Richard94611

Watching the news today I saw that when Congress v**ed for the comprehensive anti-apartheid act during Reagan's presidency, Reagan vetoed it. The Congress than overrode his veto and the bill was passed.

This shows an aspect of Reagan that I have always believed -- that he was really a mean-spirited person, happy to be on the top of the heap, but non-caring about those on the bottom.

theoldguy44

The word is comprehensive, have you looked at what the law dictated? The Democrats were in charge of the Congress and they loaded it up with more radical left crap, like they always do.

Richard94611

Fascinating. I was talking about Reagan, and you changed the subject (probably erroneously) to what is supposedly going on in South Africa. Reagan was a mean-spirited man. You conservatives always talk about "freedom." Reagan was preventing South Africans from having it.

And what did you think of Nelson Mandela ?

UncleJesse Loc: Hazzard Co, GA

Sometime, he would convinced himself of things that were out of the norm. He just didn't think the law would help fix the problem and believed it could hurt. It was similar to his insistence on supply side economic programs that didn't work or that increasing the deficit for military spending wouldn't matter in the long run because revenue from growth would decrease the spending deficit. They all sounded pretty good but simply didn't work.

Richard94611

I agree. I think that under his presidency, a lot of ineffective programs and theories were put into motion. A notable one is the whole idea of supply side economics. Frankly, a lot of us got tired of being "trickled down upon." SSE didn't work.

Richard94611

And the comprehensive anti-apartheid act did help the establishment of freedom, didn't it ? Are other people's freedom important to you -- or just your own ?

cold iron Loc: White House

I was showing you what you got when Mendela took over. Do you see any freedom in what Mandela did. Come on show me what you are.

quasimoto63

Pure nonsense. Mandela was a life-long c*******t and terrorist. Reagan saw South Africa quickly degenerating onto another Rhodesia or Cuba. Everyone seems to know Mandela was in prison for 27 years, but no one asks why. The "why" part is easy. He was a terrorist who committed HUNDREDS of brutal crimes in the early '60s--his trial was open, and fairer than it needed to be--they knew back then the spotlight was on them. Had he committed his crimes in the USA or Britain in the early '60s, he would have been eligible for the death penalty--And foreign l*****ts of the era knew this at the time. He got a surprisingly light sentence. Che Guevera and Fidel Castro were his heroes--cry not a tear for the loss of this man.

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

It is important to not focus just on the v**e, but the contents of the sanctions. President Regan, as an ever patient man showed his willingness to compromise and submitted a version twice for consideration. He viewed the proposed bill as a tool that would not benefit South Africa but to further impoverish the already poor. His comments after the overturn of his veto speaks volumes:
""Today's Senate v**e should not be viewed as the final chapter in America's efforts, along with our allies, to address the plight of the people of South Africa. Instead, it underscores that America—and that means all of us—opposes apartheid, a malevolent and archaic system totally alien to our ideals. The debate, which culminated in today's v**e, was not whether or not to oppose apartheid but, instead, how best to oppose it and how best to bring freedom to that troubled country.

I deeply regret that Congress has seen fit to override my veto of the Comprehensive Anti-Apartheid Act of 1986. Punitive sanctions, I believe, are not the best course of action; they hurt the very people they are intended to help. My hope is that these punitive sanctions do not lead to more violence and more repression. Our administration will, nevertheless, implement the law. It must be recognized, however, that this will not solve the serious problems that plague that country. The United States must also move forward with positive measures to encourage peaceful change and advance the cause of democracy in South Africa.

Now is the time for South Africa's Government to act with courage and good sense to avert a crisis. Moderate black leaders who are committed to democracy and oppose revolutionary violence are ready to work for peaceful change. They should not be kept waiting. It would be tragic to lose this opportunity to create a truly free society which respects the rights of the majority, the minority, and the individual. There is still time for orderly change and peaceful reform. South Africans of good will, black and white, should seize the moment."

After the passage, the problems in South Africa got much worse, even more wide spread abuse and starvation. It would behoove you to look at the complete history prior to passages and then the aftermath. Ugly is the only term I can bring to mind.

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

Thank you, it is good that some still look at all parts rather than the PC verity.
:thumbup: :thumbup:

UncleJesse Loc: Hazzard Co, GA

He was such an excellent speaker. The Great Communicator. He could sell sand to an Arab and had such great smile, eye twinkle and a confident air about him that made folks listen to what he was saying. "Well now, there you go again."

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

:thumbup: :thumbup:

quasimoto63

He said that to Walter Mondale in 1984--and it was great. For once in a decade, we were proud to be Americans. Reagan, though, was a politician, so he might've said a lot of good things, he didn't actually DO a lot of good things. R.I.P. Reagan.

Richard94611

Incidentally, he was eligible for the death penalty in South Africa when he was tried. He just didn't receive it, much to the betterment of the world. I suppose that back in the days of the American Revolution, if you were consistent with your present views, you would have regarded the revolutionaries as being terrorists and such, too.

When Reagan saw South Africa as degenerating quickly into another Cuba or Rhodesia, he was wrong, wasn't he ? South Africa under Mandela didn't.

quasimoto63

Washington wasn't "necklacing" his opponents with burning tires like this animal and his A.N.C. was--and still IS--doing.