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Try to think rationally
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Jun 22, 2019 00:44:31   #
lpnmajor Loc: Arkansas
 
We've been hearing for years that certain elements want to end firearm ownership, even claiming that some of them will confiscate everyone's guns. Let's look at that rationally for a moment.

There are over 300,000,000 people in this country, there are 10's, perhaps 100's, of billions of potential hiding spots. Law enforcement cannot find illegal firearms, or prevent those who cannot legally posses firearms from...................possessing firearms illegally.

With that in mind, what rational thinker would believe that any level or branch of government, could actually confiscate ANYONE's guns? Law enforcement would have to search every home, shed, barn, office, boat, aircraft, storage unit, cabin, lodge, and every other structure where firearms could be hidden. In addition, they'd have to deploy ground penetrating radar, examining every inch of ground in the country. To even come close to this, there would need to be one searcher for every gun owner, placing every suspected gun owner under 24/7 surveillance, to prevent them from moving their weapons around.

Should the Federal government, by some stretch of the imagination, pass a law barring citizens from possessing firearms......... many States would refuse to enforce it and most law enforcement officers and military personnel would look the other way.

The long and short of it is; any suggestion that guns are going to be taken away from anyone, by anyone, is laughable in the extreme. Those who suggest such a thing are trying to use "the fear factor", to gain attention, money, power, or more likely..................all three.

Try to think rationally, don't fall for the ridiculous conspiracies.

Reply
Jun 22, 2019 01:25:01   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
lpnmajor wrote:
We've been hearing for years that certain elements want to end firearm ownership, even claiming that some of them will confiscate everyone's guns. Let's look at that rationally for a moment.

There are over 300,000,000 people in this country, there are 10's, perhaps 100's, of billions of potential hiding spots. Law enforcement cannot find illegal firearms, or prevent those who cannot legally posses firearms from...................possessing firearms illegally.

With that in mind, what rational thinker would believe that any level or branch of government, could actually confiscate ANYONE's guns? Law enforcement would have to search every home, shed, barn, office, boat, aircraft, storage unit, cabin, lodge, and every other structure where firearms could be hidden. In addition, they'd have to deploy ground penetrating radar, examining every inch of ground in the country. To even come close to this, there would need to be one searcher for every gun owner, placing every suspected gun owner under 24/7 surveillance, to prevent them from moving their weapons around.

Should the Federal government, by some stretch of the imagination, pass a law barring citizens from possessing firearms......... many States would refuse to enforce it and most law enforcement officers and military personnel would look the other way.

The long and short of it is; any suggestion that guns are going to be taken away from anyone, by anyone, is laughable in the extreme. Those who suggest such a thing are trying to use "the fear factor", to gain attention, money, power, or more likely..................all three.

Try to think rationally, don't fall for the ridiculous conspiracies.
We've been hearing for years that certain elements... (show quote)


Weather it’s doable or not. Swalwell from California, a presidential candidate has already said he would order the confiscation of guns.

Reply
Jun 22, 2019 01:35:17   #
Common_Sense_Matters
 
JFlorio wrote:
Weather it’s doable or not. Swalwell from California, a presidential candidate has already said he would order the confiscation of guns.


It wasn't ALL guns he was talking about, only high powered assault weapons.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/05/03/ban-assault-weapons-buy-them-back-prosecute-offenders-column/570590002/

This was the op-ed piece he wrote for USA Today.

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Jun 22, 2019 01:38:25   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
Dumb bastard doesn’t even know what an assault weapon is. Thinks AR MEANS Assault weapon. Looks to me he’s talking about banning legal guns and confiscating them. Hope he tries it himself.
Common_Sense_Matters wrote:
It wasn't ALL guns he was talking about, only high powered assault weapons.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/05/03/ban-assault-weapons-buy-them-back-prosecute-offenders-column/570590002/

This was the op-ed piece he wrote for USA Today.

Reply
Jun 22, 2019 01:38:41   #
Seth
 
lpnmajor wrote:
We've been hearing for years that certain elements want to end firearm ownership, even claiming that some of them will confiscate everyone's guns. Let's look at that rationally for a moment.

There are over 300,000,000 people in this country, there are 10's, perhaps 100's, of billions of potential hiding spots. Law enforcement cannot find illegal firearms, or prevent those who cannot legally posses firearms from...................possessing firearms illegally.

With that in mind, what rational thinker would believe that any level or branch of government, could actually confiscate ANYONE's guns? Law enforcement would have to search every home, shed, barn, office, boat, aircraft, storage unit, cabin, lodge, and every other structure where firearms could be hidden. In addition, they'd have to deploy ground penetrating radar, examining every inch of ground in the country. To even come close to this, there would need to be one searcher for every gun owner, placing every suspected gun owner under 24/7 surveillance, to prevent them from moving their weapons around.

Should the Federal government, by some stretch of the imagination, pass a law barring citizens from possessing firearms......... many States would refuse to enforce it and most law enforcement officers and military personnel would look the other way.

The long and short of it is; any suggestion that guns are going to be taken away from anyone, by anyone, is laughable in the extreme. Those who suggest such a thing are trying to use "the fear factor", to gain attention, money, power, or more likely..................all three.

Try to think rationally, don't fall for the ridiculous conspiracies.
We've been hearing for years that certain elements... (show quote)


In many States today, you can't make a purchase at s gun shop, not even a rifle or shotgun, without showing ID and having the sale recorded.

During Katrina, the NOPD went door-to-door of recorded firearms purchasers and confiscated their firearms -- some are even today having to go through attorneys to try to get them back.

Therefore, the only "safe" way to own a firearm in many States is to own them illegally.

In that way, unless you are in law enforcement or specifically have a permit to carry, you have to be a "criminal" to own a firearm that isn't vulnerable to potential confiscation.

Reply
Jun 22, 2019 01:50:40   #
Common_Sense_Matters
 
Seth wrote:
In many States today, you can't make a purchase at s gun shop, not even a rifle or shotgun, without showing ID and having the sale recorded.

During Katrina, the NOPD went door-to-door of recorded firearms purchasers and confiscated their firearms -- some are even today having to go through attorneys to try to get them back.

Therefore, the only "safe" way to own a firearm in many States is to own them illegally.

In that way, unless you are in law enforcement or specifically have a permit to carry, you have to be a "criminal" to own a firearm that isn't vulnerable to potential confiscation.
In many States today, you can't make a purchase at... (show quote)


During a disaster where homeowners will be out of their residence for a while tends to lead to looting and it would only make sense to prevent the guns from getting looted. People tend to be more free to use stolen guns NOT registered to them in the commission of crimes so keeping them from falling into criminal hands does make sense. Of course the rightful owner should not be hassled in trying to retrieve said guns when they come to get them back though.

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Jun 22, 2019 02:02:32   #
Seth
 
Common_Sense_Matters wrote:
During a disaster where homeowners will be out of their residence for a while tends to lead to looting and it would only make sense to prevent the guns from getting looted. People tend to be more free to use stolen guns NOT registered to them in the commission of crimes so keeping them from falling into criminal hands does make sense. Of course the rightful owner should not be hassled in trying to retrieve said guns when they come to get them back though.


The homes they confiscated guns from were outside the flooded areas, nobody was evacuating, but in the pandemonium there was a distinct possibility of home invasions -- the police were only taking away those homeowners' means of defending their homes.

In that environment (massive looting) would you abandon or otherwise leave your home or business if it was undamaged and lootable?

Reply
 
 
Jun 22, 2019 02:06:49   #
Common_Sense_Matters
 
Seth wrote:
The homes they confiscated guns from were outside the flooded areas, nobody was evacuating, but in the pandemonium there was a distinct possibility of home invasions -- the police were only taking away those homeowners' means of defending their homes.

In that environment (massive looting) would you abandon or otherwise leave your home or business if it was undamaged and lootable?


Homes that were not evacuated, would be no reasonable reason I can see to confiscate the guns. Of course I would be open to hearing what their "reasoning" was though.

Reply
Jun 22, 2019 02:26:17   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
Common_Sense_Matters wrote:
It wasn't ALL guns he was talking about, only high powered assault weapons.
High powered assault weapons are mounted on tanks and aircraft, like for example the Ma Deuce or the M61 Vulcan.

The evil black rifle, otherwise known as the AR15, is not an assault weapon. If you define it as such then so is a baseball bat, a kitchen knife, a monkey wrench or a broken beer bottle.

Reply
Jun 22, 2019 02:33:50   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
lpnmajor wrote:
We've been hearing for years that certain elements want to end firearm ownership, even claiming that some of them will confiscate everyone's guns. Let's look at that rationally for a moment.

There are over 300,000,000 people in this country, there are 10's, perhaps 100's, of billions of potential hiding spots. Law enforcement cannot find illegal firearms, or prevent those who cannot legally posses firearms from...................possessing firearms illegally.

With that in mind, what rational thinker would believe that any level or branch of government, could actually confiscate ANYONE's guns? Law enforcement would have to search every home, shed, barn, office, boat, aircraft, storage unit, cabin, lodge, and every other structure where firearms could be hidden. In addition, they'd have to deploy ground penetrating radar, examining every inch of ground in the country. To even come close to this, there would need to be one searcher for every gun owner, placing every suspected gun owner under 24/7 surveillance, to prevent them from moving their weapons around.

Should the Federal government, by some stretch of the imagination, pass a law barring citizens from possessing firearms......... many States would refuse to enforce it and most law enforcement officers and military personnel would look the other way.

The long and short of it is; any suggestion that guns are going to be taken away from anyone, by anyone, is laughable in the extreme. Those who suggest such a thing are trying to use "the fear factor", to gain attention, money, power, or more likely..................all three.

Try to think rationally, don't fall for the ridiculous conspiracies.
We've been hearing for years that certain elements... (show quote)
Do you really think Diane Feinstein, Chuck Schumer, Eric Swalwell or Cory Booker are rational thinkers? Rationality has nothing to do with it, if these leftists can do it, they will undoubtedly push legislation to disarm American citizens. Yeah, it is a stupid idea and, as you say, it would be impossible to "confiscate everyone's guns", but that won't stop them from trying.

Molon Labe!

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Jun 22, 2019 02:35:58   #
Seth
 
Common_Sense_Matters wrote:
Homes that were not evacuated, would be no reasonable reason I can see to confiscate the guns. Of course I would be open to hearing what their "reasoning" was though.


It happened, I lived there for many years pre-Katrina and, like me, many of my friends there are gun owners and it happened to a couple of them (not all, because like me some had concealed carry permits with legal reasons to carry and they weren't bothered). They knew others who'd also gotten the "knock on the door."

If it could happen on a local scale like that, it could happen on a large scale between cooperating jurisdictions. On the bright side, the only cooperation would likely be found in "progressive" run states and cities, whereas in redder states where the Bill of Rights still means something they'd be S.O.L.

Reply
 
 
Jun 22, 2019 02:52:43   #
Common_Sense_Matters
 
Blade_Runner wrote:
High powered assault weapons are mounted on tanks and aircraft, like for example the Ma Deuce or the M61 Vulcan.

The evil black rifle, otherwise known as the AR15, is not an assault weapon. If you define it as such then so is a baseball bat, a kitchen knife, a monkey wrench or a broken beer bottle.


And what part of the article do you see mention of this AR15? Where did I mention an AR15? Has anyone in this thread mentioned an AR15? Only YOU have mentioned the AR15 here. The article in question ONLY mentions the AK-47 specifically.

Eric Swalwell wrote:
OPINION
Flashback: Ban assault weapons, buy them back, go after resisters: Eric Swalwell

Eric Swalwell Published 3:15 a.m. ET May 3, 2018 | Updated 9:33 p.m. ET April 8, 2019

Ban assault weapons and buy them back. It might cost $15 billion, but we can afford it. Consider it an investment in our most important right, the right to live.

Editor's note: This column was originally published on May 3, 2018.

Gary Jackson never stood a chance.

Gary was 28 and working as a security guard at a taco truck in Oakland, Calif., in 2009 when he saw Dreshawn Lee carrying a sawed-off shotgun and reported it to police. Three months later, Lee took his revenge by shooting and killing Jackson with an AK-47-style semiautomatic assault rifle.

I was the prosecutor who persuaded a jury to convict Lee and persuaded a judge to put him away for 65 years to life. But Gary’s autopsy report still haunts me.

Trauma surgeons and coroners will tell you the high-velocity bullet fired from a military-style, semiautomatic assault weapon moves almost three times as fast as a 9mm handgun bullet, delivering far more energy. The bullets create cavities through the victim, wrecking a wider swath of tissue, organs and blood vessels. And a low-recoil weapon with a higher-capacity magazine means more of these deadlier bullets can be fired accurately and quickly without reloading.


An assault weapon, then, is a hand-held weapon of war, capable of spraying a crowd with more lethal fire in seconds.

So Gary didn’t stand much chance. First-graders and teachers in Newtown, Conn., didn’t either. Nor did dancers at the Pulse nightclub in Orlando, nor concert-goers in Las Vegas, nor teenagers at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High in Parkland, Fla., nor the people at the Waffle House outside Nashville. Like so many American mass-shooting victims in recent decades, their doom was all but assured by the murderer’s tool.


Nonetheless, we can give ourselves and our children the chance these victims never had. We can finally act to remove weapons designed for war from our streets, once and for all.

Reinstating the federal assault weapons ban that was in effect from 1994 to 2004 would prohibit manufacture and sales, but it would not affect weapons already possessed. This would leave millions of assault weapons in our communities for decades to come.

Instead, we should ban possession of military-style semiautomatic assault weapons, we should buy back such weapons from all who choose to abide by the law, and we should criminally prosecute any who choose to defy it by keeping their weapons. The ban would not apply to law enforcement agencies or shooting clubs.

There's something new and different about the surviving Parkland high schoolers’ demands. They dismiss the moral equivalence we’ve made for far too long regarding the Second Amendment. I've been guilty of it myself, telling constituents and reporters that “we can protect the Second Amendment and protect lives.”

The Parkland teens have taught us there is no right more important than every student’s right to come home after class. The right to live is supreme over any other.

Our courts haven’t found a constitutional right to have assault weapons, anyway. When the Supreme Court held in 2008 that the Second Amendment protects an individual right to possess a firearm, Justice Antonin Scalia wrote that this right “is not unlimited” and is “not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose.”

Since that District of Columbia v. Heller decision, four federal appeals courts have upheld assault weapons bans. Many other firearms are available for self-protection, they found, and the danger that assault weapons pose to society is a legitimate reason for states and localities to ban them.

Australia got it right. After a man used military-style weapons to kill 35 people in April 1996, that nation adopted strict new measures and bought back 643,726 newly illegal rifles and shotguns at market value. The cost — an estimated $230 million in U.S. dollars at the time — was funded by a temporary 0.2% tax levy on national health insurance.

America won’t get off that cheaply. Gun ownership runs so deep that we don’t even know how many military-style semiautomatic rifles are in U.S. civilian hands.

Based on manufacturing figures and other indirect data, there could be 15 million assault weapons out there. If we offer $200 to buy back each weapon — as many local governments have — then it would cost about $3 billion; at $1,000 each, the cost would be about $15 billion.

It’s no small sum. But let’s put it in context.

The federal government is spending an estimated $4 trillion this year; $15 billion would be 0.375% of that, not that we must spend it all in one year.

Meanwhile, the GOP’s tax “reform” — a giveaway to corporations and the rich that threw comparatively meager scraps to working families — is projected to increase the national debt by $1.9 trillion over the next decade.

What is it worth to American taxpayers to not see our families, friends and neighbors cut down in a hail of gunfire? Consider this an investment in averting carnage and heartache and loss.

When I think of Jackson, I think of all the others who died with wounds like his. I think about my dad and two brothers who put their lives on the line as law enforcement officers. I think about my 11-month-old son, Nelson, and the safe classrooms I want him to learn in.

America has a deadly problem, a problem other developed nations have avoided or addressed. Some say we’re already too far gone to take corrective action, but we cannot have a defeatist attitude about this. Fixing our problem requires boldness and will be costly, but the cost of letting it fester will be far higher — for our wallets, and for our souls.
OPINION br Flashback: Ban assault weapons, buy the... (show quote)

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Jun 22, 2019 03:41:30   #
Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton
 
lpnmajor wrote:
We've been hearing for years that certain elements want to end firearm ownership, even claiming that some of them will confiscate everyone's guns. Let's look at that rationally for a moment.

There are over 300,000,000 people in this country, there are 10's, perhaps 100's, of billions of potential hiding spots. Law enforcement cannot find illegal firearms, or prevent those who cannot legally posses firearms from...................possessing firearms illegally.

With that in mind, what rational thinker would believe that any level or branch of government, could actually confiscate ANYONE's guns? Law enforcement would have to search every home, shed, barn, office, boat, aircraft, storage unit, cabin, lodge, and every other structure where firearms could be hidden. In addition, they'd have to deploy ground penetrating radar, examining every inch of ground in the country. To even come close to this, there would need to be one searcher for every gun owner, placing every suspected gun owner under 24/7 surveillance, to prevent them from moving their weapons around.

Should the Federal government, by some stretch of the imagination, pass a law barring citizens from possessing firearms......... many States would refuse to enforce it and most law enforcement officers and military personnel would look the other way.

The long and short of it is; any suggestion that guns are going to be taken away from anyone, by anyone, is laughable in the extreme. Those who suggest such a thing are trying to use "the fear factor", to gain attention, money, power, or more likely..................all three.

Try to think rationally, don't fall for the ridiculous conspiracies.
We've been hearing for years that certain elements... (show quote)


I wish it was that simple, but we're not dealing with rational people here. There are many who would try and ban all firearms not in government hands and would pass such a law without hesitation. While 'saying' and 'doing' are two very different things, the divisiveness such a law would engender would no doubt split the entire population into one or the other camp, and the fight that ensues would make the War of Norther Aggression look tame in comparison.

Don't take my word for it, just peruse the following posts and tell me I'm wrong. (I know they're coming...)

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Jun 22, 2019 04:50:23   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
Common_Sense_Matters wrote:
And what part of the article do you see mention of this AR15? Where did I mention an AR15? Has anyone in this thread mentioned an AR15? Only YOU have mentioned the AR15 here. The article in question ONLY mentions the AK-47 specifically.
Let's not go all wishy washy liberal with this. You look at any leftist politician's or media mouthpiece's definition of an "assault weapon" and you will find none other than the AR15.

The author of this thread mentioned no type of firearm, his point was rational thinking on the gun confiscation issue. My point was how irrational leftists are about American gun ownership and at the center of their focus on it is the evil black rifle. The AR15 has inspired more demands for gun control than any other firearm in existence, and that includes outright bans.

Ever hear of the boiling frog analogy?

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Jun 22, 2019 05:46:27   #
Common_Sense_Matters
 
Blade_Runner wrote:
Let's not go all wishy washy liberal with this. You look at any leftist politician's or media mouthpiece's definition of an "assault weapon" and you will find none other than the AR15.

The author of this thread mentioned no type of firearm, his point was rational thinking on the gun confiscation issue. My point was how irrational leftists are about American gun ownership and at the center of their focus on it is the evil black rifle. The AR15 has inspired more demands for gun control than any other firearm in existence, and that includes outright bans.

Ever hear of the boiling frog analogy?
Let's not go all wishy washy liberal with this. Yo... (show quote)


Ah, so you didn't read the article then.

Quote:
Gary was 28 and working as a security guard at a taco truck in Oakland, Calif., in 2009 when he saw Dreshawn Lee carrying a sawed-off shotgun and reported it to police. Three months later, Lee took his revenge by shooting and killing Jackson with an AK-47-style semiautomatic assault rifle.


The "sawed-off shotgun" mention is just a mention of a gun, not a gun that would be included in an assault weapon ban.

I see AK-47 mentioned there by the author of the article.

You know, we hear plenty of talk about how "the left is gonna take our guns, ALL our guns", but that whole "the sky is falling" paranoid bull crap has yet to materialize. There has NOT been any attempt to take ALL guns nor have they gone out rounding them up either. Gun buy backs happen some times but no real effort to round them all up via knocking down doors and taking them. How many times will you people go all "chicken little" on this issue?




Edit: Additionally, there was mention of 9mm ammo as well but not the gun to fire it, the 9mm ammo and the gun would also be safe from the assault weapon ban as well.

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