What Christians and Homosexuals need to understand about each other
Nov 23, 2015 21:33:26 #
Theo
Loc: Within 1000 miles of Tampa, Florida
Christians are taught to discriminate against most categories of sin committed by members of their Congregation.
Homosexuals have been taught that churches teach it is wrong to discriminate.
The truth is some denominations do in fact teach that we need to get along with all men, not discriminating, and not confronting sin since "we are all sinners."
I know of only a few who teach discrimination in todays confrontational arena. Scripture teaches discrimination among brethren, which is the term members use when referencing other members.
Many churches even teach that Christians are under the laws of Moses. That is just not so. The law of Christ is written on the heart, and is a law of the Spirit, not the letter, because the letter kills but the Spirit gives life.
2 Cor 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
And yes, that law of the spirit teaches we are to discriminate, and "I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world."[I Cor 5:9-10] This is important for Christians to understand; they are NOT to keep company with the sinners of the world. But they are not to be constantly confrontational with them unless they are attempting to join themselves to the church. They are not to be companions with the brethren within a congregation.
But the church is to judge the behavior, language, dress code, and anything that goes to making a better "Self" out of the self. And they are to judge in a way that it is aimed at helping each other grow in knowledge and practice toward a stronger Faith.
But Christians are not supposed to take public stands for the purpose of embarrassing citizens by singling them out for confrontation, and pronouncing judgment upon a behavior that is for the church, not the civil population.
Paul addressed this issue when he corrected the saints at Corinth who were causing trouble with local citizens who flaunted their evil ways taunt Christians who did not know better and thought their task was directed toward the world of sinful men.
That was the purpose of the Gospel, not the judgmental brethren. "But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? 13 But them that are without God judgeth.
14 Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person."[I Cor 5:11-14]
Christians have two basic patterns of behavior spelled out for them, each differs from the other based upon who outnumbers who in the congregation; i.e., it there are more faithful, the sinners are to be put out. If the sinners outnumber the faithful, the faithful are to leave the congregation and begin anew.
Within the church the saints are to discriminate, i.e., separate themselves from those who will not control themselves.
"Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness? 15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? 16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols?
For ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, 18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty."[II Cor 6:14-18][/quote]
It is not the function of the church to publicly confront the public. If a known base person comes into a publicly accessed place of business, for the purpose of business, it is not the place of the Christian to develop a confrontational issue as evidence of some assessment of righteousness that makes a public issue out of a private circumstance.
Yet again, a Christian cannot sit by and ignore sin within a congregation, for the cause of not wanting to confront a person who obviously needs better teaching about behavior and circumspection as a Christian. All Christians need a learning time, and need the patience of brethren, and a proper example by which they can be lead instead of driven.
The Brethren need to be made aware that lying, cheating, stealing, and a whole litany of sinful behavior is as damning to members of a congregation as the most scorned behavior among non-Christians for which many ignorant members judge in a public and confrontational manner. It is not to be the practice of Christians to make such a display of ignorance of the rules of Christian behavior.
And we should all learn to pray for our number, as well as those who are outside the body of Christ. Sin is a problem to all, and one of the greatest mischief making sins is the sin of "self-righteous judgment." We are admonished to
"Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment."[John 7:24]
Some churches have become so enamored of "Tollerance" they endanger the whole congregation by their insistence that none among them "discriminate," resulting in some cases, in developing preachers and leaders of such a terrible sinful nature as to cause the congregation to become abominable in God's sight.
It goes from a congregation being building blocks in the living temple of the living God, to submitting to the chastisement of John as he admonishes them - "Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us."[I John 2:18-19]
Christians in some situations, display a definite need to bully non-Christians with the stick of "Righteousness judgment." That is simply an attempt to beat some down who have a greater problem with temptation than the "bully" who simply cannot understand why anyone would find it harder to remain faithful than themselves.
All new Christians are "Babes in Christ, needing the sincere milk of the word of God." Some need more nourishing than do others. some need to be reminded to be patient with the weaknesses of new converts who have yet to establish themselves in the comfort of the scriptures.
Christianity is NOT a "one size fits all garment, to be worn only when in public, as a display for all to appreciate" but is a "New and Living Way, to be lived the same whether in public, or in private; in blessing or in peril; in teaching or in learning; we should ever be conscious of not only our own needs, but the needs of all our brethren who may not understand it the same way we do, and may not say it the same way we do. But it is our task to remember, they are not supposed to answer to us, but they in fact answer to the same Lord as do we.
So let us learn to practice Humility when among peers, simplicity when among babes in Christ, and eagerness to assist when among those who otherwise look upon us with the suspicion of newly formed converts to a new and living way.
Homosexuals have been taught that churches teach it is wrong to discriminate.
The truth is some denominations do in fact teach that we need to get along with all men, not discriminating, and not confronting sin since "we are all sinners."
I know of only a few who teach discrimination in todays confrontational arena. Scripture teaches discrimination among brethren, which is the term members use when referencing other members.
Many churches even teach that Christians are under the laws of Moses. That is just not so. The law of Christ is written on the heart, and is a law of the Spirit, not the letter, because the letter kills but the Spirit gives life.
2 Cor 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
And yes, that law of the spirit teaches we are to discriminate, and "I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world."[I Cor 5:9-10] This is important for Christians to understand; they are NOT to keep company with the sinners of the world. But they are not to be constantly confrontational with them unless they are attempting to join themselves to the church. They are not to be companions with the brethren within a congregation.
But the church is to judge the behavior, language, dress code, and anything that goes to making a better "Self" out of the self. And they are to judge in a way that it is aimed at helping each other grow in knowledge and practice toward a stronger Faith.
But Christians are not supposed to take public stands for the purpose of embarrassing citizens by singling them out for confrontation, and pronouncing judgment upon a behavior that is for the church, not the civil population.
Paul addressed this issue when he corrected the saints at Corinth who were causing trouble with local citizens who flaunted their evil ways taunt Christians who did not know better and thought their task was directed toward the world of sinful men.
That was the purpose of the Gospel, not the judgmental brethren. "But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? 13 But them that are without God judgeth.
14 Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person."[I Cor 5:11-14]
Christians have two basic patterns of behavior spelled out for them, each differs from the other based upon who outnumbers who in the congregation; i.e., it there are more faithful, the sinners are to be put out. If the sinners outnumber the faithful, the faithful are to leave the congregation and begin anew.
Within the church the saints are to discriminate, i.e., separate themselves from those who will not control themselves.
"Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness? 15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? 16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols?
For ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, 18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty."[II Cor 6:14-18][/quote]
It is not the function of the church to publicly confront the public. If a known base person comes into a publicly accessed place of business, for the purpose of business, it is not the place of the Christian to develop a confrontational issue as evidence of some assessment of righteousness that makes a public issue out of a private circumstance.
Yet again, a Christian cannot sit by and ignore sin within a congregation, for the cause of not wanting to confront a person who obviously needs better teaching about behavior and circumspection as a Christian. All Christians need a learning time, and need the patience of brethren, and a proper example by which they can be lead instead of driven.
The Brethren need to be made aware that lying, cheating, stealing, and a whole litany of sinful behavior is as damning to members of a congregation as the most scorned behavior among non-Christians for which many ignorant members judge in a public and confrontational manner. It is not to be the practice of Christians to make such a display of ignorance of the rules of Christian behavior.
And we should all learn to pray for our number, as well as those who are outside the body of Christ. Sin is a problem to all, and one of the greatest mischief making sins is the sin of "self-righteous judgment." We are admonished to
"Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment."[John 7:24]
Some churches have become so enamored of "Tollerance" they endanger the whole congregation by their insistence that none among them "discriminate," resulting in some cases, in developing preachers and leaders of such a terrible sinful nature as to cause the congregation to become abominable in God's sight.
It goes from a congregation being building blocks in the living temple of the living God, to submitting to the chastisement of John as he admonishes them - "Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us."[I John 2:18-19]
Christians in some situations, display a definite need to bully non-Christians with the stick of "Righteousness judgment." That is simply an attempt to beat some down who have a greater problem with temptation than the "bully" who simply cannot understand why anyone would find it harder to remain faithful than themselves.
All new Christians are "Babes in Christ, needing the sincere milk of the word of God." Some need more nourishing than do others. some need to be reminded to be patient with the weaknesses of new converts who have yet to establish themselves in the comfort of the scriptures.
Christianity is NOT a "one size fits all garment, to be worn only when in public, as a display for all to appreciate" but is a "New and Living Way, to be lived the same whether in public, or in private; in blessing or in peril; in teaching or in learning; we should ever be conscious of not only our own needs, but the needs of all our brethren who may not understand it the same way we do, and may not say it the same way we do. But it is our task to remember, they are not supposed to answer to us, but they in fact answer to the same Lord as do we.
So let us learn to practice Humility when among peers, simplicity when among babes in Christ, and eagerness to assist when among those who otherwise look upon us with the suspicion of newly formed converts to a new and living way.
Nov 24, 2015 04:21:09 #
I have no problem with homosexuals if they mind their own business, keep their sexual activities private, and maintain an even strain. However, that is not the case with gay activists, is it?
Though not even close to the vicious and lethal persecution of Christians by Islamic Jihadists, gay activists have developed their own virulent strain of coercion, intimidation, and persecution. They wield the weapon of ideological politics, which is obviously more insidious, more subtle, but, in some ways, just as destructive to the human spirit. And, for the most part, they have the government on their side. One cannot deny what gay activism has done and is doing to destroy Christianity.
It is no secret that some Christian denominational churches have already succumbed to the pressure, to PC, to government intrusions, and have abandoned the principles of their faith to accept what God has called an "abomination." For a Christian pastor or church to perform same sex marriages is to bestow God's blessing upon sin. This is sacrilege.
Though not even close to the vicious and lethal persecution of Christians by Islamic Jihadists, gay activists have developed their own virulent strain of coercion, intimidation, and persecution. They wield the weapon of ideological politics, which is obviously more insidious, more subtle, but, in some ways, just as destructive to the human spirit. And, for the most part, they have the government on their side. One cannot deny what gay activism has done and is doing to destroy Christianity.
It is no secret that some Christian denominational churches have already succumbed to the pressure, to PC, to government intrusions, and have abandoned the principles of their faith to accept what God has called an "abomination." For a Christian pastor or church to perform same sex marriages is to bestow God's blessing upon sin. This is sacrilege.
Nov 24, 2015 05:56:39 #
Theo
Loc: Within 1000 miles of Tampa, Florida
Blade_Runner wrote:
I have no problem with homosexuals if they mind th... (show quote)
Truth is, many churches have long ago destroyed Christianity and replaced it with Symbolism, doctrine, creed, and favoritism.
The teachers and preachers no longer preach the truth of scripture, but have succumbed to the traditions of the churches along denominational lines.
They no longer confront sin in the church, but join in that flavor of favoritism that will promote them the fastest.
Nov 24, 2015 10:07:10 #
Theo wrote:
Truth is, many churches have long ago destroyed Christianity and replaced it with Symbolism, doctrine, creed, and favoritism.
The teachers and preachers no longer preach the truth of scripture, but have succumbed to the traditions of the churches along denominational lines.
They no longer confront sin in the church, but join in that flavor of favoritism that will promote them the fastest.
The teachers and preachers no longer preach the truth of scripture, but have succumbed to the traditions of the churches along denominational lines.
They no longer confront sin in the church, but join in that flavor of favoritism that will promote them the fastest.
Yea, church is where sinners come to roost, that's for sure.
Nov 24, 2015 10:55:16 #
Dummy Boy wrote:
Yea, church is where sinners come to roost, that's for sure.
Maybe you should try roosting there.
Nov 24, 2015 17:11:00 #
mwdegutis wrote:
Maybe you should try roosting there.
..and sit next to you....
Nov 24, 2015 17:27:45 #
Dummy Boy wrote:
..and sit next to you....
I would welcome you to sit next to me.
Nov 24, 2015 21:07:19 #
Theo
Loc: Within 1000 miles of Tampa, Florida
Dummy Boy wrote:
Yea, church is where sinners come to roost, that's for sure.
I will try to explain to you , so you will consider something you may not have seen before -
many of us who are Christians do not attend church because we are perfect, but because if we do not attend and hear and listen to God's standard for our behavior, and his application of the lessons of Jesus' exemplary standard, we are much worse than if we do.
And I would also invite you to join with me in at least investigating this marvelous man, Jesus who is called
"Christ."
Nov 25, 2015 03:17:04 #
Theo wrote:
Christians are taught to discriminate against most... (show quote)
It is not the function of the church to publicly confront the public. If a known base person comes into a publicly accessed place of business, for the purpose of business, it is not the place of the Christian to develop a confrontational issue as evidence of some assessment of righteousness that makes a public issue out of a private circumstance.
Yet again, a Christian cannot sit by and ignore sin within a congregation, for the cause of not wanting to confront a person who obviously needs better teaching about behavior and circumspection as a Christian. All Christians need a learning time, and need the patience of brethren, and a proper example by which they can be lead instead of driven.
The Brethren need to be made aware that lying, cheating, stealing, and a whole litany of sinful behavior is as damning to members of a congregation as the most scorned behavior among non-Christians for which many ignorant members judge in a public and confrontational manner. It is not to be the practice of Christians to make such a display of ignorance of the rules of Christian behavior.
And we should all learn to pray for our number, as well as those who are outside the body of Christ. Sin is a problem to all, and one of the greatest mischief making sins is the sin of "self-righteous judgment." We are admonished to
"Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment."[John 7:24]
Some churches have become so enamored of "Tollerance" they endanger the whole congregation by their insistence that none among them "discriminate," resulting in some cases, in developing preachers and leaders of such a terrible sinful nature as to cause the congregation to become abominable in God's sight.
It goes from a congregation being building blocks in the living temple of the living God, to submitting to the chastisement of John as he admonishes them - "Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us."[I John 2:18-19]
Christians in some situations, display a definite need to bully non-Christians with the stick of "Righteousness judgment." That is simply an attempt to beat some down who have a greater problem with temptation than the "bully" who simply cannot understand why anyone would find it harder to remain faithful than themselves.
All new Christians are "Babes in Christ, needing the sincere milk of the word of God." Some need more nourishing than do others. some need to be reminded to be patient with the weaknesses of new converts who have yet to establish themselves in the comfort of the scriptures.
Christianity is NOT a "one size fits all garment, to be worn only when in public, as a display for all to appreciate" but is a "New and Living Way, to be lived the same whether in public, or in private; in blessing or in peril; in teaching or in learning; we should ever be conscious of not only our own needs, but the needs of all our brethren who may not understand it the same way we do, and may not say it the same way we do. But it is our task to remember, they are not supposed to answer to us, but they in fact answer to the same Lord as do we.
So let us learn to practice Humility when among peers, simplicity when among babes in Christ, and eagerness to assist when among those who otherwise look upon us with the suspicion of newly formed converts to a new and living way.[/quote]
discernment and discrimination may seem synonymous, but no matter how close...they are not the same. Discernment is non-judgmental, discrimination is judgmental.
Nov 25, 2015 10:17:46 #
Theo
Loc: Within 1000 miles of Tampa, Florida
fiatlux wrote:
discernment and discrimination may seem synonymous, but no matter how close...they are not the same. Discernment is non-judgmental, discrimination is judgmental.
Glad to see you DO know the difference-
I) Discrimination is what was commanded for Christians within the congregation.
Theo wrote:
"But now I have written unto you not to keep... (show quote)
II) Discernment was to be practiced outside of the congregation.
Theo wrote:
"I wrote unto you in an epistle not to compa... (show quote)
Keep up the good discernment!
Nov 25, 2015 10:21:18 #
Theo wrote:
I will try to explain to you , so you will conside... (show quote)
He's dead, he arose, and some sects celebrate his death rather than the gift of an avenue to God. I think I've got it.
Nov 25, 2015 10:22:00 #
mwdegutis wrote:
I would welcome you to sit next to me.
I'll wear tan pants, I don't like to get fur on them or at least that's visible.
Nov 25, 2015 10:24:36 #
Theo
Loc: Within 1000 miles of Tampa, Florida
Dummy Boy wrote:
He's dead, he arose, and some sects celebrate his death rather than the gift of an avenue to God. I think I've got it.
That's because in the communion we are told "Remember the Lord's death till He come."
We are not told to remember his life; but we are told to emulate his life. (Emulate= Follow his example)
Nov 25, 2015 10:30:31 #
Theo wrote:
That's because in the communion we are told "Remember the Lord's death till He come."
We are not told to remember his life; but we are told to emulate his life. (Emulate= Follow his example)
We are not told to remember his life; but we are told to emulate his life. (Emulate= Follow his example)
Wow, this information has had such a profound change in me....my legs are shaking.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Nov 25, 2015 10:39:11 #
Theo
Loc: Within 1000 miles of Tampa, Florida
Dummy Boy wrote:
Wow, this information has had such a profound change in me....my legs are shaking.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Now if your brain was as smart as your tongue, I would be impressed!
Guess it's Not to be!
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