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Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot?
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Oct 20, 2018 19:09:06   #
Radiance3
 
Doc110 wrote:
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Part 1)

E. Christian Brugge
http://m.ncregister.com/blog/christianbrugger/is-it-morally-licit-to-smoke-pot


DIFFICULT MORAL QUESTIONS: Although it is sometimes morally licit to smoke pot for purposes of healing, it is never licit to smoke it to get high.

Q. Pot smoking is legal in my state. I know pot is a bridge drug to other worse drugs.

But I was wondering if occasionally smoking it is okay. 



My parish priest says there’s nothing wrong with it, so long as I don’t get dependent.

What do you think? Thanks, Rahl.

I think your priest’s advice is misguided.

The simple answer to the title question is:

Although it is sometimes morally licit to smoke pot for purposes of healing, it is never licit to smoke it to get high.


YES

“Brain Altering Substances” (BAS)

Medicine uses the term “therapeutic” to refer to something related to facilitating good physical or psychological functioning.

Using BAS for therapeutic reasons is using them to obtain real human goods.

But most BAS also have harmful effects, which mustn’t be the reason we choose them. In the words of moral theology, we mustn’t intend those effects as ends or means.

We all use BAS sometimes for therapeutic reasons, and many of us use them daily. We drink a cup of coffee or cola for an energy boost;

We have a glass of wine to calm feelings of stress after a long day at work;

We take antidepressants to ameliorate blue mood, or melatonin or Ambien to help quiet the sleep centers in our brain;

We take analgesics to assist with back pain;

And occasionally we take very powerful narcotics such as morphine to help relieve severe pain.

Each of these can be done quite innocently, as each can be a way of realizing genuine human goods.

Marijuana is a BAS, which too, doctors tell us, can have therapeutic effects. Physicians sometimes prescribe it to aid discomfort from headaches, cancer, glaucoma or nerve pain.

But ingesting it also has bad affects.


Moral Norm

I may use a BAS — whether Advil, pot or morphine — for therapeutic reasons if two conditions are met:

a. First, I intend only the therapeutic effect:

My intended end is healing, my intended means is the substance’s ameliorating mechanisms, and I merely tolerate — as unintended side effects — the harms caused by using it;

b. Second, there must be no other reason for me not to use it.

What are other reasons not to use a BAS (including pot) therapeutically?

Whenever using it would be contrary to another moral obligation:

For example, such use is illegal where I live; or it places me in a near occasion of sin (e.g., I cannot use it with clinical moderation because of an addiction);

Or the unintended bad side-effects from using it would be manifestly disproportionate to the benefits;

Or it would unfairly harm someone else, for example, I’m a father and my therapeutic pot smoking is likely to influence my teenage son to think drug use in general is okay.


Church Teaching

These two elements — therapeutic use and fidelity to moral obligations — are noted in the teaching of Pope Pius XII on using painkillers.

He taught:

“The Christian, then, is never obliged to accept pain for its own sake. …

The patient, anxious to avoid or calm the pain, can in good conscience make use of the means discovered by science and that in themselves are not immoral.”

In this way, the Pope continues, “he is seeking, in accord with the ordinance of the Creator, to bring suffering under man’s control.”

He goes on to say, however, that a person has an obligation not to seek to relieve suffering “whenever he is faced with the unavoidable alternative of enduring suffering or acting contrary to a moral obligation, either by an action or omission”

(Responses to three questions regarding analgesia, 1957).
https://w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xii/es/speeches/1957/documents/hf_p-xii_spe_19570224_anestesiologia.html


NO Abusing BAS:

Some people use BAS, including pot, not for therapeutic reasons, but in order to alter their consciousness for the sake of the experience of the altered state itself — to get high.

Since the highness it causes, however pleasurable, is a bad effect, to intend it as an end or means is to intend harm myself (and to others if I support them in getting high).

This is never morally legitimate.


Why is highness a bad effect?

Because it entails an alteration and impairment of my sensory, rational and volitional faculties, making it more difficult for me to understand things clearly and to choose well.

Although I may tolerate such impairment as a side-effect of taking BAS for therapeutic reasons, to will it for its own sake is wrongful.


One might reply:

But when I get high, I do it for the pleasure it brings me.

Isn’t a pleasurable experience self-justifying?

No, pleasure of itself is no justification — is not a reason — for acting.

Pleasure is good if it arises from the pursuit of real human goods and bad if it arises from what harms human goods.

(Think of the pleasure of an athlete versus the pleasure of a sex trafficker.)

Since the pleasure experienced in pot smoking arises from something harmful to us, it is wrong to seek.


Moreover, ingesting marijuana is harmful to our mind and body in a host of other ways.

The NIH website lists the following:
https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/marijuana

a. Worsens memory, learning, problem-solving and verbal ability; impairs body movements; increases anxiety, depression, suicidal thoughts, and causes loss of IQ points if heavy use begins in teens;

b. Causes hallucinations, delusions, paranoia and psychosis (from long-term use); leads to a decline in academic and career success;

c. Increases job absences, accidents and injuries; acts as a “gateway drug” to harder drugs; leads to lower life satisfaction.


Presumably pot smokers do not intend any of these effects; they only want to get high.

But we’ve already shown that this is a bad effect.

Therefore, getting high is not a reason to smoke pot, but a reason not to.

Add to this the many other harms caused by ingesting the THC found in marijuana, and we end up with several reasons not to smoke pot to get high.

(End Part 1)
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Par... (show quote)

==============
Bottom line is anybody who smoke ARE STINKY!

Reply
Oct 21, 2018 08:51:40   #
Otisimo Loc: Lansing Michigan
 
Doc110 wrote:
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Part 1)

E. Christian Brugge
http://m.ncregister.com/blog/christianbrugger/is-it-morally-licit-to-smoke-pot


DIFFICULT MORAL QUESTIONS: Although it is sometimes morally licit to smoke pot for purposes of healing, it is never licit to smoke it to get high.

Q. Pot smoking is legal in my state. I know pot is a bridge drug to other worse drugs.

But I was wondering if occasionally smoking it is okay. 



My parish priest says there’s nothing wrong with it, so long as I don’t get dependent.

What do you think? Thanks, Rahl.

I think your priest’s advice is misguided.

The simple answer to the title question is:

Although it is sometimes morally licit to smoke pot for purposes of healing, it is never licit to smoke it to get high.


YES

“Brain Altering Substances” (BAS)

Medicine uses the term “therapeutic” to refer to something related to facilitating good physical or psychological functioning.

Using BAS for therapeutic reasons is using them to obtain real human goods.

But most BAS also have harmful effects, which mustn’t be the reason we choose them. In the words of moral theology, we mustn’t intend those effects as ends or means.

We all use BAS sometimes for therapeutic reasons, and many of us use them daily. We drink a cup of coffee or cola for an energy boost;

We have a glass of wine to calm feelings of stress after a long day at work;

We take antidepressants to ameliorate blue mood, or melatonin or Ambien to help quiet the sleep centers in our brain;

We take analgesics to assist with back pain;

And occasionally we take very powerful narcotics such as morphine to help relieve severe pain.

Each of these can be done quite innocently, as each can be a way of realizing genuine human goods.

Marijuana is a BAS, which too, doctors tell us, can have therapeutic effects. Physicians sometimes prescribe it to aid discomfort from headaches, cancer, glaucoma or nerve pain.

But ingesting it also has bad affects.


Moral Norm

I may use a BAS — whether Advil, pot or morphine — for therapeutic reasons if two conditions are met:

a. First, I intend only the therapeutic effect:

My intended end is healing, my intended means is the substance’s ameliorating mechanisms, and I merely tolerate — as unintended side effects — the harms caused by using it;

b. Second, there must be no other reason for me not to use it.

What are other reasons not to use a BAS (including pot) therapeutically?

Whenever using it would be contrary to another moral obligation:

For example, such use is illegal where I live; or it places me in a near occasion of sin (e.g., I cannot use it with clinical moderation because of an addiction);

Or the unintended bad side-effects from using it would be manifestly disproportionate to the benefits;

Or it would unfairly harm someone else, for example, I’m a father and my therapeutic pot smoking is likely to influence my teenage son to think drug use in general is okay.


Church Teaching

These two elements — therapeutic use and fidelity to moral obligations — are noted in the teaching of Pope Pius XII on using painkillers.

He taught:

“The Christian, then, is never obliged to accept pain for its own sake. …

The patient, anxious to avoid or calm the pain, can in good conscience make use of the means discovered by science and that in themselves are not immoral.”

In this way, the Pope continues, “he is seeking, in accord with the ordinance of the Creator, to bring suffering under man’s control.”

He goes on to say, however, that a person has an obligation not to seek to relieve suffering “whenever he is faced with the unavoidable alternative of enduring suffering or acting contrary to a moral obligation, either by an action or omission”

(Responses to three questions regarding analgesia, 1957).
https://w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xii/es/speeches/1957/documents/hf_p-xii_spe_19570224_anestesiologia.html


NO Abusing BAS:

Some people use BAS, including pot, not for therapeutic reasons, but in order to alter their consciousness for the sake of the experience of the altered state itself — to get high.

Since the highness it causes, however pleasurable, is a bad effect, to intend it as an end or means is to intend harm myself (and to others if I support them in getting high).

This is never morally legitimate.


Why is highness a bad effect?

Because it entails an alteration and impairment of my sensory, rational and volitional faculties, making it more difficult for me to understand things clearly and to choose well.

Although I may tolerate such impairment as a side-effect of taking BAS for therapeutic reasons, to will it for its own sake is wrongful.


One might reply:

But when I get high, I do it for the pleasure it brings me.

Isn’t a pleasurable experience self-justifying?

No, pleasure of itself is no justification — is not a reason — for acting.

Pleasure is good if it arises from the pursuit of real human goods and bad if it arises from what harms human goods.

(Think of the pleasure of an athlete versus the pleasure of a sex trafficker.)

Since the pleasure experienced in pot smoking arises from something harmful to us, it is wrong to seek.


Moreover, ingesting marijuana is harmful to our mind and body in a host of other ways.

The NIH website lists the following:
https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/marijuana

a. Worsens memory, learning, problem-solving and verbal ability; impairs body movements; increases anxiety, depression, suicidal thoughts, and causes loss of IQ points if heavy use begins in teens;

b. Causes hallucinations, delusions, paranoia and psychosis (from long-term use); leads to a decline in academic and career success;

c. Increases job absences, accidents and injuries; acts as a “gateway drug” to harder drugs; leads to lower life satisfaction.


Presumably pot smokers do not intend any of these effects; they only want to get high.

But we’ve already shown that this is a bad effect.

Therefore, getting high is not a reason to smoke pot, but a reason not to.

Add to this the many other harms caused by ingesting the THC found in marijuana, and we end up with several reasons not to smoke pot to get high.

(End Part 1)
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Par... (show quote)


Wow! The writer of this crap took a really convoluted route to try to rationalize and justify their own opinions about marijuana. Morally licit? Really? But alcohol is fine.. God made pot, man made alcohol! Enough said there.

Reply
Oct 21, 2018 10:55:21   #
kemmer
 
Doc110 wrote:
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Part 1)

E. Christian Brugge
http://m.ncregister.com/blog/christianbrugger/is-it-morally-licit-to-smoke-pot


DIFFICULT MORAL QUESTIONS: Although it is sometimes morally licit to smoke pot for purposes of healing, it is never licit to smoke it to get high.

Q. Pot smoking is legal in my state. I know pot is a bridge drug to other worse drugs.

But I was wondering if occasionally smoking it is okay. 



My parish priest says there’s nothing wrong with it, so long as I don’t get dependent.

What do you think? Thanks, Rahl.

I think your priest’s advice is misguided.

The simple answer to the title question is:

Although it is sometimes morally licit to smoke pot for purposes of healing, it is never licit to smoke it to get high.


YES

“Brain Altering Substances” (BAS)

Medicine uses the term “therapeutic” to refer to something related to facilitating good physical or psychological functioning.

Using BAS for therapeutic reasons is using them to obtain real human goods.

But most BAS also have harmful effects, which mustn’t be the reason we choose them. In the words of moral theology, we mustn’t intend those effects as ends or means.

We all use BAS sometimes for therapeutic reasons, and many of us use them daily. We drink a cup of coffee or cola for an energy boost;

We have a glass of wine to calm feelings of stress after a long day at work;

We take antidepressants to ameliorate blue mood, or melatonin or Ambien to help quiet the sleep centers in our brain;

We take analgesics to assist with back pain;

And occasionally we take very powerful narcotics such as morphine to help relieve severe pain.

Each of these can be done quite innocently, as each can be a way of realizing genuine human goods.

Marijuana is a BAS, which too, doctors tell us, can have therapeutic effects. Physicians sometimes prescribe it to aid discomfort from headaches, cancer, glaucoma or nerve pain.

But ingesting it also has bad affects.


Moral Norm

I may use a BAS — whether Advil, pot or morphine — for therapeutic reasons if two conditions are met:

a. First, I intend only the therapeutic effect:

My intended end is healing, my intended means is the substance’s ameliorating mechanisms, and I merely tolerate — as unintended side effects — the harms caused by using it;

b. Second, there must be no other reason for me not to use it.

What are other reasons not to use a BAS (including pot) therapeutically?

Whenever using it would be contrary to another moral obligation:

For example, such use is illegal where I live; or it places me in a near occasion of sin (e.g., I cannot use it with clinical moderation because of an addiction);

Or the unintended bad side-effects from using it would be manifestly disproportionate to the benefits;

Or it would unfairly harm someone else, for example, I’m a father and my therapeutic pot smoking is likely to influence my teenage son to think drug use in general is okay.


Church Teaching

These two elements — therapeutic use and fidelity to moral obligations — are noted in the teaching of Pope Pius XII on using painkillers.

He taught:

“The Christian, then, is never obliged to accept pain for its own sake. …

The patient, anxious to avoid or calm the pain, can in good conscience make use of the means discovered by science and that in themselves are not immoral.”

In this way, the Pope continues, “he is seeking, in accord with the ordinance of the Creator, to bring suffering under man’s control.”

He goes on to say, however, that a person has an obligation not to seek to relieve suffering “whenever he is faced with the unavoidable alternative of enduring suffering or acting contrary to a moral obligation, either by an action or omission”

(Responses to three questions regarding analgesia, 1957).
https://w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xii/es/speeches/1957/documents/hf_p-xii_spe_19570224_anestesiologia.html


NO Abusing BAS:

Some people use BAS, including pot, not for therapeutic reasons, but in order to alter their consciousness for the sake of the experience of the altered state itself — to get high.

Since the highness it causes, however pleasurable, is a bad effect, to intend it as an end or means is to intend harm myself (and to others if I support them in getting high).

This is never morally legitimate.


Why is highness a bad effect?

Because it entails an alteration and impairment of my sensory, rational and volitional faculties, making it more difficult for me to understand things clearly and to choose well.

Although I may tolerate such impairment as a side-effect of taking BAS for therapeutic reasons, to will it for its own sake is wrongful.


One might reply:

But when I get high, I do it for the pleasure it brings me.

Isn’t a pleasurable experience self-justifying?

No, pleasure of itself is no justification — is not a reason — for acting.

Pleasure is good if it arises from the pursuit of real human goods and bad if it arises from what harms human goods.

(Think of the pleasure of an athlete versus the pleasure of a sex trafficker.)

Since the pleasure experienced in pot smoking arises from something harmful to us, it is wrong to seek.


Moreover, ingesting marijuana is harmful to our mind and body in a host of other ways.

The NIH website lists the following:
https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/marijuana

a. Worsens memory, learning, problem-solving and verbal ability; impairs body movements; increases anxiety, depression, suicidal thoughts, and causes loss of IQ points if heavy use begins in teens;

b. Causes hallucinations, delusions, paranoia and psychosis (from long-term use); leads to a decline in academic and career success;

c. Increases job absences, accidents and injuries; acts as a “gateway drug” to harder drugs; leads to lower life satisfaction.


Presumably pot smokers do not intend any of these effects; they only want to get high.

But we’ve already shown that this is a bad effect.

Therefore, getting high is not a reason to smoke pot, but a reason not to.

Add to this the many other harms caused by ingesting the THC found in marijuana, and we end up with several reasons not to smoke pot to get high.

(End Part 1)
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Par... (show quote)

One of mankinds first discoveries was intoxicants. And it has been everso since. Weed is just another in a very long line. It is morally neutral per se.

Reply
Check out topic: Clarence Thomas Drops Sledgehammer on D.C. Swamp - He Just Left Liberals Speechless
Oct 21, 2018 10:56:37   #
kemmer
 
BigMike wrote:
Point?

Can we chop it up into bite sized pieces?


It is best made into cookies.

Reply
Oct 21, 2018 11:48:30   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
Radiance3 wrote:
==============
Bottom line is anybody who smoke ARE STINKY!


I remember a gal in Dutch Harbor who found some perfume she reeely liked...Cotton Candy.

She bought two big jugs of it. Expensive stuff, too.

It was awful! That stuff was so strong in even the tiniest amounts I could taste it!

The Grand Aleutian had three floors, two restaurants, two bars and a basement. Anyone could find her with ease, anywhere inside the building.

Reply
Oct 21, 2018 11:49:59   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
kemmer wrote:
It is best made into cookies.



Reply
Oct 21, 2018 11:55:32   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
kemmer wrote:
One of mankinds first discoveries was intoxicants. And it has been everso since. Weed is just another in a very long line. It is morally neutral per se.


Ya...people are the problem. Anything good can be made bad, usually be placing inordinate priority on it.

Reply
Check out topic: Stormy Daniels' husband ( porn star too) 🤣🤣🤣 says they will probably will leave the co...
Oct 21, 2018 13:34:20   #
clevey77
 
Off topic, but the A-Moral question of sobrity and the functioning of the spirit.

Opinion 101,
Reprobate, comes to mind:
“The mind is a terrible thing to waste”, The old adage, Let all things be done in moderation could be the oxymoron of the moment…Do high Andes Populations chew coco leaves in order to function in there daily lives…? Here the word function, crosses the divide of moral bondage and just prudence… Your gods bind u to words that others have used to bring conformity to society, all judgement possibly is in the mind of the human spirit… It possibly, is autonomous with the entity of DNA and the conditioning it receives from birth, How does it, (the spirit), make a decision other than from the mass mind of conditioned spirits that hold on to bondage as truth? Here the checks and balances need no authority, other than the right of personal judgment in the environments propagated by cause and effect… The moral code is not applicable, nor, any mental bondage from outside sources. Thusly, the intuition of the spiritual entity, the creative source within the cavernous mental galactic sphere (The mind, within the skull), has the power to determine the natural course of just prudence and divine right. All outside entity’s can disagree and find their own course of inspiration to facilitate the needs of the physical causal environment in which it finds itself…. The acts of causation are divine in nature and resident in all spiritual entity’s… We see it in the animal kingdom, and we know it as “Nature”…. Nature has ben described for homo-sapiens to mimic… Yet we are told, we have the alternate creative cognition and dexterity to accomplish our dreams within the sphere of our spiritual nature, the galactic source of light energy and the gamma rays of cosmic Sun Transmutation…the human mind is the frequency transmitter of all light cosmic energy….It has been said, that the center of light energy emanating from the galactic central core of the milky way, is the vaginal creaive force’ that is a part our essence and well being, herein, the experience of the goddesses emanating love and transcendence of the all spiritual awareness… How is it then we separate ourselves into bondages created by men of less awareness?

SUN Worship…
Humans have worshiped the sun for centuries… Why, because it is the life giving force on the planet… Which brings me to the concept of Bondage under the sun by The Priests of ignorance and Dogma, the destroyers of the creative spirit we are all born with… Some words come to mind here… “Let the dead bury the dead”… those that are dead In spirit?? Also the object of following anything required as the formulas of the Pharisees… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pharisees)
…These are the folks that create the laws of distraction and legal bondage to the reprobate mind…try to get a fair trial in a court of law…because of these lawyers, we are all in bondage in the frequency of causation….the elite that control us, as we give over our wills to the basterdazition of their self imposed male godhead. They have usurped the feminine spontaneity of the immaculateness of all creation… The Judean evangelical diaspora of FALSE male rule, In the spiraling galactic fingers of the creation, known as the PESH-METEN:
From the Wes Penre Papers
'The Ninth Passageway'. This is the Commercial Route lots of ETs are using when trading with each other. It has a long series of stairgates and Einstein-Rosen Bridges, which makes it easy for different races to travel. This is the route on which Planet Earth (Uraš) is sitting in the heart of. It starts in the Galactic Center of the Milky Way Galaxy and spirals out, following the path of the Orion Arm, passes right through the Mintaka star system, continues to the Pleiades, runs further through our own solar system and continues beyond, probably disappearing off of the galaxy and to one of the next, perhaps the Andromeda Galaxy (Source: Arynama and Robert Morning-Sky: "The Terra Papers")

Are we alone?
I think not, therefore I am… The quality of men’s creative mind must not be abridged by the futility of feudalist called Judean male gods acting out the egomania of male self absorption and the reality they can create nothing without the goddess of duality and her emasculate wisdom…. This is the counter thesis of male rule In the universe… they, (the males), cannot conceive and in their jealousy they think they should rule and do so with death and destruction…and most like eating their young, (war and death), because they want to mate in the animal kingdom of winner take all…
Get your head out of the book… and get your mind working again, instead of I n the box of the Kings court, judicial…aka… Judean law … the bondage of the many In the hands of the few…. Male rulers and female imitation’s of the latter… all bound by the laws of futility and mass mine conditioning.

The way to perdition is wide and the freedom of thought narrow… it’s all our choice… or is it?


Doc110 wrote:
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Part 2)

E. Christian Brugge
http://m.ncregister.com/blog/christianbrugger/is-it-morally-licit-to-smoke-pot


Harms to Friendship

Moral theologian Germain Grisez provides (here, see question F, No. 5) another reason.
www.twotlj.org/G-2-8-F.html

He argues that any use of BAS precisely for the sake of the experience itself is harmful to our relationships.

We take the BAS to alter our conscious experience.

But our consciousness is affected only by first affecting our brain and nervous system.

We therefore use our bodies as an instrument — a mere means — for achieving a desirable state of consciousness.

If the brain effect were merely tolerated in order to heal ourselves — the bodily-spiritual unity that we are — then the act could be self-integrating.


But we don’t tolerate it to realize any human good; we act for it.

We seek the subjective experience, an experience that is incommunicable to any other person, even though we might prefer enjoying it in the midst of people.

In this way, we act not for the sake of our unified selves, but in a way that sets one dimension of ourselves (our consciousness) against another (our body).

Instrumentalizing our body in this way is self-alienating.


To enter into human communion — friendship in its various forms — I must have the capacity to give myself, integrated and unalienated, to other people.

But seeking the subjective experience damages my capacity to give myself to others.

And therefore it damages my pursuit of friendship, which is a basic human good.

Think of the relational mixed signals we get from stoners or alcohol abusers (effusively affectionate, coldly taciturn, unreasonably evasive, bitterly critical, dangerously amorous, pugnacious, etc.).

Even when they’re not inebriated, we learn not to trust their relational responses. This is because they lack integrity.


What About for Relaxation?

If it’s okay to drink a glass of wine to calm my feelings of stress after work, why not smoke pot for the same reason?

There are two things to say here.

a. First, to not be intending harm to myself, getting high must be no part of my motive for ingesting the marijuana.

Only relaxation.

But I expect this is usually counterfactual.

How many recreational pot smokers puff a joint or toke a bong with no interest in getting high?

Perhaps some. But I expect very few.
b. Second, even for this small population, it would usually always be wrong to smoke pot since there are other reasonable alternatives for relaxation without the harmful effects of ingesting THC:

e.g., lighting a candle and sitting in a hot tub, enjoying a glass of wine with a nice meal; quiet prayer; yoga; meditation; biofeedback; deep breathing; listening to calming music; massage; progressive muscle relaxation; visualization; aromatherapy.

Add to this that my smoking must not be an occasion of scandal to anyone,

Or a failure to bear Christian witness to the Gospel, or not contribute to the moral license that today surrounds pot smoking.

And the cases in which smoking pot to relax would be morally licit are extremely rare if not practically non-existent.


(EndPart 2)
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Par... (show quote)

Reply
Oct 22, 2018 00:04:15   #
Doc110 Loc: York PA
 
clevey77,

Such a wordy reply ?

And yet you said nothing, . . . but your doubt and nothing of your Faith, what ever "it" may be ?

Quite possibly "Relativism" and "Modernism" a self-doubting new-age human man-made theology.


You only express your hatred of Christianity and of my "Catholic Faith" and you only express your limited religious knowledge of 1,986 years of Christian Catholicism.

My belief in Jesus Christ and the Church that he founded, Is-Not "Bondage."

It is freedom and is free-will to accept and believe that there is a God, when everything in this world fails the test . . .

I have been gifted to see two personal things in my life, that defies worldly explanation.

That are incredible and indefinable odd's, that could have ever happen.

My faith is untestable and is solid.


Are you calling me a reprobate e.g. a bad egg, a black sheep of the family, missing a moral compass. or a depraved, unprincipled, or wicked person ?

Or are you calling this OPP post article unacceptable, or evil.


What sad compassion I have for you, may God have mercy on your soul.


clevey77, Since you're so intelligent and wordy than all the rest of us on the OPP forum, you condone your deceitfulness and believe in UFO's and ET's.


Try explaining scientifically, these 5 Earthly unexplainable's, in this article presented below.


The Url links are there, I dare your to read all the 5 url links.

And please defy explaining, your knowledge about these 5 mysteries, that science can't.



One Apostle finally believed, and said before Jesus Christ.

"My Lord and My God" I believe . . .
John 20:28
https://biblehub.com/john/20-28.htm



10/12/2018 5 Unbelievable But True Miracles
https://www.ucatholic.com/blog/5-unbelievable-but-true-miracles/

In common speech, one may call the improbable or newly discovered a miracle, but as Catholics, we know a miracle to be an extraordinary divine act of God.

Here are five unbelievable, but true miracles of the Catholic Church.


1. The Miracle of Lanciano:
https://zenit.org/articles/physician-tells-of-eucharistic-miracle-of-lanciano/
https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/culture/catholic-contributions/the-miracle-of-lanciano.html

Around 700 A.D. in the city of Lanciano, Italy, a Basilian priest-monk was assigned to celebrate Mass at the monastery of Saint Longinus.

Celebrating in the Latin Rite and using unleavened bread, the monk had doubts whether the Eucharist was truly the Body and Blood of Christ.

During the Mass, when he said the Words of Consecration with doubt in his heart and soul, the bread changed into living flesh and the wine change into blood which quickly coagulated into five globules of differing size.

In 1971 when the specimens were tested, they found the Flesh was human heart tissue. Both the Flesh and the Blood are blood type AB Negative, the same found on the Shroud of Turin and all other Eucharistic miracles.


2. The Miracle of the Flying Saint:
https://aleteia.org/2017/09/18/5-saints-who-could-fly/
https://catholicsay.com/llevitating-saints-saints-who-could-fly-up/

Saint Joseph of Cupertino was said to have been remarkably unclever, but prone to miraculous levitation and intense ecstatic visions.

On October 4, 1630, the town of Cupertino held a procession for the feast day of Saint Francis of Assisi.

He was assisting in the procession when suddenly he soared into the sky, hovering over the crowd.
When he descended and realized what had happened, he became so embarrassed that he fled to his mother’s house and hid.

This was the first of many flights, which soon earned him the nickname “The Flying Saint.”

Joseph’s most famous flight allegedly occurred during a papal audience before Pope Urban VIII.

When he bent down to kiss the Pope’s feet, he was suddenly filled with reverence for the Pope and was lifted up into the air.

He also experienced ecstasies and flights witnessed by thousands during his last mass which was on the Feast of the Assumption in 1663.


3. The Miracle of the Sun:
http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/issues/october-13th-2017/how-the-miracle-of-the-sun-dazzled-the-sceptics/
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/miracle-of-the-sun-broke-darkness-of-portugals-atheist-regimes-28148


The Miracle of the Sun is a miraculous event witnessed by as many as 100,000 people on October 13th, 1917 in the fields of Cova da Iria near Fátima, Portugal.

They gathered to observe the claim of three young shepherd children that an apparition of the Blessed Virgin Mary would appear at high noon.

After a downfall of rain, the dark clouds broke and the sun appeared as an opaque, spinning disc in the sky.

It was significantly less bright than normal, casting a multicolored light.

The sun then careened towards the earth in a zigzag pattern.

Some witnesses reported that their previously wet clothes became “suddenly and completely dry.”

The event was attributed by believers to Our Lady of Fátima, as the children said Mary had promised to reveal her identity and provide a miracle “so that all may believe.”

4. The Miracle of Saint Januarius’ Blood:
https://www.catholic.org/news/hf/faith/story.php?id=76059
https://cruxnow.com/global-church/2016/09/19/famed-blood-miracle-san-gennaro-unfolds-naples/

According to tradition, the blood of Saint Januarius was saved by a woman called Eusebia just after the saint’s martyrdom and hermetically sealed in two glass vials.

He is believed to have been martyred in the Emperor Diocletian’s persecution of AD 305.

Every year, the vial of dried blood is seen to liquefy miraculously. 

The liquefaction sometimes takes place almost immediately but can take hours or even days.

In rare occasions the blood is found already liquefied when taken out of their safe or liquefies outside the usual times.

Every year, thousands assemble thrice to witness the liquefaction of the blood of Saint Januarius in Naples Cathedral:

On September 19 to commemorate his martyrdom, on December 16 to celebrate his patronage of Naples and its archdiocese, and on the Saturday before the first Sunday of May to commemorate the reunification of his relics.


5. The Miracle of Our Lady of Lourdes:
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/its-a-miracle-lourdes-healing-officially-declared-supernatural-84194
http://www.piercedhearts.org/treasures/shrines/lourdes.htm
On February 11, 1858, Saint Bernadette Soubirous, a 14-year old peasant girl from Lourdes admitted when questioned by her mother that she had seen a “lady” in the cave of Massabielle, about a mile from the town, while she was gathering firewood with her sister and a friend.

Similar appearances of the “lady” took place on seventeen more occasions throughout the year.

Generally, each vision was focused on the need for prayer and penance, but her 16th vision the lady revealed herself saying “I am the immaculate conception.”

During one of the apparitions, she was directed to dig near a rock and drink from the spring there.

There was a small puddle of mud in the place but as Bernadette dug into it, a large spring appeared.

Today, this spring is the source of the water in the grotto that millions flock to each year hoping for miraculous cures.

To date, the Lourdes Medical Bureau has declared 69 cases of inexplicable cures out of thousands tested in “extremely rigorous scientific and medical examinations” that failed to find any other explanation.


[quote=clevey77

Off topic, but the A-Moral question of sobrity and the functioning of the spirit.

Opinion 101,

Reprobate, comes to mind:

“The mind is a terrible thing to waste”, The old adage, Let all things be done in moderation could be the oxymoron of the moment …

Do high Andes Populations chew coco leaves in order to function in there daily lives…?

Here the word function, crosses the divide of moral bondage and just prudence…

Your gods bind u to words that others have used to bring conformity to society, all judgement possibly is in the mind of the human spirit…

It possibly, is autonomous with the entity of DNA and the conditioning it receives from birth.

How does it, (the spirit), make a decision other than from the mass mind of conditioned spirits that hold on to bondage as truth?

Here the checks and balances need no authority, other than the right of personal judgment in the environments propagated by cause and effect …

The moral code is not applicable, nor, any mental bondage from outside sources.

Thusly, the intuition of the spiritual entity, the creative source within the cavernous mental galactic sphere (The mind, within the skull), has the power to determine the natural course of just prudence and divine right.

All outside entity’s can disagree and find their own course of inspiration to facilitate the needs of the physical causal environment in which it finds itself ….

The acts of causation are divine in nature and resident in all spiritual entity’s …

We see it in the animal kingdom, and we know it as “Nature” ….

Nature has ben described for homo-sapiens to mimic …

Yet we are told, we have the alternate creative cognition and dexterity to accomplish our dreams within the sphere of our spiritual nature, the galactic source of light energy and the gamma rays of cosmic Sun Transmutation …

The human mind is the frequency transmitter of all light cosmic energy ….

It has been said, that the center of light energy emanating from the galactic central core of the milky way, is the vaginal creaive force’ that is a part our essence and well being, herein.

The experience of the goddesses emanating love and transcendence of the all spiritual awareness …

How is it then we separate ourselves into bondages created by men of less awareness?


SUN Worship…

Humans have worshiped the sun for centuries …

Why, because it is the life giving force on the planet …

Which brings me to the concept of Bondage under the sun by The Priests of ignorance and Dogma.

The destroyers of the creative spirit we are all born with …

Some words come to mind here …

“Let the dead bury the dead” … those that are dead In spirit ? ?

Also the object of following anything required as the formulas of the Pharisees …

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pharisees) …


These are the folks that create the laws of distraction and legal bondage to the reprobate mind … try to get a fair trial in a court of law…because of these lawyers.

We are all in bondage in the frequency of causation …. the elite that control us, as we give over our wills to the basterdazition of their self imposed male godhead.

They have usurped the feminine spontaneity of the immaculateness of all creation …

The Judean evangelical diaspora of FALSE male rule, In the spiraling galactic fingers of the creation, known as the PESH-METEN:

From the Wes Penre Papers:

'The Ninth Passageway'.

This is the Commercial Route lots of ET's are using when trading with each other.

It has a long series of stairgates and Einstein-Rosen Bridges, which makes it easy for different races to travel.

This is the route on which Planet Earth (Uraš) is sitting in the heart of.

It starts in the Galactic Center of the Milky Way Galaxy and spirals out, following the path of the Orion Arm, passes right through the Mintaka star system, continues to the Pleiades, runs further through our own solar system and continues beyond, probably disappearing off of the galaxy and to one of the next, perhaps the Andromeda Galaxy.

(Source: Arynama and Robert Morning-Sky: "The Terra Papers")

Are we alone?

I think not, therefore I am …

The quality of men’s creative mind must not be abridged by the futility of feudalist called Judean male gods acting out the egomania of male self absorption and the reality they can create nothing without the goddess of duality and her emasculate wisdom ….

This is the counter thesis of male rule In the universe … they, (the males), cannot conceive and in their jealousy they think they should rule and do so with death and destruction…

And most like eating their young, (war and death), because they want to mate in the animal kingdom of winner take all …

Get your head out of the book… and get your mind working again, instead of In the box of the Kings court, judicial … aka… Judean law …

The bondage of the many In the hands of the few….

Male rulers and female imitation’s of the latter… all bound by the laws of futility and mass mine conditioning.

The way to perdition is wide and the freedom of thought narrow … it’s all our choice… or is it?

[/quote]

Reply
Oct 22, 2018 00:50:07   #
Iamdjchrys Loc: Decatur, Texas
 
Doc110 wrote:
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Part 2)

E. Christian Brugge
http://m.ncregister.com/blog/christianbrugger/is-it-morally-licit-to-smoke-pot


Harms to Friendship

Moral theologian Germain Grisez provides (here, see question F, No. 5) another reason.
www.twotlj.org/G-2-8-F.html

He argues that any use of BAS precisely for the sake of the experience itself is harmful to our relationships.

We take the BAS to alter our conscious experience.

But our consciousness is affected only by first affecting our brain and nervous system.

We therefore use our bodies as an instrument — a mere means — for achieving a desirable state of consciousness.

If the brain effect were merely tolerated in order to heal ourselves — the bodily-spiritual unity that we are — then the act could be self-integrating.


But we don’t tolerate it to realize any human good; we act for it.

We seek the subjective experience, an experience that is incommunicable to any other person, even though we might prefer enjoying it in the midst of people.

In this way, we act not for the sake of our unified selves, but in a way that sets one dimension of ourselves (our consciousness) against another (our body).

Instrumentalizing our body in this way is self-alienating.


To enter into human communion — friendship in its various forms — I must have the capacity to give myself, integrated and unalienated, to other people.

But seeking the subjective experience damages my capacity to give myself to others.

And therefore it damages my pursuit of friendship, which is a basic human good.

Think of the relational mixed signals we get from stoners or alcohol abusers (effusively affectionate, coldly taciturn, unreasonably evasive, bitterly critical, dangerously amorous, pugnacious, etc.).

Even when they’re not inebriated, we learn not to trust their relational responses. This is because they lack integrity.


What About for Relaxation?

If it’s okay to drink a glass of wine to calm my feelings of stress after work, why not smoke pot for the same reason?

There are two things to say here.

a. First, to not be intending harm to myself, getting high must be no part of my motive for ingesting the marijuana.

Only relaxation.

But I expect this is usually counterfactual.

How many recreational pot smokers puff a joint or toke a bong with no interest in getting high?

Perhaps some. But I expect very few.
b. Second, even for this small population, it would usually always be wrong to smoke pot since there are other reasonable alternatives for relaxation without the harmful effects of ingesting THC:

e.g., lighting a candle and sitting in a hot tub, enjoying a glass of wine with a nice meal; quiet prayer; yoga; meditation; biofeedback; deep breathing; listening to calming music; massage; progressive muscle relaxation; visualization; aromatherapy.

Add to this that my smoking must not be an occasion of scandal to anyone,

Or a failure to bear Christian witness to the Gospel, or not contribute to the moral license that today surrounds pot smoking.

And the cases in which smoking pot to relax would be morally licit are extremely rare if not practically non-existent.


(EndPart 2)
10/17/2018 Is It Morally Licit to Smoke Pot? (Par... (show quote)



What a crock. Alcohol causes stomach, liver and brain damage. I can be happily satisfied with just a toke or two of marijuana, but I don't know a single drinker who can be satisfied with a sip or two of alcohol in any form. Marijuana is very relaxing, and a wonderful thing to anticipate after a long day at work, just like a glass or two of wine. It's also a reasonably effective aphrodisiac (blush). Contrary to right wing dogma, marijuana has not been proven to be a gateway drug any more than alcohol is, and is not a preferred drug of choice to those with addictive personalities. Marijuana is an herb of the earth, given us by our Creator, and is a powerful aid to healing in a variety of illnesses. Humans have been contriving ways to make alcoholic beverages since time out of mind; why the drive to bring back the "Reefer Madness" mindset of yesteryear? I guess you think it's better to be stumbling drunk than to be a little high and looking forward to a good night's sleep (without the hangover). Hangovers, by the way, are symptoms of alcohol poisoning; there is no similar correlation in the use of marijuana. Sorry if I'm rambling a bit, and no, I'm not high. Just sick of this newest wave to criminalize marijuana.

Reply
Oct 22, 2018 02:07:35   #
Doc110 Loc: York PA
 
Iamdjchrys,

You're not "Sorry" and you are justifiable in your belief and the Chemical THC found in Pot.

now on the other hand clevey77, and his UFO's ant ET's are a large amount of crock and compost.


On the article 5 Unbelievable But True Miracles . . . check out the URL links or do your own search ? Is completely accurate.
https://www.onepoliticalplaza.com/t-143564-1.html


Here is the problem that you fail to understand, Iamdjchrys.

God also made alcohol.

Found naturally in apples when they ferment on the ground, ever seen a drunk horse or drunk deer before.

The fermentation process is a natural process and occurs in nature, naturally.

Man understood the fermentation process and, waa-la grape juice to wine or to vinegar.


Then modern day Man took regular pot and made the THC level, 10 times powerful than the pot 20 to 50 years ago.

Soooo,

Marijuana is a “Brain Altering Substances” (BAS)

Because it entails an alteration and impairment of my sensory, rational and volitional faculties, making it more difficult for me to understand things clearly and to choose well.

Interesting it also has bad affects, but you fail to mention those side effects.


I am a believer in moderation also.

I'm also a cheep drunk and rarely drink more than one beer.


But hey it's all free will, and that's your decision to make.


Who am I to Judge you. What you do to you're self and to your body.

I remember hearing that your body is a temple.


The article is about the moral people and not about the amoral people, who do not believe or put their faith in God.


It's all in your personal imagination and you're sexual lobido.



Iamdjchrys wrote:


What a crock.

Alcohol causes stomach, liver and brain damage.

I can be happily satisfied with just a toke or two of marijuana, but I don't know a single drinker who can be satisfied with a sip or two of alcohol in any form.

Marijuana is very relaxing, and a wonderful thing to anticipate after a long day at work, just like a glass or two of wine.

It's also a reasonably effective aphrodisiac (blush).

Contrary to right wing dogma, marijuana has not been proven to be a gateway drug any more than alcohol is, and is not a preferred drug of choice to those with addictive personalities.

Marijuana is an herb of the earth, given us by our Creator, and is a powerful aid to healing in a variety of illnesses.

Humans have been contriving ways to make alcoholic beverages since time out of mind; why the drive to bring back the "Reefer Madness" mindset of yesteryear?

I guess you think it's better to be stumbling drunk than to be a little high and looking forward to a good night's sleep (without the hangover).

Hangovers, by the way, are symptoms of alcohol poisoning; there is no similar correlation in the use of marijuana.

Sorry if I'm rambling a bit, and no, I'm not high.

Just sick of this newest wave to criminalize marijuana.
br br What a crock. br br Alcohol causes stom... (show quote)

Reply
Check out topic: Biden Blocks Release Of His Special Counsel Interview
Oct 22, 2018 08:15:54   #
clevey77
 
Ahh, I did not say you had a reprobate mind... your faith is your faith... end of your story... I have studied much in the (The Book)...bible... I would say I’m the seed that landed on stony ground… I assume there is no hereafter at this point… does that make me the seed of Satin?... Is the god of the bible no respecter of persons…and what does that mean?
Acts 10:34 King James Version (KJV)
34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

Me: is man a livingh soul?

Genesis 2:7 King James Version (KJV)
7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Me:
Is not the breath of life…the spirit that animates all man kind… once again, Act 10:34 comes to mind. Kind after it’s kind and so forth?

The reformer Calvin was to have said:

Therefore, in reading profane authors, the admirable light of truth displayed in them should remind us, that the human mind, however much fallen and perverted from its original integrity, is still adorned and invested with admirable gifts from its Creator. If we reflect that the Spirit of God is the only fountain of truth, we will be careful, as we would avoid offering insult to him, not to reject or condemn truth wherever it appears. In
despising the gifts, we insult the Giver.”
― John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, 2 Vols

Moreover, many philosophers, being overcome with arrogance, have recommended seeking virtue for its own sake. They recommend seeking virtue only for the sake of pride. Yet God isn’t pleased with those who strive after fleeting praise. He isn’t pleased with those who have puffed-up hearts and who manifest to others that they have received their reward in this life (Matt. 6:5–6, 16). Prostitutes and tax collectors are nearer to the kingdom of heaven than such people.”
― John Calvin, A Little Book on the Christian Life

But the nimbleness of the human mind in searching out heaven and earth and the secrets of nature, and when all ages have been compassed by its understanding and memory, in arranging each thing in its proper order, and in inferring future events from past, clearly shows that there lies hidden in man something separate from the body.”
― John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, 2 Vols

“Jean Calvin in his major work, l’Institution de la Religion chrétienne, promotes the doctrine of predestination: God would predestinate ones to salvation and others to destruction Predestination is a classical theme in Christian theology. Throughout the history of the Church, some of the most important theologians promoted predestination. Among them, Augustine and Jean Calvin. Predestination means that before one does anything, before one thinks anything, before one believes anything, even before one was born, even before mankind had existed, even before the world had been created, God knew one’s destiny. Yes Sir, yes Madam, before the beginning, God would have known the destiny of every one of us. And what our destiny would be? Here is the answer: some of us are predestined to salvation and others to destruction! In fact, there is a double predestination: a good one for salvation and a bad one for destruction! “

Me:
It would seem, many a man has gone astray… that’s what humans do!... Am I not In the hands of the creators palms… the metaphor is an axiom delivered to the spirit that enlightens the minds of men… Who, and what mind has the authority, concept, or right to say that their spirit has more then I, or we… those that wrote the book…? Of course this sounds haughty, the mid evil church and the lust for power and control of the hearts of men… This is why we are all reprobate… I will Include myself as it is the frankness of truth.

On the otherhand, No man is an island unto himself… We all error… the dogmas change nothing… but the thinking mind will always be self abased In the sight of the creators… Mono-o-mono not singular. After all, I said it is my opinion… and there are millions of opinions… even you are repetitive in your own intelligence and dogmatic consensus… We all should be humbled by our ignorance in the state of our conditioning…all else is brandish illusion. To repeat the writings of others is common In mans conditioned state … Now tell me that is not so!

I’m repeating what I have read… yet, I’m not quite sure you understand, we all are!
Call me lost if you like… You will not determine what my fate will be…nor any other…accept the creators of the seen and unseen hand… Namaste.


Doc110 wrote:
clevey77,

Such a wordy reply ?

And yet you said nothing, . . . but your doubt and nothing of your Faith, what ever "it" may be ?

Quite possibly "Relativism" and "Modernism" a self-doubting new-age human man-made theology.


You only express your hatred of Christianity and of my "Catholic Faith" and you only express your limited religious knowledge of 1,986 years of Christian Catholicism.

My belief in Jesus Christ and the Church that he founded, Is-Not "Bondage."

It is freedom and is free-will to accept and believe that there is a God, when everything in this world fails the test . . .

I have been gifted to see two personal things in my life, that defies worldly explanation.

That are incredible and indefinable odd's, that could have ever happen.

My faith is untestable and is solid.


Are you calling me a reprobate e.g. a bad egg, a black sheep of the family, missing a moral compass. or a depraved, unprincipled, or wicked person ?

Or are you calling this OPP post article unacceptable, or evil.


What sad compassion I have for you, may God have mercy on your soul.


clevey77, Since you're so intelligent and wordy than all the rest of us on the OPP forum, you condone your deceitfulness and believe in UFO's and ET's.


Try explaining scientifically, these 5 Earthly unexplainable's, in this article presented below.


The Url links are there, I dare your to read all the 5 url links.

And please defy explaining, your knowledge about these 5 mysteries, that science can't.



One Apostle finally believed, and said before Jesus Christ.

"My Lord and My God" I believe . . .
John 20:28
https://biblehub.com/john/20-28.htm



10/12/2018 5 Unbelievable But True Miracles
https://www.ucatholic.com/blog/5-unbelievable-but-true-miracles/

In common speech, one may call the improbable or newly discovered a miracle, but as Catholics, we know a miracle to be an extraordinary divine act of God.

Here are five unbelievable, but true miracles of the Catholic Church.


1. The Miracle of Lanciano:
https://zenit.org/articles/physician-tells-of-eucharistic-miracle-of-lanciano/
https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/culture/catholic-contributions/the-miracle-of-lanciano.html

Around 700 A.D. in the city of Lanciano, Italy, a Basilian priest-monk was assigned to celebrate Mass at the monastery of Saint Longinus.

Celebrating in the Latin Rite and using unleavened bread, the monk had doubts whether the Eucharist was truly the Body and Blood of Christ.

During the Mass, when he said the Words of Consecration with doubt in his heart and soul, the bread changed into living flesh and the wine change into blood which quickly coagulated into five globules of differing size.

In 1971 when the specimens were tested, they found the Flesh was human heart tissue. Both the Flesh and the Blood are blood type AB Negative, the same found on the Shroud of Turin and all other Eucharistic miracles.


2. The Miracle of the Flying Saint:
https://aleteia.org/2017/09/18/5-saints-who-could-fly/
https://catholicsay.com/llevitating-saints-saints-who-could-fly-up/

Saint Joseph of Cupertino was said to have been remarkably unclever, but prone to miraculous levitation and intense ecstatic visions.

On October 4, 1630, the town of Cupertino held a procession for the feast day of Saint Francis of Assisi.

He was assisting in the procession when suddenly he soared into the sky, hovering over the crowd.
When he descended and realized what had happened, he became so embarrassed that he fled to his mother’s house and hid.

This was the first of many flights, which soon earned him the nickname “The Flying Saint.”

Joseph’s most famous flight allegedly occurred during a papal audience before Pope Urban VIII.

When he bent down to kiss the Pope’s feet, he was suddenly filled with reverence for the Pope and was lifted up into the air.

He also experienced ecstasies and flights witnessed by thousands during his last mass which was on the Feast of the Assumption in 1663.


3. The Miracle of the Sun:
http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/issues/october-13th-2017/how-the-miracle-of-the-sun-dazzled-the-sceptics/
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/miracle-of-the-sun-broke-darkness-of-portugals-atheist-regimes-28148


The Miracle of the Sun is a miraculous event witnessed by as many as 100,000 people on October 13th, 1917 in the fields of Cova da Iria near Fátima, Portugal.

They gathered to observe the claim of three young shepherd children that an apparition of the Blessed Virgin Mary would appear at high noon.

After a downfall of rain, the dark clouds broke and the sun appeared as an opaque, spinning disc in the sky.

It was significantly less bright than normal, casting a multicolored light.

The sun then careened towards the earth in a zigzag pattern.

Some witnesses reported that their previously wet clothes became “suddenly and completely dry.”

The event was attributed by believers to Our Lady of Fátima, as the children said Mary had promised to reveal her identity and provide a miracle “so that all may believe.”

4. The Miracle of Saint Januarius’ Blood:
https://www.catholic.org/news/hf/faith/story.php?id=76059
https://cruxnow.com/global-church/2016/09/19/famed-blood-miracle-san-gennaro-unfolds-naples/

According to tradition, the blood of Saint Januarius was saved by a woman called Eusebia just after the saint’s martyrdom and hermetically sealed in two glass vials.

He is believed to have been martyred in the Emperor Diocletian’s persecution of AD 305.

Every year, the vial of dried blood is seen to liquefy miraculously. 

The liquefaction sometimes takes place almost immediately but can take hours or even days.

In rare occasions the blood is found already liquefied when taken out of their safe or liquefies outside the usual times.

Every year, thousands assemble thrice to witness the liquefaction of the blood of Saint Januarius in Naples Cathedral:

On September 19 to commemorate his martyrdom, on December 16 to celebrate his patronage of Naples and its archdiocese, and on the Saturday before the first Sunday of May to commemorate the reunification of his relics.


5. The Miracle of Our Lady of Lourdes:
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/its-a-miracle-lourdes-healing-officially-declared-supernatural-84194
http://www.piercedhearts.org/treasures/shrines/lourdes.htm
On February 11, 1858, Saint Bernadette Soubirous, a 14-year old peasant girl from Lourdes admitted when questioned by her mother that she had seen a “lady” in the cave of Massabielle, about a mile from the town, while she was gathering firewood with her sister and a friend.

Similar appearances of the “lady” took place on seventeen more occasions throughout the year.

Generally, each vision was focused on the need for prayer and penance, but her 16th vision the lady revealed herself saying “I am the immaculate conception.”

During one of the apparitions, she was directed to dig near a rock and drink from the spring there.

There was a small puddle of mud in the place but as Bernadette dug into it, a large spring appeared.

Today, this spring is the source of the water in the grotto that millions flock to each year hoping for miraculous cures.

To date, the Lourdes Medical Bureau has declared 69 cases of inexplicable cures out of thousands tested in “extremely rigorous scientific and medical examinations” that failed to find any other explanation.
clevey77, br br Such a wordy reply ? br br And y... (show quote)

Reply
Oct 22, 2018 11:15:52   #
Radiance3
 
BigMike wrote:
I remember a gal in Dutch Harbor who found some perfume she reeely liked...Cotton Candy.

She bought two big jugs of it. Expensive stuff, too.

It was awful! That stuff was so strong in even the tiniest amounts I could taste it!

The Grand Aleutian had three floors, two restaurants, two bars and a basement. Anyone could find her with ease, anywhere inside the building.

==================
That is a good tracking system. You always find things funny like your adopted cats.

Reply
Oct 23, 2018 12:57:34   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
clevey77 wrote:
Off topic, but the A-Moral question of sobrity and the functioning of the spirit.

Opinion 101,
Reprobate, comes to mind:
“The mind is a terrible thing to waste”, The old adage, Let all things be done in moderation could be the oxymoron of the moment…Do high Andes Populations chew coco leaves in order to function in there daily lives…? Here the word function, crosses the divide of moral bondage and just prudence… Your gods bind u to words that others have used to bring conformity to society, all judgement possibly is in the mind of the human spirit… It possibly, is autonomous with the entity of DNA and the conditioning it receives from birth, How does it, (the spirit), make a decision other than from the mass mind of conditioned spirits that hold on to bondage as truth? Here the checks and balances need no authority, other than the right of personal judgment in the environments propagated by cause and effect… The moral code is not applicable, nor, any mental bondage from outside sources. Thusly, the intuition of the spiritual entity, the creative source within the cavernous mental galactic sphere (The mind, within the skull), has the power to determine the natural course of just prudence and divine right. All outside entity’s can disagree and find their own course of inspiration to facilitate the needs of the physical causal environment in which it finds itself…. The acts of causation are divine in nature and resident in all spiritual entity’s… We see it in the animal kingdom, and we know it as “Nature”…. Nature has ben described for homo-sapiens to mimic… Yet we are told, we have the alternate creative cognition and dexterity to accomplish our dreams within the sphere of our spiritual nature, the galactic source of light energy and the gamma rays of cosmic Sun Transmutation…the human mind is the frequency transmitter of all light cosmic energy….It has been said, that the center of light energy emanating from the galactic central core of the milky way, is the vaginal creaive force’ that is a part our essence and well being, herein, the experience of the goddesses emanating love and transcendence of the all spiritual awareness… How is it then we separate ourselves into bondages created by men of less awareness?

SUN Worship…
Humans have worshiped the sun for centuries… Why, because it is the life giving force on the planet… Which brings me to the concept of Bondage under the sun by The Priests of ignorance and Dogma, the destroyers of the creative spirit we are all born with… Some words come to mind here… “Let the dead bury the dead”… those that are dead In spirit?? Also the object of following anything required as the formulas of the Pharisees… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pharisees)
…These are the folks that create the laws of distraction and legal bondage to the reprobate mind…try to get a fair trial in a court of law…because of these lawyers, we are all in bondage in the frequency of causation….the elite that control us, as we give over our wills to the basterdazition of their self imposed male godhead. They have usurped the feminine spontaneity of the immaculateness of all creation… The Judean evangelical diaspora of FALSE male rule, In the spiraling galactic fingers of the creation, known as the PESH-METEN:
From the Wes Penre Papers
'The Ninth Passageway'. This is the Commercial Route lots of ETs are using when trading with each other. It has a long series of stairgates and Einstein-Rosen Bridges, which makes it easy for different races to travel. This is the route on which Planet Earth (Uraš) is sitting in the heart of. It starts in the Galactic Center of the Milky Way Galaxy and spirals out, following the path of the Orion Arm, passes right through the Mintaka star system, continues to the Pleiades, runs further through our own solar system and continues beyond, probably disappearing off of the galaxy and to one of the next, perhaps the Andromeda Galaxy (Source: Arynama and Robert Morning-Sky: "The Terra Papers")

Are we alone?
I think not, therefore I am… The quality of men’s creative mind must not be abridged by the futility of feudalist called Judean male gods acting out the egomania of male self absorption and the reality they can create nothing without the goddess of duality and her emasculate wisdom…. This is the counter thesis of male rule In the universe… they, (the males), cannot conceive and in their jealousy they think they should rule and do so with death and destruction…and most like eating their young, (war and death), because they want to mate in the animal kingdom of winner take all…
Get your head out of the book… and get your mind working again, instead of I n the box of the Kings court, judicial…aka… Judean law … the bondage of the many In the hands of the few…. Male rulers and female imitation’s of the latter… all bound by the laws of futility and mass mine conditioning.

The way to perdition is wide and the freedom of thought narrow… it’s all our choice… or is it?
Off topic, but the A-Moral question of sobrity and... (show quote)


It has ALWAYS been all our own choice. That is exactly the reason for the Genesis account.

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Oct 23, 2018 13:00:16   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
Radiance3 wrote:
==================
That is a good tracking system. You always find things funny like your adopted cats.


I know. I have a sideways way of attaching things to other things and God brings me great joy in simplicity. This blessing has some unexpectedly beneficial side-effects.

There are two other things I'm able to follow like a bloodhound. Other than these my sense of smell sucks!

Aqua Net hairspray and mildew.

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