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President Trump Announces Call For A National ‘Red Flag’ Gun Law That Will Allow The Government To Begin Confiscating Guns From US Citizens
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Aug 7, 2019 02:19:56   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
rumitoid wrote:
Too funny, really pathetic response. It was like the little child with jelly surrounding his mouth saying, "What jelly doughnuts, mommy?" Terrorists will not take advantage of your advice how to build and hide the construction of an assault rifle? Huh? Why the hell not? They do not just throw bombs or use suicide vests. Grow up or just admit you are possibly aiding and abetting terrorists.

So let me get this right. A terrorist wanting to build a gun would not know enough to google it. He’d have to hear me say it. You are a complete fool and when you get busted with one of your stupid assumptions you double down. You bait a lot of people on OPP to have a civil conversation then go right to the absurd. You’re a joke. Just wish we could meet up.

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Aug 7, 2019 02:25:56   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
rumitoid wrote:
What? You are hysterical! Please re-read your first two sentences for the absurdities. Your words: "I never said there was nothing anyone can do about gun violence (which is only an epidemic in the minds of Hoplophobes). What I said was passing more gun control laws will not stop or even reduce gun violence." Do you the absurdity? You claim you never said there was nothing we can do about gun violence, lol, but go on to say "...passing more gun control laws will not stop or even reduce gun violence." That seems to translate into "nothing we can do."
What? You are hysterical! Please re-read your firs... (show quote)
That's what I said, but that is not all I said. You failed to even address the rest of what I said. So, who's being absurd?

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Aug 7, 2019 03:42:03   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
rumitoid wrote:
Too funny, really pathetic response. It was like the little child with jelly surrounding his mouth saying, "What jelly doughnuts, mommy?" Terrorists will not take advantage of your advice how to build and hide the construction of an assault rifle? Huh? Why the hell not? They do not just throw bombs or use suicide vests. Grow up or just admit you are possibly aiding and abetting terrorists.
Wow! Just Wow! I mean, good grief, it is stupid to think terrorists would ever need to build their own guns. AKs are a dime a dozen in the ME, and those are automatics. There are gun runners in Mexico, Central and South America and in the US who can get you whatever you want. Not one gun control law has ever stopped or even curtailed illicit gun trading, and no gun control law ever will.

Americans have been building firearms from parts for 30 years. The lower receiver must be purchased through the same process as buying a fully functional firearm--an FFL will process the transaction with a completed Form 4473 and a background check. Those into custom builds will purchase an 80% lower receiver which also must be processed by a licensed FFL dealer. Those that go this route are equipped with the machines, routers and drills necessary to machine the 80% lower receiver for their specific needs. All other parts can be purchased individually or in kits--that includes the barrel, bolt, trigger kit, sights, pins, springs and any other parts, all of which do not require the services of an FFL dealer.

If someone is going to build a firearm from scratch, they will need a complete gun manufacturing machine shop to do their own forging, milling, machining, barrel turning or hammer forging, bore drilling, rifling, and wood work if that is in the plans. The must purchase the raw materials. All of this costs mucho dinero. And, manufacturing a firearm from scratch can't be done overnight.

It is foolish to think that terrorists or crackpots like Connor Betts would ever go this route.

You are at a major disadvantage, bub, you are arguing against something you don't know a damned thing about. Like an atheist arguing there is no God. You know nothing about firearms. You're shooting blanks. But you sure can make a lot of friggin noise about those killed by guns. I don't believe you give a tinker's damn about the victims of gun crime. I think you are just screaming and yelling and whining like an emotionally distraught old woman who doesn't have a clue why. There is nothing rational, reasonable, or sensible in your emotionally charged arguments.

Gun Laws of America is 384 pages of just the federal statutes that regulate guns—more than 88,000 words. Additionally, the associated federal regulations interpreting these laws are even larger. Minimum penalty for a violation is typically 5 years in federal prison for every offense. The budget for the thousands of gun-regulating bureaucrats is in the billions and constantly growing. Everything even remotely criminal about gun use is already totally illegal.” –Alan Korwin, Author, Gun Laws of America, GunLaws.com

It is estimated that there are between 22,000 and 30,000 gun laws on the books in America. Those laws include restrictions on possession, carry, distribution, storage, transfer, manufacture, sale, ownership, importation, use and more. Some types of guns are heavily taxed while others are banned entirely for large segments of the American population—including, in some cases, guns that were carried by George Washington himself (current carrying laws in New York would require Washington’s arrest).

The longest single gun law on the books is 8,307 words with a 3,710-word list as an appendix. A long article in a newspaper runs 2,000 words.

Federal agents can wiretap citizens for gun crimes, or even suspicion of gun crimes where “anonymous” informants point the finger at someone—even if that someone committed no crime.

Our children are precious to us, and yet there is a federal law banning qualified principals, teachers and parents from defending them with guns even though arming teachers stopped school violence in Israel.

Peaceful American citizens are sitting in jails and prisons for mere possession of guns—when those guns were never used nor intended to be used to hurt anyone. People have collectively spent untold millions of dollars in legal fees defending themselves in court against charges that involved their guns—when their guns were never used to violate the rights of another, and there are no victims.

There are laws in some states mandating that guns in people’s homes (private property) be stored according to government edicts—and some well-meaning but misguided people are pushing for a national “lock up your self-defense” law even though it is prohibited by the Constitution. There are numerous instances where people were victimized by criminals because they were unable to access their self-defense tools.

Gun buyers must go through background checks, waiting periods, and get licenses if they wish to carry concealed (or sometimes in plain sight)—but a surprising number of our public servants have exempted themselves from these (and many other) laws.

Self-defense with a firearm is banned in many cities and states in America. These “laws” are enforced by police and prosecutors—with the force of guns bought with our tax money. A pregnant mother of two who works nights and walks home—in some areas of America—has no choice but to submit to violent people if confronted. If she lives, the police—her public servants—will come and take her report, with guns strapped on their belts.

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Aug 7, 2019 08:09:17   #
Parky60 Loc: People's Republic of Illinois
 
Parky60 wrote:
President Trump Announces Call For A National ‘Red Flag’ Gun Law That Will Allow The Government To Begin Confiscating Guns From US Citizens

Blade Runner wrote:
This statement is ambiguous and highly misleading. Let's put this in the proper perspective… a red flag law is about actively determining what human beings are a danger to society, not about what a firearm looks like or how many bullets it'll shoot.

I only quoted part of what you said but I’m surprised by what I did Blade. There are many folks that think Christians are a danger to society and what’s to say that a red flag law wouldn’t actively determine that they are. So, I defend that the headline: President Trump Announces Call For A National ‘Red Flag’ Gun Law That Will Allow The Government To Begin Confiscating Guns From US Citizens is not ambiguous and highly misleading but is in effect plainly pointing out the VERY slippery slope this will head down.

"The newly-proposed National Red Flag Gun Law is absolutely an infringement on the rights of the American people to “keep and bear arms”, it is nothing less than gun confiscation. And it is the Republican Party that is allowing this proposed bill to proceed towards being enshrined in law. If passed, the so-called Red Flag Gun Law is the beginning of the end of not only the Second Amendment, but of all the other amendments as well. Remember, if they can take just one away from you, they can take all of them away from you." Geoffrey Grider

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Aug 7, 2019 08:13:28   #
lpnmajor Loc: Arkansas
 
Parky60 wrote:
Nothing good can come of this. Although I don’t own any guns, I wholeheartedly disagree with President Trump calling for a national ‘Red Flag’ Gun Law that will allow the government to begin confiscating guns from US citizens. ~ Parky60

Donald Trump addressed the nation on Monday in the wake of two deadly mass shootings in El Paso, Texas and Dayton, Ohio over the weekend. He blamed violent video games and mental health for the shooting and called for "red flag laws" as a measure of gun control. Under a red flag law, potentially dangerous individuals can be reported by family or others, and local officials then determine whether there is cause to temporarily remove firearms the person may have. Cases where weapons were removed in Florida involved both risks to others or potential suicide cases.

President Trump Announces Call For A National ‘Red Flag’ Gun Law That Will Allow The Government To Begin Confiscating Guns From US Citizens
Geoffrey Grider August 6, 2019
Sen. Lindsey Graham said Monday he’s struck a bipartisan deal to write legislation that would encourage states to adopt “red flag” laws allowing guns to be taken from potentially dangerous individuals, and he vowed action in the wake of this weekend’s shootings.

An estimated 88,000 people die every year from alcohol, and yet alcohol is legal in all 50 states. Over 324,000 babies are killed in abortion each year, and yet abortions are legal in all 50 states. Over 40,000 people each year die in car crashes, the majority of which are linked to alcohol, and yet automobiles are legal in all 50 states. In 2018, less than 15,000 people died from gun violence in America. Yet somehow, guns are the real problem. Go figure.

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed. Second Amendment to the US Constitution, ratified December 1791

The newly-proposed National Red Flag Gun Law is absolutely an infringement on the rights of the American people to “keep and bear arms”, it is nothing less than gun confiscation. And it is the Republican Party that is allowing this proposed bill to proceed towards being enshrined in law. If passed, the so-called Red Flag Gun Law is the beginning of the end of not only the Second Amendment, but of all the other amendments as well. Remember, if they can take just one away from you, they can take all of them away from you.

And just so you know, President Trump, who promised the millions of patriots who voted for him he would protect our gun rights, is not only in favor of it he’s also the one pushing for it, as you will see in the video below.

FROM THE WASHINGTON TIMES: Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham said his legislation, which he has worked on with Sen. Richard Blumenthal, Connecticut Democrat, would offer grants to law enforcement to hire professionals to try to decide cases where guns should be taken from troubled individuals.

Mr. Graham said he talked to President Trump about the idea earlier Monday, and the president “seems very supportive.”

“Many of these shootings involved individuals who showed signs of violent behavior that are either ignored or not followed up. State Red Flag laws will provide the tools for law enforcement to do something about many of these situations before it’s too late,” said Mr. Graham, the chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee.

Congressional Republicans, under pressure to respond to this weekend’s massacres, appear to be coalescing around legislation to help law enforcement to take guns from those who pose an imminent danger — a measure that, if signed into law, would be the most significant gun safety legislation enacted in 20 years.

Red flag laws have been pioneered in some states such as Florida, scene of the 2018 Valentine’s Day school shooting in Parkland.

Under a red flag law, potentially dangerous individuals can be reported by family or others, and local officials then determine whether there is cause to temporarily remove firearms the person may have. Cases where weapons were removed in Florida involved both risks to others or potential suicide cases.

Mr. Graham said he and Mr. Blumenthal will introduce national red flag grant legislation “in the very near future.” Sen. Dianne Feinstein, the top Democrat on the Judiciary Committee, said there’s no need to wait.

She’s already written and introduced her own version, the Extreme Risk Protection Order Act,” that would create a grant program to encourage states to come up with red flag laws. She said Mr. Graham could put her bill on the committee’s agenda.

“The Senate could vote on that bill today,” she said.

She said that while 15 states and the District of Columbia have red flag laws on the books, neither Texas nor Ohio — scenes of the weekend’s shootings — have one. But she said the Senate needs to go further than that. She called for Congress to renew the Assault Weapons Ban, a now-expired 1994 law that restricted the sale of some military-style semiautomatic rifles.

“It took the Dayton shooter less than 30 seconds to shoot 35 people, nine of whom died. This validates the theory that these weapons are designed to kill as many people as possible, as quickly as possible,” she said.

President Trump Calls For National ‘Red Flag’ Gun Control Law
Donald Trump addressed the nation on Monday in the wake of two deadly mass shootings in El Paso, Texas and Dayton, Ohio over the weekend. He blamed violent video games and mental health for the shooting and called for “red flag laws” as a measure of gun control.

https://youtu.be/V1FicXIZL40
i Nothing good can come of this. Although I don’t... (show quote)


Every Constitutional article and amendment has qualifiers and limits. The right to be free of unreasonable search and seizure requires a determination of where the difference between reasonable and unreasonable lies, done on a case by case basis. The same is true for the 2nd amendment. Too many people get stuck on "shall not be infringed upon" and ignore the REST of the amendment......................which quite clearly gives each State the right to define " a well regulated militia " as they see fit. Persons prone to violence or showing some other risk factor, are unlikely to qualify for a well regulated militia.

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Aug 7, 2019 09:22:20   #
Coos Bay Tom Loc: coos bay oregon
 
Well regulated malitia == the national guard.

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Aug 7, 2019 09:52:29   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
Coos Bay Tom wrote:
Well regulated malitia == the national guard.


Hint; the National guard is not mentioned in the constitution. The right to bear and own arms is settled law. which I know drives liberals nuts.

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Aug 7, 2019 12:45:45   #
Lonewolf
 
JFlorio wrote:
My advice. Build your own. If you’re in a state that allows it. Have built a couple AR 15’s. Can legally buy everything you need on the internet. No way to trace. Can’t steal em if they don’t know you have em.


I built a ar rifle and a short barelled rifle which I keep separate from my other guns

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Aug 7, 2019 13:23:17   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
Lonewolf wrote:
I built a ar rifle and a short barelled rifle which I keep separate from my other guns


Exactly what I built. The shorty fires a 7.62 on a AR frame.

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Aug 7, 2019 15:10:15   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
Parky60 wrote:
I only quoted part of what you said but I’m surprised by what I did Blade. There are many folks that think Christians are a danger to society and what’s to say that a red flag law wouldn’t actively determine that they are. So, I defend that the headline: President Trump Announces Call For A National ‘Red Flag’ Gun Law That Will Allow The Government To Begin Confiscating Guns From US Citizens is not ambiguous and highly misleading but is in effect plainly pointing out the VERY slippery slope this will head down.

"The newly-proposed National Red Flag Gun Law is absolutely an infringement on the rights of the American people to “keep and bear arms”, it is nothing less than gun confiscation. And it is the Republican Party that is allowing this proposed bill to proceed towards being enshrined in law. If passed, the so-called Red Flag Gun Law is the beginning of the end of not only the Second Amendment, but of all the other amendments as well. Remember, if they can take just one away from you, they can take all of them away from you." Geoffrey Grider
I only quoted part of what you said but I’m surpri... (show quote)


The law itself does not specify any particular individual or group as a threat to society like the SPLC hate list, nor does it allow such a list to be generated, it simply authorizes a family member who recognizes dangerous behavior in one of his or her own to petition authorities to deny the subject access to firearms or to confiscate if the subject already has guns.

Not a teacher or a cop or a doctor or anyone other than a member of the subject's family is authorized to petition. A teacher or a cop or a doctor may alert the family that someone in their house is a problem, but only a member of the family can petition. It's a family matter and it is on a case by case basis.

It isn't like the law is Carte Blanche where anybody can target anybody, or any group can target another. For example the law doesn't authorize LGBT activists to file a blanket petition that targets all Christians as a "grave risk" to public safety, or the democrat party to file a blanket petition targeting all republicans. If that were the case, every political, racial, religious, and cultural group could file a petition against every other political, racial, religious and cultural group which would immediately result in counter petitions and eventually every American citizen in the country would end up on the petitions as a "grave risk". The whole thing would go totally out of control and bury itself in absurdity.

At this point, Parky, this red flag thing is just a proposal, it isn't yet a law, and considering the bloody mess congress is in, what are the odds this law will make it through there.

Not time to panic yet, bro. Thing is, if some sort of nationwide gun confiscation effort is attempted, it ain't gonna happen without a fight. I can back that up with some stats if you are interested.

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Aug 7, 2019 17:10:47   #
Parky60 Loc: People's Republic of Illinois
 
Blade_Runner wrote:
The law itself does not specify any particular individual or group as a threat to society like the SPLC hate list, nor does it allow such a list to be generated, it simply authorizes a family member who recognizes dangerous behavior in one of his or her own to petition authorities to deny the subject access to firearms or to confiscate if the subject already has guns.

Not a teacher or a cop or a doctor or anyone other than a member of the subject's family is authorized to petition. A teacher or a cop or a doctor may alert the family that someone in their house is a problem, but only a member of the family can petition. It's a family matter and it is on a case by case basis.

It isn't like the law is Carte Blanche where anybody can target anybody, or any group can target another. For example the law doesn't authorize LGBT activists to file a blanket petition that targets all Christians as a "grave risk" to public safety, or the democrat party to file a blanket petition targeting all republicans. If that were the case, every political, racial, religious, and cultural group could file a petition against every other political, racial, religious and cultural group which would immediately result in counter petitions and eventually every American citizen in the country would end up on the petitions as a "grave risk". The whole thing would go totally out of control and bury itself in absurdity.

At this point, Parky, this red flag thing is just a proposal, it isn't yet a law, and considering the bloody mess congress is in, what are the odds this law will make it through there.

Not time to panic yet, bro. Thing is, if some sort of nationwide gun confiscation effort is attempted, it ain't gonna happen without a fight. I can back that up with some stats if you are interested.
The law itself does not specify any particular ind... (show quote)

I understand everything you're saying Blade but a case in point I'd like to make is look how much more depraved we've become in just the four short years since we've legalized same-sex marriage? This very well could be the same slippery slope.

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Aug 10, 2019 11:51:58   #
Coos Bay Tom Loc: coos bay oregon
 
JFlorio wrote:
Hint; the National guard is not mentioned in the constitution. The right to bear and own arms is settled law. which I know drives liberals nuts.


I own a lot of guns and will continue to buy them. I support the 2nd amendment. . I also support removing guns from those proven to be dangerous and apt to kill people without intervention. A good friend of mines sister begged police to take her husbands guns--they refused--- One week later he killed 6 people some of whom I knew from high school.

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Aug 10, 2019 14:10:17   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
Coos Bay Tom wrote:
I own a lot of guns and will continue to buy them. I support the 2nd amendment. . I also support removing guns from those proven to be dangerous and apt to kill people without intervention. A good friend of mines sister begged police to take her husbands guns--they refused--- One week later he killed 6 people some of whom I knew from high school.


My wife knows two of the people shot in Dayton. Knows their parents real well. The kids weren't killed but their friend was. The shooter gave law enforcement multiple reasons to watch him. Until Laws change I don't know how you legally commit people like him.

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Aug 10, 2019 15:46:54   #
Coos Bay Tom Loc: coos bay oregon
 
JFlorio wrote:
My wife knows two of the people shot in Dayton. Knows their parents real well. The kids weren't killed but their friend was. The shooter gave law enforcement multiple reasons to watch him. Until Laws change I don't know how you legally commit people like him.


That is why laws must change. It is unfortunate for most of us but we can't let the bad guys go undetected and give them a free space to kill.

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Aug 10, 2019 16:25:05   #
Rose42
 
Parky60 wrote:
I understand everything you're saying Blade but a case in point I'd like to make is look how much more depraved we've become in just the four short years since we've legalized same-sex marriage? This very well could be the same slippery slope.


It is the same slippery slope. We know things are going to get much worse but we also know who wins in the end.

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