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The Tragedy of Trump
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Aug 22, 2019 12:10:42   #
moldyoldy
 
There have been 44 other Presidents, but this is the first nut. He has the temperament of a three year old, and the brains of a five year old. He makes it obvious who has been in his ear by the way he changes from day to day, whether it is the NRA, or fox news, they say it and he follows.

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Aug 22, 2019 13:57:22   #
Rose42
 
moldyoldy wrote:
There have been 44 other Presidents, but this is the first nut. He has the temperament of a three year old, and the brains of a five year old. He makes it obvious who has been in his ear by the way he changes from day to day, whether it is the NRA, or fox news, they say it and he follows.


And yet...he is the president and you're on a forum complaining about him. Lol

He's not the first nut but he is the first that's had no filter between his brain and his mouth.

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Aug 22, 2019 14:10:28   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
slatten49 wrote:
I would'a thought...for you, it was the choice of Pat Buchanan's liberal rag as my source.

The American Conservative was founded by Pat Buchanan, Scott McConnell and Taki Theodoracopulos in 2002 in opposition to the Iraq War. Daniel Strauss wrote: The idea of The American Conservative was that there were enough who disagreed with mainstream conservatism—libertarians, paleoconservatives, and civil libertarian conservatives, among other dissenters—to warrant such a publication.

Rod Dreher is a senior editor at The American Conservative. He has written and edited for the New York Post, The Dallas Morning News, National Review, the South Florida Sun-Sentinel, the Washington Times, and the Baton Rouge Advocate. Rod’s commentary has been published in The Wall Street Journal, Commentary, the Weekly Standard, Beliefnet, and Real Simple, among other publications. He lives in St. Francisville, Louisiana, with his wife Julie and their three children.
I would'a thought...for you, it was the choice of ... (show quote)

Pat Buchanan and Rod Dreher?? Now there's a pair to draw to.

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Aug 23, 2019 09:45:48   #
okie don
 
Rose42 wrote:
Interesting article. But what's next? There's Trump vs one of the horrific democrat candidates. All I see are articles that criticize Trump yet everyone seems to ignore the abysmal state of the democrat party. Both parties are in a sorry state. People want change? Nothing is going to change unless its demanded and its not demanded as seen by the lack of a standout democrat candidate. By the look of things the democrats will change nothing if they win.

Nikki Haley should run.
Interesting article. But what's next? There's Tr... (show quote)


The only Dim o crat that impressed me was Tulsi Gabbard from Hawaii and she's not far enuf left for the PTB, apparently...

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Aug 23, 2019 11:37:30   #
kemmer
 
slatten49 wrote:
The American Conservative: The Tragedy of Trump, By Rod Dreher • October 24, 2016 (pre-e******n)

The dangers of a Hillary Clinton presidency are more familiar than Trump’s authoritarian unknowns, because we live with them in our politics already. They’re the dangers of elite groupthink, of Beltway power worship, of a cult of p**********l action in the service of dubious ideals. They’re the dangers of a recklessness and radicalism that doesn’t recognize itself as either, because it’s convinced that if an idea is mainstream and commonplace among the great and good then it cannot possibly be folly.

Almost every crisis that has come upon the West in the last 15 years has its roots in this establishmentarian type of folly. The Iraq War, which liberals prefer to remember as a conflict conjured by a neoconservative cabal, was actually the work of a bipartisan interventionist consensus, pushed hard by George W. Bush but embraced as well by a large slice of center-left opinion that included Tony Blair and more than half of Senate Democrats.

Likewise the financial crisis: Whether you blame financial-services deregulation or happy-go-lucky housing policy (or both), the policies that helped inflate and pop the bubble were embraced by both wings of the political establishment. Likewise with the euro, the European common currency, a terrible idea that only cranks and Little Englanders dared oppose until the Great Recession exposed it as a potentially economy-sinking folly. Likewise with Angela Merkel’s grand and reckless open-borders gesture just last year: She was the heroine of a thousand profiles even as she delivered her continent to polarization and violence.
And: One can look at Trump himself and see too much danger of still-deeper disaster, too much temperamental risk and moral turpitude, to be an acceptable alternative to this blunder-ridden status quo … while also looking at Hillary Clinton and seeing a woman whose record embodies the tendencies that gave rise to Trumpism in the first place.

Along these lines, there was a quite good Peggy Noonan column in the WSJ last week (now, alas, behind the paywall, but I found the whole thing here), saying that if Trump were not a “nut” — which he clearly is — he would be winning this thing by a landslide, because a lot of folks are sick and tired of the status quo that Hillary represents. Excerpt:

Mr. Trump’s great historical role was to reveal to the Republican Party what half of its own base really thinks about the big issues. The party’s leaders didn’t know! They were shocked, so much that they indulged in sheer denial and made believe it wasn’t happening.

Because she is largely in sympathy with Trump’s political views, she is “particularly sorry” that Trump is a nut (me too! me too!). She wonders what would have happened if we had had a Sane Donald Trump. For one, she says, he “would have won in a landslide.” Excerpts:

Sane Donald Trump, just to start, would look normal and happy, not grim and glowering. He would be able to hear and act on good advice. He would explain his positions with clarity and depth, not with the impatient half-grasping of a notion that marks real Donald Trump’s public persona.

Sane Donald Trump would have looked at a dubious, anxious and therefore standoffish Republican establishment and not insulted them, diminished them, done tweetstorms against them. Instead he would have said, “Come into my tent. It’s a new one, I admit, but it’s yuuge and has gold faucets and there’s a place just for you. What do you need? That I be less excitable and dramatic? Done. That I not act, toward women, like a pig? Done, and I accept your critique. That I explain the moral and practical underpinnings of my stand on refugees from terror nations? I’d be happy to. My well-hidden secret is that I love everyone and hear the common rhythm of their beating hearts.”

And: Sane Donald Trump would not treat the political process of the world’s greatest democracy as if it were, as somebody said, the next-to-last episode of a reality-TV series. That’s the episode that leaves you wondering how the season will end—who will scream, who will leave the drunken party in a huff, who will accuse whom of being a whore. I guess that’s what “I’ll keep you in suspense” as to whether he’ll accept the e******n result was about. We’re being teed up. The explosive season finale is Nov. 8. Maybe he’ll leave in a huff. Maybe he’ll call everyone whores.

Does he know he’s playing with fire? No. Because he’s a nut.

Ben Stein agrees with Noonan that Trump is a nut, but he’s v****g for Trump anyway, because he thinks Trump is less of a nut than Clinton. This is not persuasive, but this is true: Trump’s a nut. I don’t doubt Peggy Noonan at all. But we have a choice of nuts this year, and that’s the tragedy. It’s a tragedy the greatest nation in history does not deserve.

The only real question for conservatives and Republicans now is what happens to the Right and the GOP, its political vehicle, in the wake of Trump’s loss. #NeverTrumpers will be strongly tempted to indulge in bitter “I told you so!” recriminations. Trumpers, likewise, will be strongly tempted to indulge in bitter “You stabbed him in the back!” polemics. All of this will work to the advantage of President H. Clinton, of course. What is needed is for the GOP establishment to humble itself enough to admit those who, like Noonan, accept the critique of the party and the system that Trump’s candidacy embodies, however, well, nuttily. And the Trump insurgents — including their leader — need to have the sense to realize that it advantages them not at all to d**g this fight with Republicans out past the e******n. Their candidate will have received a thorough, resounding rejection by v**ers in an e******n he likely would have won had he not consistently spoken and acted like a nut.

Do I think this (humility on both sides, uniting in the face of Hillaryism) is likely to happen? No, I do not. But I hope I’m wrong. The Trump people, like their candidate, are not known for their ability to think strategically and to restrain themselves for their own good. And the bitterness and spite among Republican regulars is going to blind them to their own role in creating this mess. I overheard a conversation the other day in which some Republican lamented that “we” — meaning the GOP — “have Donald Trump.”

“We don’t have Trump,” his interlocutor shot back. “We have Paul Ryan. He’s ours.”

And I thought, “Who’s this we?” The party isn’t yours anymore, mister, though admittedly it’s hard to say who it belongs to or what it stands for. Because Trump did not build any kind of movement, and doesn’t have any obvious heirs in the party leadership, there’s no telling where the GOP is going after November.

But we can be sure it’s not going back to the way things were pre-Trump.

https://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/tragedy-trump/ (very slightly edited)
The American Conservative: The Tragedy of Trump, ... (show quote)

And this weekend Trump is off to the G-7 with only one goal--to get Russia back in. For the first time in 44 years, the 6 members have decided NOT to issue a final communique after the hissy fit Trump threw after the last G-7 in Canada. Trump is no longer the leader of the Free World because nobody trusts him any longer.

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Aug 23, 2019 14:27:19   #
debeda
 
nwtk2007 wrote:
Trump a nutt? Maybe. Maybe not. He seems to always be one step ahead of his opposition. Hmm. And he did bring out the true nature of the democratic party; that being a bunch of l*****ts with no morals at all, willing to do anything and everything to get their way, to force their way upon us all. Maybe it took a nutt to bring that all to the surface. And now we ALL know.


I agree with your assessment.

Reply
Aug 23, 2019 14:29:52   #
debeda
 
okie don wrote:
The only Dim o crat that impressed me was Tulsi Gabbard from Hawaii and she's not far enuf left for the PTB, apparently...


Yes, I liked some of what she said. There was another guy,whose name I cant remember who also appeared to have a brain. Hes already gone, tho, and I cant remember his name. Ugh. Old timers I guess

Reply
 
 
Aug 23, 2019 14:38:59   #
Rose42
 
okie don wrote:
The only Dim o crat that impressed me was Tulsi Gabbard from Hawaii and she's not far enuf left for the PTB, apparently...


I liked some of what she said too. But she has no chance. These days the process drops the best candidates and we’re left with the dregs.

Reply
Aug 23, 2019 18:00:20   #
badbob85037
 
slatten49 wrote:
The American Conservative: The Tragedy of Trump, By Rod Dreher • October 24, 2016 (pre-e******n)

The dangers of a Hillary Clinton presidency are more familiar than Trump’s authoritarian unknowns, because we live with them in our politics already. They’re the dangers of elite groupthink, of Beltway power worship, of a cult of p**********l action in the service of dubious ideals. They’re the dangers of a recklessness and radicalism that doesn’t recognize itself as either, because it’s convinced that if an idea is mainstream and commonplace among the great and good then it cannot possibly be folly.

Almost every crisis that has come upon the West in the last 15 years has its roots in this establishmentarian type of folly. The Iraq War, which liberals prefer to remember as a conflict conjured by a neoconservative cabal, was actually the work of a bipartisan interventionist consensus, pushed hard by George W. Bush but embraced as well by a large slice of center-left opinion that included Tony Blair and more than half of Senate Democrats.

Likewise the financial crisis: Whether you blame financial-services deregulation or happy-go-lucky housing policy (or both), the policies that helped inflate and pop the bubble were embraced by both wings of the political establishment. Likewise with the euro, the European common currency, a terrible idea that only cranks and Little Englanders dared oppose until the Great Recession exposed it as a potentially economy-sinking folly. Likewise with Angela Merkel’s grand and reckless open-borders gesture just last year: She was the heroine of a thousand profiles even as she delivered her continent to polarization and violence.
And: One can look at Trump himself and see too much danger of still-deeper disaster, too much temperamental risk and moral turpitude, to be an acceptable alternative to this blunder-ridden status quo … while also looking at Hillary Clinton and seeing a woman whose record embodies the tendencies that gave rise to Trumpism in the first place.

Along these lines, there was a quite good Peggy Noonan column in the WSJ last week (now, alas, behind the paywall, but I found the whole thing here), saying that if Trump were not a “nut” — which he clearly is — he would be winning this thing by a landslide, because a lot of folks are sick and tired of the status quo that Hillary represents. Excerpt:

Mr. Trump’s great historical role was to reveal to the Republican Party what half of its own base really thinks about the big issues. The party’s leaders didn’t know! They were shocked, so much that they indulged in sheer denial and made believe it wasn’t happening.

Because she is largely in sympathy with Trump’s political views, she is “particularly sorry” that Trump is a nut (me too! me too!). She wonders what would have happened if we had had a Sane Donald Trump. For one, she says, he “would have won in a landslide.” Excerpts:

Sane Donald Trump, just to start, would look normal and happy, not grim and glowering. He would be able to hear and act on good advice. He would explain his positions with clarity and depth, not with the impatient half-grasping of a notion that marks real Donald Trump’s public persona.

Sane Donald Trump would have looked at a dubious, anxious and therefore standoffish Republican establishment and not insulted them, diminished them, done tweetstorms against them. Instead he would have said, “Come into my tent. It’s a new one, I admit, but it’s yuuge and has gold faucets and there’s a place just for you. What do you need? That I be less excitable and dramatic? Done. That I not act, toward women, like a pig? Done, and I accept your critique. That I explain the moral and practical underpinnings of my stand on refugees from terror nations? I’d be happy to. My well-hidden secret is that I love everyone and hear the common rhythm of their beating hearts.”

And: Sane Donald Trump would not treat the political process of the world’s greatest democracy as if it were, as somebody said, the next-to-last episode of a reality-TV series. That’s the episode that leaves you wondering how the season will end—who will scream, who will leave the drunken party in a huff, who will accuse whom of being a whore. I guess that’s what “I’ll keep you in suspense” as to whether he’ll accept the e******n result was about. We’re being teed up. The explosive season finale is Nov. 8. Maybe he’ll leave in a huff. Maybe he’ll call everyone whores.

Does he know he’s playing with fire? No. Because he’s a nut.

Ben Stein agrees with Noonan that Trump is a nut, but he’s v****g for Trump anyway, because he thinks Trump is less of a nut than Clinton. This is not persuasive, but this is true: Trump’s a nut. I don’t doubt Peggy Noonan at all. But we have a choice of nuts this year, and that’s the tragedy. It’s a tragedy the greatest nation in history does not deserve.

The only real question for conservatives and Republicans now is what happens to the Right and the GOP, its political vehicle, in the wake of Trump’s loss. #NeverTrumpers will be strongly tempted to indulge in bitter “I told you so!” recriminations. Trumpers, likewise, will be strongly tempted to indulge in bitter “You stabbed him in the back!” polemics. All of this will work to the advantage of President H. Clinton, of course. What is needed is for the GOP establishment to humble itself enough to admit those who, like Noonan, accept the critique of the party and the system that Trump’s candidacy embodies, however, well, nuttily. And the Trump insurgents — including their leader — need to have the sense to realize that it advantages them not at all to d**g this fight with Republicans out past the e******n. Their candidate will have received a thorough, resounding rejection by v**ers in an e******n he likely would have won had he not consistently spoken and acted like a nut.

Do I think this (humility on both sides, uniting in the face of Hillaryism) is likely to happen? No, I do not. But I hope I’m wrong. The Trump people, like their candidate, are not known for their ability to think strategically and to restrain themselves for their own good. And the bitterness and spite among Republican regulars is going to blind them to their own role in creating this mess. I overheard a conversation the other day in which some Republican lamented that “we” — meaning the GOP — “have Donald Trump.”

“We don’t have Trump,” his interlocutor shot back. “We have Paul Ryan. He’s ours.”

And I thought, “Who’s this we?” The party isn’t yours anymore, mister, though admittedly it’s hard to say who it belongs to or what it stands for. Because Trump did not build any kind of movement, and doesn’t have any obvious heirs in the party leadership, there’s no telling where the GOP is going after November.

But we can be sure it’s not going back to the way things were pre-Trump.

https://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/tragedy-trump/ (very slightly edited)
The American Conservative: The Tragedy of Trump, ... (show quote)


The housing down fall was caused by Barney Franks, Dobbson, and Obama when they ran interference to any investigation into Fanny Mae. The 3 top executives to Fanny Mae, Rains, Johnson, and Howard had taken $250 million in bonuses. A court of law made them give back half and they say crime doesn't pay. What would anyone expect when Bill Clinton and Democrats forced banks into giving housing loans to people who couldn't keep their utilities on.

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Aug 23, 2019 20:01:49   #
moldyoldy
 
badbob85037 wrote:
The housing down fall was caused by Barney Franks, Dobbson, and Obama when they ran interference to any investigation into Fanny Mae. The 3 top executives to Fanny Mae, Rains, Johnson, and Howard had taken $250 million in bonuses. A court of law made them give back half and they say crime doesn't pay. What would anyone expect when Bill Clinton and Democrats forced banks into giving housing loans to people who couldn't keep their utilities on.


Deregulation and greed, was the cause.

Reply
Aug 24, 2019 10:56:16   #
nwtk2007 Loc: Texas
 
moldyoldy wrote:
Deregulation and greed, was the cause.


That and giving loans to people who could not possibly be able to pay their payments; then selling these notes to other banks as if they were good, leaving the other bank to take the hit of the foreclosed notes; selling them in mass with hardly any review to see how worthless those notes were.

Reply
 
 
Aug 24, 2019 11:05:31   #
moldyoldy
 
nwtk2007 wrote:
That and giving loans to people who could not possibly be able to pay their payments; then selling these notes to other banks as if they were good, leaving the other bank to take the hit of the foreclosed notes; selling them in mass with hardly any review to see how worthless those notes were.


A lot of that was interest rates that jumped up after a year, and balloon payments. Fast talking loan closers and gullible consumers. Don't forget the home improvement loan s**ms.

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Aug 24, 2019 11:35:09   #
nwtk2007 Loc: Texas
 
moldyoldy wrote:
A lot of that was interest rates that jumped up after a year, and balloon payments. Fast talking loan closers and gullible consumers. Don't forget the home improvement loan s**ms.


That's a part of it, yes, and allowing huge debt to income ratios and unverified income claims which would have never been allowed but for those pushing to give the poor home loans.

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