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Mar 23, 2015 19:58:00   #
jelun wrote:
Funny, I hadn't realized that this is a real issue for Ted Cruz.
I just heard discussion this morning and apparently it could be if someone who is running sues.
It has to be a candidate, it seems, that standing thing.



Dont worry, its not an issue.
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Mar 23, 2015 19:11:09   #
KHH1 wrote:
Can you prove is is BS or is that your intellectually lazy way of running from reality? It is there for you to see on YouTube...scared i may be right?


KHH1 wrote:
Can you prove is is BS or is that your intellectually lazy way of running from reality?



Why would I need to prove BS that you write?
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Mar 23, 2015 16:52:40   #
KHH1 wrote:
Go to Youtube and search "David Duke Speaks to the Tea Party....may give you some insight...it speaks volumes that they even invited him or even allowed him to speak........draw your own conclusions as i already have....



More BS conclusions from the king of BS
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Mar 23, 2015 16:52:01   #
KHH1 wrote:
Well I see you left off these Republican campaigns-How's this for research?

1991 campaign for Governor of Louisiana
1992 Republican Party p**********l candidate
1996 campaign for U.S. Senate
1999 campaign for U.S. House

Duke claimed that thousands of Tea Party movement activists had urged him to run for president in 2012,[93][94] and that he was seriously considering entering the Republican Party primaries.[94] However, Duke ultimately did not contest the primaries won by Mitt Romney, who lost in the p**********l e******n to incumbent Barack Obama.[95]
Well I see you left off these Republican campaigns... (show quote)


More made up BS from the BS artist
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Mar 22, 2015 18:00:19   #
moldyoldy wrote:
That clause only applies to a child born outside the US, such as Cruz
The Debate Over Who Qualifies To Run For President
In order to qualify to be President, the US Constitution states, “No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.” So what defines a “natural born citizen.” The answer has not been so simple over the years. The framers left it fairly vague and up to us to interpret throughout our history, and it is an issue that has gone back and forth.
This has all been brought into question as a result of one man whom various media outlets have kept an eye on that he might try to run for President in 2016. The man in question is freshman Senator Ted Cruz (R-TX). Cruz was born in Canada to an American mother and a Cuban father. His parents were working in the oil business there. (This will be addressed later on.) Cruz’s father did not become a US citizen until 2005. So though he has made trips to Iowa and the media seems to be watching him quite closely, does he even meet the qualifications of being a natural born citize
So now we know that Congress, under the 14th Amendment, can write legislation declaring what constitutes a natural born citizen. And yes, that means that there will be legal challenges and the US Supreme Court (SCOTUS) will have to make sure such legislation does not violate the Constitution in any way… including Section 1 of the 14th Amendment. In the case Minor v. Happersett (1875), the Court ruled, “The Constitution does not in words say who shall be natural-born citizens. Resort must be had elsewhere to ascertain that.
At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children born in a country of parents who were its citizens became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners. Some authorities go further and include as citizens children born within the jurisdiction without reference to the citizenship of their parents.”

Anyone born inside the United States. The person must be “subject to the jurisdiction” of the United States. (This would exempt the child of a diplomat, for example, from

Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time)

By the conditions just laid out, it would appear that Senator Ted Cruz is not eligible to run for President as he would not qualify as a natural born citizen since only one of the parents was a citizen of the US. However, there still exists one more historical clause which will challenge this argument. The clause states, “a person born before May 24, 1934 of an alien father and a US citizen mother who has lived in the US” is a citizen. Does this change the argument? If it is grouped with Section 1401 of Title 8 of the US Code, then it would appear so.
Currently, citizenship in the US is governed by the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952. The most recent changes to statutory law was done by Congress in 2001. So since this most recent debate has circulated around Sen. Cruz, I am going to focus on one particular section… birth abroad to one US citizen. There are a certain set of rules for those born after November 14, 1986, but I’m focusing on the rules at the time of Cruz’s birth which are the rules that were in effect from December 24, 1952 – November 14, 1986. { The person’s parents were married at the time of birth
One of the person’s parents was a U.S. citizen when the person was born}
The citizen parent lived at least ten years in the United States before the child’s birth;
A minimum of 5 of these 10 years in the United States were after the citizen parent’s 14th birthday.

By these very definitions of the law, it would appear that Sen. Cruz is a natural born citizen and thus meets the qualifications to run for President if
That clause only applies to a child born outside t... (show quote)



nevermind!
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Mar 22, 2015 17:30:52   #
jelun wrote:
None of it really matters since Ted Cruz doesn't have a teabaggers shot in a hot pot of water of going more than 5 months in the primaries. He is a zero.


And in comes J Lune to change the subject again.
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Mar 22, 2015 17:27:42   #
LAPhil wrote:
We're only talking about people born outside the U.S. Anchor babies are considered citizens simply by virtue of being born in the U.S., something which I think needs to be changed.



Good point and I agree. But, nobody has proven that obama was born outside the US. Which leaves the 'two citizen parent ' argument. Thats why the court needs to clarify this issue. Then we all will know. It is probably the reason they wont touch it. In any case, anchor babies are citizens, but not natural born citizens.
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Mar 22, 2015 17:10:10   #
righty wrote:
LA bing bing bing. you win the prize of the day for providing the correct answer. Obamas mother would have needed to been 19 years old to bestow citizenship onto her son. Since she was only 18 she could not, therefore he is NOT a natural born


Then how can anchor babies be considered citizens?
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Mar 22, 2015 17:08:22   #
moldyoldy wrote:
What I said:
negotiations of an international treaty among several nations.



What I said:
China and Russia??? Get a life!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Mar 22, 2015 17:02:25   #
moldyoldy wrote:
No more help for you, find it yourself.

UNITED NATIONS (Reuters) - Major world powers have begun talks about a United Nations Security Council resolution to lift U.N. sanctions on Iran if a nuclear agreement is struck with Tehran, a step that could make it harder for the U.S. Congress to undo a deal, Western officials said.

The talks between Britain, China, France, Russia and the United States — the five permanent members of the Security Council — plus Germany and Iran, are taking place ahead of difficult negotiations that resume next week over constricting Iran's nuclear ability.

Some eight U.N. resolutions - four of them imposing sanctions - ban Iran from uranium enrichment and other sensitive atomic work and bar it from buying and selling atomic technology and anything linked to ballistic missiles. There is also a U.N. arms embargo.

Iran sees their removal as crucial as U.N. measures are a legal basis for more stringent U.S. and European Union measures to be enforced. The U.S. and EU often cite violations of the U.N. ban on enrichment and other sensitive nuclear work as justification for imposing additional penalties on Iran.

U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry told Congress on Wednesday that an Iran nuclear deal would not be legally binding, meaning future U.S. presidents could decide not to implement it. That point was emphasized in an open letter by 47 Republican senators sent on Monday to Iran's leaders asserting any deal could be discarded once President Barack Obama leaves office in January 2017.

But a Security Council resolution on a nuclear deal with Iran could be legally binding, say Western diplomatic officials. That could complicate and possibly undercut future attempts by Republicans in Washington to unravel an agreement.

Iran and the six powers are aiming to complete the framework of a nuclear deal by the end of March, and achieve a full agreement by June 30, to curb Iran's most sensitive nuclear activities for at least 10 years in exchange for a gradual end to all sanctions on the Islamic Republic.
No more help for you, find it yourself. br br UNI... (show quote)


Name the countries that are in agreement with obamas deal.
Thats what you said, so dont bring up the UN security council? The UN doesnt negotiate our law even though you and obama think it should. China and Russia???? Get a life!! The 'ol schuck and jive' defense huh??? :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Mar 22, 2015 16:45:52   #
moldyoldy wrote:
Trying to undermine the president by going around him to interfere with the negotiations of an international treaty among several nations.



Why dont you name the 'several nations' that are in agreement with obamas deal!
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Mar 22, 2015 16:44:04   #
moldyoldy wrote:
http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2015/03/letter_from_47_gop_senators_to.html


I mailed a postcard from Sanaa Yemen in 1992 just to see how long it would take and if it would arrive at all..... it did.. 6 months!!!! If the Iranian mail systems the same, then there is no chance the ayatollah would have received it yet. WTF are you talking about other than you dont believe in the 1st amendment or facebook.
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Mar 22, 2015 16:12:23   #
Kevyn wrote:
President Obama is a natural born citizen of the United States born in the state of Hawaii to his natural born citizen Mother. Cruz on the other hand was born in Canada. There is no "your side" in this matter, only undisputable t***h.


Welcome, Did you just wake up?
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Mar 22, 2015 16:03:38   #
moldyoldy wrote:
Natural-Born Citizen Defined

One universal point most all early publicists agreed on was natural-born citizen must mean one who is a citizen by no act of law. If a person owes their citizenship to some act of law (naturalization for example), they cannot be considered a natural-born citizen. This leads us to defining natural-born citizen under the laws of nature – laws the founders recognized and embraced.

Under the laws of nature, every child born requires no act of law to establish the fact the child inherits through nature his/her father’s citizenship as well as his name (or even his property) through birth. This law of nature is also recognized by law of nations. Sen. Howard said the citizenship clause under the Fourteenth Amendment was by virtue of “natural law and national law.”

The advantages of Natural Law is competing allegiances between nations are not claimed, or at least with those nations whose custom is to not make citizens of other countries citizens without their consent. Under Sec. 1992 of U.S. Revised Statutes (1866) made clear other nation’s citizens would not be claimed: “All persons born in the United States and not subject to any foreign power, excluding Indians not taxed, are declared to be citizens of the United States.”

Rep. John A. Bingham commenting on Section 1992 said it means “every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen.” (Cong. Globe, 39th, 1st Sess., 1291 (1866))

Bingham had asserted the same thing in 1862 as well:


Does the gentleman mean that any person, born within the limits of the Republic, and who has offended against no law, can rightfully be exiled from any State or from any rood of the Republic? Does the gentleman undertake to say that here, in the face of the provision in the Constitution, that persons born within the limits of the Republic, of parents who are not the subjects of any other sovereignty, are native-born citizens, whether they be black or white? There is not a textbook referred to in any court which does not recognise the principle that I assert. (Cong. Globe, 37th, 2nd Sess., 407 (1862))

Bingham of course was paraphrasing Vattel whom often used the plural word “parents” but made it clear it was the father alone for whom the child inherits his/her citizenship from (suggesting a child could be born out of wedlock wasn’t politically correct). Bingham subscribed to the same view as most everyone in Congress at the time that in order to be born a citizen of the United States one must be born within the allegiance of the Nation. As the court has consistently ruled without controversy, change of location never changes or alters a persons allegiance to their country of origin except by acting in accordance to written law in throwing off their previous allegiance and consenting to a new one.

This of course, explains why emphasis of not owing allegiance to anyone else was the effect of being subject to the jurisdiction of the United States under the Fourteenth Amendment.

The constitutional requirement for the President of the United States to be a natural-born citizen had one purpose according to St. George Tucker:


That provision in the constitution which requires that the president shall be a native-born citizen (unless he were a citizen of the United States when the constitution was adopted,) is a happy means of security against foreign influence, which, wherever it is capable of being exerted, is to he dreaded more than the plague. The admission of foreigners into our councils, consequently, cannot be too much guarded against; their total exclusion from a station to which foreign nations have been accustomed to, attach ideas of sovereign power, sacredness of character, and hereditary right, is a measure of the most consummate policy and wisdom. …The title of king, prince, emperor, or czar, without the smallest addition to his powers, would have rendered him a member of the fraternity of crowned heads: their common cause has more than once threatened the desolation of Europe. To have added a member to this sacred family in America, would have invited and perpetuated among us all the evils of Pandora’s Box.
Natural-Born Citizen Defined br br One universal... (show quote)



“All persons born in the United States and not subject to any foreign power,........." That fairly well excludes obama.....
Which is the basis of citizen parents, also mentioned in the article. Btw, Rep. John A. Bingham does not unilaterally decide law.
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Mar 22, 2015 15:49:34   #
moldyoldy wrote:
You have your flawed opinion, which you refuse to give up, but there is no constitutional, nor supreme court ruling on that natural born citizen crap.



There is precedent : MINOR V. HAPPERSETT
http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2011/06/24/minor-v-happersett-is-binding-precedent-as-to-the-constitutional-definition-of-a-natural-born-citizen/

There are both comments of agreement and disagreement to the article. This is why the court needs to test the challenge.
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