BigMike Loc: yerington nv

I guess that's the rub. There's some that want our money funneled to such entities.

federally indicted mattoid

Lol, like so many here, selective hearing.

Go read the actual transcript and turm off Fox news. It's eating your brain.

dougolfw

American Vet is right.

Gatsby

Mitt harbors a pathological hatred for President Trump, it is only that h**e that he is true to.

dougolfw

do you have a list of Republican Senators that have said Trump was guilty? I think the list is one.

federally indicted mattoid

Lamar A

Makes 2. Weak tea Collins sorta kinda said it but was afraid to ruffle IMPOTUS's tar and feathers - I mean feathers :)

Sondland, Vindman, Taylor, Hill, Yavonovich, all part of this administration also agreed he is guilty.

proud republican Loc: RED CALIFORNIA

Who the hell cares???

Liberty Tree

Mitt was driven by h**e. The others knew it was not an impeachable offense.

Peewee Loc: San Antonio, TX

Great, now you're a mind reader and physic.

BigMike Loc: yerington nv

So? Who cares what unelected, c*********d-and-about-to-be-busted, sour grapes bureaucrats have to say about it?

BigMike Loc: yerington nv

Not far enough. Plenty of "Republicans" were in on it too.

JohnCorrespondent

What bugged me is that they refused to allow evidence in the formal trial, such as Bolton, Trump, & Mulvaney testimonies (for the Senate to subpoena) and such as "documents" (I heard there were "documents", and normally a genuine trial would have documentary evidence -- and witnesses, of course).

Re: what's wrong with them: to put it charitably, they are only human. They have their own skins to save, and their own comfortable lives to try to save, and they might be thinking short-term instead of long-term.

(
Those who have had some kinds of experiences will not be so surprised at this. For example, one of my experiences was to appear before a judge in a "Hearing" but I found the "Hearing" was grossly unfair. I didn't expect that. I didn't understand. (Maybe now, with experience, I'd be able to navigate such a "Hearing" a little better, but it would still be challenging.) After a while I got used to it, sort of. Judges, and Senators, and we (including myself, and maybe including you), and even Presidents, are fallible human beings and subject to a great variety of corruptions.
)

Re: what's wrong with the system. At this point, I'd say the problem with the system is that many people misunderstand the system. The system was designed, wisely, to have a deliberative, thoughtful body with relevant educations -- that would be the U.S. Senate -- theoretically -- and they would have a role, which in this case was to have a genuine trial (theoretically impartial jurors, or jurors trying to behave responsibly, evidence, etc.). The attempts to off-put the problem onto "the will of the People", which would be expressed in nationwide "popular" (theoretically "popular", though warped by the e*******l college) e******ns, is based on a misunderstanding. The misunderstanding is the failure to realize why some things should be decided by a deliberative, thoughtful body with relevant educations, rather than by a general v**e of the People.

So the original design of the system was sort of okay -- pretty good, I think. The Founders had some good ideas. Those good ideas are not appreciated well enough, and so then the process gets corrupted.

A relatively very good attorney once told me that many judges don't really understand the need for due process.

But even the People have to understand, so that they will hold the officials accountable.

(
By the way:

A televised genuine trial in the Senate, viewed by many well-informed citizens, would tend to educate us, so that we and the government all improve over time.

We do improve over time, I think. In my opinion the lack of a genuine trial slows us down in our improvement and maybe even sets us back.
)

On the other hand, you could see what an expert says: Lawrence Lessig recently wrote a book _They Don't Represent Us_. In the beginning of Part I, he says "For many years ... I've called money the root to the problems of this Republic. That was a mistake. ... [Money] is just one example of a more fundamental problem: unrepresentativeness."

Good luck trying to absorb the experts. I find it a lot easier to acquire a book than to read it.

Peewee Loc: San Antonio, TX

It only takes three things that are in short supply: 1) know right from wrong 2) character 3) being willing to hold wrongdoers to the law or standards. But then you have to hold yourself to the same standards.

BigMike Loc: yerington nv

The 17th amendment would be where I'd start. Only then could we get rid of the Fed and IRS...although Trump has some plans for the former, I hear.

I'd also advise a new rule; Former spooks can never run for prez or as vice-prez ever again! Cabinet positions OK.

Peewee Loc: San Antonio, TX

Poppy Bush? I can't think of any others.