working class stiff Loc: N. Carolina

Again.....asserting something as fact does not make it so.
Show me the links proving v***r f***d.

alex Loc: michigan now imperial beach californa

when you keep your head up your ass all the time no one can show you anything

working class stiff Loc: N. Carolina

Nice.
Is it too much to ask to for data? Or am I just to believe wh**ever assertion is made on the web. Because no-one posts falsehoods on the internet.

Gino

Yeah, your right!, with it put into Law, that they must show a Picture ID, the current and Future Administrations like them, wouldn't be able to get the Illeagal Imigrant V**es, nor would they be able to get the V**es of People that have been Deceased for years!..Oh Shucky Darn!......Bunch of Crooks!

hprinze Loc: Central Florida

Obama is not the greatest danger to America.
The greatest danger to America is the abject stupidity of an e*****rate that allows such an evil creature to infest the White House.

That abject stupidity is evident in the post I quoted and replied to.

alex Loc: michigan now imperial beach californa

you are the best example I could give

berdeanyolles

First time on here. Wow, it's really interesting to hear opinions of everyone. I'm glad to know some one else calls him obummer. Him and his cronies have thrown our country to the wolfes and there's no getting back what we had. Our country is so divided,I honestly think it's worse than the civil war. Oh, we aren't on the ground, but gov't D.C. is So messed up and controlled, we don't have a genus, I know of alive that can fix things. If I didn't know better, with obummer is still campaigning. Is this the new gov't we see,edgeing it's way in. People are not listening, nor do they want to. As my friend says, and I'm finding it to be true, people are rolling along in life and when the bottom falls out, or exployeds, then the cry will be HELP. and that's what gov't wants. To divide us, which is working really well,and keep us fighting each, which is alsoworking.thought I'd throw in a comment or two

working class stiff Loc: N. Carolina

Still no examples of this alleged v***r f***d. Just name calling.

OffGrid9 Loc: off-grid, down in a canyon, mostly

If "extensive studies" have failed to identify a single case of v***r f***d in NC, then I'd guess the studies weren't extensive enough. Over the years, most other states have found numerous cases of v***r f***d, including miscounted v**es, lost/destroyed/disappearing v**es, intimidation at polling places, and (most of all) v**es cast by persons not constitutionally permitted to v**e. The attempt to pass a law to require v**er identification was never intended to limit or complicate the v****g process for citizens. Yes, there is a small percentage of legal v**ers who don't have adequate documentation of their citizenship status, but seldom will it be necessary to expend great time or money to obtain a certified copy of a birth certificate, naturalization document, or passport. Where a citizen can make a case that such an expense would really be a burden, then we should make arrangements (using public funds, or better, private donations) to help those people get the proper documents. This can all be done far in advance of the next e******n cycle. It should NOT pose any substantial inconvenience to the huge majority of v**ers, and would pose a tremendous advantage to e******n officials who need to identify and block illegal v**ers. I congratulate NC on its purported lack of v***r f***d, but again, this is to prevent what has become a nationwide v**er-fraud scandal in recent e******ns. Most states are affected, including my own, WA state. We need to stop dead people and criminals and i*****l i*******ts from v****g. If the process of doing that places a slight burden on some of our poorer v**ers (both Democrat AND Republican), so be it...and again, we should be able to help them. But wh**ever the cost, it's a price we need to pay, to ensure honest e******ns in EVERY state.

If you don't object to jerrymandering, I do. Matter of opinion, I guess, but I don't like ANY party creating hugely stupid district boundaries to assure themselves a political advantage. It ain't kosher. In any case, with or without jerrymandering, in a country that uses representative democracy as a v****g model, there will always be situations where the majority of v****g citizens do not get their way. Get over it. Work to get out your party's v**ers to make sure that, next e******n, even jerrymandering can't muzzle you. I sincerely hope you succeed, because I don't want to disenfranchise anyone, especially through jerrymandering. Good luck.

OffGrid9 Loc: off-grid, down in a canyon, mostly

I agree with your sentiment, and I certainly feel that Obama and his political, financial, and media supporters have done more damage to the USA than any previous group...but as for sheer corruption, they'd be hard-pressed to match Boss Tweed's Tammany Hall in the mid-1800's, or Daly's Cook County political machine for the last half of the 20th century, both Democratic machines. Of course, Obama himself is a latter-day product of that Cook County machine. Yet we'll have to admit that there were corruption scandals galore in the terms of Republican Presidents Grant and Harding...even a few under Lincoln and Eisenhower.

Nobody's perfect, I guess.

snowbear37 Loc: MA.

www.usatoday.com%2Fnews%2Fopinion%2Fstory%2F2012-03-19%2Fv**er-ID-Texas-fraud%2F53658158%2F1" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/#search?q=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.usatoday.com%2Fnews%2Fopinion%2Fstory%2F2012-03-19%2Fv**er-ID-Texas-fraud%2F53658158%2F1


http://townhall.com/columnists/rachelalexander/2012/11/11/obama_likely_won_ree******n_through_e******n_fraud/page/full


http://patdollard.com/2012/11/massive-e******n-f***d-evidence-mounts-obama-won-more-than-99-percent-of-the-v**e-in-more-than-100-ohio-precincts/


http://www.wnd.com/2012/11/did-v**er-fraud-swing-e******n/

working class stiff Loc: N. Carolina

The issue has been studied by our local university and the state legislature. I'm not sure why NC would be cleaner than other states in that regard, because we certainly have had our fair share of other types of corruption, including our last governor being threatened with federal prison. Yes he was a democrat.
As I have said (maybe on another thread), I was not disturbed by the Republican victory, nor surprised. The Democrats had gotten way too comfortable.
I know that v****g and it's counting is a complex procedure and mistakes get made in counting, registration, etc. But that's a far cry from thinking, as some folks do, that Democrats that are in power are stealing e******ns.
I have no objection to streamlining, clarifying, updating or other fixes to make e******ns for fair and efficient. I don't even oppose the v**er ID laws in principle. For all the reasons you stated, and especially if the state helps in getting the ids. But when the Pa. governor said they did it to deliver Pa. to Romney, my antenna went up. And some of the rhetoric surrounding this issue is counterproductive. American liberals need and deserve representation also. We are not inherently Marxist America hating folks. We love our country too.
Which brings me to jerrymandering. I'm not for it. I just don't blame the Republicans for doing it. The former Democratic administrations certainly drew safe seats for themselves.....hence the corruption.
I think you'd be surprised at how much this liberal agrees with the conservative critique of our current politics and governance. It's the solutions that need negotiation.

OffGrid9 Loc: off-grid, down in a canyon, mostly

From some of the other things you've written, it appear that we may have a lot more in common than I thought, and I welcome this discussion. I can even occasionally change an opinion, if you have a long enough lever and a rock-solid fulcrum (data, data, data, not conjecture).

And look, I actually agree with you, that v***r r**********n should not be aimed at giving any party an advantage. But you have joined the mainstream media in misquoting PA Republican House Leader Mike Turzai (...yeah, that's right, it wasn't the governor). On June 23 or 24, 2012, Turzai was listing several recent Republican accomplishments in the PA legislature, the last of which was this:

"...V**er ID, which is gonna allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania, done."

He did NOT mean that the new PA v***r r**********n law was passed in order to give Romney a victory, although many MSM outlets made that inference, purposefully misquoting him. For example, Annie-Rose Strasser, writing for Think Progress on 25-Jun 2012, utterly distorted his meaning: "This weekend, Pennsylvania Republican House Leader Mike Turzai (R-PA) finally admitted what so many have speculated: V**er identification efforts are meant to suppress Democratic v**es in this year’s e******n." That is NOT what Turzai said. Note Turzai's use of the word, "allow". He meant that v***r r**********n would help to ensure a clean e******n, without v***r f***d, AND THIS WOULD ALLOW ROMNEY TO WIN, IF HE GOT THE MOST V**ES. I admit he could have phrased it better, but he never said what was claimed, and many PA Housemembers who know Turzai, even Democrats, repudiated the claims made by Strasser and others.

CrazyHorse Loc: Kansas

Quid Pro Quo, OffGrid9: The media's tatic is called sophistry, and misleading fallacious argument.

Rikkyrick

I really don't think Obama could win without c***ting! These people are so immoral. They take an oath on the constitution then spend all their time trying to get around it. I despise Obama, Holder, Pelosi and Reid!