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The Black Dilemma Not a Joke... Or Is It ?
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Jul 14, 2015 00:36:13   #
moldyoldy
 
Unclet wrote:
Can't respect someone who doesn't respect themselves. Not much hope if the don't stop doing what they do to themselves and their neighborhood. Ferguson ring a bell. How about Watts, if you are that old.


Does police misconduct ring a bell?

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 00:43:50   #
Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone
 
Good to see you do research. Believe it or not, white people were the most hunted last year by police. It was reported nationwide that in the year of 2014, whites were the number one victims of police, with a number of 414. Meanwhile, blacks took the number two slot with 233 deaths. The number of Hispanic victims came in third place with 138 kills, with Asians being least likely victimized with an all time low of 15. - See more at: http://thereelnetwork.net/the-primary-victims-of-police-brutality-and-theyre-not-black-people/#sthash.l6IdQPsq.dpuf

moldyoldy wrote:
Does police misconduct ring a bell?

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 00:55:49   #
moldyoldy
 
Pennylynn wrote:
Good to see you do research. Believe it or not, white people were the most hunted last year by police. It was reported nationwide that in the year of 2014, whites were the number one victims of police, with a number of 414. Meanwhile, blacks took the number two slot with 233 deaths. The number of Hispanic victims came in third place with 138 kills, with Asians being least likely victimized with an all time low of 15. - See more at: http://thereelnetwork.net/the-primary-victims-of-police-brutality-and-theyre-not-black-people/#sthash.l6IdQPsq.dpuf
Good to see you do research. Believe it or not, w... (show quote)


Racial Disparities

Indeed, although police violence to a certain degree does cut across racial and demographic lines, the reality is, if you are black you are far more likely die at the hands of a police officer than you would if you are white. A 2007 investigation by ColorLines and the Chicago Reporter found for example that in ten major cities, there was a disproportionately high number of African-Americans among police shooting victims, particularly in New York, San Diego, and Las Vegas.

An investigation of the NAACP into police shootings in Oakland, California, found that out of 45 officer-involved shootings in the city between 2004 and 2008, 37 of those shot were black and none were white. Although one-third of the shootings resulted in fatalities and despite the fact that weapons were not found in 40 percent of cases, no officers were ever brought up on criminal charges.

Considering these statistics, the black-white perception divide on the Ferguson situation may indeed be a cause for concern. While there could be other unaddressed dynamics at play, including a general ignorance and apathy as it pertains to the racial disparities in law enforcement, it seems likely that the concept of white privilege is also playing a significant role.

White privilege, as defined by sociologists, is a system of unearned benefits granted to white people, providing them with an advantage based on their race, which enables them to maintain an elevated status in society. As Frances Kendall describes the concept in Understanding White Privilege, it is “an institutional, rather than personal, set of benefits granted to those of us, who, by race, resemble the people who hold the power positions in our institutions.”

One of those benefits, it is assumed, is the right not to be shot, beaten or even harassed by police. And by maintaining relative silence over the routine police brutality that disproportionately affects African-Americans and expressing general support to cops who are “just doing their jobs,” whites may think that they can maintain this privilege and hold on to their perceived immunity from police violence.

Reply
Check out topic: A Big Salute
Jul 14, 2015 01:01:24   #
fiatlux
 
timmh67 wrote:
I copied and paste this, it's an interesting artical.
By the way I am not a racist but I believe portions of what is said.

&#8203;The Baltimore Sun” is definitely not known as a Conservative newspaper. This very well written assessment of the situation in USA comes as something of a surprise.. some objective observations about other races that have come to the USA and successfully integrated into our society.
This article will obviously be called racist, and will upset the liberals, but they should really think about the message and this deeply rational point of view.
The Black Dilemma

"For almost 150 years the United States has been conducting an interesting experiment. The subjects of the experiment: black people and working-class whites.

The hypothesis to be tested: Can a people taken from the jungles of Africa and forced into slavery be fully integrated as citizens in a majority white population?

The whites were descendants of Europeans who had created a majestic civilization. The former slaves had been tribal peoples with no written language and virtually no intellectual achievements. Acting on a policy that was not fair to either group, the government released newly freed black people into a white society that saw them as inferiors. America has struggled with racial discord ever since.

Decade after decade the problems persisted but the experimenters never gave up. They insisted that if they could find the right formula the experiment would work, and concocted program after program to get the result they wanted. They created the Freedman's Bureau, passed civil rights laws, tried to build the Great Society, declared War on Poverty, ordered race preferences, built housing projects, and tried midnight basketball.

Their new laws intruded into peoples lives in ways that would have been otherwise unthinkable. They called in National Guard troops to enforce school integration. They outlawed freedom of association. Over the protests of parents, they put white children on buses and sent them to black schools and vice-versa. They tried with money, special programs, relaxed standards, and endless hand wringing to close the achievement gap. To keep white backlash in check they began punishing public and even private statements on race. They hung up Orwellian public banners that commanded whites to Celebrate Diversity! and Say No to Racism. Nothing was off limits if it might salvage the experiment.

Some thought that what W.E.B. DuBois called the Talented Tenth would lead the way for black people. A group of elite, educated blacks would knock down doors of opportunity and show the world what blacks were capable of.

There is a Talented Tenth. They are the black Americans who have become entrepreneurs, lawyers, doctors and scientists. But ten percent is not enough. For the experiment to work, the ten percent has to be followed by a critical mass of people who can hold middle-class jobs and promote social stability. That is what is missing.

Through the years, too many black people continue to show an inability to function and prosper in a culture unsuited to them. Detroit is bankrupt, the south side of Chicago is a war zone, and the vast majority of black cities all over America are beset by degeneracy and violence. And blacks never take responsibility for their failures. Instead, they lash out in anger and resentment.

Across the generations and across the country, as we have seen in Detroit, Watts, Newark, Los Angeles, Cincinnati, and now Ferguson, rioting and looting are just one racial incident away. The white elite would tell us that this doesn't mean the experiment has failed. We just have to try harder. We need more money, more time, more understanding, more programs, and more opportunities.

But nothing changes no matter how much money is spent, no matter how many laws are passed, no matter how many black geniuses are portrayed on TV, and no matter who is president. Some argue its a problem of culture, as if culture creates peoples behavior instead of the other way around. Others blame white privilege.

But since 1965, when the elites opened Americas doors to the Third World, immigrants from Asia and India people who are not white, not rich, and not connected have quietly succeeded. While the children of these people are winning spelling bees and getting top scores on the SAT, black youths are committing half the country's violent crime, which includes viciously punching random white people on the street for the thrill of it that has nothing to do with poverty.

The experiment has failed. Not because of white culture, or white privilege, or white racism. The fundamental problem is that American black culture has evolved into an un-fixable and crime ridden mess. *They do not want to change their culture or society, and expect others to tolerate their violence and amoral behavior. They have become socially incompatible with other races by their own design, not because of the racism of others - but by their own hatred of non-blacks.*

Our leaders don't seem to understand just how tired their white subjects are with this experiment. *They don't understand that white people aren't out to get black people; they are just exhausted with them. They are exhausted by the social pathologies, the violence, the endless complaints, and the blind racial solidarity, the bottomless pit of grievances, the excuses, and the reflexive animosity. The liberal elites explain everything with racism, and refuse to believe that white frustration could soon reach the boiling point."---

"You can't legislate the poor into freedom by legislating the wealthy out of freedom. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. The government can't give to anybody anything that the government doesn't first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they don't have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is about the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it."

Ian Duncan
The Baltimore Sun , May 30, 2015 &#8203;
I copied and paste this, it's an interesting artic... (show quote)


Wow. You read this and thought only liberals might find this racist? It is astonishing people like you exist with such a convincing facade of awareness. How do you do it? This article is wholly offensive from start to finish, its premises rationally absurd and racially biased. Are you gonna say, "See, I told you the liberals would hate it"? No, just sane people do. Lol, I am beside myself that any human in their right frkn mind might find this article as anything but a prompt for genocide.

To begin, "Can a people taken from the jungles of Africa and forced into slavery be fully integrated as citizens in a majority white population?" Hilarious. Slavery was going on for a few hundred years. Blacks in slavery could be here for five generations or more. They did not just step off Caucasian Cruise Lines at the Emancipation Proclamation. And something really insidious is lurking in that statement: the belief these jungle citizens did not have the intellectual wherewithal to adjust.

"The whites were descendants of Europeans who had created a majestic civilization." A "majestic civilization"? That was constantly warring against each, had pogroms, inquisitions, and lavish structures and governments that housed vicious and mean-spirited people willing to torture or kill all that disagreed. Majestic?

The premises are not just factually wrong but racially tinted. Slavery ended in 1865. These tribal people stepping off the boat from Africa, here for multiple generations in America, had another hundred years of lynchings, Jim Crow Laws, segregation, and restrictions (summary death, at times) on inter-racial marriage.

"When half of the people get the idea that they don't have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is about the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it." This statement is idiotic. You really think that people making millions or even billions will stop living in absolute luxury because a pittance has to be paid to keep the body and soul together for the poor? Have you such an incredibly low opinion of the poor, portrayed by this article as Black, that they have no drive or honor or self-respect and like wallowing in handouts? Unfrknreal!

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 01:36:26   #
Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone
 
Did you bother to read the date on my post.... this is 2015 and the information is from 2014. Your information is OLD. And you need to look at the site I included....IT IS A BLACK WEB SITE.

And do explain the white privileges you mention? Are there any neighborhoods where blacks are banned? Are there any educational facilities where blacks are not given preferential treatment and extra points for the color of the skin? Can you eat wherever you can afford? Can you rent rooms in hotels on the same floors and equal accommodations as a white? Are blacks given preferential treatment in hiring and retention with phase backs? Do supermarkets bar blacks for buying food? Do auto sales restrict what kind of car you can buy? Has someone told you that you can not be intrude in a specific cemetery because of the color of your skin? Can you see any doctor you wish if they have space? So, do tell me more about "white privilege."

Asia for Asians (Good),
Africa for Africans (Good),
White countries for White people (White privilege!) and white privilege is just a substituted word for racist.


moldyoldy wrote:
Racial Disparities

Indeed, although police violence to a certain degree does cut across racial and demographic lines, the reality is, if you are black you are far more likely die at the hands of a police officer than you would if you are white. A 2007 investigation by ColorLines and the Chicago Reporter found for example that in ten major cities, there was a disproportionately high number of African-Americans among police shooting victims, particularly in New York, San Diego, and Las Vegas.

An investigation of the NAACP into police shootings in Oakland, California, found that out of 45 officer-involved shootings in the city between 2004 and 2008, 37 of those shot were black and none were white. Although one-third of the shootings resulted in fatalities and despite the fact that weapons were not found in 40 percent of cases, no officers were ever brought up on criminal charges.

Considering these statistics, the black-white perception divide on the Ferguson situation may indeed be a cause for concern. While there could be other unaddressed dynamics at play, including a general ignorance and apathy as it pertains to the racial disparities in law enforcement, it seems likely that the concept of white privilege is also playing a significant role.
Racial Disparities br br Indeed, although police ... (show quote)





Reply
Jul 14, 2015 02:48:05   #
KHH1
 
moldyoldy wrote:
Black wall street in OK, burned to the ground by jealous whites. Allenwood in CA. water supply poisoned by jealous whites. Several towns in the south east, destroyed because they were Black and successful.


Man they know that....like they really believe that white people were not capable of such things in that timeframe.....or that you listed is just some trumped-up shit That schit was the norm...right wingers put on a little, "i'm stupid and I don't know about that" act that is disrespectful to the other person's intelligence........

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 03:25:11   #
Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone
 
Black wall street burned in 1921. There is no Allenwood, Ca. The "successful black" towns burned, also happened in the 1920s, ...... what current towns have been burned by whites? Ferguson is all on you. Baltimore, all on you. Watts riots, all on you..... So, enlighten me.

While I was searching for verification on the burning issue, I did find something real interesting.....16 whites across the nation set on fire by blacks.

KHH1 wrote:
Man they know that....like they really believe that white people were not capable of such things in that timeframe.....or that you listed is just some trumped-up shit That schit was the norm...right wingers put on a little, "i'm stupid and I don't know about that" act that is disrespectful to the other person's intelligence........

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 04:12:42   #
ColdDrink
 
Pennylynn wrote:
Did you bother to read the date on my post.... this is 2015 and the information is from 2014. Your information is OLD. And you need to look at the site I included....IT IS A BLACK WEB SITE.

And do explain the white privileges you mention? Are there any neighborhoods where blacks are banned? Are there any educational facilities where blacks are not given preferential treatment and extra points for the color of the skin? Can you eat wherever you can afford? Can you rent rooms in hotels on the same floors and equal accommodations as a white? Are blacks given preferential treatment in hiring and retention with phase backs? Do supermarkets bar blacks for buying food? Do auto sales restrict what kind of car you can buy? Has someone told you that you can not be intrude in a specific cemetery because of the color of your skin? Can you see any doctor you wish if they have space? So, do tell me more about "white privilege."

Asia for Asians (Good),
Africa for Africans (Good),
White countries for White people (White privilege!) and white privilege is just a substituted word for racist.
Did you bother to read the date on my post.... thi... (show quote)


Wow. You read this and thought only liberals might find this racist? It is astonishing people like you exist with such a convincing facade of awareness. How do you do it? This article is wholly offensive from start to finish, its premises rationally absurd and racially biased. Are you gonna say, "See, I told you the liberals would hate it"? No, just sane people do. Lol, I am beside myself that any human in their right frkn mind might find this article as anything but a prompt for genocide.

To begin, "Can a people taken from the jungles of Africa and forced into slavery be fully integrated as citizens in a majority white population?" Hilarious. Slavery was going on for a few hundred years. Blacks in slavery could be here for five generations or more. They did not just step off Caucasian Cruise Lines at the Emancipation Proclamation. And something really insidious is lurking in that statement: the belief these jungle citizens did not have the intellectual wherewithal to adjust.

"The whites were descendants of Europeans who had created a majestic civilization." A "majestic civilization"? That was constantly warring against each, had pogroms, inquisitions, and lavish structures and governments that housed vicious and mean-spirited people willing to torture or kill all that disagreed. Majestic?

The premises are not just factually wrong but racially tinted. Slavery ended in 1865. These tribal people stepping off the boat from Africa, here for multiple generations in America, had another hundred years of lynchings, Jim Crow Laws, segregation, and restrictions (summary death, at times) on inter-racial marriage.

"When half of the people get the idea that they don't have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is about the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it." This statement is idiotic. You really think that people making millions or even billions will stop living in absolute luxury because a pittance has to be paid to keep the body and soul together for the poor? Have you such an incredibly low opinion of the poor, portrayed by this article as Black, that they have no drive or honor or self-respect and like wallowing in handouts? Unfrknreal!

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 04:13:16   #
ColdDrink
 
KHH1 wrote:
Man they know that....like they really believe that white people were not capable of such things in that timeframe.....or that you listed is just some trumped-up shit That schit was the norm...right wingers put on a little, "i'm stupid and I don't know about that" act that is disrespectful to the other person's intelligence........


Wow. You read this and thought only liberals might find this racist? It is astonishing people like you exist with such a convincing facade of awareness. How do you do it? This article is wholly offensive from start to finish, its premises rationally absurd and racially biased. Are you gonna say, "See, I told you the liberals would hate it"? No, just sane people do. Lol, I am beside myself that any human in their right frkn mind might find this article as anything but a prompt for genocide.

To begin, "Can a people taken from the jungles of Africa and forced into slavery be fully integrated as citizens in a majority white population?" Hilarious. Slavery was going on for a few hundred years. Blacks in slavery could be here for five generations or more. They did not just step off Caucasian Cruise Lines at the Emancipation Proclamation. And something really insidious is lurking in that statement: the belief these jungle citizens did not have the intellectual wherewithal to adjust.

"The whites were descendants of Europeans who had created a majestic civilization." A "majestic civilization"? That was constantly warring against each, had pogroms, inquisitions, and lavish structures and governments that housed vicious and mean-spirited people willing to torture or kill all that disagreed. Majestic?

The premises are not just factually wrong but racially tinted. Slavery ended in 1865. These tribal people stepping off the boat from Africa, here for multiple generations in America, had another hundred years of lynchings, Jim Crow Laws, segregation, and restrictions (summary death, at times) on inter-racial marriage.

"When half of the people get the idea that they don't have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is about the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it." This statement is idiotic. You really think that people making millions or even billions will stop living in absolute luxury because a pittance has to be paid to keep the body and soul together for the poor? Have you such an incredibly low opinion of the poor, portrayed by this article as Black, that they have no drive or honor or self-respect and like wallowing in handouts? Unfrknreal!

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 04:13:34   #
ColdDrink
 
Pennylynn wrote:
Black wall street burned in 1921. There is no Allenwood, Ca. The "successful black" towns burned, also happened in the 1920s, ...... what current towns have been burned by whites? Ferguson is all on you. Baltimore, all on you. Watts riots, all on you..... So, enlighten me.

While I was searching for verification on the burning issue, I did find something real interesting.....16 whites across the nation set on fire by blacks.


Wow. You read this and thought only liberals might find this racist? It is astonishing people like you exist with such a convincing facade of awareness. How do you do it? This article is wholly offensive from start to finish, its premises rationally absurd and racially biased. Are you gonna say, "See, I told you the liberals would hate it"? No, just sane people do. Lol, I am beside myself that any human in their right frkn mind might find this article as anything but a prompt for genocide.

To begin, "Can a people taken from the jungles of Africa and forced into slavery be fully integrated as citizens in a majority white population?" Hilarious. Slavery was going on for a few hundred years. Blacks in slavery could be here for five generations or more. They did not just step off Caucasian Cruise Lines at the Emancipation Proclamation. And something really insidious is lurking in that statement: the belief these jungle citizens did not have the intellectual wherewithal to adjust.

"The whites were descendants of Europeans who had created a majestic civilization." A "majestic civilization"? That was constantly warring against each, had pogroms, inquisitions, and lavish structures and governments that housed vicious and mean-spirited people willing to torture or kill all that disagreed. Majestic?

The premises are not just factually wrong but racially tinted. Slavery ended in 1865. These tribal people stepping off the boat from Africa, here for multiple generations in America, had another hundred years of lynchings, Jim Crow Laws, segregation, and restrictions (summary death, at times) on inter-racial marriage.

"When half of the people get the idea that they don't have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is about the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it." This statement is idiotic. You really think that people making millions or even billions will stop living in absolute luxury because a pittance has to be paid to keep the body and soul together for the poor? Have you such an incredibly low opinion of the poor, portrayed by this article as Black, that they have no drive or honor or self-respect and like wallowing in handouts? Unfrknreal!

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 04:32:26   #
Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone
 
Are you sure you are speaking to the right person? I think you may have intended your remarks for another. My remarks was about police brutality. Did you find it offensive?

I see that you are new to OPP. If I may, when you read the comment on the thread, directly below that comment you want to make a response, there is a quote reply button, when you use that button you are replying directly back to that person. It seves to keep remarks in context and pretty much eliminates the confusion to whom you are talking. As in my case, you seem to be offended by timmh67, but you replied to me and apparently to everyone else with your critique of his article as if all agreed with him. I do not agree with the article in general. So I withheld comment to him. However, Moldy came along with her remarks defending blacks and saying that blacks are more often killed by police. Knowing that she was in error, I felt compelled to correct the misinformation. Now you come along and copy and paste the comments of fiatlux as a response not just to me, but others. So, you have me at a disadvantage. Are you Fiatlux? Or was this just a mistake?

ColdDrink wrote:
Wow. You read this and thought only liberals might find this racist? It is astonishing people like you exist with such a convincing facade of awareness. How do you do it? This article is wholly offensive from start to finish, its premises rationally absurd and racially biased. Are you gonna say, "See, I told you the liberals would hate it"? No, just sane people do. Lol, I am beside myself that any human in their right frkn mind might find this article as anything but a prompt for genocide.

To begin, "Can a people taken from the jungles of Africa and forced into slavery be fully integrated as citizens in a majority white population?" Hilarious. Slavery was going on for a few hundred years. Blacks in slavery could be here for five generations or more. They did not just step off Caucasian Cruise Lines at the Emancipation Proclamation. And something really insidious is lurking in that statement: the belief these jungle citizens did not have the intellectual wherewithal to adjust.

"The whites were descendants of Europeans who had created a majestic civilization." A "majestic civilization"? That was constantly warring against each, had pogroms, inquisitions, and lavish structures and governments that housed vicious and mean-spirited people willing to torture or kill all that disagreed. Majestic?

The premises are not just factually wrong but racially tinted. Slavery ended in 1865. These tribal people stepping off the boat from Africa, here for multiple generations in America, had another hundred years of lynchings, Jim Crow Laws, segregation, and restrictions (summary death, at times) on inter-racial marriage.

"When half of the people get the idea that they don't have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is about the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it." This statement is idiotic. You really think that people making millions or even billions will stop living in absolute luxury because a pittance has to be paid to keep the body and soul together for the poor? Have you such an incredibly low opinion of the poor, portrayed by this article as Black, that they have no drive or honor or self-respect and like wallowing in handouts? Unfrknreal!
Wow. You read this and thought only liberals might... (show quote)

Reply
Check out topic: End the Deficit in 5 minutes
Jul 14, 2015 04:50:37   #
ColdDrink
 
Pennylynn wrote:
Are you sure you are speaking to the right person? I think you may have intended your remarks for another. My remarks was about police brutality. Did you find it offensive?

I see that you are new to OPP. If I may, when you read the comment on the thread, directly below that comment you want to make a response, there is a quote reply button, when you use that button you are replying directly back to that person. It seves to keep remarks in context and pretty much eliminates the confusion to whom you are talking. As in my case, you seem to be offended by timmh67, but you replied to me and apparently to everyone else with your critique of his article as if all agreed with him. I do not agree with the article in general. So I withheld comment to him. However, Moldy came along with her remarks defending blacks and saying that blacks are more often killed by police. Knowing that she was in error, I felt compelled to correct the misinformation. Now you come along and copy and paste the comments of fiatlux as a response not just to me, but others. So, you have me at a disadvantage. Are you Fiatlux? Or was this just a mistake?
Are you sure you are speaking to the right person?... (show quote)


Yes. And no. You may want to claim your comments are not racist but follow this pattern whenever this subject comes up. "Well, I have statistics to prove that..." and always in favor of whites. Maybe they are true. But that does not dismiss racism in America. Or that too many cases against Blacks were unjust, even if statistically lower. This point is not in the normal parameters. Half the number of whites when Blacks are a tenth of whites. Nothing skewed there?

Fiatlux nailed it--and no one could respond. This bugs me about this site. A well-reasoned rebuttal has to be ignored to keep the rabbit hole open. This is truly ugly. Ugliness defined.

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 04:52:46   #
Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone
 
so you are fiatlux, thank you for your honesty.

ColdDrink wrote:
Yes.

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 05:07:31   #
ColdDrink
 
Pennylynn wrote:
so you are fiatlux, thank you for your honesty.


Huh?

Reply
Jul 14, 2015 07:39:56   #
ssgtgood
 
moldyoldy wrote:
Unfortunately, this was not written by Ian Duncan..... not anywhere to be found on the Baltimore Sun site, plus snopes has it being tossed around with multiple authors


Its still true moldyass. Every word of it.

Reply
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