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"The sacrament of the present moment."
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May 29, 2015 01:38:56   #
fiatlux
 
Zemirah wrote:
This title: "The sacrament of the present moment" has such a connotation of fragile futility, I am drawn to comment"

The quotes and remarks in parenthesis, other than scripture, are from the following article:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2012/sep/21/zen-buddhism-lessons

It is the claim of modern Zen Buddhist teachers, according to the above lesson, that

Jesus said, because of our Christian faith, He is with us every moment, every hour, and every day, throughout life.

and He said, “It is fitting that we do the works of Him who has sent me while it is day; the night is coming in which a man cannot work.” John 9:4

"Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of time." Matthew 28:19-20

This leaves us with no reason to either brood or to feel despair.
This title: "The sacrament of the present mom... (show quote)


This seems to sum up your objections: "To live without the value of a past from which we have learned, and a future to which we aspire in hope, life has no meaning."
Hope is not about looking forward, to a better future, but about looking inward, to the ever-present spirit of God.
Of what value is the past? The notion the past has any value is not just preposterous but detrimental to growth. God transforms, not lessons from the past. We do not in Christ learn from our mistakes but are given direction and instruction and strength by spirit and grace in each moment and situation to act for the kingdom.

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May 29, 2015 01:41:20   #
fiatlux
 
Zemirah wrote:
Are you speaking of the twelve positions of power yoga, - performed while standing in left field??


This is called free association with the yoga bit, and that is not paying attention to what Suzie said.

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May 29, 2015 01:43:39   #
fiatlux
 
Zemirah wrote:
My only theology is the written word of God.

Jesus said, in praying to God, the Father, "Thy word is truth."

John 17:17 "Sanctify them in the truth; Your word is truth."


Truth is found only in the moment. Repent for the kingdom of heaven is NOW!

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May 31, 2015 00:52:30   #
Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...
 
dennisimoto wrote:
Gotcha there, kiddo. Hernia surgery removed my belly button years ago. Consider: "God gave us memory that we may have roses in December." We do imagine that we live in a linear "time" but really, "now" is all the time there is.


Interesting.

I had hernia surgery last year that was "minimally invasive," band aid size incisions, and small band aid size at that, which visibly, at least, removed nothing.

I suppose that can be considered "progress." ;-)

If "now" is all the time for which we plan, we'll be like the grasshoppers in winter, - begging the busy ants to share the product of their labor.

Reply
May 31, 2015 01:03:44   #
fiatlux
 
fiatlux wrote:
This seems to sum up your objections: "To live without the value of a past from which we have learned, and a future to which we aspire in hope, life has no meaning."
Hope is not about looking forward, to a better future, but about looking inward, to the ever-present spirit of God.
Of what value is the past? The notion the past has any value is not just preposterous but detrimental to growth. God transforms, not lessons from the past. We do not in Christ learn from our mistakes but are given direction and instruction and strength by spirit and grace in each moment and situation to act for the kingdom.
This seems to sum up your objections: "To liv... (show quote)


This is utterly crucial to living in Christ: we learn nothing from the past; that is clever worldliness weaving a net to ensnare reliance on our own understanding, will, and effort.

Reply
May 31, 2015 01:10:09   #
fiatlux
 
Zemirah wrote:
This title: "The sacrament of the present moment" has such a connotation of fragile futility, I am drawn to comment"

The quotes and remarks in parenthesis, other than scripture, are from the following article:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2012/sep/21/zen-buddhism-lessons

It is the claim of modern Zen Buddhist teachers, according to the above lesson, that

Jesus said, because of our Christian faith, He is with us every moment, every hour, and every day, throughout life.

and He said, “It is fitting that we do the works of Him who has sent me while it is day; the night is coming in which a man cannot work.” John 9:4

"Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of time." Matthew 28:19-20

This leaves us with no reason to either brood or to feel despair.
This title: "The sacrament of the present mom... (show quote)


Before leaping to attack by what you perceive as language not properly pastorized to suit your ears, pause and reflect. The spirit will protect and guide you. You must trust that! Not to pause and reflect indicates doubt about grace. "I can do all things in Christ whose strengthens me."

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May 31, 2015 01:27:43   #
Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...
 
fiatlux wrote:
This seems to sum up your objections: "To live without the value of a past from which we have learned, and a future to which we aspire in hope, life has no meaning."
Hope is not about looking forward, to a better future, but about looking inward, to the ever-present spirit of God.
Of what value is the past? The notion the past has any value is not just preposterous but detrimental to growth. God transforms, not lessons from the past. We do not in Christ learn from our mistakes but are given direction and instruction and strength by spirit and grace in each moment and situation to act for the kingdom.
This seems to sum up your objections: "To liv... (show quote)


I have no objections.

I was contrasting the beliefs taught by Christian Scripture and that of Zen Buddism.

Looking inward requires no hope. It's a purely subjective enterprise requiring nothing more than self-absorption.

The Holy Spirit is our guide, comforter, and teacher. Once indwelling, one need not search for Him.

He'll find you.

The only thing we can do about the past is to learn from it, - and use that knowledge to assist those whom God inevitably places in our path; those who are now suffering in the same circumstances from which God delivered us...

"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our affliction so that we will be able to comfort those who are in any affliction with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God."
2nd Corinthians 1:3-4

Whatever the "kingdom" may be, on whose behave, you're acting; Failure to learn from the past is still a prime clue portending insanity. ;)

The only thing we can do about the past is to learn from it, - and to thank God we survived it.

Reply
 
 
May 31, 2015 19:52:16   #
Armageddun Loc: The show me state
 
Zemirah wrote:
This title: "The sacrament of the present moment" has such a connotation of fragile futility, I am drawn to comment"

The quotes and remarks in parenthesis, other than scripture, are from the following article:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2012/sep/21/zen-buddhism-lessons

It is the claim of modern Zen Buddhist teachers, according to the above lesson, that

Jesus said, because of our Christian faith, He is with us every moment, every hour, and every day, throughout life.

and He said, “It is fitting that we do the works of Him who has sent me while it is day; the night is coming in which a man cannot work.” John 9:4

"Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of time." Matthew 28:19-20

This leaves us with no reason to either brood or to feel despair.
This title: "The sacrament of the present mom... (show quote)


:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Reply
May 31, 2015 20:00:21   #
Armageddun Loc: The show me state
 
fiatlux wrote:
This is utterly crucial to living in Christ: we learn nothing from the past; that is clever worldliness weaving a net to ensnare reliance on our own understanding, will, and effort.


Romans 15:4

Reply
May 31, 2015 20:11:15   #
Armageddun Loc: The show me state
 
fiatlux wrote:
Truth is found only in the moment. Repent for the kingdom of heaven is NOW!



Matt 3:2; 4:17

Reply
May 31, 2015 22:24:17   #
fiatlux
 
Zemirah wrote:
I have no objections.

I was contrasting the beliefs taught by Christian Scripture and that of Zen Buddism.

Looking inward requires no hope. It's a purely subjective enterprise requiring nothing more than self-absorption.

The Holy Spirit is our guide, comforter, and teacher. Once indwelling, one need not search for Him.

He'll find you.

The only thing we can do about the past is to learn from it, - and use that knowledge to assist those whom God inevitably places in our path; those who are now suffering in the same circumstances from which God delivered us...

"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our affliction so that we will be able to comfort those who are in any affliction with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God."
2nd Corinthians 1:3-4

Whatever the "kingdom" may be, on whose behave, you're acting; Failure to learn from the past is still a prime clue portending insanity. ;)

The only thing we can do about the past is to learn from it, - and to thank God we survived it.
I have no objections. br br I was contrasting the... (show quote)


"Looking inward requires no hope. It's a purely subjective enterprise requiring nothing more than self-absorption.

"The Holy Spirit is our guide, comforter, and teacher. Once indwelling, one need not search for Him."

Are you even reading what I said? "indwelling" is somehow not "inward"? I never said one need search for the spirit" I said look 'inward to the ever-present spirit.' No Google or Bing required. The seed of God is there.

The past teaches us absolutely nothing and never well. The reasons for that are so multiple and obvious if we are in Christ that I am at a real loss as to how to proceed. If you cannot see this, I doubt that we can continue this discussion.

Reply
 
 
May 31, 2015 22:40:04   #
fiatlux
 
Armageddun wrote:
Matt 3:2; 4:17


Do you ever once try to look deeper than the surface? Pompous quotes from scripture you think you alone have read and understand? Why assume I am some ignorant bumpkin that somehow never got around to read Matthew? Your arrogance is sickening. Or is it just self-righteousness? You could inquire as to what I mean by "Truth is found only in the moment." But you much prefer to judge and condemn, opening your mind a can of worms best left contained. Right? Or are you agreeing? Mt4:17 is, or appears to be, a non Sequitor.

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May 31, 2015 23:09:39   #
Armageddun Loc: The show me state
 
fiatlux wrote:
Do you ever once try to look deeper than the surface? Pompous quotes from scripture you think you alone have read and understand? Why assume I am some ignorant bumpkin that somehow never got around to read Matthew? Your arrogance is sickening. Or is it just self-righteousness? You could inquire as to what I mean by "Truth is found only in the moment." But you much prefer to judge and condemn, opening your mind a can of worms best left contained. Right? Or are you agreeing? Mt4:17 is, or appears to be, a non Sequitor.
Do you ever once try to look deeper than the surfa... (show quote)


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Does this mean I won't be on your Christmas card list this year?

Your response sounds like a remark that would be made on the Main thread. Also what happened to all of the love, love, love your were touting?

I am so sorry I cannot trust your persona, I am not a trouble maker or a smart alec. You haven't convinced me that you are who you claim to be.

I vowed to myself to just set and watch for a while since this is a new section. However, I could not let you or anyone for that matter change words from scripture that could possibly cause confusion to new believers or perhaps one who may be on the edge of accepting Christ.

All arguments, discussion, decisions, in my estimation should be from the Bible (God's inspired Word).

Your self reflection, at least in my estimation leaves out denying oneself, taking up the cross, and following Jesus. The Cross must always come before the Crown.

Reply
May 31, 2015 23:24:10   #
Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...
 
fiatlux wrote:
"Looking inward requires no hope. It's a purely subjective enterprise requiring nothing more than self-absorption.

"The Holy Spirit is our guide, comforter, and teacher. Once indwelling, one need not search for Him."

Are you even reading what I said? "indwelling" is somehow not "inward"? I never said one need search for the spirit" I said look 'inward to the ever-present spirit.' No Google or Bing required. The seed of God is there.

The past teaches us absolutely nothing and never well. The reasons for that are so multiple and obvious if we are in Christ that I am at a real loss as to how to proceed. If you cannot see this, I doubt that we can continue this discussion.
"Looking inward requires no hope. It's a pure... (show quote)


Good thinking.

God, the Holy Spirit, has personhood, - no "seed" is required.

Reply
May 31, 2015 23:27:33   #
fiatlux
 
Armageddun wrote:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Does this mean I won't be on your Christmas card list this year?

Your response sounds like a remark that would be made on the Main thread. Also what happened to all of the love, love, love your were touting?

I am so sorry I cannot trust your persona, I am not a trouble maker or a smart alec. You haven't convinced me that you are who you claim to be.

I vowed to myself to just set and watch for a while since this is a new section. However, I could not let you or anyone for that matter change words from scripture that could possibly cause confusion to new believers or perhaps one who may be on the edge of accepting Christ.

All arguments, discussion, decisions, in my estimation should be from the Bible (God's inspired Word).

Your self reflection, at least in my estimation leaves out denying oneself, taking up the cross, and following Jesus. The Cross must always come before the Crown.
--------------------------------------------------... (show quote)


I accept your Right wing paranoia inhibits your ability to open to my words. What happened to "all of the love, love, love": it was given in stern rebuke for your prejudiced and closed heart and mind. All my arguments and discussions are taken straight from scripture. If you find this not to be true, then speak plainly, not cast scripture verses like stones to somehow indict me. Show me I am wrong--and I will concede.

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