straightUp Loc: California

For something to be unconstitutional, it has to actually violate a provision of the Constitution itself. So... I'm going to ask you to back up your smack here. What provision of the U.S. Constitution was violated when Obama issued the DACA Act?

'Seem's like we've been through this before mac, when I asked you to show me the law that you say Dreamers are guilty of violating. You couldn't even find that law. You kept coming back at me swearing that they broke the law as if screaming will make it true. But screaming doesn't make it true mac. So if you're going to say DACA was unconstitutional, you need to show us the constitutional law that *makes* it unconstitutional.

Good luck ;)

permafrost Loc: Minnesota

I tried to explain to you. It was not an excuse..

what do you think was unconstitutional?

He is well within the constitution using an EO to determine how a law should enforced..

mactheknife

They broke the immigration law, don't you understand that? Maybe it was the fault of their parents, but the law was broken nevertheless. Go and read up on the law will so that don't have a never-ending exchange that becomes pointless. As far as Obama is concerned, he himself declared that he did not have constitutional authority and he was, supposedly, a constitutional scholar. It was straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak.

permafrost Loc: Minnesota

I already posted most of these excerpts. back a few posts..

But if you look at it, you will see I made a mistake.. I thought President Obama used an EO for this program.. He did not...

Look at the line which is marked with **** to get that information..

You should follow the link, read all of the article and think about it..

we are faced with a complicated set of laws on immigration..



http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2018/jan/09/donald-trump/obama-hedged-didnt-say-he-lacked-legal-right-daca/

Obama didn’t say that he lacked the right to act. In contrast, he emphasized his authority to set priorities until Congress approved the DREAM Act, a measure that would formalize the legal status of this group of immigrants.

"In the absence of any immigration action from Congress to fix our broken immigration system, what we’ve tried to do is focus our immigration enforcement resources in the right places," Obama said June 15, 2012. "This is not a path to citizenship. It's not a permanent fix. This is a temporary stopgap measure that lets us focus our resources wisely while giving a degree of relief and hope to talented, driven, patriotic young people."

Obama did urge Congress to act, saying, "There is still time for Congress to pass the DREAM Act this year, because these kids deserve to plan their lives in more than two-year increments."

ndeed, Obama did tell a Univision audience Oct. 25, 2010, that "I'm president, I'm not king.

In the fall of 2011, he said, "I just have to continue to say this notion that somehow I can just change the laws unilaterally is just not true."

Then he added, "What we can do is to prioritize enforcement, since there are limited enforcement resources, and say we’re not going to go chasing after this young man or anybody else who’s been acting responsibly and would otherwise qualify for legal status if the DREAM Act passed."

In announcing DACA, Obama emphasized that it was a temporary policy. He did not issue an executive order. Rather, the policy was released by the Department of Homeland Security. ***************

Our ruling
Trump said that when Obama signed the executive order on DACA, he acknowledged that he didn’t have the right to do it.

The smaller errors in that statement are that Obama didn’t sign an executive order, and that when he announced the new policy, he didn’t say that he lacked the authority.

The bigger issue is that in 2010 and 2011, Obama reserved the right to enforce immigration laws selectively. His emphasis was on deporting criminals who were undocumented, rather than undocumented students or workers who presented no threat to public safety.

kankune Loc: Iowa

Permmm....you're getting funnier all the time. Take that dream on the road. You'll make a lot of money. Probably from Liberals...

straightUp Loc: California

I understand that you keep saying that but you still can't find a law to prove it.


But that doesn't make them guilty... This is the part that you're just not getting ...at all.


You got a lot of nerve saying that. I've been referencing the laws all along to support my arguments while you can't even find one single law to support yours. And you're telling ME to read up on "the law"?

Remember how pointless I already said it was to talk about the law with you? I shifted, I asked... so what's you're problem with the Dreamers? You responded with the assertion that they are a burden to our system... a claim that you actually based on data from a nativist foundation.

So you've proven that your "concern for the law" is an act. You're justifying your position on disputed data from a biased source so a "concern for the truth" also seems to be an act. I dunno mac, what does that leave?


Yes, he was a constitutional scholar, which may have actually been part of the problem... He was gettin' all constitutional in front of a general population, containing a good chunk of folks that just don't know enough about the Constitution to actually understand what Obama was saying.

Obama said he did not have constitutional authority to make laws.
People familiar with the U.S. Constitution know that DACA is NOT a law.
get it now?

The Constitution says that only Congress can make laws, but the Constitution also says the president has the power to direct his administration through executive orders in support of the law. These things are like company policies more than actual laws.

DACA is a directive coming from the president to instruct his administration to defer action on childhood arrivals until Congress can write a law. So yes, Obama was correct he did not have the authority to make the laws, but he DOES have the authority to

...last time I explain that to you.

mactheknife

As I said before, the problem is easily fixed. Have the Dreamers apply for legal immigration and if they are the fine, upstanding folks that you claim them to be they should have no problem in being accepted. But why should they be allowed to jump to the front of the line ahead of other worthy applicants? Obama's directive was an EO, period.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

Don't confuse sUp with facts. It might make his head hurt.

straightUp Loc: California

That's not actually what you said before, but at least you're saying it now... I agree, let them apply. Only one problem with your easy fix... The president can't just instruct his administration to offer applications for entry to Dreamers unless there is a law that says he can. This is what Obama was trying to explain to everyone.


Who's saying they should? As long as deportation actions can be deferred there's no rush, right? I *do* think they should be allowed to stay here in the meantime, so as not to disrupt their lives and the well-being of their dependents... so long as they abide the law. Don't you think that's reasonable? Most of these Dreamers do have jobs to keep and bills to pay. They won't be able to do that if they're being kicked out.


Yes, did you miss where I kept telling you that? DACA is not a law, it's an Executive Order.

This is why we can say that after more than a year in office, Trump has only managed to sign two laws... The one that cut taxes and the one that increased spending (look out national debt). Everything else Trump has signed were his own executive orders ALL of which can easily be reversed by any subsequent president, just like Trump has been doing to Obama's EOs.

straightUp Loc: California

The only fact in the post you were responding to is that DACA is an Executive Order, something I've been telling you folks all along. At least mac is getting it now. Are you?

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

Are you getting that DACA is a phony stand being used by the Dems for votes?
Trump offered amnesty for the non criminal illegal aliens; and the D's crapped their pants.
How dare he!!!!

mactheknife

I "got it" right from the beginning.

permafrost Loc: Minnesota

The problem is that he tied it to we the people paying for his wall..

so that was not even close to an honest offer, was it..

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

There are many ways for the wall to be paid for, and costs taken care of.
It must be built ASAP.
Have you seen the hordes moving up to the border to storm the gate/border?

The military needs to be stationed on the border, until the wall/technology is in place.
AND the Catch and Release program is terminated.

permafrost Loc: Minnesota

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Never any change in your fears... when you find a link post it for me..