So you're clearly stating here that capitalism is the choice of lavish dictators that keep their servants poor. That's very interesting. I would not have expected that from you.

But what's more interesting is that you're getting closer to understanding what I've been trying to tell you all along... that the leaders of "c*******t" countries are not the champions of c*******m we make them out to be. Leaders like Lenin, Stalin and Mao, just to list the iconic examples, were far more interested in using tyranny to satisfy their own desires which is NOT what Marx had in mind.

You're basically shooting the wrong target. All this fuss about defectors and "living the experience" is related to tyranny. C*******m, in the academic sense, as described by Marx has nothing to do with any of it.

I *have* tried to explain the difference between the c*******m I've read about and the c*******m that were are assuming PR experienced but you aren't really listening to me because you've already made up your mind to disagree before you even start reading.

I'll try one more time...

The c*******m that Marx described is NOT the "c*******m" that Russians experienced. What the Russians experienced was a tyrannical regime that hijacked a revolution that promised c*******m (as described by Marx)but never delivered it.

The reason why I feel it's important to make this point is that in America there is an effort to prevent the working class from defending themselves against exploitation and one the most effective approaches to doing this is to equate all forms of collectivism to c*******m and then equate c*******m to what happened in Russia.

Indeed, it's become clear throughout history that the only way "little people" are able to stand up against the bullies is if they do it collectively, whether it's e******ns, labor union negotiations or revolution. As they say, "United we stand, divided we fall." Most people can see the logic in that so it take a fair amount of emotional leverage to by-pass that logic circuit and commit people to a society where little people are too scared of being c*******t to even bargain collectively.

So there's a point… about 500 miles beyond the traffic jam of emotions and right-wing delusion that you folks can't seem to get out of.

I'll try one more time...

The c*******m that Marx described is NOT the "c*******m" that Russians experienced. What the Russians experienced was a tyrannical regime that hijacked a revolution that promised c*******m (as described by Marx)but never delivered it.

The reason why I feel it's important to make this point is that in America there is an effort to prevent the working class from defending themselves against exploitation and one the most effective approaches to doing this is to equate all forms of collectivism to c*******m and then equate c*******m to what happened in Russia.

Indeed, it's become clear throughout history that the only way "little people" are able to stand up against the bullies is if they do it collectively, whether it's e******ns, labor union negotiations or revolution. As they say, "United we stand, divided we fall." Most people can see the logic in that so it take a fair amount of emotional leverage to by-pass that logic circuit and commit people to a society where little people are too scared of being c*******t to even bargain collectively.

So there's a point… about 500 miles beyond the traffic jam of emotions and right-wing delusion that you folks can't seem to get out of.