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Jul 23, 2014 11:22:26   #
MarvinSussman
 
BigOlBear wrote:
That could happen and, if it does, I would be much happier to see the Red Cross or the Salvation Army or United Way or the like show up ... more so that a bunch of moldy FEMA trailers and unaccountable, overpaid bureaucrats.

There are too many Government agencies that exist today because "we do it that way because we've always done it that way." Once started, we never seem to be able to even measure their effectiveness let alone make them go away. It's time we started taking a little more personal responsibility and stop thinking like victims. Americans not only look out for one another but we've also shown incredible generosity when there are disasters around the world. Why would we need the central planners to do this for us?

And, while we're at it, let's hire an efficiency expert company to analyze the effectiveness of a few other agencies ... like the Department of Education, the Export-Import Bank, the Department of Energy, and on and on. And how do we continue to defend the existence of the so-called "War on Poverty" with it's record of utter failure? I'm sure you know the definition of "insanity" don't you?
That could happen and, if it does, I would be much... (show quote)


All federal government agencies (except the FBI) had an excellent reputation for civil service until small government nuts shrunk the departments until they were small enough to drown in a bathtub. Then they complain about inefficiency!

If you want to see the problem, look in a mirror!

Reply
Jul 23, 2014 11:36:40   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
BigOlBear wrote:
Fair question. Here's what I think. This country has been successful for a number of reasons, not the least of which are the facts that we have a huge and varied land full of natural resources and that we are populated by immigrants who came here to become Americans and to find their fortunes. Sadly, too many newcomers are coming here to colonize and to take what others have earned. That said, we must never lose sight of the fact that the States created the Federal government, not the other way around. Much of the power at the Federal level was once closer to the people and therefore under more control by the citizens.

As American citizens, we have mobility. If we don't like the policies in our state, or we can't earn a living where we live, it's very easy to go wherever we desire. Let's say you live in California and you can't earn enough money to cover the high cost of living and the taxation ... you can easily move to let's say North Dakota where the forces of supply and demand have created a far more comfortable living situation. (As an aside: I believe that, in time, California will either change it's ways or it will become a part of Mexico.) Over time, the States will pay attention to what works and what doesn't. The Federal government seems to constantly want to re-invent the wheel.

Look at the bankrupt cities: Detroit was once the darling of industry and was one of the largest metropolitan areas in the country. While it's shocking that the city leaders are still asleep at the wheel, it's only a matter f time before they will be d**gged, kicking and screaming, back to policies that will allow the citizens to flourish.
Fair question. Here's what I think. This country h... (show quote)


It is good to have mobility. But if you were to check on which group of people end up with the better over all life I think you would see that living in less mobile areas are some of the best places for a good life.

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Jul 23, 2014 11:42:22   #
BigOlBear
 
All federal government agencies (except the FBI) had an excellent reputation for civil service until small government nuts shrunk the departments until they were small enough to drown in a bathtub. Then they complain about inefficiency!

If you want to see the problem, look in a mirror!

Spoken like a true bureaucrat.

My apologies, I couldn't resist a snarky response to yours. This thread is intended for people who seek to identify issues and discuss solutions. I doubt that's what you're looking for. I suggest you look at some of the other threads and I'm sure you'll find the type of posts you seek.

Reply
 
 
Jul 23, 2014 11:44:26   #
BigOlBear
 
MarvinSussman wrote:
All federal government agencies (except the FBI) had an excellent reputation for civil service until small government nuts shrunk the departments until they were small enough to drown in a bathtub. Then they complain about inefficiency!

If you want to see the problem, look in a mirror!


All federal government agencies (except the FBI) had an excellent reputation for civil service until small government nuts shrunk the departments until they were small enough to drown in a bathtub. Then they complain about inefficiency!

If you want to see the problem, look in a mirror!

Spoken like a true bureaucrat.

My apologies, I couldn't resist a snarky response to yours. This thread is intended for people who seek to identify issues and discuss solutions. I doubt that's what you're looking for. I suggest you look at some of the other threads and I'm sure you'll find the type of posts you seek.

Reply
Jul 23, 2014 11:44:39   #
Kirk
 
MarvinSussman wrote:
Should the federal government (FEMA) help a town struck by a tornado?

If your answer is ''yes'', does it make sense to help a town struck by a tornado but not help an individual struck by cancer?

Then why not include health and welfare and education along with bridges.

Let's see how co-operative you are.


Marvin enough with this sly narrative that avoids the real questions. What works? We all want to be compassionate. I'm tired of you and the liberals immediate claim that we who believe in limited government are not compassionate. Give a man a fish and you feed him a meal. Teach a man to fish and he will eat his whole life. Government programs create bureaucracies that are expensive and inefficient. Limited government allows for the free flow of expression, innovation and commerce that creates jobs and opportunity.

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Jul 23, 2014 11:47:20   #
BigOlBear
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
It is good to have mobility. But if you were to check on which group of people end up with the better over all life I think you would see that living in less mobile areas are some of the best places for a good life.


I think your point is that stability is a good thing and I agree with you on that. Would you agree with me that many of our citizens believe they are stuck in toxic conditions and believe they can't escape, even though they actually can do better without leaving the country?

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Jul 23, 2014 11:48:18   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
Workinman wrote:
I apologize for not being tech savy but their is a great read ( little long) if you google Porter Stansbury "The corruption of America" written 12-15-2011 it will take you to his site. I think people will find it interesting.


I have to make sense of what Stansbury has to say but have given up & put him down as a big waste.

Reply
 
 
Jul 23, 2014 11:48:59   #
BigOlBear
 
Kirk wrote:
Marvin enough with this sly narrative that avoids the real questions. What works? We all want to be compassionate. I'm tired of you and the liberals immediate claim that we who believe in limited government are not compassionate. Give a man a fish and you feed him a meal. Teach a man to fish and he will eat his whole life. Government programs create bureaucracies that are expensive and inefficient. Limited government allows for the free flow of expression, innovation and commerce that creates jobs and opportunity.
Marvin enough with this sly narrative that avoids ... (show quote)


Excellent points! :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

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Jul 23, 2014 11:52:50   #
Workinman Loc: Bayou Pigeon
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
I have to make sense of what Stansbury has to say but have given up & put him down as a big waste.


Really, how so?

Reply
Jul 23, 2014 12:14:04   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
BigOlBear wrote:
I think your point is that stability is a good thing and I agree with you on that. Would you agree with me that many of our citizens believe they are stuck in toxic conditions and believe they can't escape, even though they actually can do better without leaving the country?


I think mass media has painted a picture that people wish they could be a part of.

The picture is of a life style that only a few can live but many dream of.

So yes this leaves them trapped in a life that seems almost toxic to them.

As I see it is just to much greed by a few that suck to much of the wealth of the system in to their own pockets.

For my self I choose to live a much plainer life style so I have money left over. I do mot pursue more money just to have more. I am still working, but fewer hours hoping to keep pace with the cost of living.

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Jul 23, 2014 12:20:19   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
Workinman wrote:
Really, how so?


It should have said I have tried to make sense of him more than once. I am not going back.

But I sure will read what your thoughts are about him.

Reply
 
 
Jul 23, 2014 12:27:22   #
BigOlBear
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
I think mass media has painted a picture that people wish they could be a part of.

The picture is of a life style that only a few can live but many dream of.

So yes this leaves them trapped in a life that seems almost toxic to them.

As I see it is just to much greed by a few that suck to much of the wealth of the system in to their own pockets.

For my self I choose to live a much plainer life style so I have money left over. I do mot pursue more money just to have more. I am still working, but fewer hours hoping to keep pace with the cost of living.
I think mass media has painted a picture that peop... (show quote)


And that is your choice. I see nothing wrong with living within your means and enjoying the simpler things in life and I admire you for it. I don't think, however, that wealth is a zero-sum game. Some of the people you might call greedy are the people who have created new wealth not to mention lots of opportunity for others. To me, greed is being envious of what others have and finding ways to take it from them.

By the way, when I say we have a mobile society, I'm not just talking about crossing state lines. If you check the Forbes 500 list you will see that it changes constantly. People get on the list, people drop off the list. Some of our citizens who were once wealthy are now living less opulently while we have many examples of Americans who have pulled themselves out of disagreeable circumstances and accomplished much, including personal wealth ... all done without harming anyone, while also providing opportunity for others.

Reply
Jul 23, 2014 14:28:30   #
MarvinSussman
 
Kirk wrote:
Marvin enough with this sly narrative that avoids the real questions. What works? We all want to be compassionate. I'm tired of you and the liberals immediate claim that we who believe in limited government are not compassionate. Give a man a fish and you feed him a meal. Teach a man to fish and he will eat his whole life. Government programs create bureaucracies that are expensive and inefficient. Limited government allows for the free flow of expression, innovation and commerce that creates jobs and opportunity.
Marvin enough with this sly narrative that avoids ... (show quote)


Give a person cancer and let him struggle with it. If he inherits enough money, he can live to procreate and pass on his wealth and his genes.

Otherwise, it's the law, not of Mother Nature's jungle, but of Reagan's jungle, where not the fit but the rich survive.

You are creating a hell on earth by violating the laws of Nature.

And what is Medicare if not good old capitalistic insurance?

Reply
Jul 23, 2014 14:35:37   #
MarvinSussman
 
BigOlBear wrote:
All federal government agencies (except the FBI) had an excellent reputation for civil service until small government nuts shrunk the departments until they were small enough to drown in a bathtub. Then they complain about inefficiency!

If you want to see the problem, look in a mirror!

Spoken like a true bureaucrat.

My apologies, I couldn't resist a snarky response to yours. This thread is intended for people who seek to identify issues and discuss solutions. I doubt that's what you're looking for. I suggest you look at some of the other threads and I'm sure you'll find the type of posts you seek.
All federal government agencies (except the FBI) h... (show quote)


You don't have the courage to face a simple question. You prefer to wish it away. Cowardice is the biggest problem we face. And you will never be a solution.

Reply
Jul 23, 2014 14:40:08   #
no propaganda please Loc: moon orbiting the third rock from the sun
 
BigOlBear wrote:
That could happen and, if it does, I would be much happier to see the Red Cross or the Salvation Army or United Way or the like show up ... more so that a bunch of moldy FEMA trailers and unaccountable, overpaid bureaucrats.

There are too many Government agencies that exist today because "we do it that way because we've always done it that way." Once started, we never seem to be able to even measure their effectiveness let alone make them go away. It's time we started taking a little more personal responsibility and stop thinking like victims. Americans not only look out for one another but we've also shown incredible generosity when there are disasters around the world. Why would we need the central planners to do this for us?

And, while we're at it, let's hire an efficiency expert company to analyze the effectiveness of a few other agencies ... like the Department of Education, the Export-Import Bank, the Department of Energy, and on and on. And how do we continue to defend the existence of the so-called "War on Poverty" with it's record of utter failure? I'm sure you know the definition of "insanity" don't you?
That could happen and, if it does, I would be much... (show quote)


:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

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