straightUp Loc: California

Anyone who takes the time to converse with half-wits is going to come off as condescending or arrogant. That's just the way it is.


You might not intend for it to be a compliment, but given the context and where the "insult" is coming from I DO consider it a compliment and there's really not much you can do about that. When the only response a person has to a argument is a personal insult, that's an indication that the person being insulted has the better argument and the other person is what we call a sore loser.


Some people do. They just tend not to be half-witted Republicans.


Just because someone struggles to read something doesn't mean it's wordy.


Is that why you always feel compelled to respond with insults from your bucket of anger?

straightUp Loc: California

Living it doesn't mean you understand it... Lot's of people live in poverty, that doesn't mean they understand economics.


LOL - You just keep telling yourself that, Sparky.

trashbaum

People who say they prefer c*******m over capitalism are liars. Take a look at all leaders of c*******t countries. Their servants are poor but they themselves live lavishly. The leaders want for nothing, meaning capitalism means much more to them.

straightUp Loc: California

I *have* tried to explain the difference between the c*******m I've read about and the c*******m that were are assuming PR experienced but you aren't really listening to me because you've already made up your mind to disagree before you even start reading.

I'll try one more time...

The c*******m that Marx described is NOT the "c*******m" that Russians experienced. What the Russians experienced was a tyrannical regime that hijacked a revolution that promised c*******m (as described by Marx)but never delivered it.

The reason why I feel it's important to make this point is that in America there is an effort to prevent the working class from defending themselves against exploitation and one the most effective approaches to doing this is to equate all forms of collectivism to c*******m and then equate c*******m to what happened in Russia.

Indeed, it's become clear throughout history that the only way "little people" are able to stand up against the bullies is if they do it collectively, whether it's e******ns, labor union negotiations or revolution. As they say, "United we stand, divided we fall." Most people can see the logic in that so it take a fair amount of emotional leverage to by-pass that logic circuit and commit people to a society where little people are too scared of being c*******t to even bargain collectively.

So there's a point… about 500 miles beyond the traffic jam of emotions and right-wing delusion that you folks can't seem to get out of.

straightUp Loc: California

That a ridiculous assumption...

Like I said, there are millions of Americans that have lived here all their lives and still don't know how their own government works or how the market economy works.

If you want to know the frustration of living under a tyranny like the Soviet system then yes, "living it" will do the trick, but if you want to understand the theory of c*******m, you need to read a book.

straightUp Loc: California

You keep saying that I toss out red herrings and yet you can never actually point them out. Hmmm.

Just because someone is introducing another angle you haven't thought of before doesn't mean they are pushing away from the point. Sometimes that angle exposes the fallacy of the point.

trashbaum

People trying to stand together collectively to o*******w a dictator, never works because the leaders already have their security in place. Life is very dear to most. Reading books about anything is not necessarily good because you are learning only about he authors opinion. Again facts are compiled by the author and contain only their opinion. Now we will hear NO,NO, thats not true. But I am afraid it is.

straightUp Loc: California

I'm just waiting for you to respond Huckleberry... The ball is in your court. In case, you forgot (or you're trying to) here's the last post in that side discussion on c*******m. You have yet to respond.

https://www.onepoliticalplaza.com/tpr?p=3880621&t=225989

BTW, thanks for defending my posts... I know you don't agree with with what you think I am saying most of the time but it's nice to see someone who doesn't agree with you at least have the integrity to acknowledge the efforts made to explain a different perspective.

trashbaum

You are nuts, reading a book only teaches you the author's opinion. You are trying to base your knowledge on half fiction. People who have escaped c*******m is still afraid to discuss the real problem. Fear is how you contain c*******m. It still works today. Reading a book will not truly teach you anything. Experience is the real teacher.

straightUp Loc: California

So when 13 colonies collectively stood up to the king, it didn't work?


So people are too scared to assemble, is that what you're saying?


So read more than one book. Dugh.



Every conclusion has a varying level of credibility ranging from fact to fantasy that can be assessed logically. At the same time, people often deny credibility based on illogical circumstances such as emotional attachments to ideology and this is where you can often hear people calling facts, opinions.

trashbaum

Thirteen colonies did not go up against a dictator, but a monarch and fought on different continents. That is not an uprising but a war fought against countries. No matter what your comic books may say.

straightUp Loc: California

Well, like I said the last time you pointed out how books are bad... If you want more that one author's opinion, read more than one book!

When I read a book, I don't consider it scripture to stock my faith in... I consider it a perspective to think about.


I am basing my knowledge on the triangulation of many different sources. Please try to remember... I'm not some redneck who thinks every book should be read like it's the Holy Bible. I don't subscribe like you folks do. That how I'm able to read the C*******t Manifesto without "becoming" a c*******t.

Do you really not understand that concept?


They probably don't KNOW the real problem. Just because someone experiences something doesn't make them an expert. Were s***es experts in t***s-Atlantic trade?


And there's no better example than right here in America where a red-dawn fear of c*******m is manufactured and propagated across the fearful right.


Obviously... You can't talk about c*******m without hyperventilating.


So then surgeons should just start cutting up patients to learn how to be a surgeon instead of reading books about conditions and treatments because books are... worthless. Got it.

son of witless

I'm a little slow sometimes. In general I do a good job of sizing people up. With you I am taking a little longer to get there.

straightUp Loc: California

LOL - desperately trying to save your argument? Look, you can toss labels around all you want... it doesn't change the fact that it took the collective effort of 13 colonies (and help from France) to match up to the power of the ruling authority and break free from it's domain.

"but that was a monarch, not a dictator" - LOL

straightUp Loc: California

I don't know anyone who says they prefer c*******m to capitalism, so I wouldn't know.


So you're clearly stating here that capitalism is the choice of lavish dictators that keep their servants poor. That's very interesting. I would not have expected that from you.

But what's more interesting is that you're getting closer to understanding what I've been trying to tell you all along... that the leaders of "c*******t" countries are not the champions of c*******m we make them out to be. Leaders like Lenin, Stalin and Mao, just to list the iconic examples, were far more interested in using tyranny to satisfy their own desires which is NOT what Marx had in mind.

You're basically shooting the wrong target. All this fuss about defectors and "living the experience" is related to tyranny. C*******m, in the academic sense, as described by Marx has nothing to do with any of it.