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True American: Do you still support Donald Trump?
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Dec 14, 2023 20:15:55   #
Haski123
 
jack sequim wa wrote:
You make an excellent point of past collapses.
It is my understanding, most empires collapsed when morality fell.
We have as a nation, arrived at a fallen morality.


That’s my understanding as well, less church goers, shorter marriages, fewer marriages, many just living together( typically no tax benefit to marry), to many single parents, commitment to things are not as frequency, high and low income brackets growing, ethic( truth vs lies, doing what’s right vs my partisan platform), corruption, crime easy ways to make money, American dream of security and purchase own home-fading, used to be done on one family income member, now tough with two family income with one job each, embracing diversity is not widely accepted- to many closet racist, sexist,etc.,- intolerance of those different than us across the board, fear of self or child shot for just being in the wrong place at wrong time, not enough emotional counselling available for all ages. Affordable health care, help for aged and homeless. Ones I can think of.

A lot of negative, but if each of us open our minds, pick one or two or more to work with congressman, peers, friends, support organizations to improve, parents and grandparents with kids, we still have hope.
Stress to growing low/tight income is creating more crime, homelessness

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Dec 14, 2023 20:16:33   #
4430 Loc: Little Egypt ** Southern Illinory
 
Haski123 wrote:
His approach did not bring unity to USA, in fact it made partisan divide stronger and deeper. His my way or the highway


There hasn't been any unity in the USA since Obama came into play .

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Dec 14, 2023 20:18:28   #
BIRDMAN
 
4430 wrote:
There hasn't been any unity in the USA since Obama came into play .


👍👍👍

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Dec 14, 2023 20:20:50   #
EmilyD
 
facts matter wrote:
trump took documents he had no right to and refused to give them back, then had his lawyer sign an affidavit claiming he gave them back, but still had them. He conspired to discount the peoples vote. And he committed fraud. He's not a victim, he's a criminal.

The FBI knew exactly where the documents were in Trump's house.

I know exactly where the documents were! They were in a locked room in Trump's home. I know this because three FBI agents went to Mar-a-Lago on June 3, 2022 - two months earlier than the fake raid they conducted and saw the boxes there! They didn't look into the boxes at the time, but they did tell Trump to keep the boxes locked in a single room, which he complied with! He also told them during the June 3 visit that they could take the boxes or whatever they wanted from them, but that the National Archives wanted some of them for their own purposes. None of you conspiracy people ever say anything about this! Look it up! There are timelines of these visits all over the net.

The problem I have with the FBI going to his home in August was that they went there at a time they KNEW he was not home. Trump couldn't tell them to go ahead and take the boxes or whatever they wanted from him because he was NOT THERE! And this is obvious because when they showed up at Mar-a-Lago, they told the staff to turn off all the cameras! It's a good thing Eric Trump was there that day because he was able to at least keep the cameras going. Those videos have never been shown to anyone. I really want to see them! All of them! Especially the ones of them going through Melania's lingerie drawers!

Trump also said he never told the FBI agents they couldn't have any of the documents - they just didn't take them in June - probably because they wanted the raid they were planning later on to look "real". There is even some suspicion that documents were planted in Trump's home by the FBI when they went there in either the June visit or the August raid.

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Dec 14, 2023 20:29:12   #
Haski123
 
BIRDMAN wrote:
If you think inflation is low your mommy must do your grocery shopping


It’s now ~3%, down from 9% high. Many things have come down or discontinued rising, some items have increased or stabilised leading currently to downward trend. Trump was at ~+2% which is desired Fed level. Getting closer to 2%.

I was around in 70’s and it hit ~14% and did not normalize for ten years(wages didn’t keep up either), jobs were not as strong, unemployment high( specially after Vietnam War ended, )government contractor and their jobs reduced significantly. Tough long time.

I do a majority of grocery shopping and I drive 40-50 miles a day to volunteer to coach Basketball. So I know gas has come down as some of the others.

Thanks for sharing.

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Dec 14, 2023 20:41:56   #
Haski123
 
padremike wrote:
You want to present the job as POTUS on par with the President of a huge major corporation. How foolish. Lock your heels together and pay attention. The job and title of POTUS automatically requires respect. With the responsibility of an entire nation in his hands and much of the free world too, its not adaptive to a laissez-faire management style. He hires people he hopes will give him good counsel and if they don't he fires them. If he discovers back stabbers, people drilling holes in his ship of state, he fires them with prejudice. It's a job that demands immediate respect and loyalty from subordinates and if someone can't give it then quit before you're fired. Truth be told, Trump didn't fire enough people fast enough. One of the complaints staff had against Trump was that he started work early and stayed late. Two things hurt Trump's presidency more than anything else, Marxist Democrats and their press and Covid; he was not responsible for creating eather.
You want to present the job as POTUS on par with t... (show quote)


That’s your view, I agree to disagree. If Trump was so great he wouldn’t have been ranked 41 of 45 by historians( before you respond look it up “ historians ranking of presidents and. See how they rank presidents) He would not have been one of the few incumbent presidents not to get re elected to a second term. “ A majority of USA voters + 81M voted him out- 2020 election was his employee survey. His handling of Covid( an opportunity if handled right Trump turned to a negative) affected him, not sure what you mean about what Marxist Democrats did to have him lose the election other than put a more viable candidate on the ballot. Trump lost and election, it wasn’t stolen, if you are going there. NO PROOF of stolen 2020 election that would change the results, exists- show it if you got it.

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Dec 14, 2023 20:43:34   #
padremike Loc: Phenix City, Al
 
Haski123 wrote:
So demeaning over 80M people with your cussing and name calling and judging of others- that will go along ways to continuing civil discussion of issues and working to make USA better.

Related to Trump from 2026 campaign to today his negative rhetoric, his demand for absolute loyalty to him, the fact that his Republican associates that are mostly the ones testifying against him and his questionably legal ( maybe illegal- courts will tell) action prior, during and til today he has targeted himself.

Trump didn’t need media( grand juries who investigated him didn’t get fact/ evidence from the news, they found Trumps actions provided sufficient evidence to indict and prosecute himself. Trump University convicted of fraud, Trump NY business- summary judgement guilty of fraud trial ongoing to determine penalties, Convicted of defamation and sexual abuse- Jean Carroll case. 91 indictments pending.

Where are the indictments against Joe Biden? Trump utilised DOJ to get him out of prosecution from Mueller investigations, and majority in House to stifle J6 findings and sway impeachment( very close vote in Senate).
You appear to be projecting Trumps attempted use of government agencies to cover his misdeeds to Joe Biden.

Again your words with no examples just your opinion make easy for me to say:
Your description of me is inaccurate with no factual support, . I could change paragraph one to rightest and me to you , and it just as easily be true( I don’t like swearing , name calling as it’s rude, demeaning, immoral and non value add.

Same for your second paragraph just change leftist to rightist and it could be as true.

You don’t know me and I don’t know you so saying you do and calling me names and categorising me and others and judging solely based on these posts is inaccurate.

I provide facts that show Trump is fraudulent, King of Lies- in previous post, defamer and sexual abuser. All you provide are things on Biden’s son, no indictments or impeachments( Biden impeachment inquiry recently announced).
Same with election denial, I post tons of facts, you show none or outdated debunked conspiracy theories.

I have facts you have feelings. You are entitled to them and if these facts can’t even get “those facts are true” response at all, vs deflect to other issues, deflect to feelings based on what appears to be your far right only info sources( I look at both sides to get varying points of view then make my own opinion.), the. Stick with your unsupported opinion and I’ll agree to disagree and stick with my fact supported opinion.
So demeaning over 80M people with your cussing and... (show quote)


Don't tell me that I don't know you. The entire conscientious world now knows you and they're rejecting your ideology. Your facts are direct from the spoon fed DNC State Controlled Marxist Media. You're the walking dead, victim of a very efficient clandestine spin machine. You morons didn't vote against Trump because of his great policies and agenda. No, you voted against Trump because you were brainwashed to hate him. Only the lazy, simple-minded Marxist influenced simpletons were this susceptible to brainwashing. Very little effort was needed to capture you. You didn't vote for Biden because you liked him, you voted against Trump because you were taught to hate him. You still hate him over the worst POS to ever occupy the Oval Office. A man so worthless that the British Parliment voted to hold him in contempt.

What you call my "far right" info sources or people now identified as far right by the Left were once basic everyday Traditional Americans until the worthless, evil cultural Marxist finally captured the Democrat Party and spawned people like you. You're disgusting.

You gave no response to those Communist Goals I gave you. Perhaps you saw yourself smack in the middle of them?

Reply
 
 
Dec 14, 2023 20:47:33   #
BIRDMAN
 
padremike wrote:
Don't tell me that I don't know you. The entire conscientious world now knows you and they're rejecting your ideology. Your facts are direct from the spoon fed DNC State Controlled Marxist Media. You're the walking dead, victim of a very efficient clandestine spin machine. You morons didn't vote against Trump because of his great policies and agenda. No, you voted against Trump because you were brainwashed to hate him. Only the lazy, simple-minded Marxist influenced simpletons were this susceptible to brainwashing. Very little effort was needed to capture you. You didn't vote for Biden because you liked him, you voted against Trump because you were taught to hate him. You still hate him over the worst POS to ever occupy the Oval Office. A man so worthless that the British Parliment voted to hold him in contempt.

What you call my "far right" info sources or people now identified as far right by the Left were once basic everyday Traditional Americans until the worthless, evil cultural Marxist finally captured the Democrat Party and spawned people like you. You're disgusting.

You gave no response to those Communist Goals I gave you. Perhaps you saw yourself smack in the middle of them?
Don't tell me that I don't know you. The entire c... (show quote)


👍👍👍

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Dec 14, 2023 20:50:29   #
padremike Loc: Phenix City, Al
 
4430 wrote:
There hasn't been any unity in the USA since Obama came into play .


It was no accident that he created divisions and reestablished class and cultural warfare. He's still very much involved. The man's an evil monster.

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Dec 14, 2023 20:53:32   #
Haski123
 
BIRDMAN wrote:
Why did a vice president have classified docs that he was not supposed to have


Biden & Pence shouldn’t have, once aware of it they had them collected and returned where they belong.
If Trump had provided info as requested he basically would have been in same position as Biden & Pence, instead he held back responding, then he gave partial documents and had lawyer create letter confirming he sent them all, then search subpoena found more.
He’s said everything was declassified, then he said they were his, pointed fingers at everyone else, then he shared some of the classified documents with MarALargo guests/ tenants and bragged about having them. Who knows what else he did with them.

You question is a mute point. Biden and Pence could be subject to penalties, but know where near the penalties Trump created through his actions. His lawyer even told him not returning all the requested documents would be illegal.

Thanks for sharing.

Two radically different ways to handle similar situations.

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Dec 14, 2023 20:59:42   #
4430 Loc: Little Egypt ** Southern Illinory
 
Haski123 wrote:
That’s my understanding as well, less church goers, shorter marriages, fewer marriages, many just living together( typically no tax benefit to marry), to many single parents, commitment to things are not as frequency, high and low income brackets growing, ethic( truth vs lies, doing what’s right vs my partisan platform), corruption, crime easy ways to make money, American dream of security and purchase own home-fading, used to be done on one family income member, now tough with two family income with one job each, embracing diversity is not widely accepted- to many closet racist, sexist,etc.,- intolerance of those different than us across the board, fear of self or child shot for just being in the wrong place at wrong time, not enough emotional counselling available for all ages. Affordable health care, help for aged and homeless. Ones I can think of.
That’s my understanding as well, less church goers... (show quote)


You've made some good points .

The USA has been slowly turning away from God for decades and went into a Fast down hill power slide starting with taking prayer out of schools along with the administrations of Bill Clinton , Obama , and Biden which we can see the consequences happening today.

The left and the leftist here on OPP don't want God , Christians and or Conservatives having any thing to do in government .

You say "" doing what’s right vs my partisan platform "" here's the problem with that You lefties think it's wrong to stop abortion is the right way to go , HOWEVER the right fights for the right of the unborn to live .

You say "" there's not enough emotional counseling available for all ages "", YET the left fights against having help centers for those that want to leave those lifestyles trans and homosexuals .

You say "" to many single parents "" a lot of that is due to the fact that LBJ wanted to keep the blacks voting Democrat for the next 200 years by encouraging women to stay single and pay them for every kid they popped out and to keep making babies thus many of not most of the kids have NO Father role to follow and that has lead to many of these kids turning to drug , gangs and stealing when morals are No longer esteemed to be needed and heeded brings forth the predicament we see ourselves in today.

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Dec 14, 2023 20:59:42   #
padremike Loc: Phenix City, Al
 
Haski123 wrote:
That’s your view, I agree to disagree. If Trump was so great he wouldn’t have been ranked 41 of 45 by historians( before you respond look it up “ historians ranking of presidents and. See how they rank presidents) He would not have been one of the few incumbent presidents not to get re elected to a second term. “ A majority of USA voters + 81M voted him out- 2020 election was his employee survey. His handling of Covid( an opportunity if handled right Trump turned to a negative) affected him, not sure what you mean about what Marxist Democrats did to have him lose the election other than put a more viable candidate on the ballot. Trump lost and election, it wasn’t stolen, if you are going there. NO PROOF of stolen 2020 election that would change the results, exists- show it if you got it.
That’s your view, I agree to disagree. If Trump wa... (show quote)


You put a great deal of credibility in your so called historians. Legitimate historians always wait a long time before giving their opinions. Biased historians hurry up to get their obnoxious partisan licks in. The history books today are teaching our children to hate America. These are your kind of historians.

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Dec 14, 2023 21:01:33   #
Haski123
 
4430 wrote:
There hasn't been any unity in the USA since Obama came into play .


What specifically did Obama do to break up USA unity?, he pulled us out of recession, was ranked 10th of 45 presidents by Historians( Trump was 41st- Biden not ranked until out of office)

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Dec 14, 2023 21:02:41   #
EmilyD
 
Haski123 wrote:
That’s your view, I agree to disagree. If Trump was so great he wouldn’t have been ranked 41 of 45 by historians( before you respond look it up “ historians ranking of presidents and. See how they rank presidents) He would not have been one of the few incumbent presidents not to get re elected to a second term. “ A majority of USA voters + 81M voted him out- 2020 election was his employee survey. His handling of Covid( an opportunity if handled right Trump turned to a negative) affected him, not sure what you mean about what Marxist Democrats did to have him lose the election other than put a more viable candidate on the ballot. Trump lost and election, it wasn’t stolen, if you are going there. NO PROOF of stolen 2020 election that would change the results, exists- show it if you got it.
That’s your view, I agree to disagree. If Trump wa... (show quote)


Historians have not had a chance to rate Trump on his COMPLETE legacy at this point in time! He's still alive and may yet win another term in office, where his legacy would be greatly affected! Yet here you are telling people that these historians have already rated him! That's pretty deceptive of you!

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Dec 14, 2023 21:06:28   #
padremike Loc: Phenix City, Al
 
EmilyD wrote:
Historians have not had a chance to rate Trump on his COMPLETE legacy at this point in time! He's still alive and may yet win another term in office, where his legacy would be greatly affected! Yet here you are telling people that these historians have already rated him! That's pretty deceptive of you!


If he can read it in print or hear it on MSNBS it's immediately sacrosanct truth.

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