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What is basic to faith and salvation, and also, what are disputable matters, if you care to comment on that?
Jun 5, 2019 00:00:43   #
rumitoid
 
Essentially, what makes a Christian a true follower of Christ?

I feel that some have questioned my motives and beliefs regarding Jesus. Therefore, I will offer no opinion on this matter. Please share for the members of this site how we best serve God and achieve Eternal Happiness.

Reply
Jun 7, 2019 07:56:20   #
Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...
 
rumi, personal faith in Jesus Christ as Savior is each individual's only "step" to salvation.

Only those who can look into your relationship with the living God can deny that your faith is sufficient.

No one can truly judge you by your words, for your words may not adequately express your faith.

We are "true Christians" if our faith is genuine.


The message of the Bible is abundantly clear.

We have all sinned against God (Romans 3:23).

Because of our sin, we deserve to be eternally separated from God (Romans 6:23).

Because of His love for us (John 3:16), God took on human form and died in our place, taking the punishment that we deserve (Romans 5:8; 2 Corinthians 5:21).

God promises forgiveness of sins and eternal life in heaven to all who receive, by grace through faith, Jesus Christ as Savior (John 1:12; 3:16; 5:24; Acts 16:31).

Salvation is not about certain required steps we must complete to earn our salvation.

Yes, Christians should be baptized.
Yes, Christians should publicly confess Christ as Savior.
Yes, Christians should turn from sin.
Yes, Christians should commit their lives to obeying God.

These are not, however, steps to salvation. They are the result of salvation. Because of our sin, we cannot in any sense earn salvation.

We could follow 1000 steps, and it would not be enough.

We are absolutely incapable of paying our sin debt to God or cleansing ourselves from sin.

That is why Jesus had to die in our place.

Only God could accomplish our salvation, and so He did.

God Himself completed the "steps" and He can therefore offer salvation to anyone who will receive it from Him.

Again, salvation and forgiveness of sins is not about following steps.
It is about receiving Christ as Savior and recognizing that He has done all of the work for us.
God requires only one step of us — receiving Jesus Christ as our Savior from sin and fully trusting in Him alone as the way of salvation.

This distinguishes the Christian faith from all other world religions, each of which has a list of steps that must be followed in order for salvation to be received. The Christian faith recognizes that God has already completed the steps for us and now calls upon the repentant believer to receive Him in faith.

We serve God by obeying His commandments, after our salvation.

On achieving eternal "happiness," I offer no opinion.


Basic outline is from "Got Questions?"


Editing to add a thought on "disputable" matters...

Absolutely anything can and has been disputed by contentious men, but if it in anyway changes the words or the meaning of written Scripture, it is without merit.


rumitoid wrote:
Essentially, what makes a Christian a true follower of Christ?

I feel that some have questioned my motives and beliefs regarding Jesus. Therefore, I will offer no opinion on this matter. Please share for the members of this site how we best serve God and achieve Eternal Happiness.

Reply
Jun 7, 2019 11:03:57   #
Rose42
 
Zemirah wrote:
rumi, personal faith in Jesus Christ as Savior is each individual's only "step" to salvation.

Only those who can look into your relationship with the living God can deny that your faith is sufficient.

No one can truly judge you by your words, for your words may not adequately express your faith.

We are "true Christians" if our faith is genuine.


The message of the Bible is abundantly clear.

We have all sinned against God (Romans 3:23).

Because of our sin, we deserve to be eternally separated from God (Romans 6:23).

Because of His love for us (John 3:16), God took on human form and died in our place, taking the punishment that we deserve (Romans 5:8; 2 Corinthians 5:21).

God promises forgiveness of sins and eternal life in heaven to all who receive, by grace through faith, Jesus Christ as Savior (John 1:12; 3:16; 5:24; Acts 16:31).

Salvation is not about certain required steps we must complete to earn our salvation.

Yes, Christians should be baptized.
Yes, Christians should publicly confess Christ as Savior.
Yes, Christians should turn from sin.
Yes, Christians should commit their lives to obeying God.

These are not, however, steps to salvation. They are the result of salvation. Because of our sin, we cannot in any sense earn salvation.

We could follow 1000 steps, and it would not be enough.

We are absolutely incapable of paying our sin debt to God or cleansing ourselves from sin.

That is why Jesus had to die in our place.

Only God could accomplish our salvation, and so He did.

God Himself completed the "steps" and He can therefore offer salvation to anyone who will receive it from Him.

Again, salvation and forgiveness of sins is not about following steps.
It is about receiving Christ as Savior and recognizing that He has done all of the work for us.
God requires only one step of us — receiving Jesus Christ as our Savior from sin and fully trusting in Him alone as the way of salvation.

This distinguishes the Christian faith from all other world religions, each of which has a list of steps that must be followed in order for salvation to be received. The Christian faith recognizes that God has already completed the steps for us and now calls upon the repentant believer to receive Him in faith.

We serve God by obeying His commandments, after our salvation.

On achieving eternal "happiness," I offer no opinion.


Basic outline is from "Got Questions?"


Editing to add a thought on "disputable" matters...

Absolutely anything can and has been disputed by contentious men, but if it in anyway changes the words or the meaning of written Scripture, it is without merit.
rumi, personal faith in Jesus Christ as Savior is ... (show quote)


Excerpts from a John MacArthur sermon -

True believers are those who have come to Christ to follow Him. They are those - remember last time Luke 14 - who have counted the cost to build the tower and then went about to build it when they knew what it would cost. They’re not superficial like the rocky soil where the seed goes in and there’s an emotional response but it’s superficial, and pressure, and tribulation, and persecution comes, and the plant dies because it has no real root.

They’re not like the weedy soil where the love of the things of the world and the love of riches still dominates the heart, and so the seed goes in, there’s a momentary response, but the life has never divested itself of itself. And so no fruit ever comes and the plant withers and dies.

True salvation, the really good soil, occurs when somebody understands that when I ask the Lord Jesus to save me from hell and forgive my sin and give me eternal life, I am at the same time submitting everything to His lordship.

John Stott, years ago in his book Basic Christianity, wrote, “The Christian landscape is strewn with the wreckage of derelict half-built towers. The ruins of those who began to build and were unable to finish, for thousands of people still ignore Christ’s warning and undertake to follow Him without first pausing to reflect on the cost of doing so. The result is the great scandal of Christendom today, so-called nominal Christianity.

“In countries to which Christian civilization has spread, large numbers of people have covered themselves with a decent but thin veneer of Christianity. They have allowed themselves to become somewhat involved, enough to be respectable, but not enough to be uncomfortable. Their religion is a great soft cushion. It protects them from the hard unpleasantness of life while changing its place and shape to suit their convenience. No wonder the cynics speak of hypocrites in the church and dismiss religion as escapism.”

"...to follow Christ, and be a true disciple, to be a Christian, you must do these three things: You must deny yourself, take up your cross, and follow Him. This is the hard message of evangelism."

https://www.gty.org/library/sermons-library/42-120/the-necessary-components-of-saving-faith

Reply
 
 
Jun 7, 2019 12:43:12   #
Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...
 
Every word of Dr. MacArthur's sermon is true, and was taken for granted in the family and church community in which I grew to adulthood, however, we were never taught it was a hard life, or a hard thing to do.

In today's world and by earthly standards, especially, it is "hard," but to those who are living it in each age, to my parents and to my siblings it was the life we wanted, and very rewarding.

My parents life could be summed up in three words, as could every devout Christian, "self-sacrificial giving," and they were the most content people I ever knew, for perpetually wrapped around them like a shield was "the peace that passeth all understanding." (Philippians 4:7)



Rose42 wrote:
Excerpts from a John MacArthur sermon -

True believers are those who have come to Christ to follow Him. They are those - remember last time Luke 14 - who have counted the cost to build the tower and then went about to build it when they knew what it would cost. They’re not superficial like the rocky soil where the seed goes in and there’s an emotional response but it’s superficial, and pressure, and tribulation, and persecution comes, and the plant dies because it has no real root.

They’re not like the weedy soil where the love of the things of the world and the love of riches still dominates the heart, and so the seed goes in, there’s a momentary response, but the life has never divested itself of itself. And so no fruit ever comes and the plant withers and dies.

True salvation, the really good soil, occurs when somebody understands that when I ask the Lord Jesus to save me from hell and forgive my sin and give me eternal life, I am at the same time submitting everything to His lordship.

John Stott, years ago in his book Basic Christianity, wrote, “The Christian landscape is strewn with the wreckage of derelict half-built towers. The ruins of those who began to build and were unable to finish, for thousands of people still ignore Christ’s warning and undertake to follow Him without first pausing to reflect on the cost of doing so. The result is the great scandal of Christendom today, so-called nominal Christianity.

“In countries to which Christian civilization has spread, large numbers of people have covered themselves with a decent but thin veneer of Christianity. They have allowed themselves to become somewhat involved, enough to be respectable, but not enough to be uncomfortable. Their religion is a great soft cushion. It protects them from the hard unpleasantness of life while changing its place and shape to suit their convenience. No wonder the cynics speak of hypocrites in the church and dismiss religion as escapism.”

"...to follow Christ, and be a true disciple, to be a Christian, you must do these three things: You must deny yourself, take up your cross, and follow Him. This is the hard message of evangelism."

https://www.gty.org/library/sermons-library/42-120/the-necessary-components-of-saving-faith
Excerpts from a John MacArthur sermon - br br Tru... (show quote)

Reply
Jun 7, 2019 14:12:33   #
Rose42
 
Zemirah wrote:
Every word of Dr. MacArthur's sermon is true, and was taken for granted in the family and church community in which I grew to adulthood, however, we were never taught it was a hard life, or a hard thing to do.

In today's world and by earthly standards, especially, it is "hard," but to those who are living it in each age, to my parents and to my siblings it was the life we wanted, and very rewarding.

My parents life could be summed up in three words, as could every devout Christian, "self-sacrificial giving," and they were the most content people I ever knew, for perpetually wrapped around them like a shield was "the peace that passeth all understanding." (Philippians 4:7)
Every word of Dr. MacArthur's sermon is true, and ... (show quote)


What a blessing that kind of upbringing is. The older we get the more baggage we have to shed and that can be a struggle at times.

I did not grow up in a Christian environment. I understand what he means when he says "a hard message of evangelism" because I didn't want to hear it and was more into easy believism. Little did I know how freeing it was.

Reply
Jun 7, 2019 19:55:48   #
Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...
 
After giving it due thought, I want to revisit your inquiry regarding "eternal happiness," about which I declined commenting earlier.

I don't think "happiness" quite captures the quality of emotion that one receives as a Christian from knowing one is securely in Christ, and the Holy Spirit resides within us, and has sealed us for eternity.

I think of happiness as a momentary, fleeting emotion, the emotion a child experiences at a birthday party.

What I experience daily, regardless of the day's individual troubles, and the world news, is a deeply abiding sense of joy.

It gives us the ability to laugh and to be lighthearted through the direst of occurrences.

It makes life's journey to eternity, always an adventure to be savored, regardless of changing circumstances.

2nd Corinthians 1:21-22:

"Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and anointed us is God, who also sealed us and gave us the Holy Spirit in our hearts as a pledge."


rumitoid wrote:
Essentially, what makes a Christian a true follower of Christ?

I feel that some have questioned my motives and beliefs regarding Jesus. Therefore, I will offer no opinion on this matter. Please share for the members of this site how we best serve God and achieve Eternal Happiness.

Reply
Jun 7, 2019 23:57:29   #
rumitoid
 
Zemirah wrote:
rumi, personal faith in Jesus Christ as Savior is each individual's only "step" to salvation.

Only those who can look into your relationship with the living God can deny that your faith is sufficient.

No one can truly judge you by your words, for your words may not adequately express your faith.

We are "true Christians" if our faith is genuine.


The message of the Bible is abundantly clear.

We have all sinned against God (Romans 3:23).

Because of our sin, we deserve to be eternally separated from God (Romans 6:23).

Because of His love for us (John 3:16), God took on human form and died in our place, taking the punishment that we deserve (Romans 5:8; 2 Corinthians 5:21).

God promises forgiveness of sins and eternal life in heaven to all who receive, by grace through faith, Jesus Christ as Savior (John 1:12; 3:16; 5:24; Acts 16:31).

Salvation is not about certain required steps we must complete to earn our salvation.

Yes, Christians should be baptized.
Yes, Christians should publicly confess Christ as Savior.
Yes, Christians should turn from sin.
Yes, Christians should commit their lives to obeying God.

These are not, however, steps to salvation. They are the result of salvation. Because of our sin, we cannot in any sense earn salvation.

We could follow 1000 steps, and it would not be enough.

We are absolutely incapable of paying our sin debt to God or cleansing ourselves from sin.

That is why Jesus had to die in our place.

Only God could accomplish our salvation, and so He did.

God Himself completed the "steps" and He can therefore offer salvation to anyone who will receive it from Him.

Again, salvation and forgiveness of sins is not about following steps.
It is about receiving Christ as Savior and recognizing that He has done all of the work for us.
God requires only one step of us — receiving Jesus Christ as our Savior from sin and fully trusting in Him alone as the way of salvation.

This distinguishes the Christian faith from all other world religions, each of which has a list of steps that must be followed in order for salvation to be received. The Christian faith recognizes that God has already completed the steps for us and now calls upon the repentant believer to receive Him in faith.

We serve God by obeying His commandments, after our salvation.

On achieving eternal "happiness," I offer no opinion.


Basic outline is from "Got Questions?"


Editing to add a thought on "disputable" matters...

Absolutely anything can and has been disputed by contentious men, but if it in anyway changes the words or the meaning of written Scripture, it is without merit.
rumi, personal faith in Jesus Christ as Savior is ... (show quote)


For me, dear Zenith, this is all you had to say, what you already said: "They are the result of salvation." This is a totally mind-blowing, nearly incomprehensible, and revolutionary idea of real liberty.

When we come across something like "Faith without works is dead," there are those that will question it only takes faith, not works. What they fail to realize is that we can only do good through spirit and grace, which is supplied by faith. Simply put, there can be no works without faith. What we do for "the least of these" is how Scripture says we will be judged, and that means it is not what we do for them but where our heart is in Christ. This will compel our love of neighbor and enemy alike.

Reply
 
 
Jun 8, 2019 00:11:33   #
rumitoid
 
Rose42 wrote:
Excerpts from a John MacArthur sermon -

True believers are those who have come to Christ to follow Him. They are those - remember last time Luke 14 - who have counted the cost to build the tower and then went about to build it when they knew what it would cost. They’re not superficial like the rocky soil where the seed goes in and there’s an emotional response but it’s superficial, and pressure, and tribulation, and persecution comes, and the plant dies because it has no real root.

They’re not like the weedy soil where the love of the things of the world and the love of riches still dominates the heart, and so the seed goes in, there’s a momentary response, but the life has never divested itself of itself. And so no fruit ever comes and the plant withers and dies.

True salvation, the really good soil, occurs when somebody understands that when I ask the Lord Jesus to save me from hell and forgive my sin and give me eternal life, I am at the same time submitting everything to His lordship.

John Stott, years ago in his book Basic Christianity, wrote, “The Christian landscape is strewn with the wreckage of derelict half-built towers. The ruins of those who began to build and were unable to finish, for thousands of people still ignore Christ’s warning and undertake to follow Him without first pausing to reflect on the cost of doing so. The result is the great scandal of Christendom today, so-called nominal Christianity.

“In countries to which Christian civilization has spread, large numbers of people have covered themselves with a decent but thin veneer of Christianity. They have allowed themselves to become somewhat involved, enough to be respectable, but not enough to be uncomfortable. Their religion is a great soft cushion. It protects them from the hard unpleasantness of life while changing its place and shape to suit their convenience. No wonder the cynics speak of hypocrites in the church and dismiss religion as escapism.”

"...to follow Christ, and be a true disciple, to be a Christian, you must do these three things: You must deny yourself, take up your cross, and follow Him. This is the hard message of evangelism."

https://www.gty.org/library/sermons-library/42-120/the-necessary-components-of-saving-faith
Excerpts from a John MacArthur sermon - br br Tru... (show quote)


I like this. A bit overly dramatic but workable. I do not feel Jesus wanted so many trumpets when meeting people.

"...without first pausing to reflect on the cost of doing so": few have even the slightest idea "on the cost of doing so." Anyone who comes to Christ is utterly clueless to what is asked. Make an altar call that gets a thousand converts, and not one understands. But God works like that.

We cannot possibly "deny ourselves." A foolish pursuit. Egotistical, really. Do you know why? We do not have the power or propensity to "deny ourselves." This is not left up to our motives and efforts. Faith in Christ alone acts to reduce or inhibit our created self from its worldly ways.

Reply
Jun 8, 2019 18:24:19   #
Zemirah Loc: Sojourner En Route...
 
rumi, I have "one more final thought" on your topic of choice...

It revolves around "disputable matters:"


Colossians 2:16-23:

"So don’t let anyone condemn you for what you eat or drink, or for not celebrating certain holy days or new moon ceremonies or Sabbaths.

"These are a shadow of the things to come, but the body that casts it belongs to Christ.

"Let no one disqualify you, insisting on asceticism (pious self-denial) and worship of angels, going on in detail about visions, puffed up without reason by his unspiritual mind,

"and he loses connection to the head (Jesus Christ), from whom the whole body, supported and knit together by its joints and ligaments, grows as God causes it to grow.…

"For the law is only a shadow of the good things to come, not the realities themselves. It can never, by the same sacrifices offered year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship.

"If you have died with Christ to the spiritual forces of the world, why, as though you still belonged to the world, do you submit to its regulations:

"Do not handle, do not taste, do not touch!"?

"These will all perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings.…

"Such restrictions indeed have an appearance of wisdom, with their self-imposed worship, their false humility, and their harsh treatment of the body; but they are of no value against the indulgence of the flesh."




rumitoid wrote:
For me, dear Zenith, this is all you had to say, what you already said: "They are the result of salvation." This is a totally mind-blowing, nearly incomprehensible, and revolutionary idea of real liberty.

When we come across something like "Faith without works is dead," there are those that will question it only takes faith, not works. What they fail to realize is that we can only do good through spirit and grace, which is supplied by faith. Simply put, there can be no works without faith. What we do for "the least of these" is how Scripture says we will be judged, and that means it is not what we do for them but where our heart is in Christ. This will compel our love of neighbor and enemy alike.
For me, dear Zenith, this is all you had to say, w... (show quote)

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