whitnebrat Loc: In the wilds of Oregon

On another thread, you responded to a statement of mine with the following quoted sentences. I feel compelled to answer your post here.
You said:

A statement that is open to major dispute.


Another statement open to major dispute.


Most of the founders were not necessarily Christian, but referred to themselves as 'deists'. Even the various Christian sects (Anabaptists, Puritans, Quakers, Catholics) could not agree on much theology at the time of the Constitution.


While it is true that the stock market is thriving, and those holding stock are seeing profits, the average American has seen virtually no increase in wage growth, nor in their relative standard of living.


Those numbers are deceiving. The reason that this number is so low is because there are many people that have given up on reentering the job market, and a change in the parameters for determining the rate have excluded entire categories that, if counted would place the actual rate at approximately 7%. It does not count the numbers of people that have minimum wage jobs that are looking for better employment.


Again, the numbers are deceiving because of the large number of people that have given up looking for employment in their area and thus aren't counted.


Grammar aside, the unemployment figures are still misleading, since they don't include people that have quit looking.


I assume you're talking about GDP growth per quarter. Depending on which model you use, it can vary as much as 3% depending on whether you subtract the equivalent period inflation percentage from the overall number. Assuming 2% inflation over the period you quote, those numbers fall to 2.1% and 1.5% respectively.


This number is the gross number of added jobs. It does not take into account the number of jobs lost because of automation, plant closings, etc.


The average Joe has experienced an increase in their taxes because of lowered withholding rates. The tax rate change mainly affected corporate rates and gave a massive amount of unexpected profit, which the majority of companies promptly used for stock buybacks. This had little to no effect on wages or reinvestment for the employees.


Most defense analysts disagree with this statement. ISIS has not been eliminated by any stretch, they've just gone underground while still having substantial followings in Libya, Iraq, and numerous other unstable places.


First, most of the people these days are legitimate families of asylum seekers from Central America.
Second, 90%plus of the drugs come through the legitimate ports of entry, not by going around the existing barriers.
Third, sealing the border only hurts the existing trade on both sides of the border.


Another misstatement. NATO members are ASKED to increase their defense spending to the 2.5% suggested amount of their GDP (not required). Some have complied to an extent, but many have not done so.


Both of these actions go against 60+ years of international understanding and numerous United Nations resolutions regarding both the Golan Heights, Jerusalem, and the West Bank. This also tanks any possibility of a two-state solution because of the increased settlement activity, and now the probability of Israel annexing the West Bank. I suspect the Palestinians are probably not too happy about any of these things.


Point of fact, North Korea has not made any efforts at stopping their nuclear capability. Indeed, they are making efforts to revitalize the one launch pad that they "destroyed", and are reactivating their nuclear reactor complex for making plutonium.


First, the Republican Congress had total control of the legislative agenda, and could not agree to either k**l Obamacare or provide a replacement for it.
Second, the political ramifications of what k*****g Obamacare would do considering that 21 million plus citizens would lose their existing health care is mind-boggling.
Third, getting equity for all means something like "Medicare for all", which is an anathema to conservatives. You can't have it both ways.


Many have started living in their cars or are homeless or have gone on state welfare because they aren't paid enough to buy groceries and pay all their bills. This just t***sferred the problem to the state and local governments.


OK, but how many manufacturing jobs were lost in the same period due to plant closings, shifting jobs overseas, etc. I suspect that this number is as phony as the actual GDP and unemployment rates.


Most people have seen little to no improvement in their financial status. Many saw a bump in their paycheck, but that evaporated once they filed their taxes. Due to the withholding changes, they now owe money in taxes that previously got them refunds. I'm betting that that same bunch of people isn't feeling so much better at this point.


Another mirage. While the stock market is at highs, it is primarily because of the stock buybacks generated by the tax cuts last year that reduced the amount of outstanding stock. This in turn amplified the dividends and raised the price of outstanding stock.

Given the number of misstatements, half-t***hs and outright lies that you have put out in just this post alone, I can no longer attribute any credibility to your postings.
Have a delightful life.

Common_Sense_Matters

Excellent reply, I wouldn't expect it will change his mind, or many others for that matter, but at least it was a worthy effort with actual facts to support it.

padremike Loc: Phenix City, Al

It won't change minds because: it's too long and boring for a response that no one else will read and some of the items are simply false. For example, the majority of the founders were Deist is completely untrue.

Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall

Hi there stranger...

Long time...

How have you been?

whitnebrat Loc: In the wilds of Oregon

Doing well ... just busy... thanx for asking.

karpenter Loc: Headin' Fer Da Hills !!

Along With Dropped Out And Stopped Looking For Work
That Was A Previous Administration

Seth

What a bunch of crap you have.

Smedley_buzkill

Lots of comments. I noticed you were careful to verify all of them with links to your sources.
Not.

Smedley_buzkill

Facts are most generally accompanied by links to sources. When they are not they are more properly referred to as unsupported opinions.

Carol Kelly

You are so wrong on every single point, Socialist that you are. If you truly were a
Patriotic American you would not have torn that apart. This seems to be a new tactic an one which I, personally, abhor as much as I abhor Trump name calling. No other president could have persevered against all odds as has our President Trump. He will go down in history as one of, if not the,greatest President this country has had.
Obama on the other hand will just go down. Take this apart bit by bit and see far it gets you. You are not a nice person to put it mildly and you are an enemy of this United States of America. It doesn’t matter if you no longer attribute any credibility to any of our statements. You don’t matter.

Carol Kelly

I did read it and I felt insulted, but I feel on the right side of this pig’s fight. You are right about our founders. Without the guidance of God, our Constitution would have been k**led long ago instead of being recognized around the world as one of the greatest documents ever written.

Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall

Where do you get the "recognized around the world as one of the greatest documents ever written" part? Have only heard Americans make that claim...

And Whitnbrat is not a pig... Be civil...
If you disagree then point out where she is wrong...

Really now...

karpenter Loc: Headin' Fer Da Hills !!

Too Bad The Magna Carta
Doesn't Have A Surf's Bill Of Rights

slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas

whitnebrat [quote]: "Most of the founders were not necessarily Christian, but referred to themselves as 'deists'. Even the various Christian sects (Anabaptists, Puritans, Quakers, Catholics) could not agree on much theology at the time of the Constitution."

https://www.britannica.com/topic/The-Founding-Fathers-Deism-and-Christianity-1272214

Excerpt/summation...

"Although orthodox Christians participated at every stage of the new republic, Deism influenced a majority of the Founders. The movement opposed barriers to moral improvement and to social justice. It stood for rational inquiry, for skepticism about dogma and mystery, and for religious toleration. Many of its adherents advocated universal education, freedom of the press, and separation of church and state. If the nation owes much to the Judeo-Christian tradition, it is also indebted to Deism, a movement of reason and e******y that influenced the Founding Fathers to embrace liberal political ideals remarkable for their time."

whitnebrat Loc: In the wilds of Oregon

I notice that most of the criticisms of the post do not cite specific problems with the items that were listed. And the ones that are listed as being wrong are likewise not refuted with chapter and verse.
For almost all the points that I made, the facts are available to the casual observer, and a little research on anyone's part will back them up. Restating public knowledge usually does not require citations and references. And even if I took the time to cite chapter and verse, I doubt that those of you that choose to respond with invective and insult would believe the sources anyway.
It is the standard practice of small minds when confronted with t***hs that they do not agree with to respond by attacking the person, rather than the items presented.
There is a legal maxim that reads: "When the law does not support your case, argue the facts. When the facts do not support your case, argue the law. When neither the facts nor the law support your case, scream and shout and bang on the table." The last part seems to be the modus operandi for many in this forum.