fiatlux

If it was a Republican at that deserted outpost, he would have killed Wind In His Hair at first sight, and received a medal. It is a mindset that allows, welcomes, such violence and death. "Stand your ground" the law; I have a right to kill--not disarm, reason with, look for alternative measures, run away from--this person. The law creates a predisposition to violence. It becomes the primary option. No thought is needed. And all prejudices are allowed. Simple math: kill.

But violence and death need to be the last thing on our mind, if at all. "Love your enemies" Jesus said. Such laws and the promotion of a gun culture--where 10k people a year are murdered in the US and the nearest industrial country has 200 a year killed--is sick and ugly. Gun culture promotes violence and mayhem. Gun culture is anti-Christian. Gun culture is a direct threat to the safety of our children, future and this country.

The mindset of the NRA is no different than the mindset of the Brown Shirts: we have to eliminate our enemies, whether criminals or political. Yet Jesus said, "Love your enemies." Loving your enemies is far more important than opposing gay marriage or abortion. Loving your enemies is far more important than attacking Islam or securing American borders. Christians are acting like cowards and fools for the Right. Stand your ground should mean, not kill your neighbor or carry a gun but stand in the Kingdom of God and be a vessel of peace and love.

Loki Loc: Georgia

How fortunate that I am not a Christian. You go ahead and love your enemies. I will do unto mine before they do unto me.

fiatlux

...and the cycle of violence is perpetuated.

Loki Loc: Georgia

As is my continued health and well-being. As long as there are people there will be violence. As long as there are people who are professional victims, there will be predators to take advantage. Nature abhors a vacuum.

Among reported violent crimes, unarmed victims who tried to resist were injured or killed more than 90% of the time.
Unarmed victims who complied with everything the perpetrator told them to do were still hurt or killed in nearly 50% of the cases.
The success rate of criminals against victims who turn out to be armed is barely one percent.
You can carry your beliefs. I will carry my .45.

fiatlux

I know what you said above is wrong. Please give multiple sources, or not.

Violence begets violence: this is not an abstract idea. All civilization attests to it. An "eye for an eye" is both the way of the world and the end of the world. For how long can you protect your life with a .45? Is that the preferred way to live?

Loki Loc: Georgia

I will look up my sources, they are from the National Sheriff's Association, a fraternal Law Enforcement organization of current and former Law Enforcement.
How long can I protect my life with a .45? Until I run out of ammo, at which point I will switch to one of my other firearms.
I prefer living to dying. By the way, it is also the "way of the world" for predators to seek out those least able to defend themselves. Criminal attacks on armed and alert victims are rarely successful. The same attacks on unarmed victims almost always are.
If you wish to offer yourself up as a sacrifice to violent criminals, be my guest. Do not expect me to follow your lead.
I have used deadly force to defend my life against an armed opponent. It did not beget more violence, it begat less. I have not had to use it since. This may change in the next five minutes, but I doubt it. I am not safer because criminals love and respect me. I am safer because I am armed and alert. The best way to avoid the status of victim is to be aware, avoid trouble whenever possible, and give the assailant more of it than he can handle when you can no longer avoid. Many situations can be diffused or avoided with a little common sense. I go armed at all times for those situations that fall outside these parameters.

fiatlux

Two non-violent movements that changed history. History should have convinced them they were fools on a fool's errand. The sword is the way.

You say, "I go armed at all times for those situations that fall outside these parameters." You don't know that for sure. A predilection for violence, a mind to kill or survive at any cost, sees differently than the pacifist mind. Pacifism is a proactive and conscious dedication to the sanctity of life. Losing one's life to change one mind from the way of the world is well worth it. We all die. Length of life is not the measure of anything. Kill for another day of breath? What has changed? Evil is well and prosperous. The cycle continues, fueling genocides and serial killers and war-mongers. Violence begats violence. Only you can end the spiral.

Loki Loc: Georgia

Violence also ends violence. Had the Allies stomped on Hitler in 1938, instead of pursuing your peace at any price philosophy, millions of innocent lives would have been spared.
Your way is, in my opinion, the coward's way. Killers are predators. Victims do not satiate them, they whet their appetite for more. The violence of violent people continues until they are met with violence that exceeds their own. Laying down and offering no resistance does not stop violence, it encourages and enables it.

fiatlux

You have no way of knowing that is true. I got attacked by two men in an empty subway car. I was 22 at the time. They were not good at what they did. My older brother had given me a large and very sharp knife just for such occasion. Due to their overzealous ineptitude, there was an easy opening to stab and probably kill, or seriously injure, both of them. Something stopped me. Then I heard one of them say, "This is wrong, bro; let's get outta here." And his friend was already moving to the doors. One said sorry as he left the train. An exception, possibly. Or good duty by some on the Right would have been to rid society of them both when I had the chance.

Hitler could have fallen in the shower, cracked his skull and died if we did not bring him to the military table. Violence never ends violence, and believing it does is the true coward's way of life.

Loki Loc: Georgia

Very nice, except for one thing; Hitler did not fall down and go boom. He invaded Poland and Poland faw down go boom. Along with 200,000 Poles who were completely unprepared to resist. Then there were those little incidents in Norway, and France, and Belgium, etc.
While you were waiting for God to strike him dead, He struck millions of people dead. Violence begats violence, but only when it is allowed to flourish.
Your reasoning is flawed, and your attempt to portray those who resist evil as cowards is simply a justification for your own cowardice. Your willingness to let violent criminals have their way in the hope they will crack their head in the shower at some future date shows an inability to separate wishful thinking from reality.

As far as violence never ending violence, the guy who shot at me had a record of violent criminal attacks. He hasn't attacked anyone else.

Loki Loc: Georgia

[quote=Loki]Very nice, except for one thing; Hitler did not fall down and go boom. He invaded Poland and Poland faw down go boom. Along with 200,000 Poles who were completely unprepared to resist. Then there were those little incidents in Norway, and France, and Belgium, etc.
While you were waiting for God to strike him dead, He struck millions of people dead. Violence begats violence, but only when it is allowed to flourish.
Your reasoning is flawed, and your attempt to portray those who resist evil as cowards is simply a justification for your own cowardice. Your willingness to let violent criminals have their way in the hope they will crack their head in the shower at some future date shows an inability to separate wishful thinking from reality.

As far as violence never ending violence, the guy who shot at me had a record of violent criminal attacks. He hasn't attacked anyone else, and as far as I know, he is still breathing. I'll shoot more accurately if there is a next time.

TexaCan Loc: Homeward Bound!

Do you ever use just good ole' common sense as a source?

Loki Loc: Georgia

That would be too sensible. The guy I shot, as I said, had a history. While he lived, as far as I know he hasn't done any more of this. Maybe he learned something, I don't know.

TexaCan Loc: Homeward Bound!

What would you have done if they had not have stopped their attack? Would you have just let them rob and beat you, or would you have defended yourself? How much would you have suffered to prove your point?

Loki Loc: Georgia

She has never had to.