Ok, BigMike. I got it! You feel that what is happening is all the Dems fault. I agree that both sides are playing games. I still feel that shutting down even 17% of the govt. is unnecessary, especially over the ACA (Obamacare). We NEED universal health care, which is something that ALL developed nations have, EXCEPT the USA. It will not bankrupt us, if everyone participates. It is likely to even SAVE money for the govt. I also feel that defaulting on our debt is a very BAD idea, despite what Ted Cruz thinks. My question is why are these mostly grown men and women acting like such great big babies? Guess they don't have much respect for the people they represent.

Thanks, claytonin, for backing me up. I am not a "T tard" to use BoJester's term. In fact, some people call me a raving liberal. And I might just agree with BoJester's perspective, if he/she would express him/herself in a way that doesn't disgust most people. But when a person has no other way to express their disagreements except by being crude and insulting, it does nothing to enhance their position. Get a clue, BoJester. Clean up your posts. You can disagree without being disagreeable. I might just want to hear what you have to say if you can express yourself without the use of the verbal filth.

Thank-you for your well-expressed and cogent input. I am aware of the deficit and I agree with you, we MUST do something to stop the excessive spending in Washington. I am just not convinced that shutting down the government is the way to get this done. Ultimately, it will cost us a lot if the government defaults on its debt. I can see the future, and I believe that a duel approach, increasing taxes on the very wealthy and decreasing tax loopholes that allow many to avoid paying their fair share should be considered. We certainly need to evaluate our spending and cut where it will do the most good. I am still not convinced that the government shutdown will accomplish what we both seem to want, responsible government by our lawmakers. Again, thank-you for your input. I enjoy having a productive conversation with folks like you. I hope we can speak again. Take care.

Thank-you for your well-expressed and cogent input. I am aware of the deficit and I agree with you, we MUST do something to stop the excessive spending in Washington. I am just not convinced that shutting down the government is the way to get this done. Ultimately, it will cost us a lot if the government defaults on its debt. I can see the future, and I believe that a duel approach, increasing taxes on the very wealthy and decreasing tax loopholes that allow many to avoid paying their fair share should be considered. We certainly need to evaluate our spending and cut where it will do the most good. I am still not convinced that the government shutdown will accomplish what we both seem to want, responsible government by our lawmakers. Again, thank-you for your input. I enjoy having a productive conversation with folks like you. I hope we can speak again. Take care.

I frankly don't care WHO those terms were sent to. They are offensive, unnecessary and reveal nothing but the stupidity and crudeness of the writer. I still don't want to have to wade through the garbage this person spews in order to carry on a conversation with the person they were aimed at or anyone else. If BoJester makes this type of "conversation" a habit, and I suspect that he does, I don't want to have to read it. My choice, You do what you want. I don't like wallowing in pig poop.

In a way, I hope that Cruz does run. He will be beaten by Hillary in a landslide. Go ahead, T Party hopefuls, push for his nomination. It will make our task to elect a Democrat so much easier. You realize, of course that the Repugs will never nominate Ted Cruz. Most of them despise the man. And he hasn't shown any attempts to work with members of his own party. He is a divider, not a uniter, and he has his own best interests at heart, not the country's and not the Republican party. He will be the final nail in the coffin of the Republican party and I can't wait to see them crash and disappear.

Why is it that you T party types always try to distort what the majority of people are saying. When we v**ed in the last e******n, we v**ed to reelect the President. The last e******n was also a referendum on the ACA. The MAJORITY of American citizens v**ed FOR the ACA. That means that the minority T party should have to honor that e******n, not try and subvert or nullify it. The T Party should accept the results of the free and f**r e******n that approved Obamacare and the President. That is the American way.

I didn't say that the ACA was bad or good for the country. I said that the government SHUTDOWN by a handful of minority republicans was bad for the country. The ACA is a LAW. It can be amended, and it probably will be. Shutting down the government is NOT the way to amend the law. It is not the way to amend ANY law and it certainly isn't the way to run the government. It is not how our founding fathers ran the government, nor is it the way they designed the balance of powers. It is unproductive and it does nothing but damage the economy and the American people. Immature and irresponsible politicians who ought to know better prefer to extort legislative change rather than work it out through balanced and reasonable negeotiation. That is what I find frustrating.

malestrom, I agree with you. It's too bad that our Republican politicians have decided to test the full faith and credit of the USA as well as signal our enemies that we can't move ahead due to a minority of extremists. This is bad for our country. It is bad for our government and if the Dems and the President cave in to these T party extortionists, it will set a precident that whenever extremists do not like the results of a free and f**r e******n, they can sabotage it by refusing to fund the government itself. It is e******n nullification on a huge scale and it undermines everything our country stands for. A few ideologues should not be able to shut down the country and harm millions of Americans to get their own way, and to take the results of an e******n away from the v**ers.

Well, BoJester certainly turned me off! I'm not used to that level of obscenity and hostility. Calling people names like "stupid" or "moron" is one thing, calling people "douchebags" and "dogpile" is something else again. It frankly makes me queasy. I wasn't raised like that. Glad you can handle his insults. I just can't. It isn't fun for me to have to wade through filth in order to chat with someone else. You'd need hip boots to get through BoJester's muck. Ain't worth it. I'd probably enjoy talking to you, but don't want to have to deal with BoJester's insults. Sorry! But thanks for the thumbs up, anyway. Take Care and Stay Strong.

Wow, I now live in the country with chickens, 2 dogs and 2 cats. I worry about the cats, because they want to hunt at night. I don't let either of the dogs out at night, and I try to keep the cats in, as well. We have coyotes around here, and they can be aggressive. My big dog makes so much noise that, so far, the coyotes have left the chickens alone. I also have them fenced in at night. Recently I saw a large, very healthy-looking coyote crossing the road in broad daylight. So perhaps I should fence the chickens in during the day as well. The dogs have a large run that is strongly fenced, and the cats sleep all day, or lay outside near the house. I don't worry about them during the day.

Not everyone who lives in "the city" sells drugs. or is a prostitute. I've lived in a city (actually various cities) for over half my life, and I never actually "knew" anyone who did either of those things. I knew there were people who did, but I never ran into them, personally. I actually have had a fairly crime-free life in the cities I've lived in. I have never been robbed or mugged, never had anyone stalk me, never felt the need to carry a weapon. Maybe I was just lucky, I don't know. And I worked until 9 or 10 PM in a hospital, so I was walking around in a "t***sitional" neighborhood at night to get to my car. My car was never stolen or vandalized, either. I guess I was lucky.

Interestingly, all of these successful people were raised in a mixed neighborhood of b****s, w****s and latinos. All, including myself went to a public high school in that same neighborhood. We lived in a moderate -sized city of about 50 -65 thousand people in the city proper. The city itself is in Western NY and has a large suburban population, as well. I think that probably 2/3 of these people came from fairly liberal backgrounds. Their fathers were teachers, researchers at the local university, a librarian, a dentist, a physician, a pharmacist etc. The 2 men who were trades people had fathers who were a sales manager and an electrician. Most of the people who were raised as liberals stayed liberal. One did not, and is a Republican. None are libertarians. I know that 3 of the dozen were raised Roman Catholic. Two were raised Unitarian/Universalist, as was I. The rest were raised, either with no religious affiliation,(2) and 4 were members of various Protestant denominations.

You asked if my wealthier friends got that way through natural intelligence, a good education, hard work and good parenting. I would have to say "Yes". All of them, black and white, came from what I would call a "middle class" background. They didn't all come from money, in fact, a lot of them did not. But they all had good, strong, loving families, a solid education, including some college, a strong work ethic and native intelligence. Not all were "book smart" but they all liked to read, and they all believed in working hard. Most had jobs starting in high school. All were good students, none had problems with drugs or alcohol. Two of them, guys who attended "trade" colleges, made money the old fashioned way, they worked with their hands, but they were smart, always kept up with the latest technology in their fields and worked very hard. Interestingly, those guys made larger incomes than some of the ones who went to traditional 4 year colleges. The college grads ALL got advanced degrees, either Masters or PhD's. Some earned two advanced degrees. All but two of them are liberals. The two guys who owned their own businesses are more conservative, moderate Republicans. Hope this answers your question. I think you and I probbly agree that it takes most of the factors we've both cited to be a success. Certainly the strong family is a large factor, as is hard work. Education is a close third and native intelligence would be the fourth component in order of importance. What do you think?