Thank you for the fires GOP! (Page 18): Could be time for you to get a grip on reality.

America 1 Loc: South Miami

straightUp wrote:

So... are you referring to where I said I cleared the brush from the fire zone around my house? OK, that's true. But where did I say "cutting out fuel in the forest is taboo." ??? I didn't. I never said that. I said it wasn't FEASIBLE to clear dead wood from the 33 million acres of forest in California because it's cost prohibitive. I NEVER said it was taboo.

Get a grip Sparky.

Could be time for you to get a grip on reality.

straightUp Loc: California

RandyBrian wrote:

okay, friend. I am good with that. I will say this:
I have been following the arguments on global warming since I first heard about it in 1974 or so. I know the earth is warming, but I'm one of your deniers who does not believe mankind is causing any significant amount of it, and I do not believe there is much, if anything, we can do about it, even if we are.

Well, there might not be much we can do about it NOW. I mean it's a little late to avoid it now. But we can maybe slow it down enough to buy some time and figure out how to survive the future the Republicans made for us.

RandyBrian wrote:

There has been WAY too many lies and exaggerations from the left, trying to force this down our throats for the last 30 years, for me to accept anything but hard evidence.

Well, here's the thing about hard evidence. It all comes from the past. There has NEVER been ANY hard evidence to prove anything about the future and unless we can time travel, there never will be.

So what we have are theories - when it comes to the future, that's all we ever have and the way science works, it's a constant process of improving the theories. So I don't know exactly what you are calling a lie or an exaggeration but I know that updated theories often strike people as contradictions. Especially religious people who are accustomed to thinking of the truth as a constant, a revelation that has already been presented in its absolute form based on what people said 2000 years ago.

If you felt like it was being shoved down your throat it might be due to the urgency of the matter. When you're being chased by a monster and run into your front door only to find it locked but you know friends inside can open it, you knock. When your friends take their sweet time to open the door because they don't think your in danger and the monster is closing in, what happens? You start banging and yelling, "Let me IN!!!" Right?

RandyBrian wrote:

But I am a pragmatist. I am open to being convinced. If you will provide the credible evidence to support your views, I will read with an open mind.
And take your time. I'm not going anywhere.

Evidence of what? That we are emitting gigatons of greenhouse gases in the air? Evidence that greenhouse gasses really do retain heat? Or that according to all the natural cycles we know about we should be cooling right now, not warming? I can't hop in a DeLorean and blast into the future to find that sign that says "humans did it". At some point when looking at the future we just have to put two and two together.

Maybe you can let me know what evidence from the past you need to believe we have more control over our destiny that you seem to think presently.

I gotta take a break... But I'll check in later.

Rose42

straightUp wrote:

Oh, I get the point and yes it's very simple. You think I'm being intellectually dishonest. But I don't agree. I think I AM being intellectually honest. That's why I asked you to explain your accusation but it seems you can't. So don't tell me I'm not getting the point Rose.

I did with an analogy. Its simple.

Quote:

Sure. I accept that. Obviously, I'm not like you Rose. I have the courage and the integrity to confront my own actions. Yes, I am partly responsible through my politics for allowing embryos to be terminated. I already described that as last resort mercy killing.

No you don't have integrity. Your OP shows that and your continued inane defense of it. And you make far too many assumptions.

Quote:

Neither of us know how many of those abortions were for "convenience". I think the vast majority of abortions are last resort measures.

You can check the Guttmacher Institute for an estimate. Its most. Its a pro abortion site and they have statistics. Some consider theirs on the low side.

Quote:

But hey, conditions were sterile!

Yes, so the mothers don't get infected. Dugh!

Lets give out needles to druggies so they're sterile. That's a stupid argument too.

Quote:

Absolutely! Because of the right, we have the crappiest AND most expensive healthcare system in the developed world, the crappiest education system in the developed world, the most gun violence (per capita) in the developed world, the worst water quality in the developed world... I mean, the list goes on and on.

And you believe you think for yourself. I see talking points. Like these - because of the left we have attacks on free speech, indoctrination instead of education, rewriting history to kowtow to special interests, the victim mindset vs taking personal responsibility, giving animals more protection than children, promotion of class warfare, inciting racism....the list goes on and on.

Quote:

Mercy killing isn't amoral. Killing people because you don't care enough to realize you're doing it and then denying it when someone points it out or worse putting the blame on the victims... THAT is amoral!

Killing innocent life is amoral. Abortion isn't mercy killing that's ridiculous.

Quote:

'Not a game and I don't yip yap.

You sure are in this thread.

Quote:

Yes, both have betrayed us... But politics isn't static. Parties shift with the times and sometimes one party is more caustic than the other, which is why people so often vote for the lesser of two evils. I have no doubt in my mind that the Republican party is currently the more evil of the two by a wide margin.

And you are still voting for evil and patting yourself on the back for it. You're running with the herd.

Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI

Carol Kelly wrote:

Quite simply ridiculous.

Man kind has played a role in this problem.
WE ARE ALL A PART OF THE PROBLEM.
SOME MORE THAN OTHERS.

Michael Rich Loc: Lapine Oregon

straightUp wrote:

So... are you referring to where I said I cleared the brush from the fire zone around my house? OK, that's true. But where did I say "cutting out fuel in the forest is taboo." ??? I didn't. I never said that. I said it wasn't FEASIBLE to clear dead wood from the 33 million acres of forest in California because it's cost prohibitive. I NEVER said it was taboo.

Get a grip Sparky.

Yo..Junior Samples Used Cars...fire suppression is a proactive business.

I listened to a forest service official explain how forests that had been thinned didn't contribute to the severity of the wildfires as the untouched ones have been acting.

Forest thinning and tree farming could be a healthy restart for our forests.

Lumber is outrageously expensive right now, through sensible logging, affordable lumber is a huge incentive to building....and construction is a huge part of the economy.

Oregon St ...conducted studies that prove the Ponderosa Pine was most healthy at least 17ft from other trees.

To just throw your hands up and say there's too much ground to cover is the typical leftist lazy solution...ignore the wood fuels and blame gases.

Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON

Blade_Runner wrote:

Is your entire AGW argument the product of thinking for yourself? Or, are you relying on other sources to back you up?

straightUp wrote:

Both.

So, it is OK for you to rely on other sources, but when we do so, you hammer us for not thinking for ourselves.

I have read the Biden-Sanders Unity Transformation Recommendations which begins with the plan to combat global warming. "A Clean Energy Economy"! Eliminate fossil fuels and go for solar panels and wind turbines. IOW, shut down the engine of prosperity and introduce Too much Wind.

California’s Power Failure Is A Frightening Preview Of Democrats’ ‘Green New Deal’

California’s Blackouts Display The Results Of Kamala Harris’s Favored Energy Policy

This one is an eye opener. Ontario wind turbines -- An inefficient, unreliable energy fiasco, especially the massive wind turbine installations around the shores of the Great Lakes. Talk about polluting the environment.

All that aside, I'm wondering how the Marxist DINOs plan to power aircraft, trains, trucks, ships, and all the military machines that depend on fossil fuels. Batteries? Solar Panels? Nuclear reactors?

Damned fools are planning a new Dark Age.

RandyBrian Loc: Texas

Barracuda2020 wrote:

I love that argument, I really do, to say that all... (show quote)

I have never said 'absolutely no impact'. And I said I am open to credible evidence. YOU however, are not in any way credible. You're just another big mouth jerk with nothing to back himself up with. Straightup is willing to discuss. You....I'm not interested in your opinions and you have presented no facts.

EmilyD

straightUp wrote:

Evidence of what? That we are emitting gigatons of... (show quote)

straightUp wrote:

Well, there might not be much we can do about it NOW. I mean it's a little late to avoid it now. But we can maybe slow it down enough to buy some time and figure out how to survive the future the Republicans made for us.

You say we should slow it down since it's too late to avoid it, but WHAT are you suggesting that we do to buy time to figure this problem out?

And I just want to say that blaming Republicans because the magnitude of fires in California are greater now than ever before just plain sounds weak. IF the Global Cooling/Global Warming/Climate Change problem has been growing exponentially every year for many years, I seriously doubt that it is now (or has been in the past) only Republicans that are responsible. And just because a Republican happens to be in office this year does not make him culpable for all years past and all past Republicans that have allegedly led humanity to where it is today with regard to climate-related problems. A Democrat, who was in complete agreement with you about man-made climate problems, did not seem to be able to accomplish much in the way of solutions for the California fires during the eight years of his administration, if the fires got larger and larger...

Tug484

Blade_Runner wrote:

So, it is OK for you to rely on other sources, but... (show quote)

They figured out up north you can't use wind power because in the winter the oil in them freezes.
It makes them unusable.

promilitary

straightUp wrote:

Of course there are many causes that spark the fires raging across the western states and we really can't track them down to one cause. But there's more to starting a fire than a spark. You need three things... heat (such as a spark) oxygen and fuel.

It's the fuel that makes these fires so much worse now than they used to be. There's more of it. Why? because of increased drought conditions... the lack of rain kills the vegetation and dries the biomass into fuel for fire. Of course droughts have always been a problem in the western states and so have fires, but for some reason the current drought which started in 2012, has been more severe and prolonged than any previous drought on record and with it comes a series of record-breaking fires with every year getting worse.

Scientists at NOAA are saying this drought would have been bad anyway but not nearly as bad as it is due to... yup, I'm going to say it... Global Warming.

I can remember reading the studies as far back as 1978 that predicted these conditions... if we don't curb our emissions, because of the greenhouse effect. Then I watched that concern turn into a political battle with Democrats asking for the concern to be addressed and Republicans downplaying the studies and denying the science upon which they were based. Obviously, the Republicans were protecting the oil business which didn't want to sacrifice any part of their profit for a cleaner environment.

The Republican people voted big oil tycoons to the White House and sent their loved ones to fight wars to advance oil profits. Republicans have always been on the side of burning fossil fuels without any concern for the consequences.

42 years after I first read about global warming and it's potential outcomes, I am witnessing exactly what they predicted. We did NOT curb our emissions. The Republicans got in the way. Everytime we tried, the Republicans would reverse our efforts. I watched it happen... for 40 years!

So when I see those fires raging, blotting out the sky, destroying forests and structures, killing people and animals alike, I blame the Republicans. I don't accept ignorance on this one. There is no lack of information on this. After 40 years, if people STILL don't get it, it's because they choose not to. Therefore the lives lost in the fires was by choice. The choice made by Republicans... election after election.

And that goes for ALL people who have voted Republican over the last 40 years. Even those of you reading this. Yes, I am telling these Republicans with the utmost clarity... YOU are to blame for the fires and all the lives these fires will claim. 100%!

Of course there are many causes that spark the fir... (show quote)

Say What!!!! You're politicizing fires???

RandyBrian Loc: Texas

straightUp wrote:

Evidence of what? That we are emitting gigatons of... (show quote)

I'm going to give this some deep thought over the next few days. I will do my best to keep an open mind.
I do like your analogy about the monster enough that I want to elaborate on it a little, just for consideration. Let's say you are the friend in the house. You let the terrified man in, and he immediately says he wants to drastically remodel your house and use it, plus all your money and resources, and that of your kids and grandkids, to turn your house into a fortress to protect everyone from the monster. Do you take his word for it, or look outside for a monster? And what do you do when you find nothing outside except a pleasant warm night? You believe the man is sincere....but is he right?
So, yes, I am indeed going to require some very hard evidence. Talk to you again in a few days or so.

straightUp Loc: California

byronglimish wrote:

I bet it was your "academically holier than thou) personality that ruined your chances from the get go.

LOL - yeah, that's it... Republicans base their policy decisions on how insulted they are by someone's personality. You got it bro!

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

Blade_Runner wrote:

So, it is OK for you to rely on other sources, but... (show quote)

"Damned fools are planning a new Dark Age." - Blade_Runner

Yep!
AND;
they want to force it on every one.

lindajoy Loc: right here with you....

straightUp wrote:

Of course there are many causes that spark the fires raging across the western states and we really can't track them down to one cause. But there's more to starting a fire than a spark. You need three things... heat (such as a spark) oxygen and fuel.

It's the fuel that makes these fires so much worse now than they used to be. There's more of it. Why? because of increased drought conditions... the lack of rain kills the vegetation and dries the biomass into fuel for fire. Of course droughts have always been a problem in the western states and so have fires, but for some reason the current drought which started in 2012, has been more severe and prolonged than any previous drought on record and with it comes a series of record-breaking fires with every year getting worse.

Scientists at NOAA are saying this drought would have been bad anyway but not nearly as bad as it is due to... yup, I'm going to say it... Global Warming.

I can remember reading the studies as far back as 1978 that predicted these conditions... if we don't curb our emissions, because of the greenhouse effect. Then I watched that concern turn into a political battle with Democrats asking for the concern to be addressed and Republicans downplaying the studies and denying the science upon which they were based. Obviously, the Republicans were protecting the oil business which didn't want to sacrifice any part of their profit for a cleaner environment.

The Republican people voted big oil tycoons to the White House and sent their loved ones to fight wars to advance oil profits. Republicans have always been on the side of burning fossil fuels without any concern for the consequences.

42 years after I first read about global warming and it's potential outcomes, I am witnessing exactly what they predicted. We did NOT curb our emissions. The Republicans got in the way. Everytime we tried, the Republicans would reverse our efforts. I watched it happen... for 40 years!

So when I see those fires raging, blotting out the sky, destroying forests and structures, killing people and animals alike, I blame the Republicans. I don't accept ignorance on this one. There is no lack of information on this. After 40 years, if people STILL don't get it, it's because they choose not to. Therefore the lives lost in the fires was by choice. The choice made by Republicans... election after election.

And that goes for ALL people who have voted Republican over the last 40 years. Even those of you reading this. Yes, I am telling these Republicans with the utmost clarity... YOU are to blame for the fires and all the lives these fires will claim. 100%!

Of course there are many causes that spark the fir... (show quote)

Lolololl I’m really beginning to worry about you...

Ice ages and Warming trends have been around as long as the world has been around. Evolutionary cycle is just that and what the world has done from day one...

California goes on fire every year. You may wish to consider the fact that while they have money supposedly allocated to clear the brush, build firewalls, remove the dead trees etc. they don’t do it. There’s your man-made problem by the democrats.. The same ones that let their cities burn by rioters too.. Probably not a good time to be throwing stones for the Republicans when your dems are letting your cities burn by people actually setting them on fire...While they stand around watching and prohibiting police from taking action to stop it.. Including businesses and homes of people who worked all their lives to watch it go up in smoke!!!

Your illustrious don’t care enough about the environment to take care of the environment properly by clearing the deadwood, brush, build firewalls etc...Some things we can do to help but obviously you’re California wizz kids don’t give a damn and then turn around blaming everyone else..How about clear cutting??? California’s wildfires are being “made so much worse” by “bad environmental laws,” “Must also tree clear to stop fires from spreading!” Now where did that come from?? Yup Environmentalist and Trump....
Biomass you say, you mean the most common biomass materials used for energy are plants, such as corn and soy, above. The energy from these organisms can be burned to create heat or converted into electricity.Is there a way to harvest it in all that brush, shrubbery, dead trees etc all over Cali and other states??? Sure there is.. A natural energy base right there yet not given thought to harnessing it to a positive?? Why???

Climate change is a natural occurring event.. Global warming if you wish, being the same as climate change is also a natural occurring event. CO2 is needed just as much as the left climate change scare tactic people want to claim is so bad...

lindajoy Loc: right here with you....

promilitary wrote:

Say What!!!! You're politicizing fires???

The hole climate change, global warming BS is a politicalized endeavor...Name of the game Money money money!

Just look at your major players Al Gore and all his cronies and companies started up, you know the wind and the solar and all the money collected thanks to the French summit that actually fell on its face with little being accomplished in any of those adjoining countries. Where did all that money go and what accomplishes were actually made in all those participating countries that if you look it up show not much good took place and certainly not much changed... Well other than all those companies that joined in for the money involved in it.

Here’s one of many~~This one involved Obama with lits of shady people to help it out~~🙄

Almost exactly four years after solar panel startup Solyndra filed for bankruptcy, the ghost of the company has now risen again, for seemingly the umpteenth time. And no it wasn’t from another awkward Republican Presidential debate.

This time the haunting is in the form of a report from the Inspector General’s Office, which after more than four years of investigation, concluded that Solyndra officials used inaccurate information to mislead the Department of Energy in its application for a $535 million loan guarantee. The report also found that there were shortcomings with the DOE’s process of managing and approving the loan guarantee to Solyndra.

Solyndra of course is the once much-hyped solar panel startup that raised over a billion dollars from private investors and lost $5oo million of tax-payer funds, in the form of a loan backed by the DOE, when the company later went bankrupt. <snip, much more to read>

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fortune.com/2015/08/27/remember-solyndra-mistake/amp/