LogicallyRight Loc: Chicago

So, we are talking on another thread about dogs and breeding. But also training. And poor training or training in the wrong bad habits.

I was the victim of a pit bull attack. Reached through inadequate fencing and got a hold of my arm. I suddenly looked down and there she was, h*****g there. I had to yank my arm out of that b***hes mouth. I was the fourth bite victim in about a year and a half. Including a young teenage girl. No one followed through and so the dog struck again and again until I followed through. She had to be put down by Chicago law. She wasn't mean. Probably just defending the real young kids in the yard. But after the first bite, she should have been muzzled when outside.

But, that is the extreme. We have a leash law, but most dogs are not trained and always straining to the end of the leash and wh**ever they can get at. That means nipping people as they walk by. Twice now since the pit bull. Minor.

And they are always trying to jump up on you because they are trained to jump on people to get petted. That is how the owner treats them. "Isn't it cute. She wants to be petted." Hey, cute lady walking that dog. "I'd love to get my hands all over you and get petted. And my hands are clean." The dogs paws aren't. Sorry lady, I don't want to pet your dog and that is not training. Poor street manners at best.

And then there is the nose. If dogs can smell so damn good, why do they have to put their nose directly on your bare legs to smell you? No, I do not want your dogs nose on me. I've seen where they lick and then they lick their nose.

Licking. No way. Not your dog. Not my dog. I've seen where they lick. Their mouth is full of germs.

Kissing you on the face. No way. It is not a kiss. It is d********g. And that dog's germs and saliva are now all over your face. I've seen where they lick. Recently, before they closed the bars, I met this lady. She was all into me. (No, not bragging, It was what it was) Two days later she was back with her lap dog in her arms and was right back coming on to me with that d********g mutt constantly licking her face. If she was some fantastic looking model or such and did that I would not be interested. I've seen where they lick. No thanks.

That was a dog friendly bar. Ok. But keep the damn dogs on the floor. They are dogs. And no dogs that bark at you as you enter the bar. Bars are for humans. Keep that s**t at the dog park. New Years Eve, same bar. 1AM. A customer went home and then brought her dog back. Up on the bar where the bar tender could pet her dog. And her nose was about eight inches away from the dog's ass hole and wagging tail. Yeah, straight in view. I had it and went home.

And then they hold their dog on their lap at the bar. They have their drink and the dog has a glass of water. And I'm thinking, 'Am I drinking out of the glass that the dog drank out of last night.' Makes a bottle of beer more interesting then a draft beer.

And that goes for the home also. People just put plates on the floor for the dog to clean up after dinner. 'Am I eating off of the plate that the dog ate off of last night.' "Lets go out to dinner. And not at some patio or beer garden that is dog friendly." And no, I don't appreciate sitting on that dirty couch that the dog sleeps in all day with its dirty feet.

And no, cages are not dog friendly. They are cages, used for handling badly trained dogs. And when guests come over, they always let the neuritic dog out, who then won't let you alone as it is starved for attention.

Cats. Same indoor training and lack of. But how often have you seen cats walking over the kitchen counter where they are or have prepared food. Same with the table you will eat at. Or the couch where you will sit and the cat puked on yesterday. And think how often you have entered a cat house and the first thing you can think of as you enter is, "Oh, you have a cat." Those litter boxes stink. and after walking in a dirty litter box, they will walk over everywhere you will plan on sitting or eating off of. And I've seen where they lick.

I had cats. They were trained to stay off of furniture and my bed. Not perfect, but we tried. I trimmed their nails once a month and combed loose fur several times a week. Never again.

I like dogs. I don't love your dog. My last pair lasted about 17 years. Trained as good as anyone could expect. No collar or leash. Not necessary. They never ran into the street but just wandered along the side walk as we walked along. At corners, they automatically ran up to heal and I didn't even have to look. And they stayed there, whether half way across the street or half way down the block until I said the magic words, "OK" .They never jumped on people or licked them. And when we came back home they ran straight for the bath tub where I washed off their feet. You'd be surprised how much dirt gets between the pads of their feet. And this was on the near north side of Chicago, just off the lake front. Training. I would hope I would do just as well with a rural dog and appropriate training.

I'd rather see a well trained dog off of a leash then the average city dog on a leash, any day.

Always wanted to get that off my chest. Still can't understand why dogs need to put their cold nose on you if they can smell so well. And think how we can't even stand near each other during this Kung Flu and they can lick anyone, anywhere, any time.

Cheers and stay safe

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

I believe dog owners need to train their dogs for many reasons. Primarily for their safety.

With your history, have you considered that dogs do not like you? They may sense something about you...

I have been dealing with dogs, rescue work, for 40 years. Not once have I been nipped or bitten. Even when I am called to pick up a dog with a bad reputation....they may bark at me or growl, but a sharp no (not yelling or threatening) does the trick. No sticks or other objects that they could, through past experience, associate with pain. In fact none of our staff has ever had a problem.

LogicallyRight Loc: Chicago

I believe dog owners need to train their dogs for many reasons. Primarily for their safety.
>>>I agree in your first sentence. "I believe dog owners need to train their dogs for many reasons." But then we disagree. The prime reason is so that they fit into the society they will live in. Jumping on people is not acceptable. That is just for starters. The list goes on and did go on. I can't just jump on you. Why should your dog be able to jump on me? I could go on, but I did.


With your history, have you considered that dogs do not like you? They may sense something about you...
>>>What, the history of being bitten??? No. Not at all. Just poor training and the idea that a dog can do what it wants because it is on a leash. The two later ones were as I walked past the owners on a public sidewalk. I gave the dog a wide birth and the owner wasn't paying attention. Still within the reach of the leash. But, even if the dogs didn't like me, that is still no excuse. They nipped and it wasn't a bite drawing blood so I didn't report them to the police.
The Pit Bull was another story and as I said, I was the fourth known victim. In Chicago, dogs are given one free bite. I and many friends were walking along a side walk, legally, and without causing any a******l commotion. The Pit Bull and two others were doing what daogs do when people go by. They knew that the pit bull was getting over protective and even though they had a high steel fence, they installed five foot high plastic sheeting within the fence boundary. But they got cheap and missed about six feet in the middle. I didn't notice this gap and as I went by, Suddenly the pit bull leaped through the fence to her shoulders and grabbed my arm. I had to rip my arm out of the dogs mouth and went to the hospital over that bite. I don't fault the dog. The dog was just being protective of the kids in the yard. But it had become a serial biter and unfortunately had to be put down. Felt sorry for the dog, but one of the victims was a 13 year old girl. How is that my problem? If that dog got at that 13 year old girl like it did me, it could have done some real serious damage and even k**led her. Guess again.

I have been dealing with dogs, rescue work, for 40 years. Not once have I been nipped or bitten. Even when I am called to pick up a dog with a bad reputation....they may bark at me or growl, but a sharp no (not yelling or threatening) does the trick. No sticks or other objects that they could, through past experience, associate with pain. In fact none of our staff has ever had a problem.
>>>I'm glad that you have no problems with dogs. Tell me, when I'm supposed to issue "a sharp no". I pass someone with a dog almost every block as I walk everywhere around a very crowded city. And they all say,
'He's friendly. He just wants to say hello.' And meanwhile they are trying to restrain a hundred pound dog that wants to jump on me. And they do that to everyone that passes. So, no, you are wrong. But your cookie cutter response doesn't fit all situations.

And thanks for responding. And good luck with your rescue work. I'm sure you are trying and doing a good job.

Boo_Boo Loc: Jellystone

I do not respond to comments the way you elected to write. So, if you wish to use the quote reply button and use the available space to comment, there may be room for discussion.

archie bunker Loc: Texas

Sounds to me like, you have a bigger problem with people than animals. Everyone doesn't see it the same way.

Trust me, I know. I'm a mailman.
Everyone says their dog won't bite while it's coming at you with teeth bared, and fur sticking up. They're defending their territory.

We won't train our dogs to meet your demands since we live in the country, and they are part of our family, not our s***es. We do require certain behaviors out of them, but not to the degree that you seem to require.

It's pretty simple around here. We have dogs, and make them behave. If you don't like them, don't come over.
My mother in law was absolutely AGAINST us having a dog of the pit bull variety around the grandkids....until she came over, and met him, and saw how he interacts with the little kids.

You live in a huge city, I don't so it's different. I'll love on a dog as long as it isn't in protective mode, and doing its job.

I'm not a dog snob.....

LogicallyRight Loc: Chicago

I responded to you line for line. If you have a problem with a factual reply, that is your problem.

Have a good day and stay safe.

LogicallyRight Loc: Chicago

I don't have a problem with people. And I don't have a problem with dogs. I maintain that dogs do what they are trained to do. If you welcome your dog by welcoming him to jump up on you and lick your face, he is going to think that is what he should do to get affection back.

And then you say he is just defending his territory. I'm saying my territory is my personal self and I don't want dogs jumping on me and licking my face. They are ground animals by nature and I believe they should stay there.

I wrote about a pit bull attacking me. I believe it was defending its family, especialy the kids in the yard. I wasn't invading the yard. I was walking on by when it leaped at me through the fence and grabbed my left arm. I had to rip my arm out of its mouth and watched that one canine tooth d**g itself through my flesh like a plow going through a field. So, I think I have a right to worry about dogs biting me. The dog was a nice dog according to the cop from animal control. Friendly as hell. But I was the fourth victim and one was a little 13 year old girl. When do you say enough? The dog was doing what it was trained to do. Bite if it feels that those kids are in danger, even if they weren't. And the adults in the area did nothing. That dog was essentially trained to attack, even if that wasn't the real intent of the owners. They did it by neglect for the dogs past actions. The other two times I was attacked were minor nips, but I was just walking by on a public sidewalk and the owner wasn't paying attention. Those two dogs suddenly lunged at me and bit. So, excuse me, but I feel I have a right to walk down public sidewalks in Chicago without being attacked. And you mention personal space. I believe my body is my personal space and I have a right to object when others or their surrogates, their dogs, invade it.

We won't train our dogs to meet your demands since we live in the country, and they are part of our family, not our s***es. We do require certain behaviors out of them, but not to the degree that you seem to require.
>>> I did specify that my issues were with urban dogs and not rural. Different situation.

It's pretty simple around here. We have dogs, and make them behave. If you don't like them, don't come over.
>>>I made my dogs behave also. I agree with you. But if you invited me over, would I be subject to sitting in their dirty dog bed, eating out of their plate or drinking out of their bowl? Would I be subject to them climbing all over me and licking my face? No one ever had that worry at my house.

My mother in law was absolutely AGAINST us having a dog of the pit bull variety around the grandkids....until she came over, and met him, and saw how he interacts with the little kids.
>>>I have no problem with pit bulls. They have proven to be some of the most loyal dogs and very kid friendly. But in my instance, I was viciously ataacked for doing nothing wrong by one that was getting out of control.

>>>I have nothing against anyone one loving on their dog. That is their business. And a dog can be one of the best protective things you can have for family and property. You are rural. If you took your dog to another area for a days walk in the woods, would you want your dog to attack others for also walking around there. Or even jumping all over them. That is what it is like in the city. And they are everywhere.

I'm not a dog snob....
>>>I'm a dog lover and believe that they are different and should be kept as dogs, and well trained to be around others without assaulting them in any manner. Even just jumping on them.

If we were to meet, we probably would get along fine. If your dogs are well behaved as you say, what would be the problem. Your dogs get along well on your property probably running free within a fence or wh**ever. I wanted my dogs to be as free as possible within the city and not spend their lives pulling on a chain around their neck. So I taught them well and they lived free, within the limits I set for them. No fences but an understanding to never cross the street unless they were at my heal. Probably a better life then about any city dog could expect.

Peace and stay healthy