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Opposition at "all costs Politics" is what is killing our system of government, Trump had a chance to make things work and he blew it
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Feb 13, 2022 00:26:52   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
jelun wrote:
I am pretty sure that there was an offer and that as usual 45 played and played and then turned it down. Let me check.
This tells a tale of approximately a year of negotiation. I am sure that there is more, this seems like a reasonable outline.


The Wall Funding Deals Trump Rejected
President says he’s ready to negotiate over funding for a border wall. Here are three deals he has rejected
y Kristina Peterson
Follow
Updated Jan. 14, 2019 3:57 pm ET

Trump-Schumer negotiations: In January 2018, Mr. Trump met with Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D., N.Y.) for 90 minutes, with then-chief of staff John Kelly the only White House aide present. Mr. Schumer offered the president $25 billion over an unspecified period to be used for a border wall, paired with a path to citizenship for the young immigrants.

Mr. Trump in September 2017 had ended an Obama-era program, known as Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals, that allowed those immigrants to work and shielded them from deportation. An appeals court in November rejected Mr. Trump’s move to end the program, which is expected to be reviewed by the Supreme Court.


Mr. Kelly later called Mr. Schumer, saying that the White House considered the deal too liberal and that it didn’t do enough to end the system that prioritizes immigrants who already have family ties in the U.S.

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Bipartisan Senate proposal: In February 2018, a bipartisan group of senators hashed out a compromise proposal that would have provided $25 billion for border security over 10 years, starting with a $2.5 billion installment last year.

It would also have enabled about 1.8 million young immigrants to become citizens over a 10-to-12-year timeline, but it sought to bar them from sponsoring their parents from citizenship. Lawmakers believed it could have passed the GOP-held Senate had Mr. Trump endorsed it, but he opposed it, saying it didn’t do enough to curb legal immigration. The measure then failed in the Senate in a 54-45 vote.

It was never taken up by the House, which was then controlled by Republicans who worked on their own set of immigration bills.

Senate stopgap spending bill: Shortly before Christmas, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R., Ky.) brought a bill to the Senate floor that would have extended the government’s current funding through Feb. 8. Mr. McConnell said at the time that he was closely communicating with the White House and lawmakers expected Mr. Trump to sign it.

But after it passed the Senate, Mr. Trump appeared to change his mind and, encouraged by House Republicans, said the next day that he would veto it because it didn’t meet his demand for border-wall funding. The Senate bill would have extended current funding for the Homeland Security Department, including money for fencing, bollard barriers, levees and technology—but not a concrete barrier. Democrats say a sweeping spending bill that passed earlier last year included $1.3 billion for border security, while Republicans, counting slightly differently, say it included $1.57 billion.

In late December, at Mr. Trump’s urging, the GOP-controlled House passed a bill providing $5.7 billion for a border barrier. That bill didn’t have enough support to pass the Senate, then or now. When House Democrats took control in early January, the Congress and White House were left at an impasse when House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D., Calif.) said her chamber wouldn’t approve any funding for a border wall.

Write to Kristina Peterson at kristina.peterson@wsj.com

Copyright ©2022 Dow Jones & Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved. 87990cbe856818d5eddac44c7b1cdeb8





The rest of the story.
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/19/trump-declares-national-emergency-over-immigration-amid-border-wall-push.html
I am pretty sure that there was an offer and that ... (show quote)


They made an offer that was never going to pass... And they knew it... Because it didn't involve funding the wall...

Trump made them a similar offer... They refused... Because it involved funding the wall...

To claim that Trump was the one who was disingenuous is absurd...

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 03:02:24   #
microphor Loc: Home is TN
 
336Robin wrote:
It's been long time but, here goes:

I remember some of the discourse about the border wall and I also remember that Democrats were willing to use the wall issue to give him what he wanted to get something they wanted which is bipartisan effort but he said "No."

At this point he marked himself an "Opposition at all Costs" politician and after that the repeal of the ACA failed and things go worse and worse and now he lost the election.

Trump missed the opportunity to give the country something that both sides could agree on. I lean left when voting but am in the middle politically and I think that we need to protect our Southern Border and man people to do and be done with it. Democrats would have learned to love it.

So this type of thinking sets the stage for all out warfare in politics in an all or nothing approach and I predict that this kind of approach is going to eventually either break the country, cause civil war as we just came close to it or one side will get a full advantage of the Senate, the House and the White House and will take over and that seems to be the goal of the Republican Side which is willing to force the not popular agenda with everything on the people.

They don't give a crap about the environment, health care for people, Social Security or anything else that helps people all they really worry about is if they can find a way to keep getting their corporate donations because without them they have a dwindling crowd that will go along with them and their desires.

They are dragging the Evangelical crowd with them promising them that Roe vs. Wade will be overturned and subsequently they will get those votes to do it with.

They have been successful in the largest single gerrymandering effort ever nationwide and we are at a tipping point that they are the ones that may prevail in their goals of a fully controlled government if we don't pass voter reform legislation and that looks to be how its going to roll.

Meanwhile we are being played with in the middle but this an epic battle over the future of the country and it about nothing more than campaign money as Citizens United freed up the fight to bring in foreign money and now both sides have to do it.

If you distill this down to the very core of what this is all about, you either believe in the power of the People or the power of the Corporation and that is the battle at hand.

The Corporation (which should be everyones friend) because its the construct by which business is done and business runs the country was given status as a person and its all constructed on paper by Citizens United a Republican crafted thing. Look it up there is plenty on it. Is the silliest thing I've heard grown men try to justify because a piece of paper does not breathe and the people inside the corporation all have equal votes to everyone else and they need no voice beyond their personal votes. Paper are not people.

It is easy for me to choose and I will always vote for People rights, hence "We the People" the first 3 words of our Constitution but I'm willing to hear your take on this situation.

Why did Trump not take the deal that Democrats offered him over the Border Wall? W1ould it have been so bad for him to break the mold and get politicians working together? or Was this goal of taking over everything more along his line of thinking from day 1 and he needed complete polarization in order to do it.

Why is it necessary for this all out winner takes all conflict amongst our representative that pits neighbor against neighbor and results in an Insurrection and a take over attempt of our Government.

How are you going to feel when one side wins and gets the White House, the Senate and the House and what are you going to do when that day comes?

Can you see the day that the other side has full control and what do you think that is going to be like?

This is what is at stake. This is take over politics at its worst.
It's been long time but, here goes: br br I remem... (show quote)


Yes, as I recall Dems wanted permanent status for over 700, 000 illegals who received DACA status under the Obama admin. Trump recognized that would set a precedent for other undocumented illegals and said "hell no".

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 07:35:52   #
trashbaum
 
336Robin wrote:
It's been long time but, here goes:

I remember some of the discourse about the border wall and I also remember that Democrats were willing to use the wall issue to give him what he wanted to get something they wanted which is bipartisan effort but he said "No."

At this point he marked himself an "Opposition at all Costs" politician and after that the repeal of the ACA failed and things go worse and worse and now he lost the election.

Trump missed the opportunity to give the country something that both sides could agree on. I lean left when voting but am in the middle politically and I think that we need to protect our Southern Border and man people to do and be done with it. Democrats would have learned to love it.

So this type of thinking sets the stage for all out warfare in politics in an all or nothing approach and I predict that this kind of approach is going to eventually either break the country, cause civil war as we just came close to it or one side will get a full advantage of the Senate, the House and the White House and will take over and that seems to be the goal of the Republican Side which is willing to force the not popular agenda with everything on the people.

They don't give a crap about the environment, health care for people, Social Security or anything else that helps people all they really worry about is if they can find a way to keep getting their corporate donations because without them they have a dwindling crowd that will go along with them and their desires.

They are dragging the Evangelical crowd with them promising them that Roe vs. Wade will be overturned and subsequently they will get those votes to do it with.

They have been successful in the largest single gerrymandering effort ever nationwide and we are at a tipping point that they are the ones that may prevail in their goals of a fully controlled government if we don't pass voter reform legislation and that looks to be how its going to roll.

Meanwhile we are being played with in the middle but this an epic battle over the future of the country and it about nothing more than campaign money as Citizens United freed up the fight to bring in foreign money and now both sides have to do it.

If you distill this down to the very core of what this is all about, you either believe in the power of the People or the power of the Corporation and that is the battle at hand.

The Corporation (which should be everyones friend) because its the construct by which business is done and business runs the country was given status as a person and its all constructed on paper by Citizens United a Republican crafted thing. Look it up there is plenty on it. Is the silliest thing I've heard grown men try to justify because a piece of paper does not breathe and the people inside the corporation all have equal votes to everyone else and they need no voice beyond their personal votes. Paper are not people.

It is easy for me to choose and I will always vote for People rights, hence "We the People" the first 3 words of our Constitution but I'm willing to hear your take on this situation.

Why did Trump not take the deal that Democrats offered him over the Border Wall? W1ould it have been so bad for him to break the mold and get politicians working together? or Was this goal of taking over everything more along his line of thinking from day 1 and he needed complete polarization in order to do it.

Why is it necessary for this all out winner takes all conflict amongst our representative that pits neighbor against neighbor and results in an Insurrection and a take over attempt of our Government.

How are you going to feel when one side wins and gets the White House, the Senate and the House and what are you going to do when that day comes?

Can you see the day that the other side has full control and what do you think that is going to be like?

This is what is at stake. This is take over politics at its worst.
It's been long time but, here goes: br br I remem... (show quote)


My oh my, those who like to see it not as it is but how they would like to see it!

Reply
Check out topic: Abbe Lowell's Work Ethic
Feb 13, 2022 09:03:57   #
son of witless
 
RascalRiley wrote:
Who was afraid of Donny?


ISIS, Xi, Putin, and Kim Jong-un. The little Korean fat kid was smacked down and made to be quiet. ISIS which your mighty hero Obama allowed to grow like a cancer, was shrunken down. Xi and Putin were quiet. Afghanistan was quiet.

Then your boy Joe comes in, controlled by the hangers on from the Obama Regime and the worst of the Marxists in the Democrat Party. Suddenly Xi and Putin are no longer quiet. The little fat kid in Pyongyang is no longer quiet. The Southern Border is a total freakin joke, and your boy Joe turns a winning hand in Afghanistan into a losing hand. Crime and homelessness are rampant is cities and states controlled by Joe's party. The Corona virus is out of control, and Joe's mandates have everyone spitting nails.

Anyone who voted for Biden in 2020 should bow down and beg their fellow Americans for forgiveness. Oh and did I mention that Joe's policies have caused the worst inflation in 40 years.

If only my boy Donald was still running things. Life in America would be better than the misery we see now. But you guys got what you wanted. The Democrats run our universe, for now.

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 09:21:32   #
Michael Rich Loc: Lapine Oregon
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
They made an offer that was never going to pass... And they knew it... Because it didn't involve funding the wall...

Trump made them a similar offer... They refused... Because it involved funding the wall...

To claim that Trump was the one who was disingenuous is absurd...



Pelosi said...."not one dollar for the wall"

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 09:57:14   #
336Robin Loc: North Carolina
 
permafrost wrote:
Nothing worked for the GOP or the Dems.. and trump got fired..


That's right. He ignored the opportunity and I think it cost him the Presidency.

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 09:59:43   #
336Robin Loc: North Carolina
 
trashbaum wrote:
My oh my, those who like to see it not as it is but how they would like to see it!


The results are the same as those of us see it. He lost and this was the pivotal moment.

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 11:10:11   #
Ri-chard Loc: 23322
 
336Robin wrote:
The results are the same as those of us see it. He lost and this was the pivotal moment.


He didn't lose yet, they are still counting the real votes.

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 12:37:52   #
trashbaum
 
Michael Rich wrote:
Pelosi said...."not one dollar for the wall"


Pelosi says "not one dollar for the wall", it goes into my wall instead.

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 13:46:26   #
RascalRiley Loc: Somewhere south of Detroit
 
Ri-chard wrote:
He didn't lose yet, they are still counting the real votes.


The real results got ripped up and flushed but I miss him.

There so many more atrocities he could have entertained us with.

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 13:55:21   #
Ri-chard Loc: 23322
 
RascalRiley wrote:
The real results got ripped up and flushed but I miss him.

There so many more atrocities he could have entertained us with.


Just wait, more is coming.

Reply
 
 
Feb 13, 2022 14:05:16   #
RascalRiley Loc: Somewhere south of Detroit
 
Ri-chard wrote:
Just wait, more is coming.


I think you are right.

In fact I am sure there are more atrocious revelations about the worst president in the last hundred years still to come out.

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 14:27:19   #
Ri-chard Loc: 23322
 
RascalRiley wrote:
I think you are right.

In fact I am sure there are more atrocious revelations about the worst president in the last hundred years still to come out.


I know I'm right. His, crack head son will be very helpful. Thanks

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 14:37:26   #
RascalRiley Loc: Somewhere south of Detroit
 
Ri-chard wrote:
I know I'm right. His, crack head son will be very helpful. Thanks


I didn’t know Donny Jr. was a crack head. I always figured him as a cocaine aficionado.

And again you are right. All of the Trumps are going to roll over and blame each other.

Reply
Feb 13, 2022 14:41:50   #
Ri-chard Loc: 23322
 
RascalRiley wrote:
I didn’t know Donny Jr. was a crack head. I always figured him as a cocaine aficionado.

And again you are right. All of the Trumps are going to roll over and blame each other.


Nice try to divert from Joe supporting Hunters crack use.

Reply
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