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The GOP is fracturing
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Aug 27, 2022 12:18:51   #
RandyBrian Loc: Texas
 
336Robin wrote:
I'll just give you what I know off the top of my head.

Maga Republicans---ban books, ban personal medical choices-abortion, they seek to control elections by making it harder for people to vote (mostly those of color), they justify this by shouting their is fraud that they can't find or prove, they create lies to get people to storm the capital and try to overthrow the transfer of power, they concoct a scheme to make up fake electors to replace the real electors of the states and they don't mind harboring state secrets and may have sold them to foreign countries. Also when they are subpoenaed to testify to their innocence they fight it tooth and nail.

Is that enough for you?
I'll just give you what I know off the top of my h... (show quote)


It's enough to make me laugh, at least. I appreciate the effort, though.
Republicans (or MAGA Republicans, if you prefer) attempt to limit certain inappropriate books from certain settings and ages. Not the same as banning them.
MAGA-R's oppose killing preborn children that irresponsible mother's decide they do not want. Nothing else.
MAGA-R's want everyone who wants to vote to be able to, and wants every vote to count.....but only once. All proposed laws are attempts to prevent even the possibility of voter fraud. Why would ANYONE oppose that....except those who WANT to keep the possibility of cheating available? Using POC fallacies is just their excuse.
MAGA-R's hold the people who commit the crime responsible. They do not seek to criminally charge those who might possibly stand to benefit on the shaky and unprovable grounds that they 'orchestrated' the criminal actions.
What schemes? Are you talking about the Democrats trying to eliminate the Constitutionally mandated Electorial College system?
MAGA-R's do not prosecute ANYONE based on innuendo, anonymous sources, and supposition. And they avoid condemning people while they are under investigation. We prefer to wait on actual facts.
And when they are subpoenaed for the purpose of attacking them, they can and do use every LEGAL means of defending themselves....including fighting it 'tooth and nail'.....just as Democrats and most every other American does.

But all this aside, HOW does any of the above equate to MAGA-R's being fascist? Do you even know what fascism is?
What it's characteristics are?
Here are a few: Accusing political opponents of being evil with no redeeming qualities (a Democrat tactic).
Claiming violations of the law (or Constitution) is for the greater good of the society. (the end justifies the means).
Taking over the media and using them for silence opposition facts (a Democrat tactic).
Exaggerating and amplifying divisions among the people to create animosity and hatred (a Democrat tactic).
Ignoring individual rights and rule of law for political purposes (a Democrat tactic).
There are many more, but like you, these are just off the top of my head.

The fact is that NEITHER major party is fascist. That is the simple truth.
BUT!
Looking at the characteristics that each exhibit, the Democrats have MUCH more in common with Nazis and fascism than even the most extreme of MAGA Republicans, or any other kind of Trump supporter or Republican or conservative.
Again, thanks for responding.

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 12:21:20   #
nwtk2007 Loc: Texas
 
RandyBrian wrote:
It's enough to make me laugh, at least. I appreciate the effort, though.
Republicans (or MAGA Republicans, if you prefer) attempt to limit certain inappropriate books from certain settings and ages. Not the same as banning them.
MAGA-R's oppose killing preborn children that irresponsible mother's decide they do not want. Nothing else.
MAGA-R's want everyone who wants to vote to be able to, and wants every vote to count.....but only once. All proposed laws are attempts to prevent even the possibility of voter fraud. Why would ANYONE oppose that....except those who WANT to keep the possibility of cheating available? Using POC fallacies is just their excuse.
MAGA-R's hold the people who commit the crime responsible. They do not seek to criminally charge those who might possibly stand to benefit on the shaky and unprovable grounds that they 'orchestrated' the criminal actions.
What schemes? Are you talking about the Democrats trying to eliminate the Constitutionally mandated Electorial College system?
MAGA-R's do not prosecute ANYONE based on innuendo, anonymous sources, and supposition. And they avoid condemning people while they are under investigation. We prefer to wait on actual facts.
And when they are subpoenaed for the purpose of attacking them, they can and do use every LEGAL means of defending themselves....including fighting it 'tooth and nail'.....just as Democrats and most every other American does.

But all this aside, HOW does any of the above equate to MAGA-R's being fascist? Do you even know what fascism is?
What it's characteristics are?
Here are a few: Accusing political opponents of being evil with no redeeming qualities (a Democrat tactic).
Claiming violations of the law (or Constitution) is for the greater good of the society. (the end justifies the means).
Taking over the media and using them for silence opposition facts (a Democrat tactic).
Exaggerating and amplifying divisions among the people to create animosity and hatred (a Democrat tactic).
Ignoring individual rights and rule of law for political purposes (a Democrat tactic).
There are many more, but like you, these are just off the top of my head.

The fact is that NEITHER major party is fascist. That is the simple truth.
BUT!
Looking at the characteristics that each exhibit, the Democrats have MUCH more in common with Nazis and fascism than even the most extreme of MAGA Republicans, or any other kind of Trump supporter or Republican or conservative.
Again, thanks for responding.
It's enough to make me laugh, at least. I appreci... (show quote)


Super good comment!

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 13:19:22   #
Rose42
 
336Robin wrote:
So let's hear your idea of how to fix it then? Since you know so much.


Its you who pretends he knows so much. Your over the top hyperbole only makes you foolish.

A first step in fixing it is not accepting that we’re limited to the two corrupt parties and the candidates that are chosen for us. That won’t change as long as people stay content with voting for inept and corrupt politicians. Biden is just the latest

Reply
 
 
Aug 27, 2022 13:35:13   #
Wonttakeitanymore
 
slatten49 wrote:
From Quora

The Republican Party is starting to fracture, and it's basically splitting into three main groups, in no particular order.
First is the sanity crowd. These are the small number of people like Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger who, *regardless of their other positions* recognize Trump and Trumpism as a bridge too far and are trying to get the party to walk back the extremism by holding Trump and the other fascists in his orbit to account. They recognize that the GOP is collapsing and corrupt, and needs to fix its shit or else it will die out, and possibly take the rest of the US with it. This group officially now includes *Dick Cheney*. And when Dick Cheney thinks you're *too much of an authoritarian and are a threat to the nation*, that's a really bad sign.

They're not so much “throwing Trump under the bus” as “trying to remove his influence from the party, regardless of the personal damage to their careers”.

Second are the business-as-usual group. This is people like Mike Pence and Mitch McConnell, who want to marginalize Trump and his followers, but want to do it in a way that doesn't require actually punishing anyone involved with sedition and without alienating the Trump cult, so they can still lean on the fanatical support for electoral wins. They basically want to ignore Trump as much as possible and go back to how things were before 2015. I feel compelled to point out that this group now, officially, includes Republican bogeyman Karl Rove. THESE are the people trying to throw Trump under a bus.

Last are the lunatics. They also split into two factions.

One is the sedition crowd. This is Trump, MTG, Boebert, Gaetz, and the rest of that ilk who are still repeating the Big Lie and have 100% support for Trump running in 2024 and beyond.

The other is the flat-out fascists. Some of them have modeled themselves on Trump, while others are various flavors of older fascist ideology. They use Trumpian rhetoric about the Big Lie, but do not necessarily support Trump himself, either because of their own political aspirations or because he actually wasn't extreme enough for them. This is people like Ron DeSantis. If you don't think trying to silence dissent through direct government action, or deliberately rejecting public health measures during a pandemic, is fascism, you don't know what fascism is.

Bear in mind, ALL of these are bad, and have the same general goals of ending actual democracy in the US for good. It's just that the “sane” crowd doesn't want to openly cheat in order to do so, and the “business as usual” bunch want the nasty stuff to go back in the box so they can pretend they're *not* trying to tear democracy apart so they can install themselves as basically feudal lords.
From Quora br br The Republican Party is starting... (show quote)

Keep wishing in one hand and spit in the other! Demonrats will be devastated in Nov! Unless they cheat again!!!

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 13:35:49   #
Wonttakeitanymore
 
[quote=Ronald Hatt]AS A Republican.....I observe that "YOU" are beginning to suffer from an advanced case of dementia, due to overindulging in the *demoncrat *Kool-Aid, syndrome!

Want "fractured"...*incompetent...*mis-directed...*un-American...*Un-Constitutional...*, & just *plain ignorant?

look no further than the *Demoncrat party...The party of killing innocent babies...[ mostly black}....racism to the extreme, defunct, & lame "Foreign policy"...cowardice, & non-compliance of American laws...Subersion of law & Order....So much that is WRONG WITH YOUR PARTY , , , [/quote]

Agreed! This guy is full Romero!

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 13:37:44   #
336Robin Loc: North Carolina
 
Parky60 wrote:
Of course like the useful idiot that you are, you don't have a clue.


I know that Trump is in big trouble and Biden in the President.

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 14:11:46   #
Parky60 Loc: People's Republic of Illinois
 
336Robin wrote:
I know that Trump is in big trouble and Biden in the President.

They're REALLY gonna get him this time...REALLY!

And Biden's a PINO...president in name only.

Reply
 
 
Aug 27, 2022 15:12:09   #
slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas
 
For your perusal, Randy...

https://www.onepoliticalplaza.com/t-251444-1.html

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/dec/22/america-fascism-legal-phase

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 15:18:12   #
Liberty Tree
 
336Robin wrote:
I know that Trump is in big trouble and Biden in the President.


Biden being President is making the country in big trouble.

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 15:25:38   #
Liberty Tree
 
336Robin wrote:
I'll just give you what I know off the top of my head.

Maga Republicans---ban books, ban personal medical choices-abortion, they seek to control elections by making it harder for people to vote (mostly those of color), they justify this by shouting their is fraud that they can't find or prove, they create lies to get people to storm the capital and try to overthrow the transfer of power, they concoct a scheme to make up fake electors to replace the real electors of the states and they don't mind harboring state secrets and may have sold them to foreign countries. Also when they are subpoenaed to testify to their innocence they fight it tooth and nail.

Is that enough for you?
I'll just give you what I know off the top of my h... (show quote)


So you say Democrats have banned no books?

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 15:31:02   #
slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas
 
Parky60 wrote:
You looking in a mirror? Another useful idiot?

As the inference was unequivocally directed at you, Parky, own it.

Reply
 
 
Aug 27, 2022 15:31:31   #
Fit2BTied Loc: Texas
 
336Robin wrote:
Up until yesterday when Biden started referring to them by their rightful name--Fascists--

The MAGA guy and gals thought they were going to get away with it. Now Biden is coming out
swinging and there is no defense from the evidence of what they've done.

Magas give plenty of targets and now they are going to take some hits.
At the end of your post you have:
"Karma is something you create." OK, if you believe in Karma...
"Honest discourse, eliminates Bias" The statement is logical, but not exactly something we see from the left, and the media (social and MSM) certainly limit our attempts at discourse...
"The Bane of Trumpism is Truth" Uh-oh, some TDS here...
"Trumpism=Narcissistic Symbiosis" Hmmm... I'm sensing a theme...
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-shared-psychosis-of-donald-trump-and-his-loyalists/ OK, I believe we can see YOUR bias...
Bottom line is - you can think however you wish about current events - the truth will come out. And when it does, there will be a number of your heroes that will not fare well. Honestly, we can't wait

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 15:32:28   #
4430 Loc: Little Egypt ** Southern Illinory
 
RandyBrian wrote:
It's enough to make me laugh, at least. I appreciate the effort, though.
Republicans (or MAGA Republicans, if you prefer) attempt to limit certain inappropriate books from certain settings and ages. Not the same as banning them.
MAGA-R's oppose killing preborn children that irresponsible mother's decide they do not want. Nothing else.
MAGA-R's want everyone who wants to vote to be able to, and wants every vote to count.....but only once. All proposed laws are attempts to prevent even the possibility of voter fraud. Why would ANYONE oppose that....except those who WANT to keep the possibility of cheating available? Using POC fallacies is just their excuse.
MAGA-R's hold the people who commit the crime responsible. They do not seek to criminally charge those who might possibly stand to benefit on the shaky and unprovable grounds that they 'orchestrated' the criminal actions.
What schemes? Are you talking about the Democrats trying to eliminate the Constitutionally mandated Electorial College system?
MAGA-R's do not prosecute ANYONE based on innuendo, anonymous sources, and supposition. And they avoid condemning people while they are under investigation. We prefer to wait on actual facts.
And when they are subpoenaed for the purpose of attacking them, they can and do use every LEGAL means of defending themselves....including fighting it 'tooth and nail'.....just as Democrats and most every other American does.

But all this aside, HOW does any of the above equate to MAGA-R's being fascist? Do you even know what fascism is?
What it's characteristics are?
Here are a few: Accusing political opponents of being evil with no redeeming qualities (a Democrat tactic).
Claiming violations of the law (or Constitution) is for the greater good of the society. (the end justifies the means).
Taking over the media and using them for silence opposition facts (a Democrat tactic).
Exaggerating and amplifying divisions among the people to create animosity and hatred (a Democrat tactic).
Ignoring individual rights and rule of law for political purposes (a Democrat tactic).
There are many more, but like you, these are just off the top of my head.

The fact is that NEITHER major party is fascist. That is the simple truth.
BUT!
Looking at the characteristics that each exhibit, the Democrats have MUCH more in common with Nazis and fascism than even the most extreme of MAGA Republicans, or any other kind of Trump supporter or Republican or conservative.
Again, thanks for responding.
It's enough to make me laugh, at least. I appreci... (show quote)


Excellent Post

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 15:47:45   #
Fit2BTied Loc: Texas
 
slatten49 wrote:
From Quora

The Republican Party is starting to fracture, and it's basically splitting into three main groups, in no particular order.
First is the sanity crowd. These are the small number of people like Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger who, *regardless of their other positions* recognize Trump and Trumpism as a bridge too far and are trying to get the party to walk back the extremism by holding Trump and the other fascists in his orbit to account. They recognize that the GOP is collapsing and corrupt, and needs to fix its shit or else it will die out, and possibly take the rest of the US with it. This group officially now includes *Dick Cheney*. And when Dick Cheney thinks you're *too much of an authoritarian and are a threat to the nation*, that's a really bad sign.

They're not so much “throwing Trump under the bus” as “trying to remove his influence from the party, regardless of the personal damage to their careers”.

Second are the business-as-usual group. This is people like Mike Pence and Mitch McConnell, who want to marginalize Trump and his followers, but want to do it in a way that doesn't require actually punishing anyone involved with sedition and without alienating the Trump cult, so they can still lean on the fanatical support for electoral wins. They basically want to ignore Trump as much as possible and go back to how things were before 2015. I feel compelled to point out that this group now, officially, includes Republican bogeyman Karl Rove. THESE are the people trying to throw Trump under a bus.

Last are the lunatics. They also split into two factions.

One is the sedition crowd. This is Trump, MTG, Boebert, Gaetz, and the rest of that ilk who are still repeating the Big Lie and have 100% support for Trump running in 2024 and beyond.

The other is the flat-out fascists. Some of them have modeled themselves on Trump, while others are various flavors of older fascist ideology. They use Trumpian rhetoric about the Big Lie, but do not necessarily support Trump himself, either because of their own political aspirations or because he actually wasn't extreme enough for them. This is people like Ron DeSantis. If you don't think trying to silence dissent through direct government action, or deliberately rejecting public health measures during a pandemic, is fascism, you don't know what fascism is.

Bear in mind, ALL of these are bad, and have the same general goals of ending actual democracy in the US for good. It's just that the “sane” crowd doesn't want to openly cheat in order to do so, and the “business as usual” bunch want the nasty stuff to go back in the box so they can pretend they're *not* trying to tear democracy apart so they can install themselves as basically feudal lords.
From Quora br br The Republican Party is starting... (show quote)
You're on the right path, Slatten49, but your estimates as to how many belong to each sub-group is way off. And I base this on what's happening in the primaries. You're watching a party shedding dead wood in it's attempt to remove those who think that "They govern". They are supposed to represent the people who elected them. Liz Cheney was so out of touch with the people of one of the (if not THE) most conservative states in the US, that she lost by an enormous margin. You can try to explain that any way you want - it doesn't change the fact that those of us who are pro America First agenda now seem to control the party. BTW, your remarks about Dick Cheney are hilarious.

Reply
Aug 27, 2022 15:53:21   #
Rose42
 
336Robin wrote:
I know that Trump is in big trouble and Biden in the President.


Now that is truth. Lol

Reply
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