Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...

Each of us has the freedom of choice to see what we choose to see.

Below is a brief paper by Professor Fred Sanders regarding the Triune God of the Bible.

Zondervan Academic Online Courses: The Triune God, taught by Fred Sanders PhD, Professor of Theology in the Torrey Honors Institute at Biola University in La Mirada, CA.

What Does the Old Testament Say about the Trinity?
by Fred Sanders

In the New Testament, Christians are given a new lens through which they see God. He is still the one true God we discover in the Jewish Shema prayer:

“Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength.”—Deuteronomy 6:4–5 (emphasis added)

But we discover Jesus and the Holy Spirit as distinct persons who are also God. Because of this New Testament revelation, Christian orthodoxy relies on an understanding of God as a Trinity — one living and true God who exists eternally as three persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

In light of this revelation, can we expect to see traces of the Trinity revealed in the Old Testament as well?

"Throughout the Old Testament we catch glimpses of an agent of Yahweh who behaves as if he were the presence of the Lord, and at other times he appears to be an emissary. It’s easy to understand how a trinitarian theologian, informed by the New Testament, would recognize the Angel of the Lord — a figure who seems to be with God and to be God — as a christological figure.

“The angel added, ‘I will increase your descendants so much that they will be too numerous to count.’”—Genesis 16:10 (emphasis added)

“‘Do not lay a hand on the boy,’ he [the Angel of the Lord] said. ‘Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from Me your son, your only son.’”—Genesis 22:12

“On that day the Lord will shield those who live in Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the Angel of the Lord going before them.”—Zechariah 12:8

The angel of the Lord appears as a Christophany—a manifestation that, while distinct from God the Father, is also God.

There are points in the Old Testament where God’s very word is personified as it would be if God’s Word referenced Jesus.

“For the word of the Lord is right and true;
he is faithful in all he does.”—Psalm 33:4

“The grass withers and the flowers fall,
but the word of our God endures forever.”—Isaiah 40:8

In his gospel, John describes Jesus as the Word of God. This sheds new light on many of the Old Testament references to God’s Word.

The Spirit of God in the Old Testament

Many things said about the Spirit “going forth” or “being with” seem to indicate agency. It seems throughout the Old Testament that the Spirit is the self-conscious immanence of God, as well as the revelation of God. God’s Spirit also seems to dwell with God’s followers, and seems to act as an objective personality.

“Do not cast me from your presence
or take your Holy Spirit from me.
Restore to me the joy of your salvation
and grant me a willing spirit, to sustain me.
Then I will teach transgressors your ways,
so that sinners will turn back to you.”—Psalm 51:11–13

“Yet they rebelled
and grieved his Holy Spirit.
So he turned and became their enemy
and he himself fought against them.”—Isaiah 63:10

“Come near me and listen to this:
‘From the first announcement I have not spoken in secret;
at the time it happens, I am there.’
And now the Sovereign Lord has sent me,
endowed with his Spirit.”—Isaiah 48:16


Jesus promises us the Spirit in the New Testament, and in Acts we see the Spirit’s advent at Pentecost. In light of this, it’s no surprise that this would reframe our understanding of God’s Spirit in the Old Testament.

Old Testament passages in which God speaks of himself in the plural

At different times, God speaks about himself using singular pronouns and at others, he opts for plural ones:

Singular:

“I now establish my covenant with you and with your descendants after you”—Genesis 9:9 (emphasis added)
“Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, ‘Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?’”—Isaiah 6:8 (emphasis added)
“And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a firstborn son.”—Zechariah 12:10 (emphasis added)

Plural:

“Then God said, ‘Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.’”—Genesis 1:26 (emphasis added)
“And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.”—Genesis 3:22 (emphasis added)
“Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”—Genesis 11:7 (emphasis added)

“Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?—Isaiah 6:8 (emphasis added)

Outside of the the New Testament’s revelation of the Trinity, it’s hard to make sense of the singular/plural dichotomy in these passages. Engaging them with a trinitarian understanding sheds new light on their possible implications.

Old Testament passages where more than one person is expressly named

These are passages where the Lord speaks of himself or the Messiah in a repetitive, reduplicative way:

“Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever;
a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.
You love righteousness and hate wickedness;
therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions
by anointing you with the oil of joy.”—Psalm 45:6-7
The Lord says to my lord:
“Sit at my right hand
until I make your enemies
a footstool for your feet.”—Psalm 110:1

The repetitive expressions of God in some Old Testament passages may point to various persons in the Trinity.
9. Passages where the name of God is repeated three times

There is a rich tradition of interpreting passages where God’s name is repeated three times as a trinitarian reference. The most referenced example of this is Numbers 6:24–26:

“The Lord bless you
and keep you;
the Lord make his face shine on you
and be gracious to you;
the Lord turn his face toward you
and give you peace.”

Many theologians believe passages, like this one in Numbers, demonstrate a preview of the Trinity by repeating God’s name in threes.

Reading the Old Testament with the Trinity in mind

How do we read these passages in a way that will preserve their mystery and shed some light on what we learn about the godhead from the New Testament?

One way we can do this and maintain interpretive integrity is by rereading. Rereading is a crucial exegetical practice.

Rereading is the act of studying a document by reading it all the way through to the end—and once you have an understanding of the document as a whole—you read it all the way through again. This gives you an enriched understanding of the document as a whole. This allows you to understand the sense that individual parts make on their own, but help you also grasp the higher meaning that is generated by understanding them in relation to each other.

What is required for doctrinal interpretation of the Old Testament is a hermeneutical framework that acknowledges the complex structure of revelation, and an approach to reading the documents that precede and follow the revelation.

Rereading is the key hermeneutical category for this kind of interpretation. It captures the ambiguity and concealment of the original writings, but also accounts for the progressive revelation and the attendant growth in understanding of the earlier material.

https://courses.zondervanacademic.com/triune-god?utm_source=za_blog&utm_medium=blog&utm_campaign=triune_god_cm&utm_content=text_link

I, personally, see no reason for either a course or conscious deliberate rereading of the Bible to understand the presence of the Trinity.

Addendum:

Anyone who is truly interested in studying and knowing the Bible because it is God's message to mankind, will automatically read and reread informative passages (which are all of them), without the necessity of being instructed to do so.

I've posted this information because many people do value information more if from a PhD carrying University professor. Any professing Christian will find the guidance of the Holy Spirit sufficient for all necessary assistance.

Armageddun Loc: The show me state

Amen there is plenty scriptures that mention the Holy Spirit. The difference between the Old vs. New Testaments is in the OT. the Spirit seems to be "on" but in the NT He is said to be "in."

IMHO your (Zemirah) knowledge is akin to a Ph.D.

Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall

So you're stating that God intentionally hid His true nature from the Jews?

Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...

No, You just said that! I stated no such thing.

Where did you ever get such an idea? Don't attribute your own thoughts to me.

Are you under the impression that God contractually owes you a statement worded as you dictate?

Much of the time in the past, God appears to have operated on a "Need to Know" basis,
doubtless because He understood man's fallen nature, and superficial callousness.

He has, however, always told man to "dig deep," certainly directly insinuating there was more to discover by those willing to invest the time and energy, because of their love for Him.

Jeremiah 29:13 "You will seek Me and find Me when you search for Me with all your heart."

James 4:8 "Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you."

2nd Timothy 2:15: "Study to show thyself approved."

He is encouraging us to discover Him, as He is (a Trinity).

Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall

I certainly didn't state that..

It appeared from your post that that was your premise...

I am merely confused as to why God never revealed His essential nature to the Jewish people.. His chosen people...

Even though He repeatedly admonished them to worship only Him... And avoid all false gods...

It was his first commandment to Moses..


You don't find it somewhat odd?

Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...

Actually, God's first commandment to Moses was to take off his shoes.

Exodus 3: God called to Moses from the burning bush.
1. (1-3) Moses and the burning bush on Mount Horeb.

"Now Moses was tending the flock of Jethro his father-in-law, the priest of Midian. And he led the flock to the back of the desert, and came to Horeb, the mountain of God. And "the Angel of the LORD" appeared to him in a flame of fire from the midst of a bush."

The bush was burning with fire, but the bush was not consumed: It wasn’t just that Moses saw a bush burning; two things were distinctive about that bush:

· The Angel of the LORD appeared… from the midst of the bush.
“Not a created angel certainly, for He is called Jehovah, Exodus 3:4 (and has the most expressive attributes of the Godhead applied to him).
· Though the bush burned, the bush was not consumed.
“Though the bush burned with fire, it did not crackle or diminish, no leaf curled and no branch charred.

So when the LORD saw that he [Moses] turned aside to look, God called to him from the midst of the bush and said, “Moses, Moses!” And he said, “Here I am.” Then He said, “Do not draw near this place. Take your sandals off your feet, for the place where you stand is holy ground.”

Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God.

Did you notice that "the Angel of the Lord" [1] appeared to Moses surrounded by a flame[2] from the midst of the burning bush... and it caused Moses no consternation, for he drew aside to look closer?

Did you notice when God[3] (Are you counting?) addressed Moses from the bush, "Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God?"

Yet, he had looked upon the Angel of the Lord...

No, you didn't notice.

You were busy demanding to know: "Why didn't God do this? Why didn't God do that?"

"Ezekiel 12:2: Son of man, you are living among a rebellious people. They have eyes to see but do not see and ears to hear but do not hear, for they are a rebellious people."

Have you ever been struck by the number of times Jesus said, “For those who have eyes to see, let them see, and for those who have ears to hear, let them hear??"

Your words, Canuckus, your state of mind... "Merely confused," indeed.

Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall

Nice job at obfuscation...

God spoke through the angel...

I believe this is the Jewish idea of "agency"...

Somewhat surprised that you didn't understand I was talking about the first of the Ten Commandments...

But it was probably just your way of dodging the question...

Hard one to answer... I understand...

Rose42

No dodge. And not hard to answer.

8 “For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
Nor are your ways My ways,” declares the Lord.
9 “For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
So are My ways higher than your ways
And My thoughts than your thoughts.

Isaiah 55:8-9

I suggest you do some research on the angel of the Lord.

Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall

If it's easy to answer then please do...

It will clarify many things...

Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...

Canuckus, there are times when Jewish ideas do not align with God's own ideas.

God believes He sent the Jewish Messiah over 2,000 years ago.

The Jewish people, for the most part, believe they are still awaiting His arrival.

On the day of Pentecost, the Holy Spirit appeared as flames of fire, flames that did not burn, neither did they consume.

"And they saw tongues like flames of fire separating and resting on their heads, one to each of them, (Acts 2:3)

On the day, that God(1) appointed Moses to go back to Egypt and free His people from Pharaoh, the Angel of the Lord(2) (the pre-incarnate Christ) appeared to Moses from the midst of a flame(3) of fire that did not burn or consume (which was the Holy Spirit).

"And the Angel of the LORD appeared to him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed." (Exodus 3:2)

Obfuscation is your word, your action.

Nothing is said in the above passage of God speaking through the Angel of the Lord (who is the 2nd person of the Godhead, and is therefore, God).

When the Angel of the Lord appeared to Moses he was not afraid. He approached for a closer look.

It was when God spoke to Moses, that Moses hid his face, afraid to look upon Him.

I'm amazed that you think God gave Moses no commandments before they reached Mt. Sinai on their return trip from Egypt. Did you believe He was communicating with hand signals all those months?

God gave Moses many commandments all the way to Egypt and back, before He gave Him the tablet of stone on which the Ten Commandments were inscribed.

You asked for His first commandment to Moses, which was to remove his shoes, as the ground on which he stood was Holy Ground (for the Triune God was there).

Answering questions is not difficult, however no one can force you to understand or accept the answer.

Jesus said, "With man this is impossible, but with God, all things are possible."
(Matthew 19:26)

In the Old Testament, "the angel of the Lord / God" spoke in the first person as though He were God, had the attributes of God, yet was distinct from God. In consideration of the triune nature of God, is He God the father, Son, or Holy Spirit?

Exodus 33:20 suggests that "the angel of the Lord / God" cannot be God the father since no man can see His face and live.

John 1:18 and 1 Timothy 6:16 further affirms that no one has seen God the Father.

Examples such as Judges 3:10, Isaiah 11:2, Luke 4:18 indicate that the Holy Spirit is not visible to human beings, with the exceptions of as a dove or a flame.

Throughout the Gospels, Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is the only visible Person of the Trinity that human beings can see face to face and yet live.

"The angel of the Lord / God" share the similarity of being sent by God.

The patriarch Jacob makes the very first mention of the word redeemed and associates the term with the angel within the context of "redemption from all evil" (Gen 48:16).

Hosea 12:3-4 makes it clear that the patriarch Jacob associated the angel with God.

"The angel of the Lord / God" was never seen again after the incarnation of Jesus Christ.

For the above reasons, "the angel of the Lord / God" is understood to be the pre-incarnate Jesus Christ. And in only this instance, "the angel of the Lord / God," an angel is not seen as a created angel.

A theosophany, such as "the angel of the Lord / God," is a visual manifestation of God before the incarnation. The purpose is to convey some revelation or truth about God.

Reference:

1. Baze JM, The Angel of the Lord in the Old Testament–volume 1, number 3 (1997).

2. Baze JM, The Angel of the Lord in the Old Testament–volume 2, number 4 (1998).Pa

Angel of the Lord: Christology