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Open Border? Or the Wall? A solution....
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Jan 10, 2019 10:04:55   #
Canuckus Deploracus (a regular here)
 
Pennylynn wrote:
Sorry, but I disagree yet again. No one, to include the President is working toward getting
"rid of legal immigrants." If you listen carefully, with open heart and mind, you will hear the President offering compromises for DARCA, a generous guest worker program, and legal immigration. It is the illegal trespassers that we take issue with... and a wall would force those seeking entry into the US through customs and border control entry points. Why would you have a problem with them having to enter the US through entry points?

Yes... walls require maintenance... which means jobs. Are you against putting people to work? Who would pay for this... good question... my response, the same people that pay for the education, medical, housing, food, clothing..... for illegals. The upside of this, if we put people to work... our federal revenues will go up due to taxes... off setting the burden of upkeep. It is more than just numbers.... as people go back to work, their self esteem is elevated, tensions lessen.... and that in its self performs another needed reform... physical violence goes down, along with that drug dependence goes down along with a host of other emotional and physical positive changes. Are you opposed to those changes? So you may see 6 million dollars on a fence or barrier... I see people working, I see schools where the teacher student ration put into a more conducive to learning, I see less drive by shooting or church shootings, I see a refound pride in neighborhoods... I see growth. But, as my family would tell you... I am an eternal optimist. There is a silver lining, even for legal immigrants, workers, and their children.
Sorry, but I disagree yet again. No one, to inclu... (show quote)


Absolutely agree and couldn't have articulated it so well...

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Jan 10, 2019 10:08:16   #
Canuckus Deploracus (a regular here)
 
Coos Bay Tom wrote:
My accomplishments are tiny but they do make a difference in my little corner of the world. My elected position is strictly volunteer. My daily job is construction contractor. It is hard physical labor and I often do the jobs no one else wants.. I am grateful for my good health and abilities. I am grateful for your puny attempts That make a huge difference--- Not many will volunteer for anything or even say thankyou. You get a big star from me and thankyou.
My accomplishments are tiny but they do make a dif... (show quote)


You both get big stars from me

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Jan 10, 2019 10:10:05   #
4430 (a regular here)
 
Coos Bay Tom wrote:
The 10 foot wall does not exist around Obamas house. --It is a made up lie.. Obama was not a divider but he is Black and that drove haters nuts.. My children are safe. There is not an invasion of illegals that a wall is going to stop. . I will agree though that walls such as around gated communitys do help people from being burglerized.. The wall on the southern border is being promoted through fear. --Drug deallers and rapists are coming!!.. You don't have to understand my thinking and I can't change your thinking so we are even.. We will get a wall or we won't. I really hate seeing our country going down the path of suspicion of foriegners and outright bigotry. This is the United States--The beacon of hope and mercy. Guess not any more.
The 10 foot wall does not exist around Obamas hou... (show quote)


I saw a clip of some that had a camera with them to take a picture of Obama's wall and they could not even get close to even see the house so very few can say what size of wall is there or if there is no wall at all

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Jan 10, 2019 10:11:42   #
4430 (a regular here)
 
Do walls work ?

Well lets ask the folks at Sad Deigo and see what they have to say !

https://youtu.be/sxhhjfiSy2Y

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Jan 10, 2019 10:43:37   #
byronglimish (a regular here)
 
old marine wrote:
Not according to 90% of the population in Arizona, New Mexico and Texas.


The border Patrol officials have been very pro-wall.

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Jan 10, 2019 10:51:01   #
byronglimish (a regular here)
 
lpnmajor wrote:
Here's yours and Trumps mistake..........equating a wall/barrier with border security. Why do you think we have Customs and BORDER Patrol? Yes, BOTH borders need to be tightened up, but our own history with physical barriers has proven they don't work, and there are far more effective methods available - namely - increasing the number of humans monitoring both borders.

A wall will not keep out asylum seekers, who can come by sea if they can't find a way over, under or around a physical barrier. BTW, I haven't heard of a single Democrat espousing an open border policy, that's a false narrative generated by Trump and others. Every funding bill proposed had border security funding in it, several with broad bipartisan support.

Answer this; if the situation is so dire at the southern border.........................why not deal with it NOW, instead of waiting 3 years ( or more ) for a wall?
Here's yours and Trumps mistake..........equating ... (show quote)




The Progs are indirectly opposing border security. Walls with underground monitoring are what's needed. We need to destroy cartel and terrorist tunnels, these animals are tunneling where there's no wall already. Our border is starting to closely resemble Israel's in danger.

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Jan 10, 2019 10:52:31   #
bggamers (a regular here)
 
old marine wrote:
Good post Pennylynn.

There are a out 40 buildings on the tree farm including storage barns and the home place. NONE have locks. The trucks are never locked and the key is in the ignition. Even the tractors have the key in their ignition.

In case of an emergency like a forest fire there is no time to look for a key. With over 170 armed ex-military combat veterans we have 0 crime.

In our isolated area we are able to do this. There has never been an illegal alien criminal on the property. Our fire tower is manned by three rotation 8 hour shifts. This is for spotting forest fires also incoming vehicles. The raido in the office is also manned 24/7.

No one can approach the tree farm within a mile without being spotted.
Good post Pennylynn. br br There are a out 40 bui... (show quote)


WOW I'd love to live there

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Jan 10, 2019 10:55:29   #
bggamers (a regular here)
 
byronglimish wrote:
The Progs are indirectly opposing border security. Walls with underground monitoring are what's needed. We need to destroy cartel and terrorist tunnels, these animals are tunneling where there's no wall already. Our border is starting to closely resemble Israel's in danger.


No problem they don't want border security anyway or ice or anything that impedes the flow. Which in my opinion should be directed to California where the trespassers should feel right at home to kill, rape or burn oh and pilage

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Jan 10, 2019 11:00:53   #
byronglimish (a regular here)
 
bggamers wrote:
No problem they don't want border security anyway or ice or anything that impedes the flow. Which in my opinion should be directed to California where the trespassers should feel right at home to kill, rape or burn oh and pilage


They're asking for it!

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Jan 10, 2019 11:02:28   #
old marine (a regular here)
 
lpnmajor wrote:

Here's yours and Trumps mistake..........

First of all I do not advise or suggest policy with President Trump. So how do you think it's my mistake?


Ipnmajor wrote:

Equating a wall/barrier with border security.

Why do the Dim-O-Crats in California especially Nancy Pelosi feel that walls around her property are necessary for HER security?

Wall's are necessary for her protection but not for the American people?


Ipnmajor wrote:

Why do you think we have Customs?

To check and assist legal asylum immigrant enter America legally.


Ipnmajor wrote:

Why do you think we have BORDER Patrol?

To stop and apprehend illegal aliens from entering our country illegally. With open borders it has been proven a few Border patrol personnel can not stop them.

A Military company consists of 80 to 150 men, when 1,000 of illegales storm open borders they can not stop them.


Ipnmajor wrote:

Yes, BOTH borders need to be tightened up,

The Canadian border is not the problem it is the open border along Mexico. The wall/fence will slow the illegal criminal aliens and drug smugglers up and Border patrol can handle the problembs.


Ipnmajor wrote:

but our own history with physical barriers has proven they don't work, and

Are you trying to say the Prison walls/fences of Arkansas don't keep convicts in? Apparently they slow them up enough for the prison guards to apprehend them.


Ipnmajor wrote:

there are far more effective methods available - namely - increasing the number of humans monitoring both borders.

As i stated above a millitary company of 80-150 men could not handle a 1,000 illegal criminal aliens without a wall/fence to slow them down. As a combat Marine Corps Captain in Vietnam with all our fire power couldn't stop 1,000 men.


Ipnmajor wrote:

A wall will not keep out asylum seekers, who can come by sea if they can't find a way over, under or around a physical barrier.

The wall/fence will funnel asylum seekers to the nearest legal station where they can legally apply for asylum.

No illegal immigrants can enter America by sea or by air due to them being checked by legal authorities. That dog wont hunt.


Ipnmajor wrote:

BTW, I haven't heard of a single Democrat espousing an open border policy, that's a false narrative generated by Trump and others.

Nancy Peloski and Chuck Schumer have sworn no wall will be built. Both have made public statements that security walls were immoral. Even the Dim-O-Crat leaning news outlets have quoted both Peloski ans Schumer as saying that.


Ipnmajor wrote:

Every funding bill proposed had border security funding in it, several with broad bipartisan support.

The funding was for additional personnel NOT FOR THE WALL/FENCE. Nice try but no cigar.


Ipnmajor wrote:

Answer this; if the situation is so dire at the southern border.........................why not deal with it NOW, instead of waiting 3 years ( or more ) for a wall?

President Bush had 8 years to deal with it but he kicked the can down the road and tefused to deal with it.

President Obama refused to deal with it because he wanted open borders so his and Eric Holder could sell their guns to the Mexican Drug Cartel.

President Trump has listened to the voters and parents, husbands, wives and children of people who were murdered by illegal criminal aliens and he WILL HAVE A WALL/FENCE ONE WAY OF ANOTHER. The Ametican loyal people demand it.

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Jan 10, 2019 11:32:44   #
waltmoreno (a regular here)
 
Pennylynn wrote:
Every Democrat, Liberal, or those who are not in favor of security need to take the following steps immediately.

1. Move into close proximity to the Mexican border. Even if you can not move right now, the remaining list still applies to you.

2. Remove all locks from your doors and if weather permits, leave your doors and windows wide open.

3. Reset your garage door openers to a mutual frequency so one opener will open every garage in your area.

4. Stop locking your car doors.

5. Remove all locks and barriers from your stores... no guards or greeters.... and cash register optional, just in case someone is willing to pay... (one can dream).

6. Establish bus route (free of charge) that is mapped to your neighborhood.

7. Buy a cemetery in your new neighborhood and staff it. Also, contact the local police and fire department, let them know of your "free" status and assure them that they will never need to respond to emergencies at your home or place of business... and you will never sue.

8. Establish your own car insurance company, I am tired of paying for uninsured motorist. Also, establish your own medical services... welfare... Just establish your own little nation.

Any additions to this list? Add them!
Every Democrat, Liberal, or those who are not in f... (show quote)


I've got a couple of additions.

9. Stock your fridge and cupboards with foods for the hungry people who will be entering your open house.

10. Prepay all nearby medical providers so they can treat the diseases borne by the people who will be crashing in your home (lice, scabies, polio, tuberculosis, etc.)

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Jan 10, 2019 11:37:32   #
byronglimish (a regular here)
 
waltmoreno wrote:
I've got a couple of additions.

9. Stock your fridge and cupboards with foods for the hungry people who will be entering your open house.

10. Prepay all nearby medical providers so they can treat the diseases borne by the people who will be crashing in your home (lice, scabies, polio, tuberculosis, etc.)




Maybe access to the Prog bank accounts too. After all, according to them they're all about giving.

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Jan 10, 2019 11:59:54   #
RickyDCUSMC
 
lpnmajor wrote:
Here's yours and Trumps mistake..........equating a wall/barrier with border security. Why do you think we have Customs and BORDER Patrol? Yes, BOTH borders need to be tightened up, but our own history with physical barriers has proven they don't work, and there are far more effective methods available - namely - increasing the number of humans monitoring both borders.

A wall will not keep out asylum seekers, who can come by sea if they can't find a way over, under or around a physical barrier. BTW, I haven't heard of a single Democrat espousing an open border policy, that's a false narrative generated by Trump and others. Every funding bill proposed had border security funding in it, several with broad bipartisan support.

Answer this; if the situation is so dire at the southern border.........................why not deal with it NOW, instead of waiting 3 years ( or more ) for a wall?
Here's yours and Trumps mistake..........equating ... (show quote)


Physical barriers DO WORK! The Berlin wall worked for almost 30 years until it was torn down. The great wall of China worked for centuries and if manned again today would work now. Those are just two examples. Drones help, but look at this facts: you have a drone patrolling and it spots 10 illegals 20 miles from a point of entry, border patrol is notified and dispatched. The illegals split into smaller groups (like they do now), one drone cannot track them all and it takes border patrol 30 minutes to get to the targeted position. How many illegals are then apprehended? NONE! I have watched this very situation play out on NETGEO TV.

If there was a wall (physical barrier) 100% have to stop at the barrier for some length of time. For the idiots that claim a ladder will work, REALLY. A 25 foot wall and a 28foot ladder gets you to the top of the wall, what then? Fall 25 feet over the other side? You sure as hell can't balance on the wall and hoist the ladder over and set it up on the other side! Physics makes that impossible. Of course you are going to carry a 28 foot ladder through the desert for how many miles? Wait I know when you get to the top of the wall tie a rope to the top that you also toted for 100 miles and then repel down?! Wait if the barrier is constructed correctly there won't be a place to tie a rope too. Oh wait, that's right the Democrats don't want a concrete barrier, only metal slats! No Berlin or great wall of china type construction. Restrict the design to insure it fails so they can say "See I told you so".

Drones, infrared sensors, impact sensors are all helpful and would sense the action I just described, but these pieces cannot arrest ANYONE. Unless you have a border patrol agent stationed every 300 yards 24/7 a physical barrier is the only answer. I am not saying by any stretch that a wall will stop them all, but I can live with a 90% decrease in illegal crossings, cocaine, fentanyl, heroin coming through our southern border. I am confident if we get that far the perpetrators of these and other crimes will abandon this avenue and try something else.

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Jan 10, 2019 12:07:19   #
old marine (a regular here)
 
Pennylynn wrote:
So many people stop listening when they hear what they want to hear instead of listening to all the words. For example, the President is not proposing a 2,000 mile physical border.... but, people hear the word wall and then they stop listening...they picture a wall 800 feet tall and 100 feet wide.... but walls are much more than a physical barrier, and President Trump made it clear the money he is asking for would go to replacing some of the physical barriers, but would also go toward patrols (human and mechanical), immigration judges and for the housing, medical and transportation costs associated with those detained at the border.

If a person is seeking asylum, they do not behave as criminals. I understand your position, now understand mine. I welcome legal immigration. I do not welcome someone who breaks into my home and then demand that I pay for them, their children, and extended family for the rest of their lives. You seem to be okay with the conditions they put on the US... so, with that in mind... the list was prepared with you in mind.
So many people stop listening when they hear what ... (show quote)


I agree with you pennylynn.

I welcome honest hardworking, law abiding immigrants. We don't need or want lazy government tit suckers to support.

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Jan 10, 2019 13:52:03   #
proud republican (a regular here)
 
Coos Bay Tom wrote:
Ok here is the deal. I am for legal immigration -guest worker programs are needed and the dreamers need to be given the chance to be citizens. What we have now is a push to stop not only illegal immigration but actually get rid of as many legal immigrants as possible.. That wall is just a bandaid and not a solution. Fear and Hate are driving people to want this wall and I am not wrong in saying that. Just stepping outside the box a little here------ A wall needs maintenece. --paint repairs etc. Fences get challenged by those wishing to get through and repairs need to be made quickly.-- Who is going to pay for this and how will it be acccomplished? We can build a wall and it will fall apart and be destroyed in places. We will still have illegal aliens and plenty of people to hate them. We can do better than just build a wall. Are we America or are we isolationist and cruel?
Ok here is the deal. I am for legal immigration -... (show quote)


Tom,you didnt answer my question....Why do you think these illegal migrants deserve to go ahead of people who are waiting their turn to come here???? What makes them better then my family who waited for years to come here,paid money,filled out application????...I'm too for legal immigration, like i said im an immigrant too....And please dont tell me they running away from prosecution....We were prosecuted too because of our religion......You can come here, but you HAVE to play by the rules,Tom...Its only fair!!1

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