debeda

https://youtu.be/PtIRhGGQc5g

This is an interesting video about how colleges have morphed into, in many cases, non-useful money pits. The guest is from YAF. The video is 25 minutes long, so kinda lengthy. I didn't have time to watch it all at once, so kinda looked at it in 3 parts.

rumitoid

In the beginning, the highly prejudicial and wholly unsubstantiated statement that YAF "brings up the facts but the Left can't stand the facts." A turn off there may be some overriding bias. It does not seem unreasonable to ask if YAF also includes "alternative facts" as part of their message, which may disagree with reality.

Who are these pristine speakers of facts brought by YAF to campuses? How about eugenicist Charles Murray. In his 1994 book Bell Curve, he argues that inequalities of race, g****r and income exist because white men are smarter and genetically superior to black people, Latinos, women and the poor. Numerous academics have panned the book for its faulty reasoning and unprovable points. Protesting his h**e speech on campus by students seems reasonable and justified. American Enterprise Institute, a far right conservative think tank asked him to speak, and AEI picked up the tab.

Almost all the speakers trolling to be barred from campuses are far right extremists, like the Obama-hating Ted Nugent. He famously promoted ‘crisis actor’ conspiracy theory following Parkland shooting. When such d******e zealots are met with protests, it helps the right make the false claim of suppressing the 1st Amendment, when it is really the speciousness of the speaker and their virulent r****t and w***e s*******y rants.

Also David Horowitz Freedom Center (DHFC) has made colleges and universities his main targets. Though now deceased, at the time he was active he compiled McCarthyite lists of students, professors, and administrators and plastered campuses with posters accusing them of being subversive.

The head of the Young Americas Foundation (YAF), Richard Spencer, the one featured in that bizarre interview you posted, is a known and professed White Nationalist. He promoted and attended the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, in August which was preceded by a tiki torch-lit march, like former N**is marches in Germany, in which Spencer participated.

Or how about "alt-right" writer Milo Yiannopoulos? He actually got to speak at DePaul.

None of the men mentioned or others backed by these far-right organizations went to any campus to extol American ideals, principles, or values, or even those of Conservatives and Republicans, but to push for an extremist agenda meant to recruit the marginalized and impressionable into their fold of Nationalist extremism.

Far-rightists do not intend merely to express themselves or engage in good-faith debates when they visit universities: it is recruitment and to provoke the appearance of free speech intolerance. Very clever. Universities and colleges are pushed into a corner, like this classic lawyer stunt question: "Answer yes or no. Have you stopped beating your wife?" Let their students be unduly subjected to speeches meant to provoke d******eness and h**e or get the appearance of being Left wing bastions against free speech of the Right.

debeda

Dinesh D'Souza presents clear, factual talks and has been banned. Republican Congress people have been banned. And the point about modern college degrees being specious and useless outside of academia is a valid one. Bluntly, no matter what political side you lean toward, our colleges are NOT doing their jobs. Back in the day you had to be "college material" and pass entrance exams. In too many cases now, rigorous entrance exams are "r****t", and someone who is going into debt to attend college has to basically do remedial classes, at college cost (to the student) to even begin their education. It's a mess!!
On another note, hope all is well with you, and you're back to feeling sparky

rumitoid

Really? Dinesh D'Souza? Please take a low-rider cruise (slow and comfortable) through the absurd history he has concocted to suit his ridiculous theories. A google down the Main Street of facts will be helpful.

I went back to college in 1989: just give us your money was my entrance exam--and thank God. I was not a great student in HS, though in my senior year I did improve. If I had to do the SATs over again or prove efficiency in math and science, I would never have gone back. I graduated with a 4.4 and went on for a Masters. Perhaps an entrance exam is too elitist and maybe even r****t. Given motivation, even the worst may do well provided the opportunity.

From kindergarten to senior year I was in private school, a privilege of my white (1950s and 60s) upper middle class background. It was parochial, Roman Catholic. A great education. I do not know how many times I applied for a job in the 60s the interviewer did not say what a great education I had; I didn't know. There was a partial track scholarship to the University of Maryland (room and board plus the promise of a job) that I accepted in 1965 after graduation. This was the campus of SDS, Students for a Democratic Society. In a way they convinced me to change my draft status to 1A: they made more sense than those who tried to speak against their views. I wanted facts.

My only point here is to say many issues are more complex and maybe simpler than they appear.

Debeda, thank you for your concern. I am well.

debeda

Good to hear you're well. 👍👍😊
I disagree that entrance exams are r****t. I believe if you're going to college and paying for an advanced degree that degree should have some value, and you should be capable of learning the material. I also believe that if colleges are going to allow speakers it cannot be just the Bernie Sanders of the world, but a variety of voices. Otherwise all you're doing is teaching students what to think instead of how to think.

rumitoid

I was a slow learner for a few reasons I do not care to discuss. Those issues were dealt with when I decided to go back to college. I became capable of learning the material.

"I also believe that if colleges are going to allow speakers it cannot be just the Bernie Sanders of the world": I showed in a few instances where it was a radical Right Wing agenda bent on fomenting d******eness and to hopefully castigate colleges that found such h**eful speakers as an attack on academic peace.

debeda

Glad your return to college worked out, sometimes doesn't as an adult, life gets in the way. I do, however stand by my assertion that if colleges are going to have political type speakers, they must allow all sides to speak. When only one side of any issue of anything is presented it is propaganda, not information IMO. And narratives become monotone.

rumitoid

Define "all sides to speak." But before you answer, personally I agree. All the speakers I mentioned as d******e and with a White Nationalist agenda should be given a platform at our higher institutions of learning. If looking for a thorough and complete education of our nation and who we are as as a country. Not all will be discerning enough to see the lies and overcome the inciteful rhetoric. Yet not airing those other voices is a disservice to the broad and free exchange of ideas that is fundamental to our Republic. Let it be understood generally that college students are adults and possess the intellectual acumen to make life choices without pampering or a safe zone of discussion.

debeda

Good points, and yes we need to assume these young people are adults.
Here is one of the reasons that all need to be allowed to speak. You named off a few people and said there was a lot of h**eful rhetoric from them. Unfortunately, there's also what I consider h**eful rhetoric from the left. To give talks explaining why certain groups are victims? And certain groups are "privileged "? Way overgeneralized and, bluntly, not helpful. Only serves to divide. To me, if you are going to college, that is a time to open yourself to new knowledge, new schools of thought and the formation or refinement of your own ideas. And also a time to learn independence, self reliance and self responsibility. I absolutely agree with you about how silly safe spaces are, these are not toddlers

rumitoid

Sorry, I have a tendency to be too strident and too focused on particulars at times. I did not look to exclude the Far Left as being just as capable of the Far Right of h**eful rhetoric. The site you provided was what I took as a limited subject. YAF is not an organization to share Conservative values and principles but one with a specific and extremist agenda (a point I feel is amply certain by their choices for speakers). The Left has the same. My point in mentioning the speakers YAF has supported was not to disqualify them from speaking at colleges--which they should be able to, though restricted if there are adequate safety concerns--but to demonstrate that they choose controversial speakers to make colleges react in a seemingly hostile way to their zealot views. That is the plan: have the Left look like it is against free speech for the Right.

I should have googled how extreme Left groups have been treated in our institutions of higher learning.

debeda

I just think we're all WAY too polarized. And I wish politicians would stop trying to one up each other, it's getting really boring People are people are people
Not everyone is just alike, but there are more similarities than differences. I do believe that some cultures don't mix well, except in the cases where people immigrate to other countries for specific reasons (a friend who was born in Iraq is a good example, her family emigrated here in the mid 1950s and they managed to worship as they pleased AND follow U.S. laws - but they wanted to be here) . Honestly, I do believe that colleges focus way too much on social issues now and not nearly as much on solid academics as they should. I don't know know all (or most) of the answers, but I am becoming more and more disturbed by the hatred people show each other for OTHER people's narratives. It needs to stop

rumitoid

I agree debeda. Colleges and maybe everything is being pulled into this vortex of Event Horizon growing Nationalism, given our present conditions.

debeda

Well I see the event horizon of growing socialism, but otherwise we're on the same page. every thing in moderation I guess. Nationalism as patriotism, okay. Socialism as limited government programs, okay. Too far either way (isolationism or the government controls all) no thanks