One Political Plaza - Home of politics
Home Active Topics Newest Pictures Search Login Register
Main
Antony Blinken: Warring Ukraine Will Join NATO
Page <prev 2 of 6 next> last>>
Apr 8, 2024 14:26:17   #
WEBCO
 
JFlorio wrote:
Great idea. If you're on drugs. Like Putin would ever consider joining NATO or NATO would consider Russia. Besides the industrial military complex Eisenhower warned us about would not be making as much money.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gg-jvHynP9Y


Russia wanted to join NATO in the 90s

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 14:39:07   #
manning5me Loc: Richmond, Va.
 
WEBCO wrote:
Russia wanted to join NATO in the 90s

======================

Ridiculous idea. Russia is still an imperialistic nation, and all of their leaders want to expand their borders back to where the Soviets were, which means they want to conquer several NATO nations, say Latvia and Estonia, if not Poland and Germany too. K**l Putin and you get yet another leader with the same ideas.

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 15:04:54   #
martsiva
 
manning5me wrote:
======================

Ridiculous idea. Russia is still an imperialistic nation, and all of their leaders want to expand their borders back to where the Soviets were, which means they want to conquer several NATO nations, say Latvia and Estonia, if not Poland and Germany too. K**l Putin and you get yet another leader with the same ideas.


So you think Russian leaders want to deliberately!!! attack NATO countries bringing assured destruction of their own?? How utterly ludicrous!

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 16:18:39   #
WEBCO
 
manning5me wrote:
======================

Ridiculous idea. Russia is still an imperialistic nation, and all of their leaders want to expand their borders back to where the Soviets were, which means they want to conquer several NATO nations, say Latvia and Estonia, if not Poland and Germany too. K**l Putin and you get yet another leader with the same ideas.


Why do you believe that Russia is still an imperialistic nation that wants to expand to sviet era? I haven't seen or heard any intelligent people espousing that view. Seems to be another lie by the military industrial complex to make money and destroy the Ukraine. We've done a pretty good job so far

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 16:19:37   #
WEBCO
 
manning5me wrote:
======================

Ridiculous idea. Russia is still an imperialistic nation, and all of their leaders want to expand their borders back to where the Soviets were, which means they want to conquer several NATO nations, say Latvia and Estonia, if not Poland and Germany too. K**l Putin and you get yet another leader with the same ideas.


Do you also believe Putin destroyed his own pipeline as well?

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 17:01:55   #
manning5me Loc: Richmond, Va.
 
martsiva wrote:
So you think Russian leaders want to deliberately!!! attack NATO countries bringing assured destruction of their own?? How utterly ludicrous!

=================
Unfortunately, you are the ridiculous one. There is plentiful historical evidence that supports my statement, and not yours. Putin himself has voiced the same thing over and over in his national speeches, and has conducted now 9 wars to regain the territory they think they need for security.

Sorry, Mam, but you have it bassackwards, Putin will threaten the destruction of the US as his troops invade NATO nations, leaving us the option of using our nukes first on Russia, which we have vowed not to do. He wins, we will not use our nukes, and he annexes one or more Baltic states and perhaps Poland.

No one in their right mind would risk nuclear annihilation of America over Putin invading Latvia, for instance. Or Estonia, or Lithuania, and I believe over Poland, never mind that we could also k**l Russia in retaliation, but won't.

Looked at another way, neither Russia nor the US want to use their nukes. Russia uses that fact to invade a NATO nation, The US will not respond first with nukes, A. because it isn't worth it to take the Russian nuke attack response for a small NATO nation, and B. because we have vowed not to be a first user of nukes. So, Russia wins that nation, and can repeat the same scenario for further nations. MAD works, but at the cost of small nations one or a few at a time.

This is why NATO has sent large forces up to the borders of Russia, especially in Poland, to threaten a counter invasion of Russia if Russia invades a Baltic state, thus resorting to a non-nuclear response. These US forces also tend to ensure that Poland will not be first on Russia's agenda.

The Baltic states are weak militarily, and they are very hard to reenforce because of their geography and the narrow land connection to their south which Russia would try to capture immediately, joining up with their isolated d******n on the Baltic sea. The US has put small forces into them to act as tripwire insurance that if Russia attacks, we would be immediately involved, thus acting as a deterrent to Russia's ideas. Are all of our moves sufficient? Perhaps.

A comment: It seems that many Americans do not give credit to the nations composing NATO f or their ability to think for themselves and somehow conclude that NATO must act strongly against Russia right now! That the Ukraine is a key effort in blocking Russian ambitions, and that Putin is determined to restore the Soviet empire. They called upon the US to support the effort to stop Putin as we had already decided to do, of course, so we have a strong alliance. Sweden and Finland came on board for the same reasons: stopping Putin. Why is it that their take on the situation is ignored or downplayed by our average citizens? All 30 nations of NATO have made a serious commitment to fight Russia if necessary real soon now. We Americans cannot ignore this. These nations have heard Putin's speeches, and have been watching his 9 battles to gain back territory. They see the threat very clearly. We should also.

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 17:25:07   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
WEBCO wrote:
Russia wanted to join NATO in the 90s


They'd have never passed the smell test.

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 17:32:32   #
manning5me Loc: Richmond, Va.
 
WEBCO wrote:
Do you also believe Putin destroyed his own pipeline as well?


==================
Your off-the-wall question is noted, as is the attitude you express. So far, no one has been identified as the guilty party to my knowledge. Best it stays that way as far as I am concerned.

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 18:49:19   #
WEBCO
 
manning5me wrote:
=================
Unfortunately, you are the ridiculous one. There is plentiful historical evidence that supports my statement, and not yours. Putin himself has voiced the same thing over and over in his national speeches, and has conducted now 9 wars to regain the territory they think they need for security.

Sorry, Mam, but you have it bassackwards, Putin will threaten the destruction of the US as his troops invade NATO nations, leaving us the option of using our nukes first on Russia, which we have vowed not to do. He wins, we will not use our nukes, and he annexes one or more Baltic states and perhaps Poland.

No one in their right mind would risk nuclear annihilation of America over Putin invading Latvia, for instance. Or Estonia, or Lithuania, and I believe over Poland, never mind that we could also k**l Russia in retaliation, but won't.

Looked at another way, neither Russia nor the US want to use their nukes. Russia uses that fact to invade a NATO nation, The US will not respond first with nukes, A. because it isn't worth it to take the Russian nuke attack response for a small NATO nation, and B. because we have vowed not to be a first user of nukes. So, Russia wins that nation, and can repeat the same scenario for further nations. MAD works, but at the cost of small nations one or a few at a time.

This is why NATO has sent large forces up to the borders of Russia, especially in Poland, to threaten a counter invasion of Russia if Russia invades a Baltic state, thus resorting to a non-nuclear response. These US forces also tend to ensure that Poland will not be first on Russia's agenda.

The Baltic states are weak militarily, and they are very hard to reenforce because of their geography and the narrow land connection to their south which Russia would try to capture immediately, joining up with their isolated d******n on the Baltic sea. The US has put small forces into them to act as tripwire insurance that if Russia attacks, we would be immediately involved, thus acting as a deterrent to Russia's ideas. Are all of our moves sufficient? Perhaps.

A comment: It seems that many Americans do not give credit to the nations composing NATO f or their ability to think for themselves and somehow conclude that NATO must act strongly against Russia right now! That the Ukraine is a key effort in blocking Russian ambitions, and that Putin is determined to restore the Soviet empire. They called upon the US to support the effort to stop Putin as we had already decided to do, of course, so we have a strong alliance. Sweden and Finland came on board for the same reasons: stopping Putin. Why is it that their take on the situation is ignored or downplayed by our average citizens? All 30 nations of NATO have made a serious commitment to fight Russia if necessary real soon now. We Americans cannot ignore this. These nations have heard Putin's speeches, and have been watching his 9 battles to gain back territory. They see the threat very clearly. We should also.
================= br Unfortunately, you are the ri... (show quote)


You fail to acknowledge that we started this Ukraine problem when we o*******w their government. You also fail to recognize the numerous times Russia warned about using the Ukraine as a stepping stone to Russia. Why do we have biomass in Ukraine and why were we building intelligence centers their?

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 18:50:47   #
WEBCO
 
manning5me wrote:
==================
Your off-the-wall question is noted, as is the attitude you express. So far, no one has been identified as the guilty party to my knowledge. Best it stays that way as far as I am concerned.


A valid question...why is it best that it stays secret

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 19:00:04   #
Smedley_buzkill
 
Oldsailor65 wrote:
Antony Blinken: Warring Ukraine Will Join NATO
https://thecongressionalinsider.com/antony-blinken-warring-ukraine-will-join-nato/

Joe Biden’s Secretary of State, Antony Blinken, said Thursday in no uncertain terms that war torn Ukraine will become a member of the NATO alliance. This could draw the United States and Europe into direct military conflict with Russia, but that apparently was not a concern.

Blinken’s comments came in Brussels during the organization’s 75th anniversary celebration.

He declared that member states will “build a bridge” for Ukraine to cross into membership. Blinken echoed other alliance leaders when he flatly declared, “Ukraine will become a member of NATO.”



Blinken said “we will do everything we can, allies will do everything they can, to ensure Ukraine has what it needs to continue to deal with Russia’s ongoing aggression.”

While asserting that a pathway to membership will be cleared by the alliance, Blinken emphasized military support for Kyiv.

The Secretary of State told the media that “we are equally focused as I said on the immediate, and on Ukraine’s needs today, tomorrow, the day after to help it withstand this ongoing aggression from Russia.”


Not every NATO member is on board with the inevitability of Ukraine ascending into the alliance. In 2023, German Chancellor Olaf Scholz observed that the nation did not meet the criteria for membership.

Scholz noted, “It is also clear that we then have to discuss which security guarantees can be given in a post-war situation. But we are far from there yet…NATO’s criteria include a whole series of conditions that Ukraine cannot currently meet.”

That did not deter President Joe Biden and NATO head Jens Stoltenberg from declaring their intentions for Kyiv.

The pair commented last year that “Allies agree that Ukraine will become a member of NATO.” This is an outcome that Russian President Vladimir Putin flatly rejected.

But Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba was pleased with Blinken’s pronouncement. “We look forward to the outcome. Of course we believe Ukraine deserves to be a member of NATO and that this should happen sooner rather than later.”

He thanked the U.S. Secretary of State for the “strong, encouraging message.”

A series of 10-year treaties between individual NATO states and Ukraine have already been signed. Finland on Wednesday became the latest to ink such an agreement.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hC7DREY-Li8

This is how that problem was started by Stupid Biden.

I say let's arm Joe and the entire Biden administration with "assault weapons of war" and t***sport them to Ukraine immediately
Antony Blinken: Warring Ukraine Will Join NATO br ... (show quote)


Crimea and Donetsk, Ukraine were part of Russia for most of their history, until the 1950s. The population is majority Russian. The rest of Ukraine not so much.

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 19:04:07   #
Smedley_buzkill
 
manning5me wrote:
======================

Ridiculous idea. Russia is still an imperialistic nation, and all of their leaders want to expand their borders back to where the Soviets were, which means they want to conquer several NATO nations, say Latvia and Estonia, if not Poland and Germany too. K**l Putin and you get yet another leader with the same ideas.


Russia is a paranoid nation. They have been invaded several times. They are fanatical about having "client" countries to act as a buffer between them and anyone else. They take a longer view of things. They were invaded by Mongols, by the French, the Germans and the Japanese. Every time their civilians suffered greatly. I am not so much defending them as understanding their point of view. If we had been invaded as much as them with as much damage done we would likely feel much the same.

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 19:04:43   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
Smedley_buzk**l wrote:
Crimea and Donetsk, Ukraine were part of Russia for most of their history, until the 1950s. The population is majority Russian. The rest of Ukraine not so much.


Smed. Good to see you again. How are you doing?

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 19:35:40   #
manning5me Loc: Richmond, Va.
 
WEBCO wrote:
You fail to acknowledge that we started this Ukraine problem when we o*******w their government. You also fail to recognize the numerous times Russia warned about using the Ukraine as a stepping stone to Russia. Why do we have biomass in Ukraine and why were we building intelligence centers their?

======================
Seems to me the past is irrelevant now, and trying to sort out blame and winners and losers is a true fools game. Sins may be on both sides, but just how does one account for them if true? For me, the problem began when Russian forces crossed the Ukraine border hoping to capture Kyiv. That is a clear violation of the sovereignty of an independent nation. (And, we must admit one factor from the past, and that is the Crimea takeover by Putin in 2014.) Also, for Russia to insist that the Ukraine must not join NATO is going too far. They have the right to do that as a free nation, never mind the paranoia of Russian leaders. That NATO is a defensive alliance means that Russia should never fear an attack from NATO. Putin knows this very well, but he is a clever manipulator, and all the time he has his eyes on Ukraine for quite a number of reasons. He made his move. We have supported the resistance to it. If NATO continues their support, the US included, there is a chance we can force a withdrawal by Russia/Putin. If we falter Putin will win, stabilize the area, and then turn his attention to The Balkans.

Meanwhile, by absorbing the forces Putin has mustered in battling the Ukrainians, the idea of a Balkan thrust is deferred. Putin doesn't have the strength to do that at the moment, especially when we have brought significant forces into the region to thwart him.

So, the war to stop Putin's expansion plans hinges upon who wins in the Ukraine.

We must win. It is shameful to see resistance to this fact by congress, and a segment of the populace, I know. And, to wave the moral superiority f**g and judge the Ukraine for being corrupt is simply a distraction from the goal. That is a factor in how we support them not a stopper!

Reply
Apr 8, 2024 23:41:10   #
WEBCO
 
manning5me wrote:
======================
Seems to me the past is irrelevant now, and trying to sort out blame and winners and losers is a true fools game. Sins may be on both sides, but just how does one account for them if true? For me, the problem began when Russian forces crossed the Ukraine border hoping to capture Kyiv. That is a clear violation of the sovereignty of an independent nation. (And, we must admit one factor from the past, and that is the Crimea takeover by Putin in 2014.) Also, for Russia to insist that the Ukraine must not join NATO is going too far. They have the right to do that as a free nation, never mind the paranoia of Russian leaders. That NATO is a defensive alliance means that Russia should never fear an attack from NATO. Putin knows this very well, but he is a clever manipulator, and all the time he has his eyes on Ukraine for quite a number of reasons. He made his move. We have supported the resistance to it. If NATO continues their support, the US included, there is a chance we can force a withdrawal by Russia/Putin. If we falter Putin will win, stabilize the area, and then turn his attention to The Balkans.

Meanwhile, by absorbing the forces Putin has mustered in battling the Ukrainians, the idea of a Balkan thrust is deferred. Putin doesn't have the strength to do that at the moment, especially when we have brought significant forces into the region to thwart him.

So, the war to stop Putin's expansion plans hinges upon who wins in the Ukraine.

We must win. It is shameful to see resistance to this fact by congress, and a segment of the populace, I know. And, to wave the moral superiority f**g and judge the Ukraine for being corrupt is simply a distraction from the goal. That is a factor in how we support them not a stopper!
====================== br Seems to me the past is ... (show quote)


We never should have started this war, and we should have let it end, both times, when Zelensky was ready to sign a peace treaty. Not another dime should go to the Ukraine.

Reply
Page <prev 2 of 6 next> last>>
If you want to reply, then register here. Registration is free and your account is created instantly, so you can post right away.
Main
OnePoliticalPlaza.com - Forum
Copyright 2012-2024 IDF International Technologies, Inc.