So maybe god and the bible are NOT so pro life after all
Sep 30, 2019 09:15:33 #
TommyRadd
Loc: Midwest USA
tbutkovich wrote:
The Trinity revealed in the New Testament
The New Testament has even clearer references to the Trinity. At Jesus’ baptism, the Spirit descended on Jesus in the form of a dove, and the Father’s voice spoke from Heaven—so all three of the members of the Trinity were clearly present (Matthew 3; Mark 1).
The New Testament has even clearer references to the Trinity. At Jesus’ baptism, the Spirit descended on Jesus in the form of a dove, and the Father’s voice spoke from Heaven—so all three of the members of the Trinity were clearly present (Matthew 3; Mark 1).
"6He answered them, "Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written, 'This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
7But in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.'
8"For you set aside the commandment of God, and hold tightly to the tradition of men—the washing of pitchers and cups, and you do many other such things."
9He said to them, "Full well do you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition. 10For Moses said, 'Honor your father and your mother;' and, 'He who speaks evil of father or mother, let him be put to death.' 11But you say, 'If a man tells his father or his mother, "Wh**ever profit you might have received from me is Corban, that is to say, given to God;"' 12then you no longer allow him to do anything for his father or his mother, 13making void the word of God by your tradition, which you have handed down. You do many things like this." Mark 7:6-13
"For you set aside the commandment of God..." (Mark 7:8)
"The Lord our God (grammatical number: singular) is one* (grammatical number: singular)" Mark 12:29
*One: Greek "heîs, hice; a primary numeral; one" -Strong's
"...and hold tightly to the tradition of men":
“The Trinity revealed in the New Testament...”
"God the Father..."
+
"God the son"
+
"God the Holy Spirit" - tbutkovich
= 3 gods
"Full well do you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition."
Making the word of God":
“You worship that which you don't know. We worship that which we know; for salvation is from the Jews.” John 4:22
"...void... by your tradition, which you have handed down. You do many things like this." Mark 7:13
"If you love me keep my commandments" John 14:15
"He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the t***h is not in him." 2 John 2:4
"5Now the purpose of the commandment is love from a pure heart, from a good conscience, and from sincere faith, 6from which some, having strayed, have turned aside to idle talk, desiring to be teachers of the law, understanding neither what they say nor the things which they affirm." 1 Timothy 1:5-6 (written at a time when only the OT was considered canonical scripture)
It is written:
“4Therefore concerning the eating of things sacrificed to idols, we know that no idol is anything in the world, and that there is no other God but one. 5For though there are that are called "gods," whether in the heavens or on earth; as there are many "gods" and many "lords;" 6yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we live through him. 7However, that knowledge isn't in all men.” 1 Corinthians 8:4-7
“Jesus…lifting up his eyes to heaven, he said, ‘Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may also glorify you; even as you gave him authority over all flesh, he will give eternal life to all whom you have given him. This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.’” (John 17:1–2)
5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus (1 Timothy 2:3–5)
Jesus said to her, ‘Don’t touch me, for I haven’t yet ascended to my Father; but go to my brothers, and tell them, “I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.” (John 20:17)
“He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of my God, and he will go out from there no more. I will write on him the name of my God, and the name of the city of God, the new Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from my God, and my own new name.” (Revelation 3:12)
‘the God and Father of our lord Jesus Christ’ (Rom. 15:6;
“Praise be to God and Father of our lord Jesus Christ” 2 Cor. 1:3;
“The God and Father of the Lord Jesus” 2 Cor. 11:31;
“We always thank God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ...” Col. 1:3;
“Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ” Eph. 1:3,
“I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father...” Eph. 1:17;
“Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ...”1 Pet. 1:3
“Let all the house of Israel therefore know for certain that God has made him both Lord and Christ, this Jesus whom you crucified...” Acts 2:36
“9Therefore God also highly exalted him, and gave to him the name which is above every name; 10that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, those on earth, and those under the earth, 11and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.” Philippians 2:9-11
“33The Jews answered him, “We don’t stone you for a good work, but for blasphemy: because you, being a man, make yourself God.” 34Jesus answered them, “Isn’t it written in your law, ‘I said, you are gods?’ 35If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture can’t be broken), 36do you say of him whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God?’ 37If I don’t do the works of my Father, don’t believe me. 38But if I do them, though you don’t believe me, believe the works; that you may know and believe that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.” 39They sought again to seize him, and he went out of their hand. (John 10:33–39)
10Therefore thus said the Lord YHWH: Because you are exalted in stature, and he has set his top among the thick boughs, and his heart is lifted up in his height; 11I will even deliver him into the hand of the mighty one [el*] of the nations; he shall surely deal with him; I have driven him out for his wickedness. (Ezekiel 31:10)
When he raises himself up, the mighty [elim*] are afraid. They retreat before his thrashing. (Job 41:25)
*:410 ‘el (ale) 1. applied to men of might and rank... mighty one of the nations Ezekiel 31:11 (of Nebuchadnezzar)... mighty men Job 41:17... mighty heroes Ezekiel 32:21... Ezekiel 17:13; 2 Kings 24:15... Exodus 15:15. Brown-Driver-Briggs, Hebrew and English Lexicon, Unabridged, Electronic Database; Biblesoft: 2006.
5For though there are that are called "gods," whether in the heavens or on earth; as there are many "gods" and many "lords;" 6yet to us there is one God, the Father...” 1 Corinthians 8:4-7
“1If there arise in the midst of you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and he give you a sign or a wonder, 2and the sign or the wonder come to pass, of which he spoke to you, saying, "Let us go after other gods" (which you have not known) "and let us serve them;" [b]3you shall not listen to the words of that prophet, or to that dreamer of dreams: [color=red]for Yahweh your God proves you, to know whether you love Yahweh your God[/color with all your heart and with all your soul[/b]. 4You shall walk after Yahweh your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and you shall serve him, and cling to him. 5That prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death, because he has spoken r*******n against Yahweh your God” Deuteronomy 13:1-5
“teach no other doctrine” (1 Timothy 1:3).
“Don't you add to his words, lest he reprove you, and you be found a liar.” Proverbs 30:6
“Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the LORD your God...” Deuteronomy 4:2
To be continued...
Sep 30, 2019 09:37:45 #
tbutkovich wrote:
The Trinity revealed in the New Testament br br T... (show quote)
A worthy effort but keep in mind you are addressing someone who believes he no longer sins as well. I think he’s the first I’ve come across to believe that.
He needs help and there’s only one source for the help he needs. God is patient.
Sep 30, 2019 16:15:42 #
The Immutability of God
By Charles Haddon Spurgeon Jan 7, 1855
. . . . the proper study of a Christian is the Godhead. The highest science, the loftiest speculation, the mightiest philosophy, which can ever engage the attention of a child of God, is the name, the nature, the person, the work, the doings, and the existence of the great God whom he calls his Father. There is something exceedingly improving to the mind in a contemplation of the Divinity. It is a subject so vast, that all our thoughts are lost in its immensity; so deep, that our p***e is drowned in its infinity. Other subjects we can compass and grapple with; in them we feel a kind of self-content, and go our way with the thought, "Behold I am wise." But when we come to this master-science, finding that our plumb-line cannot sound its depth, and that our eagle eye cannot see its height, we turn away with the thought, "I am but of yesterday, and know nothing." No subject of contemplation will tend more to humble the mind, than thoughts of God. We shall be obliged to feel—
"Great God, how infinite art thou,
What worthless worms are we!"
But while the subject humbles the mind it also expands it. He who often thinks of God, will have a larger mind than the man who simply plods around this narrow globe. He may be a naturalist, boasting of his ability to dissect a beetle, anatomize a fly, or arrange insects and animals in classes with well nigh unutterable names; he may be a geologist, able to discourse of the megatherium and the plesiosaurus, and all kinds of extinct animals; he may imagine that his science, wh**ever it is, ennobles and enlarges his mind. I dare say it does, but after all, the most excellent study for expanding the soul, is the science of Christ, and him crucified, and the knowledge of the Godhead in the glorious Trinity. Nothing will so enlarge the intellect, nothing so magnify the whole soul of man, as a devout, earnest, continued investigation of the great subject of the Deity. And, whilst humbling and expanding, this subject is eminently consolatory. Oh, there is, in contemplating Christ, a balm for every wound; in musing on the Father, there is a quietus for every grief; and in the influence of the Holy Ghost, there is a balsam for every sore. Would you lose your sorrows? Would you drown your cares? Then go, plunge yourself in the Godhead's deepest sea; be lost in his immensity; and you shall come forth as from a couch of rest, refreshed and invigorated. I know nothing which can so comfort the soul; so calm the swelling billows of grief and sorrow; so speak peace to the winds of trial, as a devout musing upon the subject of the Godhead. It is to that subject that I invite you this morning. We shall present you with one view of it,—that is the immutability of the glorious Jehovah. "I am," says my text, "Jehovah," (for so it should be t***slated) "I am Jehovah, I change not: therefore, ye sons of Jacob are not consumed."
"My name from the palms of his hands
Eternity will not erase;
Impress'd on his heart it remains,
In marks of indelible grace."
By Charles Haddon Spurgeon Jan 7, 1855
. . . . the proper study of a Christian is the Godhead. The highest science, the loftiest speculation, the mightiest philosophy, which can ever engage the attention of a child of God, is the name, the nature, the person, the work, the doings, and the existence of the great God whom he calls his Father. There is something exceedingly improving to the mind in a contemplation of the Divinity. It is a subject so vast, that all our thoughts are lost in its immensity; so deep, that our p***e is drowned in its infinity. Other subjects we can compass and grapple with; in them we feel a kind of self-content, and go our way with the thought, "Behold I am wise." But when we come to this master-science, finding that our plumb-line cannot sound its depth, and that our eagle eye cannot see its height, we turn away with the thought, "I am but of yesterday, and know nothing." No subject of contemplation will tend more to humble the mind, than thoughts of God. We shall be obliged to feel—
"Great God, how infinite art thou,
What worthless worms are we!"
But while the subject humbles the mind it also expands it. He who often thinks of God, will have a larger mind than the man who simply plods around this narrow globe. He may be a naturalist, boasting of his ability to dissect a beetle, anatomize a fly, or arrange insects and animals in classes with well nigh unutterable names; he may be a geologist, able to discourse of the megatherium and the plesiosaurus, and all kinds of extinct animals; he may imagine that his science, wh**ever it is, ennobles and enlarges his mind. I dare say it does, but after all, the most excellent study for expanding the soul, is the science of Christ, and him crucified, and the knowledge of the Godhead in the glorious Trinity. Nothing will so enlarge the intellect, nothing so magnify the whole soul of man, as a devout, earnest, continued investigation of the great subject of the Deity. And, whilst humbling and expanding, this subject is eminently consolatory. Oh, there is, in contemplating Christ, a balm for every wound; in musing on the Father, there is a quietus for every grief; and in the influence of the Holy Ghost, there is a balsam for every sore. Would you lose your sorrows? Would you drown your cares? Then go, plunge yourself in the Godhead's deepest sea; be lost in his immensity; and you shall come forth as from a couch of rest, refreshed and invigorated. I know nothing which can so comfort the soul; so calm the swelling billows of grief and sorrow; so speak peace to the winds of trial, as a devout musing upon the subject of the Godhead. It is to that subject that I invite you this morning. We shall present you with one view of it,—that is the immutability of the glorious Jehovah. "I am," says my text, "Jehovah," (for so it should be t***slated) "I am Jehovah, I change not: therefore, ye sons of Jacob are not consumed."
"My name from the palms of his hands
Eternity will not erase;
Impress'd on his heart it remains,
In marks of indelible grace."
Oct 1, 2019 05:10:52 #
Can’t get a hard core Unitarian with a long history of a Monolithic God to accept the real t***h in the scripture when he goes in and selects bits and pieces of scripture. Perhaps, he will one day arrive at the t***h that God is a Triune God. Tommy needs to continue reading reading scripture to find the true “Triune God” and the meaning and purpose of his “spiritual life.”
Oct 1, 2019 05:19:13 #
tbutkovich wrote:
Can’t get a hard core Unitarian with a long history of a Monolithic God to accept the real t***h in the scripture when he goes in and selects bits and pieces of scripture. Perhaps, he will one day arrive at the t***h that God is a Triune God. Tommy needs to continue reading reading scripture to find the true “Triune God” and the meaning and purpose of his “spiritual life.”
Yep.. That history of monotheism is hard to shake... Silly Jews for not realizing the multiism of their God....
Bits and pieces?
It almost seems like he has an answer for everything... I realize he doesn't...Who does
.. But sure seems like he is familiar with scripture...Funny how many people pose the argument "so and so just needs to keep reading and trying to see"..
But truly.. This thread has been great...
I am thankful to the many posters who have kept me busy flipping through my Bible...
May we all grow in love and understanding of our Lord...
Oct 7, 2019 14:45:54 #
TommyRadd
Loc: Midwest USA
tbutkovich wrote:
Hebrews 1:3 says that Jesus “is the radiance of Go... (show quote)
Note: I’m going to jump to this one, and then later circle back to the others in this list... as I have time and Lord willing.
The way Trinitarians interpret Hebrews 1:3 is proof that Trinitarians interpret the Bible through a pagan philosophical lens.
Romans 1:20 says “the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his [3rd Person Singular] eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse”
This scripture tells us that the t***h of God (for example, the fact of Him being one “He”) can be proven by the facts of creation. It is also written:
“16Every Scripture is God-breathed and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for instruction in righteousness, 17that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.” 2 Timothy 3:16-17
Therefore, all of the knowable “invisible things” of God can also be found in the Bible, and/or are made known through God’s names as given in the Bible. Since the Trinity is neither “named” or “described” in the Bible, but the true God of the Bible most certainly is, this fact alone is enough to prove the Trinity is not the God of the Bible.
Foremost of God’s self-descriptions of Himself to man is God’s name of Yahweh, (occurring 6,519 times), which definitely describes God, and does so in a completely non-material, non-complex, non-compound way, and, describes Him as utterly singular in grammatical number, thus personally “one”:
H3068: “Yᵉhôvâh, yeh-ho-vaw'; from H1961; (the) self-Existent or Eternal; Jeho-vah, Jewish national name of God:—Jehovah, the Lord. Compare H3050, H3069.” -Strong’s
The “self-existent” definition comes from the root of the word, H1961:
H1961: “hâyâh, haw-yaw; a primitive root (compare H1933); to exist, i.e. be or become, come to pass (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary)” -Strong’s
Furthermore, God’s primary name, Yahweh, is always singular in grammatical number, for example:
“He (singular) said, "I (singular) will make all my (singular) goodness pass before you, and will proclaim the name of Yahweh (meaning: self-existent; grammatical number: singular, therefore literally: “The self-existent One”) before you. I (singular) will be gracious to whom I (singular) will be gracious, and will show mercy on whom I (singular) will show mercy."” Exodus 33:19
So, in the legally binding Scriptures of a Covenant, inspired by God Himself, we see a God who names Himself, using a word, Yahweh, over 6,500 times, that numerically excludes the idea of Him being “multipersonal.” In giving His Covenantal name to His own people, either God lied, at least that many times over, or Trinitarians do.
Imagine getting married and going to the courthouse to fill out your marriage license. In the space where you put your name, you spell out your name properly as it appears on your birth certificate. Then, when it comes time to consummate your marriage, another individual comes along, with a completely different name, and claims to be your spouse, and you say, “sure, no problem, let’s head to the bedroom.” That is what Trinitarians have done to God who names Himself in Covenant with His people, and they go after a different God of a different name and submit to him as they should be submitting to the one they entered into covenant with.
Now, if God told Moses the t***h in Exodus 33:19, and if part of God's "goodness" included "Him" being three "them", then Moses should have relayed that t***h to God’s people. But in fact, Moses went on to establish what is known as Judaism, with its views and understanding of God being the most purest form of monotheism possible. So, if the Trinity is true, either God lied to Moses, or Moses lied when scribing the Scriptures; and either way the entire OT Scriptures are untrustworthy. Trinitarians simply don’t care what damage they do to God’s reputation or accuracy: for them their tradition trumps all the scriptures and all the words and commandments of God that He has given to explicitly describe Himself. They simply feel they have a better way of describing God than God Himself has clearly described and named Himself!
And that is how Trinitarianism destroys Biblical Jewish monotheism.
In reality, in Exodus 33:19, according to God Himself, the phrase “one God” did not in any way mean a mere “one substance”, or “one essence”, or “them”, who were speaking corporately. But that is what the Trinitarian falsehood proposes and demands: that God is “one in essence but yet three persons sharing that one essence”. Nowhere in the Bible does it speak of God in such terms.
Contrary to the man-made Trinitarian definition of their god as “one substance” or “essence”, this “one” God of the Bible is also emphatically personal, thus personally one, just like the Bible explicitly and consistently describes, most importantly in the first commandment of importance as interpreted by Jesus for us:
“One of the scribes…asked him, ‘Which commandment is the most important [or first] of all?’ Jesus answered, ‘The most important is, ‘Hear, Israel, the Lord our God, [grammatical number: singular] the Lord is one [Greek "heîs; grammatical number: singular]: you shall love the Lord [grammatical number: singular] your God [grammatical number: singular] with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ This is the first commandment... The scribe said to him, ‘Truly, teacher, you have said well that He [grammatical number: singular] is one, and there is none other...’ When Jesus saw that he answered wisely, he said to him, ‘You are not far from the Kingdom of God.” (Mark 12:28–34)
One: Greek "heîs, hice; a primary numeral; one" -Strong's
This commandment is very clear and specific in the Greek. Unlike the word “elohim” in the OT, theon is not a plural word like our sheep. It is a word having a specified grammatical number: singular. Furthermore, what is being described here is a singular “He”. Nothing anywhere in the Bible names, describes, or commands us to believe, that God is only one in essence or substance but not in person. Trinitarians simply lie against God when they say that we are supposed to believe God is “one substance in three persons”, that is absolutely not what the first commandment as interpreted for us by Jesus says or means in the Greek.
“Let God be true and every man a liar” Romans 3:4
Thus the true God of the Bible, by biblical name, by biblical definition, and by biblical commandment, is not “the god of” the Trinitarians. The Trinitarians have committed two evils in forsaking the God explicitly named and openly described in the Bible, and further exchanged Him for a different god altogether.
“11Has a nation changed [its] gods, which really are no gods? But my people have changed their glory for that which does not profit...
13"For my people have committed two evils: they have forsaken me, the spring of living waters, and cut them out cisterns, broken cisterns, that can hold no water.” Jeremiah 2:11-13
Continued in Part Two
Oct 7, 2019 14:46:46 #
TommyRadd
Loc: Midwest USA
Part Two
Let’s look at some of the “invisible things of God” that both can be known by creation, and are spelled out in the Bible:
“YHVH-Jireh: The Lord will provide (Genesis 22:13, 14).
Can we understand what it means to “provide” from creation? We most certainly can. As babies we all learned how our parents provided for us.
“YHVH-Rapha: The Lord that healeth (Exodus 15:26).
Can we understand what it means to “heal” from creation? We most certainly can. Anyone who has recovered from an illness or seen someone else recover understands healing.
“YHVH-Shalom: The Lord our Peace (Judges 6:24).
Can we understand what “peace” means from creation? We most certainly can.
“YHVH-Ra-ah: The Lord my Shepherd (Psalms 23:1).
Can we understand what it means to “shepherd” from creation? We most certainly can.
Are any of these “realities” material or corporeal? No.
So, the “the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His [3rd Person Singular] eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse” Romans 1:20
Let’s look at one of the descriptions from the New Covenant:
“God is love” 1 John 4:8 & 16
Love is a concept. But keep in mind that just because love is a “concept”, it doesn’t mean love doesn’t have “definition”, for example:
“Love is never tired of waiting; love is kind; love has no envy; love has no high opinion of itself, love has no p***e; Love’s ways are ever fair, it takes no thought for itself; it is not quickly made angry, it takes no account of evil; It takes no pleasure in wrongdoing, but has joy in what is true; Love has the power of undergoing all things, having faith in all things, hoping all things.” (1 Corinthians 13:4–7)
Thus love has definition, and therefore, by having definition, love has a true “reality” without being either material or corporeal. This is something else we learn from creation, whether it sinks in and we understand it or not, it can be understood by the things that are made, which includes us. We can understand not being tired of waiting, of being kind, of not envying, etc.
Furthermore, although the Bible defines “love”, that doesn’t mean the concept of love was “created” when it was defined in the Bible. Love as a true concept exists eternally. As a concept love always was and always will be. Thus, such concepts don’t even require a “creator” per se. Whether our Creator God created love or not, the concept that we call “love” would be true with or without anyone knowing it or defining it or not.
So, whether love is or isn’t understood or properly practiced doesn’t alter the true definition of love or its timeless t***h. In this way we can say that true “love” is both totally incorruptible and eternal. God is like that, and that is how we are to understand the “invisible things of God by the creation”. Because it is in concepts just such as love that God describes Himself with.
The big important difference between the concept of love and God Himself, which is negated and rejected by Trinitarians, is that God is a single “person,” Who is described solely in these terms of non-immateriality; that is, in terms of what God does, but never in terms of God as literally made of any kind of “substance.”
Now let’s look at the concept of “faith.” Most Christians readily understand that “faith” is not a distinct member in the Godhead, but that faith is, rather, an attitude that we have.
“Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see.” Hebrews 11:1, NIV.
The KJV has this verse interpreted like this:
“Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.” Hebrews 11:1, KJV.
The Berean Literal Bible interprets it like this:
“Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not being seen.” Hebrews 11:1, BLB
This word that is t***slated for us above as confidence, substance or assurance, comes from the Greek word “hupostasis.” This word is also found in the following passages, which t***slate the word as “confidence”:
“…If there come with me any of Macedonia and find you unprepared, we (to say nothing of you) should be disappointed in this confident boasting.” (2 Corinthians 9:4)
“That which I speak, I don’t speak according to the Lord, but as in foolishness, in this confidence of boasting.” (2 Corinthians 11:17)
“For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our confidence firm to the end.” (Hebrews 3:14)
How many people would believe, based on what we learn from the creation of the world, that “confidence”, or “assurance” have a material substance or yet again a corporeal body? The idea is ludicrous, right? Until we come to the dishonest Trinitarians. It won’t do for them to have a “reality”, like “love” or “faith” that is both immaterial and incorporeal. So, they take a word that signifies exactly that and redefine it so they can divide their “deific persons” into two or three.
And that is where Hebrews 1:3 comes in. Trinitarians take the word “hupostasis”, which means “a setting under”, which carries no material meaning whatsoever, and redefine it in order to be able to use it to defend their trinity hypothesis.
NT:5287: hupostasis (hoop-os'-tas-is); from a compound of NT:5259 and NT:2476; a setting under (support), i.e. (figuratively) concretely, essence, or abstractly, assurance (objectively or subjectively)” Strong’s
If we were to interpret Hebrews 1:3 in the sense that the NT uses the word, we would interpret it more like Young’s Literal Bible does, and we would consider His “subsistence” to be non-corporeal and immaterial, like love, faith, providing for, healing, peace or shepherding:
“who being the brightness of the glory, and the impress of His subsistence {hupostasis}, bearing up also the all things by the saying of his might -- through himself having made a cleansing of our sins, sat down at the right hand of the greatness in the highest” Hebrews 1:3.
Now, if we said Jesus was the express image of love, what would we be saying? If we said he was the express image of faith, or healing, or shepherding, what would we be saying? We would simply be saying that he was the epitome of embodying those concepts. And that is what Hebrews 1:3 is literally saying, that Christ embodies the fundamental, non-compound, immaterial subsistence of all that God is in a human being.
Now, there are exceptions to Jesus being the express image of God. And these are things the Trinitarians also simply redefine to suit their fancy. For one, God is invisible, where Christ was very visible:
“No one has seen God at any time. The one and only Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has declared him.” (John 1:18)
“That which was from the beginning, that which we have heard, that which we have seen with our eyes, that which we saw, and our hands touched, concerning the Word of life (and the life was revealed, and we have seen, and testify, and declare to you the life, the eternal life, which was with the Father, and was revealed to us); that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us. Yes, and our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son, Jesus Christ.” (1 John 1:1–3)
Now here John explicitly says that they “saw” and “handled” the word of life. If the word of life is equal to God, then they must have seen and handled God! That is the kind of absurdity that is created when Trinitarians or others try to add to and take away from the word of God in the Bible.
Continued in Part Three
Let’s look at some of the “invisible things of God” that both can be known by creation, and are spelled out in the Bible:
“YHVH-Jireh: The Lord will provide (Genesis 22:13, 14).
Can we understand what it means to “provide” from creation? We most certainly can. As babies we all learned how our parents provided for us.
“YHVH-Rapha: The Lord that healeth (Exodus 15:26).
Can we understand what it means to “heal” from creation? We most certainly can. Anyone who has recovered from an illness or seen someone else recover understands healing.
“YHVH-Shalom: The Lord our Peace (Judges 6:24).
Can we understand what “peace” means from creation? We most certainly can.
“YHVH-Ra-ah: The Lord my Shepherd (Psalms 23:1).
Can we understand what it means to “shepherd” from creation? We most certainly can.
Are any of these “realities” material or corporeal? No.
So, the “the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His [3rd Person Singular] eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse” Romans 1:20
Let’s look at one of the descriptions from the New Covenant:
“God is love” 1 John 4:8 & 16
Love is a concept. But keep in mind that just because love is a “concept”, it doesn’t mean love doesn’t have “definition”, for example:
“Love is never tired of waiting; love is kind; love has no envy; love has no high opinion of itself, love has no p***e; Love’s ways are ever fair, it takes no thought for itself; it is not quickly made angry, it takes no account of evil; It takes no pleasure in wrongdoing, but has joy in what is true; Love has the power of undergoing all things, having faith in all things, hoping all things.” (1 Corinthians 13:4–7)
Thus love has definition, and therefore, by having definition, love has a true “reality” without being either material or corporeal. This is something else we learn from creation, whether it sinks in and we understand it or not, it can be understood by the things that are made, which includes us. We can understand not being tired of waiting, of being kind, of not envying, etc.
Furthermore, although the Bible defines “love”, that doesn’t mean the concept of love was “created” when it was defined in the Bible. Love as a true concept exists eternally. As a concept love always was and always will be. Thus, such concepts don’t even require a “creator” per se. Whether our Creator God created love or not, the concept that we call “love” would be true with or without anyone knowing it or defining it or not.
So, whether love is or isn’t understood or properly practiced doesn’t alter the true definition of love or its timeless t***h. In this way we can say that true “love” is both totally incorruptible and eternal. God is like that, and that is how we are to understand the “invisible things of God by the creation”. Because it is in concepts just such as love that God describes Himself with.
The big important difference between the concept of love and God Himself, which is negated and rejected by Trinitarians, is that God is a single “person,” Who is described solely in these terms of non-immateriality; that is, in terms of what God does, but never in terms of God as literally made of any kind of “substance.”
Now let’s look at the concept of “faith.” Most Christians readily understand that “faith” is not a distinct member in the Godhead, but that faith is, rather, an attitude that we have.
“Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see.” Hebrews 11:1, NIV.
The KJV has this verse interpreted like this:
“Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.” Hebrews 11:1, KJV.
The Berean Literal Bible interprets it like this:
“Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not being seen.” Hebrews 11:1, BLB
This word that is t***slated for us above as confidence, substance or assurance, comes from the Greek word “hupostasis.” This word is also found in the following passages, which t***slate the word as “confidence”:
“…If there come with me any of Macedonia and find you unprepared, we (to say nothing of you) should be disappointed in this confident boasting.” (2 Corinthians 9:4)
“That which I speak, I don’t speak according to the Lord, but as in foolishness, in this confidence of boasting.” (2 Corinthians 11:17)
“For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our confidence firm to the end.” (Hebrews 3:14)
How many people would believe, based on what we learn from the creation of the world, that “confidence”, or “assurance” have a material substance or yet again a corporeal body? The idea is ludicrous, right? Until we come to the dishonest Trinitarians. It won’t do for them to have a “reality”, like “love” or “faith” that is both immaterial and incorporeal. So, they take a word that signifies exactly that and redefine it so they can divide their “deific persons” into two or three.
And that is where Hebrews 1:3 comes in. Trinitarians take the word “hupostasis”, which means “a setting under”, which carries no material meaning whatsoever, and redefine it in order to be able to use it to defend their trinity hypothesis.
NT:5287: hupostasis (hoop-os'-tas-is); from a compound of NT:5259 and NT:2476; a setting under (support), i.e. (figuratively) concretely, essence, or abstractly, assurance (objectively or subjectively)” Strong’s
If we were to interpret Hebrews 1:3 in the sense that the NT uses the word, we would interpret it more like Young’s Literal Bible does, and we would consider His “subsistence” to be non-corporeal and immaterial, like love, faith, providing for, healing, peace or shepherding:
“who being the brightness of the glory, and the impress of His subsistence {hupostasis}, bearing up also the all things by the saying of his might -- through himself having made a cleansing of our sins, sat down at the right hand of the greatness in the highest” Hebrews 1:3.
Now, if we said Jesus was the express image of love, what would we be saying? If we said he was the express image of faith, or healing, or shepherding, what would we be saying? We would simply be saying that he was the epitome of embodying those concepts. And that is what Hebrews 1:3 is literally saying, that Christ embodies the fundamental, non-compound, immaterial subsistence of all that God is in a human being.
Now, there are exceptions to Jesus being the express image of God. And these are things the Trinitarians also simply redefine to suit their fancy. For one, God is invisible, where Christ was very visible:
“No one has seen God at any time. The one and only Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has declared him.” (John 1:18)
“That which was from the beginning, that which we have heard, that which we have seen with our eyes, that which we saw, and our hands touched, concerning the Word of life (and the life was revealed, and we have seen, and testify, and declare to you the life, the eternal life, which was with the Father, and was revealed to us); that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us. Yes, and our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son, Jesus Christ.” (1 John 1:1–3)
Now here John explicitly says that they “saw” and “handled” the word of life. If the word of life is equal to God, then they must have seen and handled God! That is the kind of absurdity that is created when Trinitarians or others try to add to and take away from the word of God in the Bible.
Continued in Part Three
Oct 7, 2019 14:47:23 #
TommyRadd
Loc: Midwest USA
Part Three
So, since Trinitarians are not satisfied with speaking of God in limited terms of immateriality and incorporeality, such as what God describes of Himself, Trinitarians end up speaking of God in pagan terms of literal “substance”. And that is what allows Trinitarians to artificially divide “God” into “persons”. In fact, you cannot define or describe the Trinity without using terms that require the subject to be both material and corporeal; things which God is not, except in categories of pagan thought. This is something one of the “fathers” of the Trinity, Tertullian, admitted, while writing to Praxeas, a one God preacher:
“He (the word) became also the Son of God, and was begotten when he proceeded forth from Him. Do you then, (you ask,) grant that the Word is a certain substance, constructed by the Spirit and the communication of Wisdom? Certainly I do. But you will not allow Him to be really a substantive being, by having a substance of His own; in such a way that he may be regarded as an objective thing and a person, and so be able (as being constituted second to God the Father,) to make two, the Father and the Son, God and the Word. For you will say, what is a word, but a voice and sound of the mouth, and (as the grammarians teach) air when struck against, intelligible to the ear, but for the rest a sort of [b]void, empty, and incorporeal thing. [color=red]I, on the contrary, contend that nothing empty and void could have come forth from God, seeing that it is not put forth from that which is empty and void; nor could that possibly be devoid of substance which has proceeded from so great a substance[/b], and has produced such mighty substances: for all things which were made through Him, He Himself (personally) made. How could it be, that he Himself is nothing, without whom nothing was made? How could he who is empty have made things which are solid, and he who is void have made things which are full, and he who is incorporeal have made things which have body?” Tertullian, Against Praxeas, Chapter 7
In this passage, Tertullian argued against the idea that the word of God was merely “a voice and sound…empty, and incorporeal…” Thus, according to Tertullian, writing at the turn of the 3rd century, if the word of God, and ultimately God Himself, does not have actual substance, it could have no real existence. For Tertullian God was corporeal, not incorporeal like love or faith. Tertullian could not believe or accept God’s own explanation of Himself that He is what He does.
In contrast to Tertullian, the earlier non-Gnostic Christians adamantly claimed, as did the Jews before them, that God was not compound, was not material, and was not corporeal:
“But God being all Mind, and all Logos, both speaks exactly what He thinks, and thinks exactly what He speaks. For His thought is Logos, and Logos is Mind, and Mind comprehending all things is the Father Himself. He, therefore, who speaks of the mind of God, and ascribes to it a special origin of its own, declares him a compound Being, as if God were one thing, and the original Mind another. So, again, with respect to Logos, when one attributes to him the third place of production from the Father; on which supposition he is ignorant of His greatness; and thus Logos has been far separated from God. As for the prophet, he declares respecting him, ‘Who shall describe his generation?’ But ye pretend to set forth his generation from the Father, and ye t***sfer the production of the word of men which takes place by means of a tongue to the Word of God, and thus are righteously exposed by your own selves as knowing neither things human nor divine.” Irenaeus, Against Heresies, Book 2, Chapter 28, par. 5
According to Irenaeus, God “the Father Himself” is all mind and all logos; He cannot be separated or distinguished from His mind. He is mind. What Trinitarians do by dividing God into parts, and making Him a “compound” being, is exactly what the Gnostics did with God—they created a compound being by dividing Him into distinct persons according to His attributes, particularly mind and logos. Irenaeus rebukes the Gnostics for this in another place also, and thereby demonstrates that the idea first existed among the Gnostics and later found its way into Trinitarianism. According to Irenaeus:
“…The Father of all is not to be regarded as a kind of compound Being, who can be separated from His Nous (mind), as I have already shown; but Nous is the Father, and the Father Nous.” Irenaeus, Against Heresies, Book 2, Chapter 17, par. 7
This was the earlier view of the Christian assembly. God was not considered a compound being as the later Trinitarians would envision and describe him (excuse me, “them”). Except for philosophers like Justin, only the Gnostics viewed him in this way in Irenaeus’ time.
So Trinitarians owe it to Tertullian for believing that God’s nature could be described as an actual material type of substance. He compared and likened that substance to other great substances that God created. (By the way, this is where the “light from light” doctrine came from that made it into the extra-biblical creeds of the fourth century). Because he said this, we don’t have to assume Tertullian meant that God’s substance was any different than the substances of created beings. Tertullian explicitly said that God had to have substance in order to produce other like substances. The Bible refers to these as, “…man—and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.” Of course, Tertullian brought himself, and all Trinitarians who ascribe to his reasoning as well, under the condemnation of the Scripture. For it is written again,
“Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Therefore God also gave them up…” (Romans 1:22–24)
Tertullian stood at the forefront of the Trinity’s development, and led the way by first changing the glory of God into an image made like corruptible man. This is precisely what happens when men presume themselves to be wise in taking up pagan philosophical views of the Godhead. And this is why the Trinity is defined as:
“One and the same essence (homoousios) in three persons (hupostases).”
This purely Trinitarian saying has absolutely no comparable statement anywhere in the Bible; it is totally non-biblical. If we were to interpret this Trinitarian statement with the biblical usage of the word hupostasis, it would amount to something like, “one essence in three confidences.” That is like saying we have “one batch of lemonade in three assurances.” We would be trying to mix two totally unequal and incompatible realities in our theological, metaphorical punch bowl. It doesn’t work, intelligibly that is. This is what “professing themselves to be wise they became fools” looks like and reads like. In order to make it appear to work, the Trinitarians resort to two phony solutions, and they are both pagan ideas: (1) speaking and conceiving of God as a material substance, and (2) claiming the Godhead is a mystery that can’t be known.
Continued in Part Four
So, since Trinitarians are not satisfied with speaking of God in limited terms of immateriality and incorporeality, such as what God describes of Himself, Trinitarians end up speaking of God in pagan terms of literal “substance”. And that is what allows Trinitarians to artificially divide “God” into “persons”. In fact, you cannot define or describe the Trinity without using terms that require the subject to be both material and corporeal; things which God is not, except in categories of pagan thought. This is something one of the “fathers” of the Trinity, Tertullian, admitted, while writing to Praxeas, a one God preacher:
“He (the word) became also the Son of God, and was begotten when he proceeded forth from Him. Do you then, (you ask,) grant that the Word is a certain substance, constructed by the Spirit and the communication of Wisdom? Certainly I do. But you will not allow Him to be really a substantive being, by having a substance of His own; in such a way that he may be regarded as an objective thing and a person, and so be able (as being constituted second to God the Father,) to make two, the Father and the Son, God and the Word. For you will say, what is a word, but a voice and sound of the mouth, and (as the grammarians teach) air when struck against, intelligible to the ear, but for the rest a sort of [b]void, empty, and incorporeal thing. [color=red]I, on the contrary, contend that nothing empty and void could have come forth from God, seeing that it is not put forth from that which is empty and void; nor could that possibly be devoid of substance which has proceeded from so great a substance[/b], and has produced such mighty substances: for all things which were made through Him, He Himself (personally) made. How could it be, that he Himself is nothing, without whom nothing was made? How could he who is empty have made things which are solid, and he who is void have made things which are full, and he who is incorporeal have made things which have body?” Tertullian, Against Praxeas, Chapter 7
In this passage, Tertullian argued against the idea that the word of God was merely “a voice and sound…empty, and incorporeal…” Thus, according to Tertullian, writing at the turn of the 3rd century, if the word of God, and ultimately God Himself, does not have actual substance, it could have no real existence. For Tertullian God was corporeal, not incorporeal like love or faith. Tertullian could not believe or accept God’s own explanation of Himself that He is what He does.
In contrast to Tertullian, the earlier non-Gnostic Christians adamantly claimed, as did the Jews before them, that God was not compound, was not material, and was not corporeal:
“But God being all Mind, and all Logos, both speaks exactly what He thinks, and thinks exactly what He speaks. For His thought is Logos, and Logos is Mind, and Mind comprehending all things is the Father Himself. He, therefore, who speaks of the mind of God, and ascribes to it a special origin of its own, declares him a compound Being, as if God were one thing, and the original Mind another. So, again, with respect to Logos, when one attributes to him the third place of production from the Father; on which supposition he is ignorant of His greatness; and thus Logos has been far separated from God. As for the prophet, he declares respecting him, ‘Who shall describe his generation?’ But ye pretend to set forth his generation from the Father, and ye t***sfer the production of the word of men which takes place by means of a tongue to the Word of God, and thus are righteously exposed by your own selves as knowing neither things human nor divine.” Irenaeus, Against Heresies, Book 2, Chapter 28, par. 5
According to Irenaeus, God “the Father Himself” is all mind and all logos; He cannot be separated or distinguished from His mind. He is mind. What Trinitarians do by dividing God into parts, and making Him a “compound” being, is exactly what the Gnostics did with God—they created a compound being by dividing Him into distinct persons according to His attributes, particularly mind and logos. Irenaeus rebukes the Gnostics for this in another place also, and thereby demonstrates that the idea first existed among the Gnostics and later found its way into Trinitarianism. According to Irenaeus:
“…The Father of all is not to be regarded as a kind of compound Being, who can be separated from His Nous (mind), as I have already shown; but Nous is the Father, and the Father Nous.” Irenaeus, Against Heresies, Book 2, Chapter 17, par. 7
This was the earlier view of the Christian assembly. God was not considered a compound being as the later Trinitarians would envision and describe him (excuse me, “them”). Except for philosophers like Justin, only the Gnostics viewed him in this way in Irenaeus’ time.
So Trinitarians owe it to Tertullian for believing that God’s nature could be described as an actual material type of substance. He compared and likened that substance to other great substances that God created. (By the way, this is where the “light from light” doctrine came from that made it into the extra-biblical creeds of the fourth century). Because he said this, we don’t have to assume Tertullian meant that God’s substance was any different than the substances of created beings. Tertullian explicitly said that God had to have substance in order to produce other like substances. The Bible refers to these as, “…man—and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.” Of course, Tertullian brought himself, and all Trinitarians who ascribe to his reasoning as well, under the condemnation of the Scripture. For it is written again,
“Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Therefore God also gave them up…” (Romans 1:22–24)
Tertullian stood at the forefront of the Trinity’s development, and led the way by first changing the glory of God into an image made like corruptible man. This is precisely what happens when men presume themselves to be wise in taking up pagan philosophical views of the Godhead. And this is why the Trinity is defined as:
“One and the same essence (homoousios) in three persons (hupostases).”
This purely Trinitarian saying has absolutely no comparable statement anywhere in the Bible; it is totally non-biblical. If we were to interpret this Trinitarian statement with the biblical usage of the word hupostasis, it would amount to something like, “one essence in three confidences.” That is like saying we have “one batch of lemonade in three assurances.” We would be trying to mix two totally unequal and incompatible realities in our theological, metaphorical punch bowl. It doesn’t work, intelligibly that is. This is what “professing themselves to be wise they became fools” looks like and reads like. In order to make it appear to work, the Trinitarians resort to two phony solutions, and they are both pagan ideas: (1) speaking and conceiving of God as a material substance, and (2) claiming the Godhead is a mystery that can’t be known.
Continued in Part Four
Oct 7, 2019 14:48:24 #
TommyRadd
Loc: Midwest USA
Part Four
Against the Trinitarian view of a corporeal, material and compound God, consider the Jewish view of the non-compound nature of God:
“G-d is one and indivisible...IN SHORT… Jews do not believe in a trinity. The Jewish idea of Gd is that Gd is One and Indivisible. Gd cannot be divided up into separate parts, where each part is unequal to each of the other parts, yet somehow they are all one and the same. The Hebrew Scriptures describe Gd as an absolute One...” https://whatjewsbelieve.org/index.php/g-d-is-one-and-indivisible/
This writer also makes another very important point to prove his statement:
“Hear, O Israel: The Etrnl is our Gd, the Etrnl is one. [Deuteronomy 6:4]
“But how do we know that the term ‘one’ at the end of the above verse, does not refer to some sort of compound unity, that Gd is made up of different parts that total up to one? The reason is that the word ‘one’ is an adjective. Here it is describing a proper noun, which is the word ‘The Etrnl.’ (In Hebrew, this is a one-word designation.) Most people forget that the word that is here t***slated as ‘The Etrnl’ is actually a Name, the holiest name for Gd, told to us in Exodus 3:14-15. The English word, ‘Gd,’ is a job description; the four-letter Name of Gd, on the other hand, is Gd’s personal Name. When the word, ‘one’ modifies a personal name, it must mean that this entity is only One, not a compound One, but rather an absolute One.” Ibid.
Remember this from above:
“He [singular] said, "I [singular] will make all my [singular] goodness pass before you, and will proclaim the name of Yahweh [meaning: [b]self-existent[/b]; grammatical number: singular, therefore literally: “The self-existent One”] before you. I [singular] will be gracious to whom I [singular] will be gracious, and will show mercy on whom I [singular] will show mercy."” Exodus 33:19
God named Himself, using a word, Yahweh, that numerically excludes the idea of Him being “multipersonal.”
Trinitarians, on the other hand, rejected that strictly monotheistic view of God, that is explicitly described by His personal name, and went to the “substance metaphysics” theories of the pagans for words and concepts by which to “interpret” the Bible. This is why the words and concepts that Trinitarians use to describe their “complex, man-made idol”, are non-biblical and extra-biblical: they are concepts that simply didn’t originate in the Bible, and they don’t describe the God of the Bible.
“Rather than presenting at this point some formulations from the Fathers, I will first go back to the fountainhead of substance metaphysics, Aristotle, from whom the Fathers inherited the concepts in terms of which they set out their substantialist formulations.” William P. Alston, “Substance and the Trinity,” in The Trinity: An Interdisciplinary Symposium on the Trinity, 180.
“For Plato…says that the most high God exists in a fiery substance. But Aristotle…o*******ws the opinion of Plato, saying that God does not exist in a fiery substance: but inventing, as a fifth substance, some kind of aetherial and unchangeable body, says that God exists in it. Thus, at least, he wrote: ‘Not, as some of those who have erred regarding the Deity say, that God exists in a fiery substance.’” Justin’s Hortatory Address to the Greeks, Chapter 5.
I guess Trinitarians would probably go with Aristotle’s invention of a “fifth substance.”
Now read this little gem from a Trinitarian trying desperately to prove his Trinity is “biblical”:
“First, it is important to note that the doctrine of the Trinity does not go back to non-Christian sources (pagan), as has sometimes been supposed in the past…There has been no lack of attempts to find the initial form of the doctrine of the Trinity in Plato, or in Hinduism, or in Parsiism. All such attempts may be regarded today as having floundered…It is another question, of course, whether or not the church, in developing the doctrine of the Trinity, had recourse to certain thought forms already present in the philosophical and religious environment, in order that, with the help of these, it might give its own faith clear intellectual expression. This question must definitely be answered in the affirmative… As far as the New Testament is concerned, one does not find in it an actual doctrine of the Trinity. This does not mean very much, however, for generally speaking the New Testament is less intent upon setting forth certain doctrines than it is upon proclaiming the kingdom of God, a kingdom that dawns in and with the person of Jesus Christ. At the same time, however, there are in the New Testament the rudiments of a concept of God that was susceptible of further development and clarification, along doctrinal lines…” http://www.bible.ca/trinity/trinity-pagan.htm
First this unnamed writer claims, using a false dilemma, that the Trinity doesn’t go back to pagan sources, but then he readily admits that Trinitarians affirmatively had recourse to “thought forms” (i.e. “concepts”) that were already present in pagan thought. And that is the admission that the Trinity required pagan philosophy to define it. Imagine if the doctrines of salvation, faith, or the death, burial and resurrection weren’t spelled out in the Bible and he said, “that doesn’t matter much”? This is just a subtle way of saying, “don’t listen to what the Bible says, listen to this instead.”
He/she also claims that it isn’t surprising that the doctrine of the Trinity isn’t found in the Bible because that wasn’t the Bible’s purpose. However, that isn’t what the Bible says:
“1Jesus said these things, and lifting up his eyes to heaven, he said, "Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may also glorify you; 2even as you gave him authority over all flesh, he will give eternal life to all whom you have given him. 3This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.” John 17:1-3
Furthermore, it is a false dilemma for that writer to say that “the initial form of the doctrine of the Trinity” has not been found “in Plato, or in Hinduism, or in Parsiism.” That is because the trinity is a hybrid of pagan thought and scriptures, as admitted to by some of its earliest professors:
“…The mystery [of the Trinity]…is separate as to personality yet is not divided as to subject matter. For, in personality, the Spirit is one thing and the Word another, and yet again that from which the Word and Spirit is [i.e., the Father is], another [person]. But when you have gained the conception of what the [personal] distinction is in these, the oneness, again, of the nature admits not division, so that the supremacy of the one [pagan philosophic] First Cause is not split and cut up into differing Godships, neither does the statement harmonize with the Jewish dogma, but the t***h passes in the mean between these two [pagan and Jewish] conceptions, destroying each heresy, and yet accepting what is useful to it from each. The Jewish dogma is destroyed by the acceptance of the Word, and by the belief in the Spirit; while the polytheistic error of the Greek school is made to vanish by the unity of the Nature… While yet...let...stand...of the [pagan/Greek] Hellenistic, only the distinction as to persons… For it is as if the number of the [Trinity] were a remedy in the case of those who are in error as to the One, and the assertion of the unity for those whose beliefs are dispersed among a number of divinities.” (Gregory of Nyssa, The Great Catechism, 1, 3)
Thus not only have trinitarians broken the first commandment by redefining God, they have also broken the action of keeping it by going to the gods of the pagans for the words and “substance” concepts by which to view, understand, and express their idol.
Thus the true God of the Bible, by biblical name, by biblical definition, by biblical commandment, and even by biblical nature of being non-material, non-compound and non-corporeal is not “the god of” the Trinitarians. The Trinitarians have committed two evils in forsaking the God explicitly named and openly described in the Bible, and further exchanged Him for a different god altogether.
“11Has a nation changed [its] gods, which really are no gods? But my people have changed their glory for that which does not profit...
13"For my people have committed two evils: they have forsaken me, the spring of living waters, and cut them out cisterns, broken cisterns, that can hold no water.” Jeremiah 2:11-13
To be continued (Lord willing and as I have time)...
Against the Trinitarian view of a corporeal, material and compound God, consider the Jewish view of the non-compound nature of God:
“G-d is one and indivisible...IN SHORT… Jews do not believe in a trinity. The Jewish idea of Gd is that Gd is One and Indivisible. Gd cannot be divided up into separate parts, where each part is unequal to each of the other parts, yet somehow they are all one and the same. The Hebrew Scriptures describe Gd as an absolute One...” https://whatjewsbelieve.org/index.php/g-d-is-one-and-indivisible/
This writer also makes another very important point to prove his statement:
“Hear, O Israel: The Etrnl is our Gd, the Etrnl is one. [Deuteronomy 6:4]
“But how do we know that the term ‘one’ at the end of the above verse, does not refer to some sort of compound unity, that Gd is made up of different parts that total up to one? The reason is that the word ‘one’ is an adjective. Here it is describing a proper noun, which is the word ‘The Etrnl.’ (In Hebrew, this is a one-word designation.) Most people forget that the word that is here t***slated as ‘The Etrnl’ is actually a Name, the holiest name for Gd, told to us in Exodus 3:14-15. The English word, ‘Gd,’ is a job description; the four-letter Name of Gd, on the other hand, is Gd’s personal Name. When the word, ‘one’ modifies a personal name, it must mean that this entity is only One, not a compound One, but rather an absolute One.” Ibid.
Remember this from above:
“He [singular] said, "I [singular] will make all my [singular] goodness pass before you, and will proclaim the name of Yahweh [meaning: [b]self-existent[/b]; grammatical number: singular, therefore literally: “The self-existent One”] before you. I [singular] will be gracious to whom I [singular] will be gracious, and will show mercy on whom I [singular] will show mercy."” Exodus 33:19
God named Himself, using a word, Yahweh, that numerically excludes the idea of Him being “multipersonal.”
Trinitarians, on the other hand, rejected that strictly monotheistic view of God, that is explicitly described by His personal name, and went to the “substance metaphysics” theories of the pagans for words and concepts by which to “interpret” the Bible. This is why the words and concepts that Trinitarians use to describe their “complex, man-made idol”, are non-biblical and extra-biblical: they are concepts that simply didn’t originate in the Bible, and they don’t describe the God of the Bible.
“Rather than presenting at this point some formulations from the Fathers, I will first go back to the fountainhead of substance metaphysics, Aristotle, from whom the Fathers inherited the concepts in terms of which they set out their substantialist formulations.” William P. Alston, “Substance and the Trinity,” in The Trinity: An Interdisciplinary Symposium on the Trinity, 180.
“For Plato…says that the most high God exists in a fiery substance. But Aristotle…o*******ws the opinion of Plato, saying that God does not exist in a fiery substance: but inventing, as a fifth substance, some kind of aetherial and unchangeable body, says that God exists in it. Thus, at least, he wrote: ‘Not, as some of those who have erred regarding the Deity say, that God exists in a fiery substance.’” Justin’s Hortatory Address to the Greeks, Chapter 5.
I guess Trinitarians would probably go with Aristotle’s invention of a “fifth substance.”
Now read this little gem from a Trinitarian trying desperately to prove his Trinity is “biblical”:
“First, it is important to note that the doctrine of the Trinity does not go back to non-Christian sources (pagan), as has sometimes been supposed in the past…There has been no lack of attempts to find the initial form of the doctrine of the Trinity in Plato, or in Hinduism, or in Parsiism. All such attempts may be regarded today as having floundered…It is another question, of course, whether or not the church, in developing the doctrine of the Trinity, had recourse to certain thought forms already present in the philosophical and religious environment, in order that, with the help of these, it might give its own faith clear intellectual expression. This question must definitely be answered in the affirmative… As far as the New Testament is concerned, one does not find in it an actual doctrine of the Trinity. This does not mean very much, however, for generally speaking the New Testament is less intent upon setting forth certain doctrines than it is upon proclaiming the kingdom of God, a kingdom that dawns in and with the person of Jesus Christ. At the same time, however, there are in the New Testament the rudiments of a concept of God that was susceptible of further development and clarification, along doctrinal lines…” http://www.bible.ca/trinity/trinity-pagan.htm
First this unnamed writer claims, using a false dilemma, that the Trinity doesn’t go back to pagan sources, but then he readily admits that Trinitarians affirmatively had recourse to “thought forms” (i.e. “concepts”) that were already present in pagan thought. And that is the admission that the Trinity required pagan philosophy to define it. Imagine if the doctrines of salvation, faith, or the death, burial and resurrection weren’t spelled out in the Bible and he said, “that doesn’t matter much”? This is just a subtle way of saying, “don’t listen to what the Bible says, listen to this instead.”
He/she also claims that it isn’t surprising that the doctrine of the Trinity isn’t found in the Bible because that wasn’t the Bible’s purpose. However, that isn’t what the Bible says:
“1Jesus said these things, and lifting up his eyes to heaven, he said, "Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may also glorify you; 2even as you gave him authority over all flesh, he will give eternal life to all whom you have given him. 3This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.” John 17:1-3
Furthermore, it is a false dilemma for that writer to say that “the initial form of the doctrine of the Trinity” has not been found “in Plato, or in Hinduism, or in Parsiism.” That is because the trinity is a hybrid of pagan thought and scriptures, as admitted to by some of its earliest professors:
“…The mystery [of the Trinity]…is separate as to personality yet is not divided as to subject matter. For, in personality, the Spirit is one thing and the Word another, and yet again that from which the Word and Spirit is [i.e., the Father is], another [person]. But when you have gained the conception of what the [personal] distinction is in these, the oneness, again, of the nature admits not division, so that the supremacy of the one [pagan philosophic] First Cause is not split and cut up into differing Godships, neither does the statement harmonize with the Jewish dogma, but the t***h passes in the mean between these two [pagan and Jewish] conceptions, destroying each heresy, and yet accepting what is useful to it from each. The Jewish dogma is destroyed by the acceptance of the Word, and by the belief in the Spirit; while the polytheistic error of the Greek school is made to vanish by the unity of the Nature… While yet...let...stand...of the [pagan/Greek] Hellenistic, only the distinction as to persons… For it is as if the number of the [Trinity] were a remedy in the case of those who are in error as to the One, and the assertion of the unity for those whose beliefs are dispersed among a number of divinities.” (Gregory of Nyssa, The Great Catechism, 1, 3)
Thus not only have trinitarians broken the first commandment by redefining God, they have also broken the action of keeping it by going to the gods of the pagans for the words and “substance” concepts by which to view, understand, and express their idol.
Thus the true God of the Bible, by biblical name, by biblical definition, by biblical commandment, and even by biblical nature of being non-material, non-compound and non-corporeal is not “the god of” the Trinitarians. The Trinitarians have committed two evils in forsaking the God explicitly named and openly described in the Bible, and further exchanged Him for a different god altogether.
“11Has a nation changed [its] gods, which really are no gods? But my people have changed their glory for that which does not profit...
13"For my people have committed two evils: they have forsaken me, the spring of living waters, and cut them out cisterns, broken cisterns, that can hold no water.” Jeremiah 2:11-13
To be continued (Lord willing and as I have time)...
Oct 7, 2019 15:56:27 #
tbutkovich wrote:
Yes, Amen. The multi-dimensional nature of God - in the spirit, in the heart, and in the flesh - is the foundation of Christianity. To deny the tri-unity of the Godhead is to commit the unforgivable sin - blaspheming the Holy Spirit. To deny the reality of the Cross and Resurrection is to deny the divinity of Jesus Christ. And, to deny the divinity of Jesus is not Christian. In fact, in all of the commentaries I have encountered by Christian theologians, Bible scholars, Christian Apologists, Christian philosophers and pastors, the denial of the Triune nature of God is heresy.Can’t get a hard core Unitarian with a long history of a Monolithic God to accept the real t***h in the scripture when he goes in and selects bits and pieces of scripture. Perhaps, he will one day arrive at the t***h that God is a Triune God. Tommy needs to continue reading reading scripture to find the true “Triune God” and the meaning and purpose of his “spiritual life.”
And, of course, we have the Word of God Himself to confirm His multi-dimensional nature.
That said, the most profound arguments for the Triune nature of God are the testimonials of Muslims who have turned to Christ. Their reasons for abandoning Allah and turning to Jesus are profound indeed.
Oct 8, 2019 04:59:17 #
EXPLAINING THE HOLY SPIRIT
Who is the Holy Spirit or what is the Holy Spirit? Is it a force, an energy, a power, or is He a person? We can find out by reading the Bible.
Third Member of the Trinity
God the Holy Spirit is a Person. He is not a power, an effect, or just energy. God the Holy Spirit does have energy (limitless), can affect things, and does have power (God’s power), but He is much more than these attributes. Almost every single time that the New Testament mentions “the Spirit” this is in direct reference to God the Holy Spirit. There are three members of the God Family. This family includes God the Father, Jesus Christ the Son of God, and God the Holy Spirit. Each member of the Trinity has a part in a person’s coming to saving faith in Jesus Christ. God the Father draws them (John 6:44), Jesus saves them (John 3:16), and the Holy Spirit tells us Who that Savior is – Jesus of course.
Who Is The Holy Spirit
Each member of the Trinity has a part in a person’s coming to saving faith in Jesus Christ.
God the Holy Spirit’s Work in Us
Bear Fruit with Him (Gal 5:22-23)
Seals us and keeps us (Eph 1:13-14)
Live In Him (Gal 5:25)
Evangelize with Him (John 16:13-14, Acts 4:31)
Renewed by Him (Titus 3:5)
Shapes us, molds us, and makes us conform to Christ’s image (Rom 8:1-17)
Be convicted Him of sin (John 16:8)
Sanctifies us (1 Peter 1:2)
Reveals Who Jesus is (John 16:8-14)
Helps us pray to Father (Rom 8:26)
Speaks to us (Acts 8:29, 11:12, 13:12)
Creates us as a new creature (2 Cor 5:17, Eph 2:10)
Helps us understand the Word of God (Heb 4:2)
Reminds us of what to say (John 14:25-26)
Testifies about Who Jesus is (John 15:26)
Leads us (Rom 8:14)
Imparts eternal life (Rom 8:10, 14)
Comforts us (2 Cor 1:4)
He will help us to overcome sin (Acts 1:5-8)
Prevents us from going somewhere or doing something (Acts 16:5-7)
We can lie to Him (Acts 5:3-4)
We can quench Him (1 Thess 5:19)
We can grieve Him (Eph 4:30)
God the Holy Spirit’s Work in the Church
The Holy Spirit not only empowers the believer with gifts but works actively in the church and even appoints church leadership (Acts 20:28). Here are a few examples:
Acts 8:29 “Then the Spirit said to Philip, Go near and overtake this char**t.“
Acts 11:12 “Then the Spirit told me to go with them, doubting nothing. Moreover these six brethren accompanied me, and we entered the man’s house.“
Acts 13:12 “As they ministered to the Lord and fasted, the Holy Spirit said, Now separate to Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.”
Acts 5:3-4 “But Peter said, Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the price of the land for yourself? 4 While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control? Why have you conceived this thing in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God.”
1 Cor 2:9-12 “However, as it is written: What no eye has seen, what no ear has heard,
and what no human mind has conceived” the things God has prepared for those who love him— these are the things God has revealed to us by his Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. For who knows a person’s thoughts except their own spirit within them? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. What we have received is not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may understand what God has freely given us.”
1 Pet 1:12 “It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves but you, when they spoke of the things that have now been told you by those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. Even angels long to look into these things.”
Rom 8:26 “In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans.”
John 15:26 “When the Advocate comes, whom I will send to you from the Father—the Spirit of t***h who goes out from the Father—he will testify about me.”
John 16:13 “But when he, the Spirit of t***h, comes, he will guide you into all the t***h. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.”
Acts 16:6-7 “Paul and his companions traveled throughout the region of Phrygia and Galatia, having been kept by the Holy Spirit from preaching the word in the province of Asia. When they came to the border of Mysia, they tried to enter Bithynia, but the Spirit of Jesus would not allow them to.”
Acts 20:28 “Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers. Be shepherds of the church of God which he bought with his own blood.”
Roman 8:14 “For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God.”
John 16:8 “When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong about sin and righteousness and judgment.”
Ephesians 1:13-14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of t***h, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.”
Isaiah 34:16 “Look in the scroll of the LORD and read: one of these will be missing, not one will lack her mate. For it is his mouth that has given the order, And his Spirit will gather them together.”
2 Peter 1:20-21 “First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.”
Praying in the Holy Spirit
The Holy Spirit is the least understood of the Trinity of God. He is the most neglected even though He is involved perhaps the most in a believer’s life. The Holy Spirit is the One Who reveals Who the Savior is and opens up our minds to understand the Word of God because flesh and blood does not bring meaning to the Scriptures. We can not understand what we are reading unless the Holy Spirit teaches us and imparts meaning to us. Almost every time you read reference to the “Spirit”, particularly in the New Testament, it is speaking of God the Holy Spirit. The “Spirit” is the Spirit – God the Holy Spirit. The Spirit is not a force to be drawn upon like a power but drawing on the power of God. He is the very power of God. You can not know Jesus without Him. You can not possibly overcome sin without His power. You can not have eternal life without His revealing the Source of this eternal life (John 3).
When you sit down to read the Bible, pray for the Holy Spirit to give you understanding. Pray that He will reveal what is being read in the Bible for part of the role of the Holy Spirit is to teach us all things, as Christ told the disciples before He departed. The Holy Spirit is also a Helper, a Comforter and He teaches us about the things of God (John 14:26, Luke 12:12). God the Holy Spirit also guides us in revealing the meaning of God’s written Word (John 16:13) and reminds us of things we need to remember (John 14:26). If you want to know a sort of job description of the Holy Spirit, John, chapters 14, 15 and 16 will help immensely. Romans chapter 8 is also a chapter that describes the role and work of God the Holy Spirit. It mentions “the Spirit” frequently in this chapter and this Spirit is none other than God the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit is God
God the Holy Spirit brings godly repentance and brings about an awareness of when we are not doing the right thing. He will begin to deal with the sins in our life and help us overcome them. We are not the ones necessarily that conquer sin; God the Holy Spirit is the power that dwells in us to help us do this. We can not possibly overcome sin by human effort. This doesn’t mean that the Holy Spirit stops all the urges nor will He stop our returning to sin, but the Holy Spirit prompts and urges the believer to not engage in such behavior as well as other ungodly acts. God the Holy Spirit enables us to do good works – not to be saved – but because we are saved. The Holy Spirit also points to and always seeks to glorify Jesus Christ. So too should we. In this way, we can join in purpose with God the Holy Spirit to glorify Jesus Christ. The next time you think of the Holy Spirit, think of Him as God Himself. For the Holy Spirit is God, was God, and will forever be God. Jesus is also called Immanuel (God with us); God the Holy Spirit is God in us; if we are Christians. That is Who the Holy Spirit is.
Who is the Holy Spirit or what is the Holy Spirit? Is it a force, an energy, a power, or is He a person? We can find out by reading the Bible.
Third Member of the Trinity
God the Holy Spirit is a Person. He is not a power, an effect, or just energy. God the Holy Spirit does have energy (limitless), can affect things, and does have power (God’s power), but He is much more than these attributes. Almost every single time that the New Testament mentions “the Spirit” this is in direct reference to God the Holy Spirit. There are three members of the God Family. This family includes God the Father, Jesus Christ the Son of God, and God the Holy Spirit. Each member of the Trinity has a part in a person’s coming to saving faith in Jesus Christ. God the Father draws them (John 6:44), Jesus saves them (John 3:16), and the Holy Spirit tells us Who that Savior is – Jesus of course.
Who Is The Holy Spirit
Each member of the Trinity has a part in a person’s coming to saving faith in Jesus Christ.
God the Holy Spirit’s Work in Us
Bear Fruit with Him (Gal 5:22-23)
Seals us and keeps us (Eph 1:13-14)
Live In Him (Gal 5:25)
Evangelize with Him (John 16:13-14, Acts 4:31)
Renewed by Him (Titus 3:5)
Shapes us, molds us, and makes us conform to Christ’s image (Rom 8:1-17)
Be convicted Him of sin (John 16:8)
Sanctifies us (1 Peter 1:2)
Reveals Who Jesus is (John 16:8-14)
Helps us pray to Father (Rom 8:26)
Speaks to us (Acts 8:29, 11:12, 13:12)
Creates us as a new creature (2 Cor 5:17, Eph 2:10)
Helps us understand the Word of God (Heb 4:2)
Reminds us of what to say (John 14:25-26)
Testifies about Who Jesus is (John 15:26)
Leads us (Rom 8:14)
Imparts eternal life (Rom 8:10, 14)
Comforts us (2 Cor 1:4)
He will help us to overcome sin (Acts 1:5-8)
Prevents us from going somewhere or doing something (Acts 16:5-7)
We can lie to Him (Acts 5:3-4)
We can quench Him (1 Thess 5:19)
We can grieve Him (Eph 4:30)
God the Holy Spirit’s Work in the Church
The Holy Spirit not only empowers the believer with gifts but works actively in the church and even appoints church leadership (Acts 20:28). Here are a few examples:
Acts 8:29 “Then the Spirit said to Philip, Go near and overtake this char**t.“
Acts 11:12 “Then the Spirit told me to go with them, doubting nothing. Moreover these six brethren accompanied me, and we entered the man’s house.“
Acts 13:12 “As they ministered to the Lord and fasted, the Holy Spirit said, Now separate to Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.”
Acts 5:3-4 “But Peter said, Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the price of the land for yourself? 4 While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control? Why have you conceived this thing in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God.”
1 Cor 2:9-12 “However, as it is written: What no eye has seen, what no ear has heard,
and what no human mind has conceived” the things God has prepared for those who love him— these are the things God has revealed to us by his Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. For who knows a person’s thoughts except their own spirit within them? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. What we have received is not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may understand what God has freely given us.”
1 Pet 1:12 “It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves but you, when they spoke of the things that have now been told you by those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. Even angels long to look into these things.”
Rom 8:26 “In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans.”
John 15:26 “When the Advocate comes, whom I will send to you from the Father—the Spirit of t***h who goes out from the Father—he will testify about me.”
John 16:13 “But when he, the Spirit of t***h, comes, he will guide you into all the t***h. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.”
Acts 16:6-7 “Paul and his companions traveled throughout the region of Phrygia and Galatia, having been kept by the Holy Spirit from preaching the word in the province of Asia. When they came to the border of Mysia, they tried to enter Bithynia, but the Spirit of Jesus would not allow them to.”
Acts 20:28 “Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers. Be shepherds of the church of God which he bought with his own blood.”
Roman 8:14 “For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God.”
John 16:8 “When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong about sin and righteousness and judgment.”
Ephesians 1:13-14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of t***h, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.”
Isaiah 34:16 “Look in the scroll of the LORD and read: one of these will be missing, not one will lack her mate. For it is his mouth that has given the order, And his Spirit will gather them together.”
2 Peter 1:20-21 “First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.”
Praying in the Holy Spirit
The Holy Spirit is the least understood of the Trinity of God. He is the most neglected even though He is involved perhaps the most in a believer’s life. The Holy Spirit is the One Who reveals Who the Savior is and opens up our minds to understand the Word of God because flesh and blood does not bring meaning to the Scriptures. We can not understand what we are reading unless the Holy Spirit teaches us and imparts meaning to us. Almost every time you read reference to the “Spirit”, particularly in the New Testament, it is speaking of God the Holy Spirit. The “Spirit” is the Spirit – God the Holy Spirit. The Spirit is not a force to be drawn upon like a power but drawing on the power of God. He is the very power of God. You can not know Jesus without Him. You can not possibly overcome sin without His power. You can not have eternal life without His revealing the Source of this eternal life (John 3).
When you sit down to read the Bible, pray for the Holy Spirit to give you understanding. Pray that He will reveal what is being read in the Bible for part of the role of the Holy Spirit is to teach us all things, as Christ told the disciples before He departed. The Holy Spirit is also a Helper, a Comforter and He teaches us about the things of God (John 14:26, Luke 12:12). God the Holy Spirit also guides us in revealing the meaning of God’s written Word (John 16:13) and reminds us of things we need to remember (John 14:26). If you want to know a sort of job description of the Holy Spirit, John, chapters 14, 15 and 16 will help immensely. Romans chapter 8 is also a chapter that describes the role and work of God the Holy Spirit. It mentions “the Spirit” frequently in this chapter and this Spirit is none other than God the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit is God
God the Holy Spirit brings godly repentance and brings about an awareness of when we are not doing the right thing. He will begin to deal with the sins in our life and help us overcome them. We are not the ones necessarily that conquer sin; God the Holy Spirit is the power that dwells in us to help us do this. We can not possibly overcome sin by human effort. This doesn’t mean that the Holy Spirit stops all the urges nor will He stop our returning to sin, but the Holy Spirit prompts and urges the believer to not engage in such behavior as well as other ungodly acts. God the Holy Spirit enables us to do good works – not to be saved – but because we are saved. The Holy Spirit also points to and always seeks to glorify Jesus Christ. So too should we. In this way, we can join in purpose with God the Holy Spirit to glorify Jesus Christ. The next time you think of the Holy Spirit, think of Him as God Himself. For the Holy Spirit is God, was God, and will forever be God. Jesus is also called Immanuel (God with us); God the Holy Spirit is God in us; if we are Christians. That is Who the Holy Spirit is.
Oct 8, 2019 05:18:04 #
What Is The Role Of The Holy Spirit?
What role does the Holy Spirit lead in the life of the believer?
The Quickening Spirit
Before we were saved, we were the walking dead; dead in our sins. We needed the Spirit’s quickening. The Apostle Paul wrote that I was dead and “you were dead in the trespasses and sins in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience” (Eph 2:1-2). We had the influence of a spirit, but an evil spirit, and were under the influence of the god of this world, Satan, however, the Holy Spirit is greater than Satan because the Holy Spirit is also God. This means that “you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world” (1 John 4:4). What changed? God changed us by His Spirit because “we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved” (Eph 2:3-5).
The Convicting Spirit
The Holy Spirit will speak to your conscience. He will tell you when you’ve blown it and need to apologize. He will tell you to avoid going certain places and with certain people because of what happened last time. He will lead you to offer a helping hand to someone in need. Our own flesh won’t usually do these things, but the Spirit of God will. Jesus, in speaking about the coming of the Holy Spirt, said that “when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment” (John 16:8), and “concerning sin, because they do not believe in me” (John 16:9); “they” being the Jewish religious leaders, so they and “the ruler of this world is judged” by Jesus’ sinless life, death, and resurrection. Satan and his minion’s fate have been sealed. The Holy Spirit not only is greater than Satan and his demons, He has power over them, so no believer need live in fear of being demon possessed or being taken over by Satan. We have previously read that God the Holy Spirit is greater than Satan who is a created being. The Creator of something is always greater than the thing which was created.
The Sanctifying Spirit
Sanctification is a lifetime process, and it will never be fully complete this side of the kingdom, but I believe the Holy Spirit has a special name for a very special reason. He is just as holy as God the Father and God the Son is, so why don’t we call them Holy Father, Holy Son, and Holy Spirit? I think it’s because of the work the Holy Spirit does in us and through us. The Holy Spirit helps us to bear fruit for Jesus’ and the Father’s glory. He prompts us to do good things for others while convicting us of doing things we shouldn’t have done. He keeps us out of sin by reminding us of Scripture. Jesus said “do not be anxious how you are to speak or what you are to say, for what you are to say will be given to you in that hour. For it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you” (Matt 10:19-20), and I can use as much of the Spirit’s help as I can get.
The Sealing of the Spirit
The Apostle Paul wrote a letter to the church at Ephesus, but it was intended for all the churches, and part of his purpose for writing this was to try and explain God’s marvelous redemptive plan. Paul reveals that “even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption to himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will” (Eph 1:4-5). It was only because of God’s will that “we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will” (Eph 1:11). Our salvation was sealed, because when we “believed in him [we] were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit” (Eph 1:13). The word used for seal is the same word used for a letter sent from a king that had his own seal on it, and no one was allowed to break the seal but the person it was intended for. In similar fashion, the sealing work of the Holy Spirit “is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory” (Eph 1:14).
Conclusion
The Holy Spirit also helps us when we’re at a loss for words and don’t know what to pray for or how to pray. Paul wrote that the “the Spirit helps us in our weakness. For we do not know what to pray for as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words” (Rom 8:26), and the Holy Spirit always does the will of God, because “the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God” (Rom 8:27b), but only those “led by the Spirit of God are sons of God” (Rom 8:14). If you have been brought to repentance and faith in Christ, then “you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father” (Rom 8:15b).
What role does the Holy Spirit lead in the life of the believer?
The Quickening Spirit
Before we were saved, we were the walking dead; dead in our sins. We needed the Spirit’s quickening. The Apostle Paul wrote that I was dead and “you were dead in the trespasses and sins in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience” (Eph 2:1-2). We had the influence of a spirit, but an evil spirit, and were under the influence of the god of this world, Satan, however, the Holy Spirit is greater than Satan because the Holy Spirit is also God. This means that “you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world” (1 John 4:4). What changed? God changed us by His Spirit because “we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved” (Eph 2:3-5).
The Convicting Spirit
The Holy Spirit will speak to your conscience. He will tell you when you’ve blown it and need to apologize. He will tell you to avoid going certain places and with certain people because of what happened last time. He will lead you to offer a helping hand to someone in need. Our own flesh won’t usually do these things, but the Spirit of God will. Jesus, in speaking about the coming of the Holy Spirt, said that “when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment” (John 16:8), and “concerning sin, because they do not believe in me” (John 16:9); “they” being the Jewish religious leaders, so they and “the ruler of this world is judged” by Jesus’ sinless life, death, and resurrection. Satan and his minion’s fate have been sealed. The Holy Spirit not only is greater than Satan and his demons, He has power over them, so no believer need live in fear of being demon possessed or being taken over by Satan. We have previously read that God the Holy Spirit is greater than Satan who is a created being. The Creator of something is always greater than the thing which was created.
The Sanctifying Spirit
Sanctification is a lifetime process, and it will never be fully complete this side of the kingdom, but I believe the Holy Spirit has a special name for a very special reason. He is just as holy as God the Father and God the Son is, so why don’t we call them Holy Father, Holy Son, and Holy Spirit? I think it’s because of the work the Holy Spirit does in us and through us. The Holy Spirit helps us to bear fruit for Jesus’ and the Father’s glory. He prompts us to do good things for others while convicting us of doing things we shouldn’t have done. He keeps us out of sin by reminding us of Scripture. Jesus said “do not be anxious how you are to speak or what you are to say, for what you are to say will be given to you in that hour. For it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you” (Matt 10:19-20), and I can use as much of the Spirit’s help as I can get.
The Sealing of the Spirit
The Apostle Paul wrote a letter to the church at Ephesus, but it was intended for all the churches, and part of his purpose for writing this was to try and explain God’s marvelous redemptive plan. Paul reveals that “even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption to himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will” (Eph 1:4-5). It was only because of God’s will that “we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will” (Eph 1:11). Our salvation was sealed, because when we “believed in him [we] were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit” (Eph 1:13). The word used for seal is the same word used for a letter sent from a king that had his own seal on it, and no one was allowed to break the seal but the person it was intended for. In similar fashion, the sealing work of the Holy Spirit “is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory” (Eph 1:14).
Conclusion
The Holy Spirit also helps us when we’re at a loss for words and don’t know what to pray for or how to pray. Paul wrote that the “the Spirit helps us in our weakness. For we do not know what to pray for as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words” (Rom 8:26), and the Holy Spirit always does the will of God, because “the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God” (Rom 8:27b), but only those “led by the Spirit of God are sons of God” (Rom 8:14). If you have been brought to repentance and faith in Christ, then “you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father” (Rom 8:15b).
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