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Nov 19, 2013 10:45:31   #
lpnmajor wrote:
You guys just can't help yourselves. Can we all just agree that Obama is a bad president - and move on to something else? I think that everyone is convinced already, at least, those who are going to be. :P


Yes! By all means lets now move on to the "obstructionist" party....the party of "NO".

One could only imagine if past administrations had to put up with a Congress we have today...it is so easy to cast the blame being closed minded and never seeing anything that has a positive value only because it doesn't resonate with our preconceived notions. Right? Let us look at gas prices...when they are high Pres. Obama gets blamed but now they are under $3.00 a gallon and we don't hear a sound and look at Wall St. record highs ...now at over 16,000. Well we can BLAME Pres. Obama for that..,.RIGHT?

Pro-Life should be Pro-Birth because after they are born life starts which the Reps. have abandoned by fighting against maternity issues....they have abandoned babies after they are born.

Healthcare for all is bad... RIGHT? Well it is unless it affects me....RIGHT?

Talk about bad Pres....how about Reagan who decided, by Alan Greenspan's suggestion to raid Soc. Sec. for hundreds of billions and giving an IOU....because having cut taxes for his cronies from 70% to 28% brought the country close to bankruptcy.

And Pres. Bush who also hit Soc. Sec. And when Florida was caught in a bad hurricane Pres. Bush came to his brother Jeb's aid right away but when Katrina hit Louisiana Pres. Bush left it up to Brownie while he went to Cal. to play golf.

And the 2 wars that he lied about. And the second term that Jeb helped his brother win.

There is a list of so called 'bad' presidents....Carry on....
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Nov 19, 2013 08:38:32   #
dville wrote:
There is no one on the horizon to contest Hillary...

If someone wants to challenge her they had better get on the move because Hillary IS on the move. :lol:


I will update that by saying Elizabeth Warren is coming into the fray.
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Nov 18, 2013 10:07:56   #
[quote=larry]Mostly because it is unusual to expect it. But those that do not believe in God are doing it all the time, and they have no excuse for their behavior, in fact they believe it is right. Might makes right to the ungodly.[/quote

Circumstances bring on different actions from different people, not that they THINK it is right...that is not proven but is surmised by some religious believers.

Those that believe in a god with the precepts of goodness violate that belief by going against those precepts. ]
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Nov 10, 2013 08:35:48   #
larry wrote:
\\\\\
Well I am back, but whether I will finish with each paragraph you have exposed or not may not be possible. It make take more than one session to see where your opinion and mine differ or coincide. Be patient with me.

Your first statement was that you take your position from the life you have lead an your life experiences

1. My belief which is really not a belief but is what is physically happening on this planet presently; in the past history and what happens in the future.

1. There are many stories and legends of history, some coincide, and some are completely different descriptions of the same thing. However, if you are willing to accept the Bible as a baseline, because it covers many ages and has been written by many authors over these ages, we find remarkable congruence in the writing by various authors. The remarkable thing about the bible is that the full story is usually covered by authors that have never known each other, but have put down "visions" or "dreams" that have predicted the future events of earth's history. It is only when these predictions come true and history records it that we feel compelled to believe it's t***h. Sometimes it takes us a while before we can coincide the symbolism of the dream with reality, but when it fits, we need to or are willing to accept it.

2. I believe that something, not a being, has created all that we see and experience in our daily discourse.

2. This is a novel idea to me, that an unknown something can do anything. It is more like magic, which is really misdirection disguised as reality.
I am not belittling your idea so much as trying to wrap my mind around such a concept. If you agree with me that nothing is ever accomplished without a desire to accomplish it, we find ourselves trapped into the idea that a person must be involved, or at least a thinking entity. A something without a personality or mind will have little chance of getting anywhere. Which by the way is one of the things that makes evolution bizarre. In order to change anything, there must be a desire to do so. If you are a perfectly happy one celled entity in your environment, you will not have the desire to change it.

3.I believe science is proving many things about our origin on a daily basis which is factual and provable but in most cases is repelled by a theistic belief.

3. This is a misconception of the ability of science. Science can only work with and interpret the present environment, the one it is dealing with at the moment. It can also make some possible predictions based on proven facts of the situation.

It can not predict the result outside of the system it is in. When the operating principles of the system are determined within some area of predictability, the tendency is to jump to the conclusion that this is the case for all systems.

It is only by experiment that we can determine the complexity of this creation or as you prefer system in existence. To attribute to science accuracy it does not have, such as Millions and billions of years of earth history without any factual baseline, is to fool oneself into a more bizarre story than any religious belief. It takes more "faith" to believe that fantasy than it does to believe the written and authenticated history of the Bible.

4.I have been designed with DNA to follow a predetermined course as a human being as does the ape, the ant, and all living things according to their genesis.

4. I don't know know what DNA has to do with it, DNA is only the master pattern set into us by ? magic? or our creator? All things that are destined to live in this environment are started with a pattern of design. Trees, animals, plants, any living thing has a pattern. Each of us has a separate and distinct pattern which is a combination of the Male and Female baselines. According to God, These elements combine in our children to create a unique individual totally separate from the parents, yet alike in all ways. When this pattern is damaged by chemicals or disease, we sometimes have individuals that are not complete to their intended pattern. But, there is only in this pattern the form and function. How we develop it is dependent upon or environment and nurturing. The parents and the social environment have more to do with it than anything. We are endowed with a pattern of behavior at birth, that is modified as we live after we are cognizant of our surroundings. Usually after about eight years of age. Then we develop our self according to our interests and desires, and needs. However, I do believe in each living thing, there is a desire or need to seek our origin. In most cases, this is what we call God. We can deny that desire, but I don't believe it is natural. Too many primitive people have devised a God image or have sought to explain the beginning without any external influence. It seems to be inherent to seek God.

5.I believe when I die I will go back to the earth from whence I came. When someone I know or was associated with I greave of the loss.

5. Now this is also part of belief in God. If you believe you were made from earth, this is the origin in Genesis in the Bible. And this belief is carried through with the coincidence of spiritual life animating the body. The spirit of animation comes from somewhere, Christians believe it comes from God, is only a temporary attachment, and returns to God when He wants it. The body made of earth is returned to earth The Bible tells us that the life of all is in the blood. If the blood supply is stilled, the entity dies, and the life force returns to God. The person who was alive, is not any more conscious of anything happening on earth or anywhere else. Christians believe that God holds these records in place and restores them to a believer at resurrection. So theoretically, no one who believes is totally obscured. This has been demonstrated in several cases in the Bible, but since we have no actual experience with such a phenomena, we have to take it on faith.

6. I believe in the teachings of Jesus the Christ to the extent that He cared for the poor, the meek, the weak and the sick and that is why I, politically, am a Democrat.

6. Yes, Jesus did care for the poor, the meek, and the weak, and the sick as much as He was able. But, he did not take anyone else's commodities to do it. He used His own riches, which is different from the Democratic theme of using your wealth and not their own to do good, hoping that you will willingly give up what your need for someone else's desires.

It is easy to spend someone else's money to do good, but it is more pure and decent to spend your own money or resources to do it. The government that takes from everyone to give to those that don't have it, are what we call socialist or c*******t. believing that no one has the right to own anything, but must share it with all. I am sure you give away a lot of your wealth to others, so that you are just as poor as they are. It gives you a good feeling to be so magnanimous doesn't it. I would do so too with your wealth and feel good about it. I would like to impoverish you to feel generous. Which is what this Democratic party is doing, taking my money and wealth and spending it as if it is their own. Bah Humbug!

7.I believe that everyone has the right to live their own life as they please within the confines of social and civil laws without being dictated beyond that. To each his own...live and let live.

7. I find no fault in this belief, and embrace it wholeheartedly.
This caveat of confines of social and civil laws, is the only thing that makes it difficult. When a law is made that is destructive on the social harmony of a society, it should not be enforced to the point where it disrupts civil tranquility. There were examples of law that did that which have since been deleted, ie. segregation, s***ery, womens rights etc. You know what I mean without me going through the whole litany of mistakes. I do believe that a******n is not a woman's right exclusively, it should be a joint decision by both the man and the woman. Both must be willing to k**l their progeny before the society can condone it. And then it should only be by court order because it is murder in my opinion. Those that believe in God will have to deal with that issue between themselves and God.

8.I would challenge you about atheists not being aware ot their surroundings. As in our daily discourse we see what is actual and factual and respond to that as opposed to a belief that puts more emphasis on a deity placing reality as second.

8. I did not say Atheists were not aware of their surroundings, I said that they did not want to be aware of the religious implications of events. (I am not sure I even said that, but I thought it.) The beliefs of individuals or anyone are not readily disclosed in events. What appears to be reality may not be, but may be a manufactured series of events meant to influence those that have a weak base of beliefs in the first place. The Klu-Klux-Klan, is an example of an organization that attempted to create an environment of fear and superiority that was based on environmental and false beliefs.
The fact that these events were cloaked in religion makes it even worse because there was not base for it in any religion. I was a lie from the start.

Now this is all for the moment, I am sure you will have a sensible rebuttal to my opinion, and I await it with baited breath.
\\\\\ br Well I am back, but whether I will finish... (show quote)


Well Sir I believe we have reached an impasse...we have brought forth each of our ideas and thoughts that will not bring any resolution.

You have laid out the foundation of your belief and given the Bible as a doctrine of fact when in effect it was written by ordinary men with inspiration.

It has been said (by the believers) that the Bible is the inerrant word of God and yet for over 1400 years scribes have altered, by accident , intent, omission and even King James, and yet God has never intervened to condemn those that are guilty, so what was the original word of God no one will ever know.

We all live in this physical world and that is where my world ends. Yours, through your belief, is a prelude to a life after death.

I am not going to go through all the differences that we have expressed because it will bring very little or no resolve to the issues we've raised.

It is your BELIEF in the Bible as literal and my FACTS as is proven in my everyday discourse that we will not resolve our differences.

That is the case with religion and politics of which you have as well as I have expressed.

Thank you for your views but as I have said we have reached an impasse.

I don't believe further discussion can produce any resolution. Thank You
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Nov 9, 2013 12:52:41   #
larry wrote:
I was going to go over this carefully because I believe you need a formal reply to everything you have posted, but I don't have the time right now. I will just say this, I do not believe that Atheists are the devil, trouble makers, etc, I just believe they are not fully aware of their surroundings, and the reality of a supernatural creator. But I will say this at this time, If you do not believe in an imperial creator, what do you believe in, you are good at saying what you do not believe in , but what do you believe in, if you have any belief at all. Let us start with your foundational beliefs, and see if there is any thing we can agree on. You obviously do not agree on a supreme being, What is it that you hang your hat on?
I was going to go over this carefully because I be... (show quote)


My belief which is really not a belief but is what is physically happening on this planet presently; in the past history and what happens in the future.

I believe that something, not a being, has created all that we see and experience in our daily discourse.

I believe science is proving many things about our origin on a daily basis which is factual and provable but in most cases is repelled by a theistic belief.

I have been designed with DNA to follow a predetermined course as a human being as does the ape, the ant, and all living things according to their genesis.

I believe when I die I will go back to the earth from whence I came. When someone I know or was associated with I greave of the loss.

I believe in the teachings of Jesus the Christ to the extent that He cared for the poor, the meek, the weak and the sick and that is why I, politically, am a Democrat.

I believe that everyone has the right to live their own life as they please within the confines of social and civil laws without being dictated beyond that. To each his own...live and let live.

I would challenge you about atheists not being aware ot their surroundings. As in our daily discourse we see what is actual and factual and respond to that as opposed to a belief that puts more emphasis on a deity placing reality as second.

When you find the time I am open for discussion. Don
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Nov 9, 2013 10:47:07   #
larry wrote:
A truly religious person, believes in the sanctity of life, and has demonstrated it time and time again. Christians have willingly died for other people. If any Atheists have no one know about it. I do not believe in a God of cruelty and death as you do, I believe in a God of Love, who took the blame for every sinner on earth, you included, if you accept that gift,

Almost all wars, are started by people that believe they have the only God. As Atheists do. You claim that Christians start wars? What wars? Don't give me the Roman Church, that is a Pagan religion.
A truly religious person, believes in the sanctity... (show quote)


You imply that I believe in a God of cruelty and death.
Wrong! I don't believe in God....Period. Earlier on this thread it was said that atheist started all wars...I will address that momentarily.

It has also been said that Jesus was the physical being of God. So then God also condones s***ery...I would have a very hard time believing that a God giving life to all would create another being that was meant to serve other people under subservient conditions.

As to wars...those driven by terrestrial concerns are for the most part religious.....here are a few....Palestine
(Jews vs. Muslims), the Balkans (Orthodox Serbians vs Catholic Croatians; Orthodox Serbians vs Bosnian and Albanian Muslims), Northern Ireland (Protestants vs Catholics), Kashmir (Muslims vs Hindus), Sudan (Muslim vs Christians),Nigeria (Muslims vs Christians) Ethiopia and Eritrea (Muslims vs Christians), Ivory coast (Muslims vs Christians), Sri Lanka (Sinhalese Buddhists vs Tamil Hindus), Philippines (Muslims vs Christians), Iran and Iraq (Shiite vs Sunni Muslims), Caucasus (Orthodox Russians vs Chechen Muslims), to name a few.
There are no atheist here. My claim is that RELIGIONS start wars, not atheists...we want to live and let live.

Atheists don't start wars, don't gather in groups of thousands demanding attention, don't have a movement, don't intrude on government policies. We only act as any individual in a societal discourse.

I would submit that any religion to believe in came from what a person has been exposed to and also resonates with. A belief in a "higher power"...a God. A belief of a God, a protector, a leader, etc. It is a matter of what we put in our grey matter. If we were born in a location quite distant from ours we would join with that religion as a daily discourse, part being it was the religion of choice for that sect of people.

God in Christianity is their Savior....what does that suggest? It suggests that if we believe in Him He will forgive the sins that we have, that we wewre born with....suggesting that God created a sinner therefore we need to answer to Him. With any religion if you don't believe as I do you are worshipping the wrong God, and that is the foundation of wars..

I would suggest that worshipping a higher power (religion) started hundreds of thousands of years before our known religions of today by the hominid when he became self aware and able to think for himself and realized that there must be a super power, a being, to be praised for what they have been given. A MAN surely not a female.

If we don't believe the same as another person we are atheists, the devil, evil, trouble makers, etc. So be it.....
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Nov 2, 2013 11:14:45   #
DocSavage wrote:
That's really terrible that you say God wasn't there for you. You talk about starting early at 7. How about starting from the time of my birth. Just flip back to where I started posting here. I grew up a ward of the courts. I'll just say that the parents I should have had where meant to be with each other but were never meant to have children. To talk of early, from my earliest memories I've had The Father and Son, and Holy Spirit in me from the getgo. At 7, back in the early 50's I had already spent more time living on the streets, then in the many institutions they put me in. You say, "(I have also aligned with the precepts of Jesus teachings and caring for the downtrodden; the meek , weak and the sick)". You are referring to when Christ was here in the Flesh. He healed the sick, and raised the downtrodden up, He gave courage to the meek, He raised the dead, as in Lazarus. By no means take this as if I were condemning you, by no means do I ever do that, nor do I Judge. I am just relating from an earlier age also as you too have said. The times I was picked up by the police and dumped in another institution, you talk of a space. By 7, my space was an open cubby, no door and 2 bunks, almost side by side. There was barely room to put your feet on the floor to get dressed. But I became quite good at running. And I was lucky, if you read back enough, the Korean Street Vets of that time looked out for me. There was no such things as dumpsters back then, just garbage cans. I've written my whole past, so if you want to know more it's here. But I just wanted to make the point that to this day at 65 Christ is as strong in me now as he was then. I'm dieing from AOD, and never new I had it until I was 55. At 50 I had already had 2 heart surgery's 9 months apart. At 55, from my time in the Army in 1966 the diagnosis came in with multiple Physical Malady's in the beginning stages. My legs don't work any more, and example, 2 days ago the mail carrier, cuase I live in the Boonies left a note saying the angle was to steep for her truck, and I needed to Fix it. I called the P.O. and they said hire someone. Yea right, like my nearest neighbors are but 2 of them, and can't even tell you their names. So I get out to the garage in my Wheelchair. The V.A. put a ramp in for me, but I chose a manual chair because my arms still work, even though they are covered with Decubitus Ulcers, as my legs and back, some so deep you can set a quater in them and it will seat 1/2" down. I tell you this because, it is not from God or Christ. It is from man, and a company called Monsanto. So now the Dioxin eats it's way out of me from the inside. I mention this because there are many documented healing miracles, from our Lord, but his purpose is different for every one of us. Me, I have already seen 100's of fellow Vets that I sat next to over the past few years move on to a new spiritual body, as I will soon, and I'm tired of this broken down physical body. So where's my Miracle? Right here. I'm still going, and won't stop till he calls me. Just look at 2 Corinthians 10 when Paul wrote his 2nd Epistle to the Corinithians, and states in his letter,
"By the humility and gentleness of Christ, I appeal to you—I, Paul, who am “timid” when face to face with you, but “bold” toward you when away! I beg you that when I come I may not have to be as bold as I expect to be toward some people who think that we live by the standards of this world. For though we live in the world, we do not wage war as the world does. The weapons we fight with are not the weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ. And we will be ready to punish every act of disobedience, once your obedience is complete". I quote that because many don't realize how humble Paul was. Yet at the same time Spiritually, how great his strength was. But at the time Paul wrote this, everything was God Breathed by the Father. And everyone of the Apostles where Martyred except for Matthew. According to some of the oldest sources, he was not martyred. Other sources hold that Ethiopia was the place where he died; and that he was stabbed to death there.
The point being here, that everyone of us has a Soul, and it is freely your choice to believe as you wish, but I know how lonely, one is with no faith. Spiritual Faith has made my life full. And to know that when you go Before The Father , Through The Son, it is about the most wonderful experience you will ever have. Nothing in this world can compare to that moment. Our Father does move in mysterious ways, and it is not for us to question, but to accept that.

One Bible that helps me to bring everything in perspective, is a Chronological Bible, and the Strong's Concordance. So yes, in the past I Prayed for a Healing, but since my many physical malady's are all from man, I don't blame Our Father for it. So you talk about sharing a space. Since 1969, I've been well Blessed. Living as far away from man as possible, and with my wife of 33 years, and the pets we've had through them have all been precious. My sermons are to the wildlife, and yes have even had a coyote come back a 2nd time to hear me. So as a Christian Pastor I like to think of myself in a way as St Francis, who was the Patron Saint to Animals.

Where politics are concerned you cannot abide by either side of the aisle as it says in Romans 13 to abide by the Government. As a Pastor, I can discern, and even most other people can see that our present Government is ruled by a Monster, who when he migrated from Kenya, to India, constantly preached his h**e and contempt for America. And by the Devil himself, along with George Soros illegally became our President, built on a foundation of lies of T***sparency. His 2nd run was a sham, and so many millions of i******s he brought over here from Cuba, Mexico, and the 1000's upon 1000's of Hamas Terrorists, and Hezbollah, Al Quida, and Al Shababb, and the v**es from people that had passed away, all lies. Just as his Obama Care has destroyed the once greatest Hospitalization and Insurance plans that we had, to his lies of Obamacare, or the Unaffordable Care Act, is all from the beast, that now calls himself Dictator! 2 Timothy 3 sums up everything in Government today. It is as run by Dathan, when he led the people back to Idolatry and all sorts of Lascivious blasphemey's.

I've always considered myself humble, and have never tried to push religion or faith on anyone that doesn't believe if 2 or more are gathered in his name he is there. I no not what age your at today, but will say a prayer that wh**ever it is you prayed for at 7, and didn't play out as you prayed, that there was a reason for wh**ever you saw as negative, that no one would have comprehended other then Our Father to the outcome. So, each sunrise I am happy to spend another day with all my critters, and know I will be with all the ones I've lost over the decades to age, or sickness. So I Pray in the name of Christ, and our Father that your heart be touched, as he has mine, and carried me for 65 years now. N'Christ' Jesus, Amen Pastor Marc
That's really terrible that you say God wasn't the... (show quote)


If I were religious i would pray for you.

As a Republican ....their policies as I have pointed out are against the precepts of Jesus Christ. So be it....they are in a hole and keep digging deeper.

They are showing on a daily basis their determination to reduce our countries democratic life to be ruled by BIG MONEY. Democracy to Oligarchy.

Condemn Pres. Obama and the Democrats all you want but to align against them wanting to address the peoples needs is hypocritical to your religious beliefs.

I as well have but a handful of years left and will until the day I die defend my position of concern for the WHOLE of our country and not for the money mongers.

With the faults of the present situation our President IS trying to do FOR the country and not TEAR IT DOWN
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Nov 1, 2013 17:42:16   #
epluribus36 wrote:
I personally believe there is a God answering prayers, but I don't think he's necessarily answering prayers for people on this Earth.

He sent his Son, who was really God Himself, to wash us clean with His blood, so that all our sins are forgiven, and therefore give us all a chance to enter his Kingdom of Heaven, if we only admit we are sinners, and believe in Jesus.

Now that's the real answered prayer, in my humble opinion!


To my belief prayers for someone is to have concern ....and that is a good thing, to believe that God answers prayers on an individual basis is a toss of the coin.

I don't believe in a personal God. If we are to believe that we are sinners at birth and need redemption than I would say that God did not put forward a pure being and only the belief in him will give us forgiveness. It sounds like a game to me.

When ever religions are discussed the faithful seem to always recite from their bible. I come from reality, actuality and actual t***h....not claimed from belief.
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Nov 1, 2013 11:36:11   #
larry wrote:
you displayed this
Your claim is that the atheists started all wars...that is so sick...that is your defense of religion.....anything... anyone that does not align with your belief is an atheist therefore if they didn't give you free reign to your belief that they were the perpetrators.

There is no room for the greed of war in the Christian concept. It is always some one that does not believe in treating another as they want to be treated that starts a war. You believe in doing unto others as yourself, That happens to be a statement from the God of Love, so apparently you are not a true Atheist. You still want to accept the precepts of religion but want not to be held accountable for your behavior.

Why bother making an issue of it, just believe in yourself. Whether you believe in God or not is your solution to your life style. And it is easy to make up rules for your behavior to let you have no accountability to your possible creator. If you don't believe in God, maybe someday you will change your mind. you cannot find God if you do not look for Him. But, God will still pursue you. You may not be able to elude Him after all.
you displayed this br Your claim is that the athe... (show quote)


I believe that a good life here on earth should be for every living thing....and share a space as I do.

I learned early on (7 years old) that God was not there for me, and I had a lot of faith in Jesus to answer my prayers....he did not.

I have also aligned with the precepts of Jesus teachings and caring for the downtrodden; the meek , weak and the sick.

I am very discouraged by the Republican party taking from those that need and favoring the rich and aligning with the 'religious right". Something very wrong there.

I believe in the creation of everything....I just don't believe in a person being responsible for it....and of course it had to be a male as our creator not a female which I agree because no woman would create such a mess.

If, as you believe there is a God and a living Christ out there answering prayers and controlling our destiny than all I have to say is that they are doing a lousy job.
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Oct 25, 2013 10:27:32   #
larry wrote:
You have apparently flown off the handle in your response, because you have made some wild statements.

You claim a moral standard? where does your morality come from? How do you know it is moral? The reality is that morality is not an individual concept. All secular laws and standards have come from religion. Modified certainly to justify actions. Unless you have a law giver, you do not have law. Who creates law? In your world, you do. Therefore your morality is based on your selfish feelings. Your desire, your greed.

You claim that religion is not based on reality? By your experience you are right, but religion is based primarily in faith on the t***h of the supreme being. It means that you must have t***h to begin with. If you do not believe in a foundation of t***h, you have nothing.

You are listing things you are against that were created in a secular society. that have no base in religion, well maybe it depends on which religion you are quoting. Some so called religions are based on secular standards. You must be discerning. But to know morality, you must know immorality, otherwise there is no difference.

Atheists do not cause wars? You might want to think that over a bit. There have been countless wars perpetrated by atheists in the history of this planet. And the response to these actions, usually Christian forces have defended against their intrusions. Almost all wars have been started by atheists.

Genocide, is a secular, concept. usually resisted by Christianity, it is not Christian . It may be Pagan.

Admittedly, there are Churches that profess to be Christian, but are not much different than any secular organization. That is no reason to condemn them all.

Just as law abiding atheists are acknowledged, as long as we follow the standards of society they are their own religion.
You believe in your condition as the right condition, fine, but it does not give you license to create your own separate t***h.

Tell me, what standard of morality do you believe in, and where does it come from?
You have apparently flown off the handle in your r... (show quote)


You are well entrenched in your belief...fine, enjoy it.

My moral standard has been born in me...it's in my DNA. Just as our ancient primate cousins did not condone murder, lying, adultery and other immoral traits preceded the Ten Commandments and the moral foundations in the Bible.

What Christian has not defiled their parents, or lied, or committed adultery and even murder with a cross h*****g from their neck.

My personal moral standard to my fellow man is to do unto others as they would do unto me. Live and let live...and they deserve to enjoy their space on earth as I do. The Bible does not make the best case for morality.

When did religions start in your opinion....and why? Did not what the creator give to us was not enough or needed correction or upgrading. Why did man have to create religion?

Here is another of your new beliefs....Intelligent Design, lets look at the male whose urinary canal is surrounded by the prostate gland which enlarges as he gets older causing a medical problem or the fistula in a women which k**ls 5000 women a year, or the lowly lizard who sheds its tail to danger only to grow another tail back but the soldier losing an arm or leg can't grow one back.

Your claim is that the atheists started all wars...that is so sick...that is your defense of religion.....anything... anyone that does not align with your belief is an atheist therefore if they didn't give you free reign to your belief that they were the perpetrators.

Genocide is the result of the immoral position that religion not paganism has manifest in So. Africa.

Each and every religion is the ONLY religion and if you don't believe as I do we will fight. Religious and ethnic wars are going on all over the world...not by atheists...

Your claim in so many words is that without religion we would have no morality...that is hog wash...and that doesn't give much credit to the god that you worship suggesting man made religion has to refine His work...that is beyond the beyond, however, I am not surprised.

Religions have a long history of violent crimes against humanity not atheists...we live our lives in normal discourse as religions encroach on our society and civility causing laws to favor religious dogma under threat.
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Oct 25, 2013 01:05:31   #
BuildYourHome wrote:
Hello Jack,

as a Judeo Christian I have found that there are many mis-t***slations in the King James Version. King James ordered
a Bible to be written in "Shakesperian Style" which was
rather impossible if one would not add or mis-t***slate
words..Many times we find that the word "blessed" is
actually "happy, worthy" etc. The word blessed in the
earliest t***slations found are only to be used by Yeshua,
not any lay person.
When reading the 8th Commanment we find "Thou shall
not steal"..actually it is only two words that state: Rob
Not" Rob in the old Hebrew meant Not stealing someone
of his freedom..Steal in Hebrew meant Not stealing someones
property. The 8th Commandment is explained when we
go to Ex 21:16. Many European scholars are now given a
more correct t***slation which reads as follows:
"Steal Not someones Property and Rob Not someone of
his freedom" If we would have had the correct t***slation in
the 1600's we would never had s***ery and s***ery could
have been eliminated by the 4th Century.

Have a nice Sabbath!
Hello Jack, br br as a Judeo Christian I have fou... (show quote)


You have pointed out the t***slation errors that happen in that instance...another is the interpretation of the 'virgin mother Mary'...in Hebrew the word 'alma' means young women, however, it was t***slated into the Greek word 'parthenos' meaning 'virgin'.
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Oct 25, 2013 00:51:00   #
larry wrote:
The great lie that you and others believe, is that there is no God. This attitude leaves you outside of any standards of civilization. There are no moral standards in Atheism. For who or what can define it if is a belief with out foundation. Atheism seems to be a life without purpose or need. yet full of desire that the non-believer becomes his own God entitled to any kind of behavior he pleases. Since the Atheist has no moral foundation, they have no moral rights. Is this the kind of existence your believe in? Atheists then are at the same level as animals. They live by instinct only, and yet are learning behavior from their environment. No chance of hope, no fulfillment of desire other than what others allow. The only status an Atheist stands, is by tolerance of their humanity. That other humans give them. Atheists then have to depend on the good will of believers for their existence. Yet Atheists copy the behavior of believers and enjoy the fruits of a believers civil construct. What kind of progress can be fulfilled by that hopeless existence.
The great lie that you and others believe, is that... (show quote)


It appears by your personal position that a person that is not involved in a man made religion has no moral standard...That position in itself tells me a multitude of what you know of reality.

First off i don't need any dogmatic belief to guide me or to lean on in my daily discourse. I have much purpose and need and I don't need to be told by you or anyone that I am outside of any standards of civilization.

You say that I would have no moral foundation and rights....WOW.

Now let me straighten you out a bit. Pick up your bible and turn to these passages and let us see what morality looks like from your side.

If the children get out of line beat them with a rod... Proverbs 13:24, ...talking back, k**l them,,,Leviticus 20:9...Deuteronomy 21:18-21...Mark 7:9-13...Mathew 15: 4-7. ....and stone people to death for heresy, adultery, homosexuality, working on the Sabbath, worshiping graven images, sorcery, etc.

Here is another one of your charms...."if your brother, son of your mother, or your son, or your daughter, or the wife of your bosom or your friend who is as your own soul, entices you secretly, saying: "Let us go and serve other gods," you shall not yield to him or listen to him, nor shall your eye pity him, nor shall you spare him, nor shall you conceal him, but you shall k**l him........Deuteronomy 13:6, 8-15...Here is another one of your moral passages:
"If a man does not abide in me, he is cast forth as a branch and withers; and the branches are gathered, thrown into the fire and burned"....John 15:6.

Atheism was a word created by the religious group...in effect it is Anti-theism...it shouldn't even be a word...one doesn't say anti-neurologist or anti-psychologist...it is stupid.

The fact is i am not against religions only to the extent that it over shadows reality. "Grandma's going to Heaven" or the 5 year old boy k**led by a car..."God has another purpose for him". CRAP...You deny the person or persons to grieve in a normal discourse and make them feel happy that God wants him. CRAP

Your morality is to stop sending condoms to So. Africa because it goes against God, however, you don't follow through to see how immoral the consequences....more births, more a******ns, more deaths and MORE HIV.

Atheists don't cause wars, don't demonstrate, don't intervene in government matters....we live a natural normal (as opposed to religion) life.

Christianity places more concern on addressing premarital sex than on genocide.

Look back at the title of this thread and turn up your mind....no....sorry....stay where you are..
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Oct 24, 2013 14:28:18   #
the t***h wrote:
Mr dville please forgive me i am merely guessing your title, i am a lady by the way, america and England is the modern Ephraim and Manasseh.
not sure if you recalled the promises made to Abraham who became father to the children of Israel who god did in fact favored, as you and i both know generations keep multiplying women never cease to reproduce just like they are still Jews, they are still the children of Israel out there remember their sinful ways caused them to be scattered. Manasseh is america remember that both tribes came off of Joseph. ~sigh~ i have a feeling someone will question this so if anyone wants historical proof from where america and England derived and bla bla bla please PM me.
anyhow god promised that Israel will be abundant but if they turn from his ways he will turn his back on them, well the promise is still there
Mr dville please forgive me i am merely guessing y... (show quote)


Dear the t***h,

I am not a biblical scholar and I will take your bible knowledge with respect. This is your belief not mine.

What I believe, and this is not a belief, is that our world has a natural mandate to pro-create, to reproduce in like kind, to me that is the intention of life.

To say that women reproduce like they are still Jews comes from your belief system, however women, as is true with every species on earth reproduce...not because they are like Jews.

Since this is an open forum, I will say that I live in the USA and it is home to any and all religions, however, mainly of Christian persuasion. My daughter, mother of 8 is a devout Christian and has raised a very loving family, and no parent could be more blessed than that.

Politically I am a Democrat and do believe in the precepts of what Christ taught....to care for your fellow man...the meek, week, poor and the sick.

Unlike the Republicans that choose to take from the poor and favor the rich and aligned with the 'religious right', I believe are hypocrites.

I have ill feelings about religions because their belief system overrides reality in their daily discourse. And all religions believe that they are the TRUE religion and has shown historically that their Gods have k**led more people than for any other reason.

To me the Ten Commandments was a period doctrine, to address those of that time and it was meant for the Jewish people.

How different our world would be if we had as a precept what Mahavira of the Jains...."Do not injure, abuse, oppress, ens***e, insult, torment, torture or k**l any creature or living being." Imagine how different our world would be if the Bible had this as a central precept.
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Oct 23, 2013 10:52:25   #
Why would the creator of all favor one country over another?

Surely there are other countries that could be favored over the US due to their concern of their citizens and country.
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Oct 23, 2013 08:50:06   #
blocklanes wrote:
No matter what Hillary does, we want a woman as the next president


There is no one on the horizon to contest Hillary...

If someone wants to challenge her they had better get on the move because Hillary IS on the move. :lol:
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