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USMCA = NAFTA with a new label
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Dec 11, 2019 14:38:13   #
straightUp Loc: California
 
lpnmajor wrote:
So far, the only deal Trump personally made was with Chairman Un of N. Korea - and we see how wonderful THAT deal turned out.


LOL. It wouldn't be so bad if he just admitted to being out of his league and accepted some help from experienced people. Dealing with world politics is not the same as haggling with real-estate investors and city councils.

He's a Pop Warner player on an NFL field and he's telling everyone to play HIS way. It's no wonder he was laughed out of the NATO conference.

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Dec 11, 2019 14:44:25   #
Fodaoson Loc: South Texas
 
[quote from heart of the deal ] “The final key to the way I promote is bravado. I play to people’s fantasies. People may not always think big themselves, but they can still get very excited by those who do. That’s why a little hyperbole never hurts. People want to believe that something is the biggest and the greatest and the most spectacular. I call it truthful hyperbole. It’s an innocent form of exaggeration—and a very effective form of promotion.”
He hasn’t given up on this habit. He still claims everything he does is the “biggest” or “best” ever.

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Dec 11, 2019 14:45:04   #
straightUp Loc: California
 
Lonewolf wrote:
Trumps own people say he can't make a deal, he just takes any deal and then uses his lawyers to cheat the other party out of their money!
If it wasn't for the saudi crown prince trump would be dumpster diving!!!!


Yeah, he's a true con man.

I suppose that's something I can give him credit for. He actually conned his way into the WH.

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Check out topic: Due to inflation...
Dec 11, 2019 14:45:51   #
straightUp Loc: California
 
woodguru wrote:
I would have given him credit early on for leaving it alone...now when he disrupts the hell out of the way things work he goes back to what it was?

I'll give him credit if he signs the frigging thing, so far his word means less than nothing, because if Hannity beats him up on FOX for caving to Pelosi's demands he will simply refuse to sign it.

I'll give him credit if he signs it, which is what a president is supposed to do. Credit for doing it...no, the house and senate came to a deal there, it's amazing trump was willing to get out of the way, except he really really needs to get something done with his do nothing senate.
I would have given him credit early on for leaving... (show quote)



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Dec 11, 2019 15:02:13   #
straightUp Loc: California
 
Fodaoson wrote:
President Trump plans on erasing as much of the Obama label as he can.

That's because it fires up his base. He doesn't know how to solve problems, he only knows how to put on shows. As long as he keeps attacking anything associated with liberals his base will rally behind him. That IS is legacy.

Fodaoson wrote:

The content of change is not as important as the name. NAFTA/USMCA is an example. As long as the Obama label is changed then it is a successful program.

Of course.. This is why I used to suggest that he just keep Obamacare and rename it to Trumpcare. That would solve the entire healthcare issue right there. The left would be happy with the content and the right would be happy thinking it was all Trumps idea.

Fodaoson wrote:

The democrats in congress, house and senate, are no better.

No, they are a LOT better. I agree that both parties can be childish at times but Trump is a clear exception to "normal" politics.

Fodaoson wrote:

If The President is for it then they are against it, The so called wall is an example. What started out as campaign promise became a major point of contention. Before it was a Trump idea democrats in congress were for it. Now it is an issue of a wall verses a border fence.

It may seem that way... but I usually find more respectable reasons when I dig in. The wall, as you said being a good example. The Democrats did indeed push for border fences in strategic locations, but that doesn't mean they were asking for the kind of wall Trump was proposing.

Fodaoson wrote:

The states get into the issue of states’ rights to determine who gets driver’s license .It not about who can drive legally but who can determine who can drive legally. Most of the disagreements between states, cities and the Federal government are over who has the power over the situation.

Eh, to a degree.

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Dec 11, 2019 15:07:44   #
straightUp Loc: California
 
Fodaoson wrote:
[quote from heart of the deal ] “The final key to the way I promote is bravado. I play to people’s fantasies. People may not always think big themselves, but they can still get very excited by those who do. That’s why a little hyperbole never hurts. People want to believe that something is the biggest and the greatest and the most spectacular. I call it truthful hyperbole. It’s an innocent form of exaggeration—and a very effective form of promotion.”
He hasn’t given up on this habit. He still claims everything he does is the “biggest” or “best” ever.
quote from heart of the deal “The final key to ... (show quote)


LOL... I guess when all you have is a hammer...

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Dec 12, 2019 05:13:06   #
Wickedestoldwolf
 
straightUp wrote:
If you tune into Trumps tweets and push your way past all the whining and bitching about the articles of impeachment you will find some chest beating about finally implementing the USMCA trade agreement.

Now back in September I did something I doubt any Trump supporter outside of Washington has done. I actually read it.

Then I posted this... NAFTA vs USMCA where I basically revealed the truth about the deal being nothing much more than the same deal Trump was calling a disaster, but with a shiny new label. In general, Trump won a small concession for dairy farmers but he lost the big "intellectual property" fight with Trudeau (who is apparently a better negotiator) and then there is the fixed wages proposed for the automotive industry that doesn't really secure a big win for anyone other than MAYBE the Mexican automotive workers.

The thread didn't even get past page one (LOL), probably because so few people actually care. But what happened in the months since then is that Pelosi refused to ratify the agreement as it was written because what little of the "disaster" Trump was able to renegotiate was so weak. Here's an extract from the Financial Times today...

Democrats successfully pushed for tighter labour standards, strengthened environmental protections and the removal of advantages for pharmaceutical companies in exchange for allowing a vote on USMCA in Congress. Ms Pelosi was able to extract enough concessions from Mr Trump for the deal to be endorsed by the AFL-CIO, the largest trade union federation.

Pelosi said the outcome is “infinitely better” than the original deal reached by Mr Trump.

https://www.ft.com/content/0cb01ba4-1b5e-11ea-9186-7348c2f183af

So, I expect Trump will be beating his chest about this "fabulous deal" that HE made for a while, but for anyone who actually pays attention to the details, USMCA is a story of how Trump's campaign trail attacks on NAFTA led him to an ass-kicking by Trudeau, Pelosi and the AFL-CIO. But hey, they let him keep the name-change, so at least he can pretend it's the amazing renegotiation he promised.
If you tune into Trumps tweets and push your way p... (show quote)


You mean like that bunch of poor excuses for politicians calling themselves democrats already did. Like they did something really great
Which after dang near 4 years of doing nothing is something I suppose. Trouble is, no one is gonna forget their 4 years of collusion, obstruction, impeachment, quid quo pro , bribery etc. big piles of I hate trump nothingness. Wonder what they'll call the new party...

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Dec 12, 2019 05:41:46   #
Tug484
 
Fodaoson wrote:
Obama wanted to change NAFTA into thee Trans Pacific partnership, TPP. Trump does not want the Obama name on anything. The USMCA is 70% to 90% lifted from the TPP. Content is not as important as the Trump label.


It's worse than you imagine.
I can't remember all of it, but the plan was to take away a bunch of land from Texas land owners.
That was to build the Mexicans a super highway from Mexico to Canada.
Their trucks were not to be stopped.
Basically it was along the already known drug route.
China was to be given a port in Texas and Mexico would be given one in Missouri. It would be called Mexico's land.
I was sent a huge investigative report years ago about it.
Research Robert Pastor.

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Dec 12, 2019 07:37:49   #
Michael Rich Loc: Lapine Oregon
 
Tug484 wrote:
It's worse than you imagine.
I can't remember all of it, but the plan was to take away a bunch of land from Texas land owners.
That was to build the Mexicans a super highway from Mexico to Canada.
Their trucks were not to be stopped.
Basically it was along the already known drug route.
China was to be given a port in Texas and Mexico would be given one in Missouri. It would be called Mexico's land.
I was sent a huge investigative report years ago about it.
Research Robert Pastor.
It's worse than you imagine. br I can't remember a... (show quote)



It never surprises me how lefty's just jump on board with the Kenyan without considering the particulars.

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Dec 12, 2019 08:30:52   #
Tug484
 
byronglimish wrote:
It never surprises me how lefty's just jump on board with the Kenyan without considering the particulars.


I know.
He's the one that should have been impeached.

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Dec 12, 2019 08:38:43   #
Michael Rich Loc: Lapine Oregon
 
Tug484 wrote:
I know.
He's the one that should have been impeached.


I 100% agree!!

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Dec 12, 2019 10:30:07   #
Lonewolf
 
Wickedestoldwolf wrote:
You mean like that bunch of poor excuses for politicians calling themselves democrats already did. Like they did something really great
Which after dang near 4 years of doing nothing is something I suppose. Trouble is, no one is gonna forget their 4 years of collusion, obstruction, impeachment, quid quo pro , bribery etc. big piles of I hate trump nothingness. Wonder what they'll call the new party...


Republicans have done nothing singer 2008 when Moscow Mitch said this president will get nothing ,on I am as first day in office!
At this very moment republicans in there senate refuse to act one hundreds of bills they recived from the house among them a rx drug plan to help lower drug cost that trump said he liked! And no one will forget the republican coverup of a crooked president .

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Dec 12, 2019 10:57:09   #
kemmer
 
byronglimish wrote:
You're jealous. How about you bum a sawbuck from your working girlfriend and buy a losers bottle, and crawl on in.

Or you might want to make cardboard sign, maybe get a puppy and head down to El Segundo.

The sign should be honest, something like..."Lazy Loudmouth Unwilling To Work Even Though The Man I Hate Has Made Millions Of Jobs Available"

(Smirk) Another substance-free attack, meaning nothing.

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Dec 12, 2019 11:28:31   #
Michael Rich Loc: Lapine Oregon
 
kemmer wrote:
(Smirk) Another substance-free attack, meaning nothing.


Substance Free?...You are confused as to what your soulful purpose of being is.

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Dec 12, 2019 12:04:06   #
kemmer
 
byronglimish wrote:
Substance Free?...You are confused as to what your soulful purpose of being is.


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