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Dec 18, 2014 12:43:54   #
vernon
 
Trooper745 wrote:
Instead of running you silly bulls**t, give me the correct FACTS, or point out which facts I stated that are wrong, ... not your l*****t rhetoric.


:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

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Dec 18, 2014 13:04:26   #
Glaucon
 
Trooper745 wrote:
No matter how you try to muddy the story of Mike Brown's death, the facts remain the same. A police officer stopped Brown for some legitimate reason. Brown entered the police vehicle and assaulted the officer, causing serious damage to the officer's face. Brown attempted to take the officer's gun, apparently to k**l the officer. After being shot in the arm during a struggle for officer Wilson's weapon, Brown exited the car and started to leave the scene, at which time the bloody and hurting officer pursued the assailant.

The assailant, Brown, turned and came toward the officer, giving officer Wilson the belief that Brown was intending to continue the attack on officer Wilson. Officer Wilson, fearing further assault and injury or death at Brown's hands, put numerous bullets into Brown, k*****g him. It was a righteous shoot, ... no matter how much bulls**t you stir in to muddy the facts.
No matter how you try to muddy the story of Mike B... (show quote)


You don’t sound like a person who is open to even considering another view, but I will give it a try.

I agree that all I have heard and seen causes me to believe (tentatively) that the officers stopped Brown for legitimate reasons.

Did you read the article? What about it do you believe is wrong or irrelevant?

I think that if we have strong opinions, it is from our emotions and not from a thoughtful analysis, because we do not have reliable information on which to have a thoughtful analysis.

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Dec 18, 2014 13:12:16   #
vernon
 
Glaucon wrote:
You don’t sound like a person who is open to even considering another view, but I will give it a try.

I agree that all I have heard and seen causes me to believe (tentatively) that the officers stopped Brown for legitimate reasons.

Did you read the article? What about it do you believe is wrong or irrelevant?

I think that if we have strong opinions, it is from our emotions and not from a thoughtful analysis, because we do not have reliable information on which to have a thoughtful analysis.
You don’t sound like a person who is open to even ... (show quote)


tell that to the l**ters in ferg.

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Dec 18, 2014 13:15:38   #
Trooper745 Loc: Carolina
 
Glaucon wrote:
You don’t sound like a person who is open to even considering another view, but I will give it a try.

I agree that all I have heard and seen causes me to believe (tentatively) that the officers stopped Brown for legitimate reasons.

Did you read the article? What about it do you believe is wrong or irrelevant?

I think that if we have strong opinions, it is from our emotions and not from a thoughtful analysis, because we do not have reliable information on which to have a thoughtful analysis.
You don’t sound like a person who is open to even ... (show quote)


Aw crap, the whole article is BS. You take the questionable testimony of one witness, and from that, you decide another grand jury is needed. In fact, a number of the pro-Brown witnesses were proven by the physical evidence to be lying. Of course, if the grand jury had returned an indictment against Wilson, ... you wouldn't have considered it a good idea to convene another grand jury to rehear the case, because they were proven to be liars, would you?

The facts are as I stated them. The members of the grand jury, even though under great pressure to indict regardless of the evidence, did their jobs courageously, and refused to indict on the grounds that there was insufficient evidence to prosecute Wilson. Get over it!

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Dec 18, 2014 14:56:45   #
Glaucon
 
Trooper745 wrote:
Aw crap, the whole article is BS. You take the questionable testimony of one witness, and from that, you decide another grand jury is needed. In fact, a number of the pro-Brown witnesses were proven by the physical evidence to be lying. Of course, if the grand jury had returned an indictment against Wilson, ... you wouldn't have considered it a good idea to convene another grand jury to rehear the case, because they were proven to be liars, would you?

The facts are as I stated them. The members of the grand jury, even though under great pressure to indict regardless of the evidence, did their jobs courageously, and refused to indict on the grounds that there was insufficient evidence to prosecute Wilson. Get over it!
Aw crap, the whole article is BS. You take the qu... (show quote)


Your opening with, "Aw crap" tells me all I need to know in order to avoid wasting any more of my time.

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Dec 18, 2014 15:01:41   #
Trooper745 Loc: Carolina
 
Glaucon wrote:
Your opening with, "Aw crap" tells me all I need to know in order to avoid wasting any more of my time.


In other words, you can't give a reasonable answer, as usual.

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Dec 18, 2014 15:18:39   #
Glaucon
 
Trooper745 wrote:
Instead of running you silly bulls**t, give me the correct FACTS, or point out which facts I stated that are wrong, ... not your l*****t rhetoric.


Name calling and insults don't make much of a platform for a civil, rational exchange, and extremely hostile and confrontational challenges are a real turn off.

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Dec 18, 2014 16:09:25   #
oldroy Loc: Western Kansas (No longer in hiding)
 
Glaucon wrote:
Sandra McElroy likely perjured herself before the Grand Jury, changing the outcome and perception of the Michael Brown shooting.

"Witness 40" was the Ferguson Grand Jury witness who wrote the r****t journal entry after she claimed to have witnessed the Michael Brown shooting. She is also the witness who described Michael Brown charging like a football player.

She's also a liar. The Smoking Gun revealed her identity on Wednesday, and she confirmed it after they published their article unmasking her.
Here's the punch line:

While the “hands-up” account of Dorian Johnson is often cited by those who demanded Wilson’s indictment, “Witness 40”’s testimony about seeing Brown batter Wilson and then rush the cop like a defensive end has repeatedly been pointed to by Wilson supporters as directly corroborative of the officer’s version of the August 9 confrontation. The “Witness 40” testimony, as Fox News sees it, is proof that the 18-year-old Brown’s k*****g was justified, and that the Ferguson grand jury got it right.
However, unlike Johnson, “Witness 40”--a 45-year-old St. Louis resident named Sandra McElroy--was nowhere near Canfield Drive on the Saturday afternoon Brown was shot to death.

Yet. She was permitted to give testimony before the Ferguson Grand Jury, she was cited by prosecutor Robert McCulloch as a corroborative witness, and she appears to have made the whole thing up.
McElroy has issues.

In the weeks after Brown’s shooting--but before she contacted police--McElroy used her Facebook account to comment on the case. On August 15, she “liked’ a Facebook comment reporting that Johnson had admitted that he and Brown stole cigars before the confrontation with Wilson. On August 17, a Facebook commenter wrote that Johnson and others should be arrested for inciting r**ts and giving false statements to police in connection with their claims that Brown had his hands up when shot by Wilson. “The report and autopsy are in so YES they were false,” McElroy wrote of the “hands-up” claims. This appears to be an odd comment from someone who claims to have been present during the shooting. In response to the posting of a news report about a rally in support of Wilson, McElroy wrote on August 17, “Prayers, support God Bless Officer Wilson.”
After meeting with St. Louis police, McElroy continued monitoring the case and posting online. Commenting on a September 12 Riverfront Times story reporting that Ferguson city officials had yet to meet with Brown’s family, McElroy wrote, “But haven’t you heard the news, There great great great grandpa may or may not have been owned by one of our great great great grandpas 200 yrs ago. (Sarcasm).” On September 13, McElroy went on a pro-Wilson Facebook page and posted a graphic that included a photo of Brown lying dead in the street. A type overlay read, “Michael Brown already received justice. So please, stop asking for it.” The following week McElroy responded to a Facebook post about the criminal record of Wilson’s late mother. “As a teenager Mike Brown strong armed a store used drugs hit a police officer and received Justis,” she stated.

She was also diagnosed with bipolar disorder as a teenager and has had a difficult life. During a bankruptcy case in 2004, her attorney asked to withdraw because McElroy would call the office and berate staff with remarks that they felt were r****t.

And as you might imagine by now, she really loathes President Obama.

McElroy’s YouTube page is also filled with a variety of anti-Barack Obama videos, including a clip purporting to show Michelle Obama admitting that the president was born in Kenya. Over the past year, McElroy has subscribed to three channels dev**ed to mystery and real crime shows, as well as a “We Are Darren Wilson” video channel.
The FBI had thoroughly discredited her testimony, but Robert McCulloch put her in front of the Grand Jury anyway, along with her handwritten account of what happened. Sean Hannity has quoted her over and over again, particularly the description of Michael Brown charging like a football player.
And it was all a lie. This alone should negate the Grand Jury decision not to indict Wilson, but it won't.
Does this rise to the level of a civil rights violation? Did McElroy's lies so taint the Grand Jury that no justice could ever be done, or was she just a blip in the larger picture? It's pretty difficult to believe that one witness could overcome sixteen who tell a different story, but anything is possible
Sandra McElroy likely perjured herself before the ... (show quote)


I must ask you if this is the link to your story from The Smoking Gun. I have to do that because I happened to just run over there to see what kind of place that is. I felt it necessary to find out where you got your stuff and I found the whole article you took your little bit out of. Here it is for all to read to see what kind of place you get your info from.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/unmasking-Ferguson-witness-40-496236

I surely as hell do wonder where a blog like that one got all that information about the witnesses on that grand jury. When they are told their identities will not be released I think they are willing to tell the t***h more so than they would if they were sure that their identities would be released.

The Smoking Gun is nothing but an internet blog and if it came out with the wrong kind of stuff you wouldn't be frequenting it, I am sure.

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Dec 18, 2014 16:28:29   #
Glaucon
 
oldroy wrote:
I must ask you if this is the link to your story from The Smoking Gun. I have to do that because I happened to just run over there to see what kind of place that is.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/unmasking-Ferguson-witness-40-496236

I surely as hell do wonder where a blog like that one got all that information about the witnesses on that grand jury. When they are told their identities will not be released I think they are willing to tell the t***h more so than they would if they were sure that their identities would be released.

The Smoking Gun is nothing but an internet blog and if it came out with the wrong kind of stuff you wouldn't be frequenting it, I am sure.
I must ask you if this is the link to your story f... (show quote)


It has been my experience that "facts" are very seldom true or false for all times and in all occasions. The Smoking gun is, indeed, nothing but an internet blog and not automatically a source for checking the probability that something is true or false. If the viewer agreed with the blog, it would be a reliable source for fact checking and if it disagreed , it would be a liberal blog funded by George Soros or a conservative blog funded by the Koch brothers.

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Dec 18, 2014 16:39:09   #
oldroy Loc: Western Kansas (No longer in hiding)
 
Glaucon wrote:
It has been my experience that "facts" are very seldom true or false for all times and in all occasions. The Smoking gun is, indeed, nothing but an internet blog and not automatically a source for checking the probability that something is true or false. If the viewer agreed with the blog, it would be a reliable source for fact checking and if it disagreed , it would be a liberal blog funded by George Soros or a conservative blog funded by the Koch brothers.


That one is surely not funded by the Kochs so I guess it has to be the other kind you suggest.

Where did they get all that info about that woman? In what the prosecutor released nothing like identification was involved. I wonder if there is really a woman by that name and if she was really on the Grand Jury. I am serious about how they got all that info about her.

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Dec 18, 2014 16:50:10   #
Glaucon
 
oldroy wrote:
That one is surely not funded by the Kochs so I guess it has to be the other kind you suggest.

Where did they get all that info about that woman? In what the prosecutor released nothing like identification was involved. I wonder if there is really a woman by that name and if she was really on the Grand Jury. I am serious about how they got all that info about her.

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Dec 18, 2014 16:58:29   #
Dave Loc: Upstate New York
 
Glaucon wrote:
That is something that is not supported by any evidence what so ever, but you apparently are able to over look the total lack of supporting evidence. Your assertions are what we call factoids, something that is not true but something you wish were true.


what you claim is not supported by any evidence was overwhelmingly supported by forensic evidence - but then when you assume guilt or innocence as a function of skin color, no evidence is sufficient.

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Dec 18, 2014 17:05:01   #
oldroy Loc: Western Kansas (No longer in hiding)
 
Dave wrote:
what you claim is not supported by any evidence was overwhelmingly supported by forensic evidence - but then when you assume guilt or innocence as a function of skin color, no evidence is sufficient.


You keep wanting to talk about all that evidence arrived at by experts and all of them were white, and that takes away anything true about what they found. You have to go by that skin color stuff and liberal thinking processes. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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Dec 18, 2014 17:06:15   #
oldroy Loc: Western Kansas (No longer in hiding)
 
Go ahead and answer one or two of my questions. I see that you said nothing by the fact that no words of yours are included here as being quoted.

Damn, do you try hard sometimes. Why you try so hard that you don't even spell Ferguson properly.

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Dec 18, 2014 17:12:33   #
Constitutional libertarian Loc: St Croix National Scenic River Way
 
Glaucon wrote:
You have an overwhelming h**e and you are going to keep it. You are right and anyone who disagrees with you is not only wrong, but evil and not worth hearing or considering. You are definitely not a liberal or a conservative.


No I think your wrong, on 2 counts. 1st you attacked him rather than his actual rebuttal of your claim that johnsons recollection is some how superior to any others. Second their are many on both sides of the political aisle that have very deep seated h**ed for a great many things.

Just saying

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