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Is Peter the rock on which the Church is built? Not according to God's word
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Dec 15, 2018 15:28:46   #
Radiance3
 
jack sequim wa wrote:
I accept the word of God. God cannot lie, his word does not lie. The Roman Catholic church is a lie because it makes the word of God a lie. We gave you evidence how and why it makes the word of God a lie.

Your defense of lies is inexcusable at the judgment seat of God.
There is no second chances.

Believers born again by the spirit will have no judgement, instead of judgement of heaven or hell our judgement is of crowns based on our good works.

Defending the whore church until your last breath, never knowing what it is like to have God (Holy Spirit) live in you.

We only hear three voices. Our own, Satan's, or the Holy Spirit and never hearing the Holy Spirits voice that we hear.

Counterfeit voice of Satan's counterfeit church lead by a demon possessed pope.
I accept the word of God. God cannot lie, his word... (show quote)

===============
Sequim, you don't accept the word of God. You defy the commandment of God. Instead, you Protestants make your own interpretations of the Scriptures, make your own laws in defiance to the order of Christ.

The multitudes of your man-made Sola Fide, and interpretations of various Pastors, do not follow within the framework of God's Church ordered to Saint Peter. Matthew
16:16-19.
Protestants have no place in God's chosen people. Not member of the body of Christ, not member of the Covenant of Christ. For short, they are all heretics. John 6:53-59.

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 16:47:24   #
Doc110 Loc: York PA
 
Rose42,

Here is the Problem with your Protestant man-Made heretical Faith.

1. Number one you are not Christian. You are a Heretical man-Mad faith from Martin Luther and other Reformists . . .

2. The Protestant faith is a heretical schismatic faith that is separated from Christianity in 1517 AD.

3. You believe in a Man-Made Bible i.e. the King James heretical version from the Christian Bible.

4. You have heretical theology, and heretical doctrines that are not found in the Bible.

5. You Heretic Protestants have a separate and different heretical man-Made liturgy at your heretical Sunday service.

6. You do not practice the 7 Sacramental graces that Jesus Christ instructed and preached to his Apostles and taught to the Early church Patristic Fathers.

7. We know this because of the early Church documents recorded before the Bible was codified in 397 AD at the Catholic Council of Nicaea.

8. We have the manuscript "The Didache" . . . “The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles . . . The Early Church Patristic Fathers, 1st Century Manuscript Found in AD 1887
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0714.htm

Where in the mid to late 1st century we have a document that clearly shows early Catholic Church Mass worship liturgical services of the Eucharist.

We also have the description and practices of the seven Sacramental graces and what Jesus instructed the Apostles, and to the Early Church Fathers and the Catholic Church Hierarchy. etc.

Thats why the heretical Protestant man-Made faith, is not Christian


Rose42 wrote:


Christians have had scripture as long as the Catholics have. The Catholic church didn't give us the bible but they helped preserve it by copying it.

Know your history not forged history.

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 17:07:02   #
Rose42
 
Doc110 wrote:
Rose42,

Here is the Problem with your Protestant man-Made heretical Faith.

1. Number one you are not Christian. You are a Heretical man-Mad faith from Martin Luther and other Reformists . . .

2. The Protestant faith is a heretical schismatic faith that is separated from Christianity in 1517 AD.

3. You believe in a Man-Made Bible i.e. the King James heretical version from the Christian Bible.

4. You have heretical theology, and heretical doctrines that are not found in the Bible.

5. You Heretic Protestants have a separate and different heretical man-Made liturgy at your heretical Sunday service.

6. You do not practice the 7 Sacramental graces that Jesus Christ instructed and preached to his Apostles and taught to the Early church Patristic Fathers.

7. We know this because of the early Church documents recorded before the Bible was codified in 397 AD at the Catholic Council of Nicaea.

8. We have the manuscript "The Didache" . . . “The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles . . . The Early Church Patristic Fathers, 1st Century Manuscript Found in AD 1887
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0714.htm

Where in the mid to late 1st century we have a document that clearly shows early Catholic Church Mass worship liturgical services of the Eucharist.

We also have the description and practices of the seven Sacramental graces and what Jesus instructed the Apostles, and to the Early Church Fathers and the Catholic Church Hierarchy. etc.

Thats why the heretical Protestant man-Made faith, is not Christian
Rose42, br br Here is the Problem with your Prot... (show quote)


Is it logical or rational to think God would have the didache hidden until 1887? Why would a perfect and all knowing God, knowing everything that we need, omit any critical information from the bible? Answer - he wouldn't.

The authorship of the didache is in dispute. The Catholic church's opinion on it is totally irrelevant especially in light of their propensity for forging documents.

http://www.bereanpublishers.com/forged-documents-and-papal-power/

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 17:32:14   #
Radiance3
 
Rose42 wrote:
Is it logical or rational to think God would have the didache hidden until 1887? Why would a perfect and all knowing God, knowing everything that we need, omit any critical information from the bible? Answer - he wouldn't.

The authorship of the didache is in dispute. The Catholic church's opinion on it is totally irrelevant especially in light of their propensity for forging documents.

http://www.bereanpublishers.com/forged-documents-and-papal-power/

=============
The only people disputing the Didache are the Protestant heretics.

Didache, The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles, is a brief anonymous early Christian treatise, dated by most modern scholars to the first century.[2] The first line of this treatise is "The teaching of the Lord to the Gentiles (or Nations) by the twelve apostles".

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 17:45:26   #
Rose42
 
Venus3 wrote:
=============
The only people disputing the Didache are the Protestant heretics.

Didache, The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles, is a brief anonymous early Christian treatise, dated by most modern scholars to the first century.[2] The first line of this treatise is "The teaching of the Lord to the Gentiles (or Nations) by the twelve apostles".


Wrong. The only ones who claim it was definitely the apostles that wrote it are the Catholics.

I've read a lot of it. You do realize that first line doesn't mean it was written by the apostles don't you?

These are not inspired writings.

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 17:45:36   #
Doc110 Loc: York PA
 
Rose42,

In your Protestant pea-brain, all you are is a heretical Protestant, believing in a man-Made doctrine from Martin Luther and his man-Made KIV Bible.

What a lying crock of hog-wallop compost rose42 . . .

Please, . . . What a copy-cut-&-paste job from a notorious anti-Catholic website link, you don't say . . . more man-Made Protestant Heretical hog-wallop compost . . .



Look in your bible again, look where Jesus called Simon Bar Jonah in Aramaic, "Cephas," "Rock."

And I say to thee: That thou art "Caphas-Rock"; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Matthew 16:

Jesus Spoke Aramaic Jesus did not speak in Greek, and He said "Caphas-Peter" upon this rock I will build my church.


Jesus did not say upon myself I will build my church.

No Rose you can twist and turn, lie, convolute any argument you want.

You are absurd rose42.

All the Apostles spoke Aramaic

Paul spoke Aramaic.

The common Jewish person in the time of Jesus, in the Middle-east either spoke Aramaic, New Testament koine Greek, and not the Old Testament Septuagint Greek, Latin and only in the synagog or Temple, Hebrew was only spoken.

The book of Matthew and Mark was first written in the Aramaic then translated to the Greek and Hebrew languages

(For he who worked through Peter for the mission to the circumcised worked through me also for the Gentiles),
And when they perceived the grace that was given to me, James and Cephas and John, who were reputed to be pillars, gave to me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised;
Galatians 2:8-9

Peter and Cephas are both said in two separate verses, Why ?

Thats because Paul also spoke in the common tongue of the day Aramaic . . .

He first found his brother Simon and told him, “We have found the Messiah” (which is translated as Christ). 42Andrew brought him to Jesus, who looked at him and said, “You are Simon son of John. You will be called Cephas” (which is translated as Peter).
John 1:42

What I mean is that each one of you says, “I belong to Paul,” or “I belong to Apol′los,” or “I belong to Cephas,” or “I belong to Christ.”
1 Corinthians 1:12

Whether Paul or Apol′los or Cephas or the world or life or death or the present or the future, all are yours;
1 Corinthians 3:22

Do we not have the right to be accompanied by a wife, as the other apostles and the brethren of the Lord and Cephas?
1 Corinthians 9:5

And that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve.
1 Corinthians 15:5

Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas, and remained with him fifteen days.
Galatians 1:18

And when they perceived the grace that was given to me, James and Cephas and John, who were reputed to be pillars, gave to me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised;
Galatians 2:9

Paul Rebukes Peter at Antioch, But when Cephas came to Antioch I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned.
Galatians 2:11

But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas before them all, “If you, though a Jew, live like a Gentile and not like a Jew, how can you compel the Gentiles to live like Jews?”
Galatians 2:14


Your Fundamentalist friend is wrong to assert there is no evidence to support the idea of an Aramaic original. In fact, the evidence is quite to the contrary. Since we have no autographs of this or any other New Testament book, it's wise to look at what the early Church had to say on the subject. Catholic apologists, theologians, and Scripture scholars of the second through fifth centuries provide us with a wealth of information on this subject.

Around 180 Irenaeus of Lyons wrote that

Matthew also issued a written Gospel among the Hebrews in their own dialect, while Peter and Paul were preaching in Rome and laying the foundation of the Church. After their departure, Mark, the disciple and interpreter of Peter, did also hand down to us in writing what had been preached by Peter. Luke also, the companion of Paul, recorded in a book the Gospel preached by him. Afterwards John, the disciple of the Lord, who also had leaned upon his breast, did himself publish a Gospel during his residence at Ephesus in Asia. (Against Heresies 3:1:1)
Fifty years earlier Papias, bishop of Hieropolis in Asia Minor, wrote, "Matthew compiled the sayings [of the Lord] in the Aramaic language, and everyone translated them as well as he could" (Explanation of the Sayings of the Lord [cited by Eusebius in History of the Church 3:39]).

Sometime after 244 the Scripture scholar Origen wrote, "Among the four Gospels, which are the only indisputable ones in the Church of God under heaven, I have learned by tradition that the first was written by Matthew, who was once a publican, but afterwards an apostle of Jesus Christ, and it was prepared for the converts from Judaism and published in the Hebrew language" (Commentaries on Matthew [cited by Eusebius in History of the Church 6:25]).

Eusebius himself declared that "Matthew had begun by preaching to the Hebrews, and when he made up his mind to go to others too, he committed his own Gospel to writing in his native tongue [Aramaic], so that for those with whom he was no longer present the gap left by his departure was filled by what he wrote" (History of the Church 3:24 [inter 300-325]).

https://www.catholic.com/qa/was-matthews-gospel-first-written-in-aramaic-or-hebrew

Rose42 wrote:
ChristisstilltherockDoc.Nomatterhowmuchyouspamyoucan'trefuteGod'sword.Themostdisputedtextonecclesiolog(the doctrine of the church)isMatthe16:13–20.ProtestantsandEasterOrthodoxaikecontesttheuseofChrist’saffirmofPeterbyRomanCatholicstoestablis the papacy.Unfortunately, we can consider the issues raised by today’s passage only in brief. Foremost among these is what Jesus does not say in His commendation of Peter. Though invested with authority in verse 19, Peter is not thereby given supreme authority over the church universal. As a steward over God’s house, Peter’s keys give him (but not only him) authority among God’s people. For example, he can assure repentant sinners of divine pardon, not because he is able to forgive sin, but because he proclaims the free Gospel of forgiveness. Therefore, the keys also enable him to assure the impenitent that they can by no means inherit the kingdom of God. Yet Peter’s keys also belong to every apostle and, in a qualified sense, church leaders today as well (18:15–20; Eph. 2:19–20). Furthermore, Matthew 16:13–20 says nothing about Peter passing on a “unique” office to successive bishops, and it gives no support for papal infallibility.Historic Protestantism recognizes such truths, and often says that Peter’s confession is the rock to which Jesus refers. This makes good sense, but we err if we say that Peter himself is not in any sense a rock upon which the church is built (Eph. 2:22). There is a play on words in the original Greek text: Peter’s name, Petros, is based on petra, that is, “rock” (v. 18). In other words, Jesus declares, “Simon, you are the rock, and on this rock I will build my church.” Peter has primacy in the church — a historical primacy, not papal primacy. Aside from being the first to confess Christ, Peter is the first apostle to extend the Gospel to the Gentiles (Acts 10), and his leadership and teaching set the stage for the church’s expansion and maturity (chap. 1–15; 1 and 2 Peter). Thus, we conclude with John Calvin: “It is a foolish inference of the Papists, that he received the primacy, and became the universal head of the whole Church. Rank is a different thing from power, and to be elevated to the highest place of honor among a few persons is a different thing from embracing the whole world under his dominion.” https://www.ligonier.org/learn/devotionals/peter-rock/
ChristisstilltherockDoc.Nomatterhowmuchyouspamyouc... (show quote)

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Dec 15, 2018 17:48:10   #
Rose42
 
You again fail to refute God's word Doc.

You may want to read - Facts of History Which Refute and Contradict Roman Catholic Claims for the Papacy

https://christiantruth.com/articles/articles-roman-catholicism/papacy-and-the-facts-of-history/

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 18:03:11   #
Doc110 Loc: York PA
 
Rose 42

Your KIV Bible is a man-Made Protestant heretic translation, you Heretics try to associate the word of God with your Heretical man-made bible and heretical man-Made doctrines.



Here is a metaphor rose42, try and understand it.


Your heretical Protestant faiths are 30,000 raft in a celestial ocean, next to a Christian Ship sailing to Heaven.

And you're not on board the celestial Christian ship going to heaven, your Protestant Heretical raft faith is adrift on the ocean and is going no where.

Thats because you do not Follow Jesus Christ and his instructions, sacramentally and you have jettisoned all Catholic reasoning.

To be deep in history, is to cease being Protestant . . .

Rose42 wrote:

You again fail to refute God's word Doc.

You may want to read - Facts of History Which Refute and Contradict Roman Catholic Claims for the Papacy

https://christiantruth.com/articles/articles-roman-catholicism/papacy-and-the-facts-of-history/

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 18:10:09   #
Rose42
 
Doc110 wrote:
Rose 42

Your KIV Bible is a man-Made Protestant heretic translation, you Heretics try to associate the word of God with your Heretical man-made bible and heretical man-Made doctrines.



Here is a metaphor rose42, try and understand it.


Your heretical Protestant faiths are 30,000 raft in a celestial ocean, next to a Christian Ship sailing to Heaven.

And you're not on board the celestial Christian ship going to heaven, your Protestant Heretical raft faith is adrift on the ocean and is going no where.

Thats because you do not Follow Jesus Christ and his instructions, sacramentally and you have jettisoned all Catholic reasoning.

To be deep in history, is to cease being Protestant . . .
Rose 42 br br Your KIV Bible is a man-Made Protes... (show quote)


I'll say it again - Newman's statement is profoundly ignorant because he believed a church founded on lies. Christianity has its roots further back than the Catholic church does.

Learn some history Doc. See how the Catholics forged documents to support a papacy. Open the bible and look at the truth.

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Dec 15, 2018 18:22:01   #
Radiance3
 
Rose42 wrote:
I'll say it again - Newman's statement is profoundly ignorant because he believed a church founded on lies. Christianity has its roots further back than the Catholic church does.

Learn some history Doc. See how the Catholics forged documents to support a papacy. Open the bible and look at the truth.

==============
LYING heretic again. Nothing credible comes out from the mouth of this woman. It is a pattern of deception.

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 20:32:23   #
Radiance3
 
Rose42 wrote:
Wrong. The only ones who claim it was definitely the apostles that wrote it are the Catholics.

I've read a lot of it. You do realize that first line doesn't mean it was written by the apostles don't you?

These are not inspired writings.

===========
Your 500-year-old Scriptura, knows nothing about the history of the Didache. You have NO history.

The Didache was practiced since 110 CE or AD.
The Didache (“The Lord’s Teaching through the Twelve Apostles to the Nations.


‘Didache’ shows today’s Christians how little has changed in Tradition
Published: January 21, 2006
By Abbot Jerome Kodell, OSB
While he was on a trip to Constantinople in 1873, Orthodox Archbishop Philotheos Byrennios, who had been a professor of Church history, took the opportunity to browse in the ancient manuscript collection of the library of Holy Sepulchre Monastery. Much to his surprise and the world’s surprise, he discovered a copy of an early Christian writing that was thought to have disappeared completely, the “Teaching of the Twelve Apostles,” better known as the “Didache” (did-ah-kay) from the first word of the Greek title.

Reply
Dec 15, 2018 23:28:25   #
jack sequim wa Loc: Blanchard, Idaho
 
Rose42 wrote:
Is it logical or rational to think God would have the didache hidden until 1887? Why would a perfect and all knowing God, knowing everything that we need, omit any critical information from the bible? Answer - he wouldn't.

The authorship of the didache is in dispute. The Catholic church's opinion on it is totally irrelevant especially in light of their propensity for forging documents.

http://www.bereanpublishers.com/forged-documents-and-papal-power/



Rose42, I went through this material thoroughly, which sent me searching and found verification after verification. I was surprised the amount of credibile witnesses a majority from within the Catholic church.
I've been researching more on the sacrices held within the Vatican and again witnesses from within by the dozens as well as documents how the sacrifices are to be performed. Several witnesses took original documents of the secret sacrifices (animals, babies, children) to give with their testamony. Learning these are not limited to the Vatican alone and many of these rituals are held daily, several times a day for months at a time to summon the power of Satan upon the leaders of the church.
The power of the church in many nations is terrifying, and the number of investigations that end in the death of not only the investigators, but prosecuting attorneys, judges ect.

Thanks for posting this, the nun did a very good job documenting the spectrum of sources for documentation.

God Bless

Reply
Dec 16, 2018 01:41:44   #
Radiance3
 
jack sequim wa wrote:
Rose42, I went through this material thoroughly, which sent me searching and found verification after verification. I was surprised the amount of credibile witnesses a majority from within the Catholic church.
I've been researching more on the sacrices held within the Vatican and again witnesses from within by the dozens as well as documents how the sacrifices are to be performed. Several witnesses took original documents of the secret sacrifices (animals, babies, children) to give with their testamony. Learning these are not limited to the Vatican alone and many of these rituals are held daily, several times a day for months at a time to summon the power of Satan upon the leaders of the church.
The power of the church in many nations is terrifying, and the number of investigations that end in the death of not only the investigators, but prosecuting attorneys, judges ect.

Thanks for posting this, the nun did a very good job documenting the spectrum of sources for documentation.

God Bless
Rose42, I went through this material thoroughly, w... (show quote)

==============
Nothing could be credible from a mouth of a heretic. Lying and deceiving are their norms of standards in order to survive, and deceive people. Satan is the most deceptive demon on earth.

Reply
Dec 16, 2018 01:46:44   #
jack sequim wa Loc: Blanchard, Idaho
 
Venus3 wrote:
==============
Nothing could be credible from a mouth of a heretic. Lying and deceiving are their norms of standards in order to survive, and deceive people. Satan is the most deceptive demon on earth.




Your entire Roman Catholic church foundation is built on forged documents. Satan's work to deceive mankind.. Keep defending Satan's counterfeit church....

Reply
Dec 16, 2018 01:51:20   #
jack sequim wa Loc: Blanchard, Idaho
 
Venus3 wrote:
==============
Nothing could be credible from a mouth of a heretic. Lying and deceiving are their norms of standards in order to survive, and deceive people. Satan is the most deceptive demon on earth.




Its your church that is built on forged documents, nothing is true, it's all Satan's lie.

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