:37   #
buffalo Loc: Texas
 
Dog and pony show for the sheople...Hide and watch...

Reply
May 22, 2018 17:11:28   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
woodguru wrote:
You are not entitled to any such thing, until After you are charged and the investigation is done, not while it is in progress.

The president doesn't even have any right directly questioning or being involved with the DOJ in a matter that is even close to his administration.

Nunes should have been investigated and charged with taking secrets the intelligence committee got straight to the white house, he even said he thought it was information the president should have...


But he did have the right to can an investigation before it ever got started and yet he did not.....Just as he has the ability and authority to shut the damn thing down right now if he wanted and there wouldn’t be a damn thing you or anyone else could do about it.... But he has not done that either has he.??....I think he’s been exceptionally lenient and patient... It’s nothing more than a witchhunt that you’re trying to extend through the 2018 election hoping to gain more seats if you can and at that point try to do something you know won’t fly now...

And you may wish to consider something else..
Article II vests the “executive power” in the President alone, and he alone wields it. That means that the President can do what he likes with his Executive branch subordinates—hire them, fire them, ignore them, order them to act in certain ways, and the like. The presidential authority to direct and control an administration is especially clear with respect to law enforcement and national security, the story goes, since the President himself has a constitutional duty to “take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed,” and is the “Commander in Chief.” When an investigation involves the administration President typically allow it to go forward rather than shed questions of the highest office...

This has been the typical route since Watergate but it is not the requirement of the President to do so.. Trump could tell Roosenstein to fire mueller if he didn’t do it Rosenstein gets fired as does Mueller...

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May 22, 2018 17:13:21   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
woodguru wrote:
Getting more out of it than any of the Benghazi/email circle jerks that produced nothing. Plus the most damaging things so far are coming out, if the right would stop listening to FOX and pay attention to how much is coming out and how it fits with other things you'd see there is definitely something there.


Ha~~~~



Reply
 
 
May 22, 2018 19:04:02   #
permafrost Loc: Minnesota
 
lindajoy wrote:
Ha~~~~





There is a reason that most presidents have sought, publicly at least, to make clear that the DOJ is free to pursue investigations without concern of presidential meddling. Because since Richard Nixon used his administration like a personal vendetta-settling machine, there has been a renewed belief in the idea that no one is above the law and that no one can make the wheels of justice move the way they want.


Trump has repeatedly flouted that standard -- whether in his pressure campaign on Justice over the "spy" story or Giuliani's recent insistence that a president cannot be subpoenaed or indicted.
Whether or not the "spy" story is true -- or even has strands of truth to it -- is immaterial to Trump. What matters is that he has forced the Justice Department to look into it. If they find some evidence of wrongdoing, that's great for Trump -- a dagger to the Mueller probe. If they find nothing, well, that's OK too, because then he can argue they are just part of the broader "deep state conspiracy" working against Trump.


It's win-win for Trump. And a lose-lose for our democratic institutions. No one should lose sight of those twin realities or misunderstand what that tells us about a President willing to violate the norms of government for his own purposes.

Reply
May 22, 2018 22:03:05   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
Blade_Runner wrote:
In the pitifully blind and ideological biased eyes of liberals, the defeat of their precious queen is the only "crime". Out of a field of 16 Republican candidates, one man stood out as a major threat, so in early 2016, the Obama administration weaponized its DOJ and FBI to surveill and investigate him in an attempt to prevent the worst "crime" in American history. Then, when American voters chose Trump as their nominee, this was evidence that a "crime" was definitely in progress, so Obama's high level operatives in the DOJ and FBI, in the Hillary campaign, and in the MSM ramped up their efforts. Yet, in spite of this subterfuge, the American voters violated the liberal laws of entitlement and elected Trump as POTUS. This was worse than a felony, this was treason, So again the Obama and Hillary operatives, and the MSM ramped up their campaign to unprecedented levels in their effort to undermine a duly elected president, to destroy him, his family, and his administration.

Trump did not elect himself, the Americans who elected him are the ones who committed the "crime". Trump is not the criminal, he is the evidence that a crime was committed.

This attempt by a sitting adminstration, the democrat nominee campaign, and the MSM to undermine and defeat its opposition and, in the process, destroy the American electoral process is the greatest political scandal in American history.

Yet, in spite of it all, both the Constitution and the law are fully on the side of the president. This is indesputable. Trump knows this and he isn't backing down, not by a long shot.
In the pitifully blind and ideological biased eyes... (show quote)


Hot damn, Blade!!! You write beautifully, full of verifiable facts and just bring the story to unmeasured Realization.!!

This said by you is so eloquently stated I copied it to retain it!!! Hope you don’t mind??

“Trump did not elect himself, the Americans who elected him are the ones who committed the "crime". Trump is not the criminal, he is the evidence that a crime was committed.”

Amen!!!!!!!

Reply
May 22, 2018 22:28:11   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
permafrost wrote:
There is a reason that most presidents have sought, publicly at least, to make clear that the DOJ is free to pursue investigations without concern of presidential meddling. Because since Richard Nixon used his administration like a personal vendetta-settling machine, there has been a renewed belief in the idea that no one is above the law and that no one can make the wheels of justice move the way they want.


Trump has repeatedly flouted that standard -- whether in his pressure campaign on Justice over the "spy" story or Giuliani's recent insistence that a president cannot be subpoenaed or indicted.
Whether or not the "spy" story is true -- or even has strands of truth to it -- is immaterial to Trump. What matters is that he has forced the Justice Department to look into it. If they find some evidence of wrongdoing, that's great for Trump -- a dagger to the Mueller probe. If they find nothing, well, that's OK too, because then he can argue they are just part of the broader "deep state conspiracy" working against Trump.


It's win-win for Trump. And a lose-lose for our democratic institutions. No one should lose sight of those twin realities or misunderstand what that tells us about a President willing to violate the norms of government for his own purposes.
There is a reason that most presidents have sought... (show quote)


I agree with your first paragraph and only add, likewise no one is above the President .. No one, not even the President goes , unaccountable or has absolute free reign..

Since Watergate bills were past to change things but ultimately the president stays out of the way not involved so there is no Impugned wrong doing .. That is still out of courtesy to the people doing the investigation it is not because he can’t do as he wishes.

Personally I believe trump has been giving the latitude for this Russia false accusation garbage and has been patient!! They either file the damn charges or they drop it!! The people are just as fed up with it!! Playing it to the 2018 elections is all he is doing, hoping more dems seats will be had and then go after Trump..

Mueller having unlimited power, no, sorry he doesn’t ...

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May 23, 2018 06:59:17   #
old marine Loc: America home of the brave
 
Pennylynn wrote:
Indeed, you are entitled to review, along with your attorney, all evidence gathered against you.

Only after a grand jury indicted you. Your attorney is entitled to the evidence in order to prepare their clients defence.


God bless America and the President

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