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Can socialism be sold to the American public
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Aug 2, 2018 19:22:34   #
Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA
 
JoyV wrote:
Our country isn't our parent!!!!!!!!

But Democrats are children.

Reply
Aug 2, 2018 20:38:33   #
Geo
 
oldroy wrote:
It appears that Ocasia-Cortez did quite a job in the election she won recently. She admitted to being a Democratic Socialist and I believe she worked on Bernie Sanders' campaign. They are both admittedly Democratic Socialists and she can't seem to define democracy and socialism at the same time. Those two are pretty solid with the far left Democrats and I think that Hillary should be thanked for screwing Bernie out of their nomination. I think there is a good chance that if he had run, he may have won since there seem to be so many fools around that will accept their sale of socialized medicine and other "social" programs that they may well be able to win a lot of seats, and maybe the presidency the next time around.

I believe that Obama's promise to effect the major change really worked to soften up our people to get them ready for socialism. I am sure that there may be plenty of "welfare" people around who do believe they are entitled to sos many things that promising them all the freebies of socialism may fool them. I am very sure that many of the illegal aliens who will be voting in the next election will go for socialism. An example of what I just said is the number of illegals that will probably register and vote in San Francisco and vote for more than schools.
It appears that Ocasia-Cortez did quite a job in t... (show quote)


Trump loves socialist government.

Reply
Aug 2, 2018 20:40:49   #
Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA
 
Geo wrote:
Trump loves socialist government.

Brilliant.

That's why he's deregulating at such a speedy pace.

Reply
 
 
Aug 2, 2018 20:59:31   #
emarine
 
eagleye13 wrote:
BTW; ALL socialism is not bad.
IT JUST MUST HAVE ITS RESTRAINED LIMITS;
or it gets abused.
abused BIGLY!

The Preamble to the Constitution?

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility,
**** provide for the common defence, ****
promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
BTW; ALL socialism is not bad. br IT JUST MUST HAV... (show quote)






general Welfare...General Welfare. The concern of the government for the health, peace, morality, and safety of its citizens. Providing for the welfare of the general public is a basic goal of government. The preamble to the U.S. Constitution cites promotion of the general welfare as a primary reason for the creation of the Constitution





health
helTH/
noun
noun: health
the state of being free from illness or injury.
"he was restored to health"
synonyms:
well-being, healthiness, fitness, good condition, good shape, fine fettle; More
strength, vigor, wellness
"he was restored to health"
antonyms:
illness
a person's mental or physical condition.
"bad health forced him to retire"
synonyms:
physical state, physical shape, condition, constitution
"bad health forced him to retire"

Reply
Aug 2, 2018 21:40:19   #
emarine
 
JoyV wrote:
The VA exists because some soldiers (including sailors, flyers, and all other Americans serving or served in the military) paid for with their blood, bodies, and lives; survived. How much is a limb worth in dollars? Lungs or minds? How much for a life? Whatever dollars taxpayers provide was already given to them by the soldiers blood, bodies, and lives.

Those receiving assistance through social programs have not first paid with their blood and bodies. They are receiving from what others have paid for. The veteran is not! He is receiving back a small portion of what he already paid for. And often the medical need is directly due to that sacrifice. In my case my sacrifice resulted in partial paralysis, intermittent blindness, a dozen seizures a day (now under medicine control), and birth defects in my son and grandchildren. My medical needs for these conditions would not exist if I hadn't willingly laid my life, freedom, and health on the line to protect you and all Americans and our constitution. So do NOT equate money going to the VA with money going to food stamps!!!!

Again, here is what I swore to give all Americans:
Download Poster
I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."

Do you stamps recipients need food stamps because they gave and followed such an oath?

I served in the Army. First as a WAC and then as a soldier. What I lived by due to giving the above oath was and is summed up by these values.
The Army Values:

LOYALTY
Bear true faith and allegiance to the U.S. Constitution, the Army, your unit and other Soldiers. Bearing true faith and allegiance is a matter of believing in and devoting yourself to something or someone. A loyal Soldier is one who supports the leadership and stands up for fellow Soldiers. By wearing the uniform of the U.S. Army you are expressing your loyalty. And by doing your share, you show your loyalty to your unit.

DUTY
Fulfill your obligations. Doing your duty means more than carrying out your assigned tasks. Duty means being able to accomplish tasks as part of a team. The work of the U.S. Army is a complex combination of missions, tasks and responsibilities — all in constant motion. Our work entails building one assignment onto another. You fulfill your obligations as a part of your unit every time you resist the temptation to take “shortcuts” that might undermine the integrity of the final product.

RESPECT
Treat people as they should be treated. In the Soldier’s Code, we pledge to “treat others with dignity and respect while expecting others to do the same.” Respect is what allows us to appreciate the best in other people. Respect is trusting that all people have done their jobs and fulfilled their duty. And self-respect is a vital ingredient with the Army value of respect, which results from knowing you have put forth your best effort. The Army is one team and each of us has something to contribute.

SELFLESS SERVICE
Put the welfare of the nation, the Army and your subordinates before your own. Selfless service is larger than just one person. In serving your country, you are doing your duty loyally without thought of recognition or gain. The basic building block of selfless service is the commitment of each team member to go a little further, endure a little longer, and look a little closer to see how he or she can add to the effort.

HONOR
Live up to Army values. The nation’s highest military award is The Medal of Honor. This award goes to Soldiers who make honor a matter of daily living — Soldiers who develop the habit of being honorable, and solidify that habit with every value choice they make. Honor is a matter of carrying out, acting, and living the values of respect, duty, loyalty, selfless service, integrity and personal courage in everything you do.

INTEGRITY
Do what’s right, legally and morally. Integrity is a quality you develop by adhering to moral principles. It requires that you do and say nothing that deceives others. As your integrity grows, so does the trust others place in you. The more choices you make based on integrity, the more this highly prized value will affect your relationships with family and friends, and, finally, the fundamental acceptance of yourself.

PERSONAL COURAGE
Face fear, danger or adversity (physical or moral). Personal courage has long been associated with our Army. With physical courage, it is a matter of enduring physical duress and at times risking personal safety. Facing moral fear or adversity may be a long, slow process of continuing forward on the right path, especially if taking those actions is not popular with others. You can build your personal courage by daily standing up for and acting upon the things that you know are honorable.
The VA exists because some soldiers (including sai... (show quote)




the US Military is the finest 100% socialized institution in this world... one in 10 to 17 US soldiers see combat depending on what war or mission... there is no monetary value that can be applied to a combat soldier... honor is priceless... combat soldiers couldn't function without the teamwork support of other Military personal therefore they too are priceless... the American people should all serve at age 18 for at least 2 years, the training is priceless... this would solve the health care issue & assure a higher state of readiness for the American people... the elite should also train & serve... no trump BS allowed ...

Reply
Aug 3, 2018 01:59:14   #
oldroy Loc: Western Kansas (No longer in hiding)
 
emarine wrote:
the US Military is the finest 100% socialized institution in this world... one in 10 to 17 US soldiers see combat depending on what war or mission... there is no monetary value that can be applied to a combat soldier... honor is priceless... combat soldiers couldn't function without the teamwork support of other Military personal therefore they too are priceless... the American people should all serve at age 18 for at least 2 years, the training is priceless... this would solve the health care issue & assure a higher state of readiness for the American people... the elite should also train & serve... no trump BS allowed ...
the US Military is the finest 100% socialized inst... (show quote)


I am thinking that you don't know any more about socialism than the poor woman from New York City who pushes socialism without knowing what it is. I say this because I trained for about a year and worked as a DF operator for two years. I never saw anything taking place that appeared to be socialism. Maybe that is because I was in the Army in the mid-50s. I had studied communism which should have told be about socialism and I wasn't allowed to go to Berlin in 1957. Was that because they were afraid the Russians may keep me there and try to "beat" all the info I had about direction finding and wanted to get from us so bad?

When you learn a bit about socialism, let me know.

Reply
Aug 3, 2018 03:24:00   #
JoyV
 
emarine wrote:
general Welfare...General Welfare. The concern of the government for the health, peace, morality, and safety of its citizens. Providing for the welfare of the general public is a basic goal of government. The preamble to the U.S. Constitution cites promotion of the general welfare as a primary reason for the creation of the Constitution





health
helTH/
noun
noun: health
the state of being free from illness or injury.
"he was restored to health"
synonyms:
well-being, healthiness, fitness, good condition, good shape, fine fettle; More
strength, vigor, wellness
"he was restored to health"
antonyms:
illness
a person's mental or physical condition.
"bad health forced him to retire"
synonyms:
physical state, physical shape, condition, constitution
"bad health forced him to retire"
general Welfare...General Welfare. The concern of ... (show quote)


Parsing each word for its individual meaning will not covey the meaning of the phrase "promoting the general welfare" in our constitution both in the preamble and in Article I section 8. Many seem to think it refers to things like welfare benefits, food stamps, or other programs to assist those in need. But you must take the two words together as a whole. It refers to the population, not to individuals within the population. For instance in regards to health the US may screen travelers for communicable diseases especially if they traveled from or through an area of outbreak, intervention to prevent or halt an epidemic such as government mandated quarantines, vaccinations when a disease outbreak such as polio were given to all children without charge when I was young. Also things like agricultural screening livestock, exotic animals, food, and plants at entry to our nation to prevent both human and animal or plant diseases, or the presence of harmful insect or parasites. These are just a few ways our government promotes the general welfare of its people.

While this post is not speaking out against individual medical, nutritional, or monetary assistance; that is not what the phrase "promoting the general welfare" means.

Reply
 
 
Aug 3, 2018 03:51:21   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
rumitoid wrote:
You do not know what socialism is. "All the freebies of socialism" are the compassion of a good government. It cares for all its citizens. We can take raising children as free handouts. What did they do to deserve them? All good parents are socialists at heart. Not even given a second thought.


How's Socialism Doing in Venezuela?

Or, how about California?

Reply
Aug 3, 2018 03:53:19   #
JoyV
 
emarine wrote:
the US Military is the finest 100% socialized institution in this world... one in 10 to 17 US soldiers see combat depending on what war or mission... there is no monetary value that can be applied to a combat soldier... honor is priceless... combat soldiers couldn't function without the teamwork support of other Military personal therefore they too are priceless... the American people should all serve at age 18 for at least 2 years, the training is priceless... this would solve the health care issue & assure a higher state of readiness for the American people... the elite should also train & serve... no trump BS allowed ...
the US Military is the finest 100% socialized inst... (show quote)


I don't know where you got your figures from. Those numbers are closer to how many are deployed 3 or more times. About 60% of soldiers are deployed during their first term. Deployed means you are sent to a place of combat or anticipated combat. Nor are support troops likely to see no combat as front lines haven't really existed since the Korean War. I was a cook yet had to have shrapnel extracted from my legs, and was exposed to toxic contamination. As a WAC, by definition I was not a combat soldier. But I saw combat none-the-less.

As for our military being socialist, in some ways it fits the socialist model. Primarily due to its funding being totally from the taxpayers. But not in all ways. For example an important part of socialism is the goal of everyone being treated equal. Yet rank is an extremely important concept in the Armed Forces, and completely differentiates what your duties and responsibilities are, and how you are treated. Promotions mean more pay AND more responsibility. The Armed Forces of the United States in most definitely NOT egalitarian!

Reply
Aug 3, 2018 08:03:55   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
JoyV wrote:
I don't know where you got your figures from. Those numbers are closer to how many are deployed 3 or more times. About 60% of soldiers are deployed during their first term. Deployed means you are sent to a place of combat or anticipated combat. Nor are support troops likely to see no combat as front lines haven't really existed since the Korean War. I was a cook yet had to have shrapnel extracted from my legs, and was exposed to toxic contamination. As a WAC, by definition I was not a combat soldier. But I saw combat none-the-less.

As for our military being socialist, in some ways it fits the socialist model. Primarily due to its funding being totally from the taxpayers. But not in all ways. For example an important part of socialism is the goal of everyone being treated equal. Yet rank is an extremely important concept in the Armed Forces, and completely differentiates what your duties and responsibilities are, and how you are treated. Promotions mean more pay AND more responsibility. The Armed Forces of the United States in most definitely NOT egalitarian!
I don't know where you got your figures from. Tho... (show quote)


"As for our military being socialist, in some ways it fits the socialist model. Primarily due to its funding being totally from the taxpayers. " - JoyV

Some people may need to refer to and pay attention to the Preamble to the Constitution?

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility,
**** provide for the common defence, ****
promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

BTW; The Constitution does not disallow "socialism"; it just puts restrictions on socialism.
Abuse has been proven to be too easy.

Reply
Aug 3, 2018 09:02:49   #
Mom8052 Loc: Lost in the mountains of New Mexico
 
eagleye13 wrote:
"As for our military being socialist, in some ways it fits the socialist model. Primarily due to its funding being totally from the taxpayers. " - JoyV

Some people may need to refer to and pay attention to the Preamble to the Constitution?

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility,
**** provide for the common defence, ****
promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

BTW; The Constitution does not disallow "socialism"; it just puts restrictions on socialism.
Abuse has been proven to be too easy.
"As for our military being socialist, in some... (show quote)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Has anybody in the Military have received a check (made of paper)? I bet that they pay FICA. Then they are paying into the system as well, so is that socialism?

Seen a lot of great points, however, we have always followed the Constitution: why should the liberals try to remove domestic Tranquility?



Reply
 
 
Aug 3, 2018 09:27:32   #
JoyV
 
Mom8052 wrote:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Has anybody in the Military have received a check (made of paper)? I bet that they pay FICA. Then they are paying into the system as well, so is that socialism?

Seen a lot of great points, however, we have always followed the Constitution: why should the liberals try to remove domestic Tranquility?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~... (show quote)


When I was in you got paid in cash. Pay tables were set up and a line before each. You stood in line in parade rest. Each time you moved up, you went back to parade rest. When you reached the table you confirmed who you were, the amount due was counted out, then you signed to say you's received it and left. The whole area surrounded by MPs. I was discharged in 78 so don't know how it's done now.

Reply
Aug 3, 2018 13:45:47   #
emarine
 
oldroy wrote:
I am thinking that you don't know any more about socialism than the poor woman from New York City who pushes socialism without knowing what it is. I say this because I trained for about a year and worked as a DF operator for two years. I never saw anything taking place that appeared to be socialism. Maybe that is because I was in the Army in the mid-50s. I had studied communism which should have told be about socialism and I wasn't allowed to go to Berlin in 1957. Was that because they were afraid the Russians may keep me there and try to "beat" all the info I had about direction finding and wanted to get from us so bad?

When you learn a bit about socialism, let me know.
I am thinking that you don't know any more about s... (show quote)





When you learn a bit about socialism, let me know.[/quote]



Ditto pop's....http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/do-you-know-the-difference-between-a-communist-and-a-socialist-a6708086.html

Reply
Aug 3, 2018 13:46:37   #
Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA
 
JoyV wrote:
When I was in you got paid in cash. Pay tables were set up and a line before each. You stood in line in parade rest. Each time you moved up, you went back to parade rest. When you reached the table you confirmed who you were, the amount due was counted out, then you signed to say you's received it and left. The whole area surrounded by MPs. I was discharged in 78 so don't know how it's done now.


Direct Deposit or a check.

Reply
Aug 3, 2018 14:02:41   #
emarine
 
JoyV wrote:
I don't know where you got your figures from. Those numbers are closer to how many are deployed 3 or more times. About 60% of soldiers are deployed during their first term. Deployed means you are sent to a place of combat or anticipated combat. Nor are support troops likely to see no combat as front lines haven't really existed since the Korean War. I was a cook yet had to have shrapnel extracted from my legs, and was exposed to toxic contamination. As a WAC, by definition I was not a combat soldier. But I saw combat none-the-less.

As for our military being socialist, in some ways it fits the socialist model. Primarily due to its funding being totally from the taxpayers. But not in all ways. For example an important part of socialism is the goal of everyone being treated equal. Yet rank is an extremely important concept in the Armed Forces, and completely differentiates what your duties and responsibilities are, and how you are treated. Promotions mean more pay AND more responsibility. The Armed Forces of the United States in most definitely NOT egalitarian!
I don't know where you got your figures from. Tho... (show quote)




count the number of US Military bases in safe zones compare it to active combat zones... then do the math over time...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_military_bases

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