mwdegutis Loc: Illinois

In one of his novel-lengthed threads, Doc110 asked the question, “‘Salvation’ is a difficult complex subject, don’t you agree?”

NO, IT’S NOT DOC…IT’S AS SIMPLE AS ABC…

It is so simple that a child can understand and receive this wonderful gift. This is how to be saved, it is simply child-like, as simple as ABC.

A: Admit that you are a sinner
This is where that godly sorrow leads to genuine repentance for sinning against a righteous God and there is a change of heart. We change our mind and God changes our hearts and regenerates us from the inside out.

Romans 3:10 – As it is written: "There is none righteous, no, not one."
Romans 3:23 – For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

We are all born sinners which is why we must be born spiritually in order to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

Romans 6:23 – For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

The bad news is that the wages of sin is death. In other words, our sin means that we have been given a death sentence. We have the death penalty hanging over our heads. That's the bad news. But here's the good news. The good news is that the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Ephesians 2:8-9 – For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith —and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.

B: Believe in your heart that Jesus Christ died for your sins, was buried, and that God raised Jesus from the dead
This is trusting with all of your heart that Jesus Christ is who he said he was.

Romans 10:9-10 – That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.

C: Call upon the name of the Lord
Every single person who ever lived since Adam will bend their knee and confess with their mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord, the Lord of lords and the King of kings.

Romans 14:11 – For it is written: "As I live, says the Lord, Every knee shall bow to Me, And every tongue shall confess to God."

Don't wait until later – do this now.

Romans 10:13 – For "whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved."

But humanity rejects this simplicity outright. They mock and belittle the sacrifice of Jesus upon the cross. They refuse to believe that salvation rests solely in the work of God in the hearts of men. They refuse to submit their lives to the Lord and live according to His Word. Many today seek to develop a religion that pleases the flesh. This should come as no surprise to us. The Scriptures warn of such rebellion and rejection.

Radiance3

================
No Mwdegutis. You think salvation is given to you on a silver platter? Salvation is not as simple as ABC. You have to earn it, because our Lord Jesus Christ sacrificed and died to wash away our sins. Your Scriptures revised by Rev. Martin Luther during the 16th century is how you now justify that faith alone can save you.
However, here it is. You have so many conflicts because it was created by reformation of your Protestant Church.

But James 2:14-26 says otherwise.
James 2:14-26
14. " What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead."

18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without [a]your works, and I will show you my faith by [b]my works. 19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is [c]dead? 21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made [d]perfect? 23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was [e]accounted to him for righteousness.” And he was called the friend of God. 24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

25 Likewise, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also."

No wonder all your co-pastors' professional career is selling the Holy Scriptures in the podium and on TV, as they amass hundreds of millions of dollars of even millions of dollars for their own to keep, instead of helping the poor that the donors intend to do. That is your salvation.
Here they are:

All over the world I saw many of them on TV quoting all those verses of the Holy Scriptures and then use them to selling and motivating people to put more money in the coffer. That is how you preach.
Below is a list of the richest pastors in the world and their estimated net worth by selling the Holy Scriptures. Their merchandise is the Holy Bible.

Mark 8:36
36." For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?"

Matthew 22:36-40 KJV - Master, which is the great commandment?
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all they soul, with all thy might. 39 And the second is like unto it, "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.

So Mwdegutis, since you believe that faith in God alone saves. What about when your neighbor is hungry, the children are hungry, you just say, "have a good day, I love the Lord."

-----------------
Here are your brethren Mwdegutis:
#50 – Paul Cain ($1 Million) – He’s a Pentecostal Minister.
#49 – Bill Moyers ($1 Million).
#48 – Richard Rossi ($1 Million) – In 1984, he opened his first church – The Fellowship.
#47 – Charles Stanley ($1.5 Million) – Currently pastors the First Baptist Church. He runs “In Touch with Dr. Charles Stanley,” which airs across many radio and TV networks.
#46 – Jimmy Swaggart ($1.5 Million) – He’s been in the gospel ministry for more than 50 years. He earns his income from his music, radio, and television ministry.
#45 – Robert Charles Sproul ($2 Million) – Founder and chairman of Ligonier Ministries.
#44 – N.T. Wright ($2.5 Million) – Ranked among the most popular New Testament scholars in Great Britain.
#43 – Jack Van Impe ($2.5 Million) – Founder of Jack Van Impe Ministries International Foundation.

#42 – Louis Farrakhan ($3 Million) – Spearheaded 1995 Million Man March in Washington, D.C. Farrakhan said.
Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan called America "the most rotten nation on Earth" in a video making the rounds of social media. On March 2008, Farrakhan said, "GD America, the chickens have come home to roast."

#41 – Ernie Fletcher ($3 Million) – A politician, a preacher, and a physician.
#40 – Clifton Davis ($3 Million) – An American pastor, actor, singer, and songwriter.
#39 – Reinhard Bonnke ($4 Million) – Claims to have evangelized to the highest number of people than any other preacher. Has been in the ministry for more than 50 years and has crisscrossed Africa in the mission.
#38 – Tony Campolo ($4 Million) – Founder of the Evangelical Association for the Promotion of Education.
#37 – Leroy Jenkins ($4 Million) – Founder of “Leroy Jenkins Ministries,” healing miracle ministry in which they use “miracle water.”
#36 – Noel Jones ($5 Million) -Became pastor at the Greater Bethany Community Church in Los Angeles in 1994.
#35 – John Hagee ($5 Million) – Established John Hagee Ministries. His sermons are aired on both television and radio.
#34 – Joseph Prince ($5 Million) – Prince rose to become Senior Pastor at the New Creation Church, one of Asia’s megachurches.
#33 – Al Sharpton ($5 Million) – Sharpton became a Baptist minister in 1994.
#32 – Eddie Long ($5 Million) – Took over the leadership of New Birth Missionary Baptist Church in 1987.
#31 – Kay Arthur ($5 Million).
#30 – John MacArthur ($5 Million) – Has been the president of Grace Community Church in Los Angeles from 1984 to date.
#29 – Paula White ($5 Million) – The current Senior Pastor of the New Destiny Christian Center in Apopka, Florida.
#28 – Ravi Zacharias ($7.5 Million) – An Indian-born apologist known for evangelizing to American soldiers in Vietnam in 1971.

#27 – Chris Okotie ($7.5 Million) – A Nigerian pastor and televangelist who heads the Household of God Church International Ministries, a Pentecostal church in Lagos, Nigeria.
#26 – Juanita Bynum ($10 Million) – An American Pentecostal televangelist.
#25 – Matthew Ashimolowo ($10 Million) – A Nigerian pastor and the current Senior Pastor of the Kingsway International Christian Centre.
#24 – Jesse Jackson ($10 Million) – An American Civil rights activist, politician and a Baptism Minister.

#23 – Joyce Meyer ($10 Million) – A charismatic American Christian author and speaker.
She uses gold toilet seat worth $20 million.

#22 – Peter Popoff ($10 Million) – A German-American televangelist.
#21 – Ed Young ($11 Million) – Founder and the current Senior Pastor of his “Fellowship Church.”

#20 – T.B. Joshua ($15 Million) – A Nigerian evangelist and a self-proclaimed prophet.
#19 – Cindy Trimm ($15 Million) – Pastor at Florida’s Embassy Worship Center.
#18 – Ernest Angley ($15 Million) – An American evangelist, author, and owner of a television station.

#17 – Thomas Dexter Jakes Sr. (T.D. Jakes) ($18 Million) – An American pastor, author, and filmmaker. He is the presiding bishop of The Potter’s House, a 30,000-member church.
#16 – Kirk Cameron ($20 Million) – An evangelist, TV actor and a show host.
#15 – Billy Graham ($25 Million).

#14 – Rick Warren ($25 Million) – Founder of Saddleback Church.
#13 – Kenneth Copeland ($26.5 Million) – Televangelist and one of the Charismatic Movement.

#12 – Creflo Dollar ($27 Million) – Televangelist, pastor, and the founder of the non-denominational World Changers Church International in Atlanta, Georgia.
#11 – John Danforth ($30 Million) – A politician-pastor.

#10 – Joel Osteen ($40 Million) – American preacher and televangelist. He is the Senior Pastor of Lakewood Church, United States’ largest Protestant church. Expert in selling the words of God in the pulpit and on TV.

#9 – Benny Hinn ($42 Million) – An American televangelist best known for his Miracle Crusades. Experts on selling his miracle crusades where people pay him to get healed.
Matthew 10:8 Jesus said to His disciples to preach the Gospel. "Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse the lepers.You have received free of charge; give free of charge. "

#8 – Chris Oyakhilome ($50 Million) – A Nigerian minister.
#7 – Janice Crouch ($50 Million) – American religious broadcaster.
#6 – Robert Tilton ($50 Million) – American prosperity gospel televangelist.
#5 – Enoch Adeboye ($55 Million) – Nigerian Pastor and the General Overseer of the Redeemed Christian Church of God.
#4 – David Oyedepo ($150 Million) – Nigerian Christian author, preacher, and the founder and Presiding Bishop of Living Faith Church World Wide, which is widely known as the Winners’ Chapel.
#3 – George Foreman ($250 Million) – Two-time World Heavyweight Champion and Olympic gold medalist.
#2- Pat Robertson ($500 Million) – Founder of the ABC Family Channel and Regent University and one of America’s biggest names in the evangelical industry.

**#1 – Edir Macedo ($1.1 Billion) – Brazillian evangelical leader and a prosperity gospel preacher. Has mainly gotten his wealth by spending church funds. When questioned for his wealth, his answer was, “If I preach prosperity and my clothes are ragged, who will follow me?”
Source

by Taboola
Sponsored Links
From The Web.

In addition, many of these multi-millionaires and billionaire, VIOLATE IRS- the federal taxes by hiding in the guise of 501c (3)-Non-profit. But the money earned goes directly to their amassing their billions and millions of wealth. That is why for a short period of reciting the word of God at the podium or on TV, they become multi-millionaires.
Their merchandise is the Holly Bible.

That is where you align and believe, while you find all faults of the Catholic church that your Bible has revised original during the 16th century reformation. You ignore the various sinful schemes and greed of your Church. They also violate the Federal laws of the IRS.

So many of the Protestant Pastors make a living comfortably. With hundreds of millions suffering all over the world, the Protestant pastors live in luxury.

John 21:15-17
Jesus begins by questioning Peter about His love for Him, and each time Peter answers in the affirmative, Jesus follows up with the command for Peter to feed His sheep. His meaning is that, if Peter truly loves his Master, he is to shepherd and care for those who belong to Christ.

WE have to care for those less fortunate, and that is what the Catholic Church does locally and all over the world. The Lord Jesus Christ said so in John 21: 15-17.

mwdegutis Loc: Illinois

With all due respect Radiance, this is from the Catholic Bible…
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God—not the result of works, so that no one may boast. Ephesians 2:8-9 New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)

Concerning James 2, I’ll consider vv. 14-20 which talk about faith vs. works (also from the NSRV).

Just as the law of love gives no excuse for respect of persons, so the possession of faith gives no license to dispense with good works. A believer must not only demonstrate his love by ready acceptance of others, but he must also demonstrate his faith by responsible aid to others. Here, James emphasizes the expression of true faith, outlines the evidence of true faith, and finally cites examples of true faith.

2:14 – What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if you say you have faith but do not have works? Can faith save you?
James introduces this paragraph with a rhetorical question, What good is it... if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? The emphasis is not on the true nature of faith but on the false claim of faith. It is the spurious boast of faith that James condemned. Such "faith" does no "good"; there is no "profit" (ophelos). It is worthless because it is all talk with no walk. It is only a habitual empty boast. Can such faith save him? Merely claiming to have faith is not enough. Genuine faith is evidenced by works.

2:15-16 – If a brother or sister is naked and lacks daily food, and one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and eat your fill,” and yet you do not supply their bodily needs, what is the good of that?
The rhetorical question is followed by a hypothetical but realistic illustration: Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. For one in need of the basics of life, sentimental good wishes do little good, like the common Jewish farewell, Go, I wish you well (lit., "Go in peace"). If nothing is done to fill the pressing need for warm clothes and satisfying food, what good is it? The same phrase that James used to introduce this paragraph (James 2:14) is repeated for emphasis.

2:17 – So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.
The vain boast, faith by itself, or faith in and of itself with no evidence of action, is dead. Workless faith is worthless faith; it is unproductive, sterile, barren, dead! Great claims may be made about a corpse that is supposed to have come to life, but if it does not move, if there are no vital signs, no heartbeat, no perceptible pulse, it is still dead. The false claims are silenced by the evidence.

2:18 – But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I by my works will show you my faith.
This may be one of the most misunderstood sections of the entire epistle. But someone will say, You have faith; I have works. An imaginary respondent, "someone," was introduced. He did not object to James' conclusion. He agreed that faith without works is dead. But he wrongly disparaged faith while stressing works.

What follows, Show me your faith apart from your works, and I by my works will show you my faith, may be the continuation of the respondent's words. If so, they should be included within quotation marks. (If this were James' response to a contender's "I have works," James would have written, "Show me your works without faith.") It seems, however, that the respondent is throwing down the challenge, "Show me your faith apart from (chōris, 'without') works, and I will show you my faith by (ek, 'emerging from') my works."

2:19 – You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder.
It may be well to include even verse 19 as part of the respondent's argument: You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder. If so, he may be a typical Gentile believer who attacked the creedal belief of monotheism accepted by all Jews. He was saying, to "believe" in one God may be good so far as it goes, but it does not go far enough. The demons do that. In fact, not only do they believe (the same verb, pisteuōʾ; they even "shudder," or "bristle up" (phrissousin, an onomatopoeic verb used only here in the NT). The "belief" in one God may not be "trust" in that God. Unless it is "trust," it is not true faith and will not be evidenced in good works.

In other words, the respondent is saying, "Faith is not the key; what counts is works." Thus, the respondent has gone too far. James did not say that works are essential to faith, or that faith is unimportant. His argument was that works are evidence of faith.

Other writers understand this passage to mean that James (v. 18b) challenged the "someone" to show his faith without deeds—the point being that it cannot be done! James, however, said that faith can be demonstrated (only) by what one does (v. 18c). The demons' "belief" in God is inadequate. Such a so-called but unreal faith is obviously unaccompanied by deeds on their parts.

2:20 – Do you want to be shown, you senseless person, that faith apart from works is barren?
James did not launch into a lengthy refutation of the respondent. The apostle simply addressed him forcefully, You senseless person, and returned to his original argument that faith without works is useless (argē, "lazy, idle, negligent"). The adjective "senseless" (kene) is usually translated "vain," "empty," or "hollow". Flimsy faith is dead; so are empty, faithless works. James' argument is not pro-works/anti-faith or pro-faith/anti-works. He has simply said that genuine faith is accompanied by good works. Spiritual works are the evidence, not the energizer, of sincere faith.

Radiance3

=================
I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT THE ENERGIZER.

The foundation of works is faith.
You cannot have works without faith. Works because your faith is loving thy neighbor as you love thyself. And you put that into action.

Now how do you reconcile these variables and discrepancies? I believe that faith and works must be together, and that is what our Lord Jesus Christ wants us to do.
HOWEVER...
Psalm 68:5
5 A father to the fatherless, a defender of widows, is God in his holy dwelling.
So, God does not expect the helpless to have the works, but faith alone could save them.

That is why God loves the poor. But God expect those who are strong to help the weak.
And the strong with faith and the love of God, share his strength to the weak. That is why those who are blessed with abundance must share to those in need.

I do have deep faith in the Lord. Is that enough? No, I must help take care of His lamb.
That is why we share our lives helping others who are not able to. Reasons why America has been helping those helpless all over the world, because we are a Christian country. Praise God!

Radiance3

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Part 2

The energizer you are talking about is faith. But I am not talking about that ALONE. That energy of faith must be put into action (works).

Radiance3

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I think you are becoming boring to me. You are reciting all those verses above to me. What do you think I am doing? I don't know those? That is what Christians must do to have faith.

You think Protestants are the only ones doing that? We Catholics do that every day, or for me every hour of the day. So, why do you recite those to me. Is that your only defense on your faith alone could save you? Those verses indicated that faith must be with works. As I have explained earlier, how faith alone could save without works.

You keep on reciting to me. I think you sound funny because you think you are the only one who knows those. Have a blessed day!

Doc110 Loc: York PA

mwdegutis,

1. Protestants, have an over simplification and a unique individualistic self-interpretation of the Bible New and Old Testament.

2. If I post factual internet articles, and URL links. Read the articles they give great bearing on the Article subjects.


Protestants consistently ignore ancient religious manuscripts and history outside of the Bible from the 1st century up to the 16th century; and up to the present 21st century.

And yet they read any and all new-age and from the enlightened books from the 16th century to the 21st century Christian books

That is Religious hypocrisy, and a religious double standard . . .


Here is a difficult quotation, that protestants get very upset, when they read this factual statements.

”To be “Deep In History” is to understanding the meaning of history and to understand it’s relevance to our present day lives."
Dr. Kenneth Howell

“To be deep in history, is to cease to be Protestant.”
Cardinal John Henry Newman


Now thats a qualifying statement. And that's where no "Protestant" will ever go there. They go into hiding

That's because you have no concept of the Church founded by Jesus Christ to our ancient history of 1,986 years to our present age.


Thats what OPP Forum Protestants conveniently perpetrate and consistently do, when confronted with the Religious Historical truths.

They put their Protestant heads in the sand like an ostrich, as if it didn't happen.

The cliche, of the three moneys comes to mind. "See no evil," "Hear no evil," but they defiantly "speak anti-Catholic evil."


This will always be the case if people are not intentional about revisiting the historical doctrine before sola Scriptura.

While we should desire our people to respect the beliefs of past generations, understanding that God is a God of history, but Protestants don't . . . acknowledge Christ's teachings.


Evangelicals do not believe that any Sacrament, Church Tradition History, Nicene Creed, or Confession-Penance, Baptism, Eucharist, Confirmation, Matrimony, Priestly Holy Orders, and Anointing of the Sick, is infallible. This is what Jesus Christ taught and commanded . . .

The Scripture was not there to conform to the traditions, but to create the new Church traditions.

And thats why there are presently 30,000 thousand Protestant denominations . . . and exponentially growing . . .

How very sad for Protestants, and Jesus asked that we disciples and we Christians are to remain as one . . .


1. Luther read the Holy Scriptures for himself. He did not seek to confirm the traditions which he was taught from his Benedictine priestly orders (for these had caused him great fear); he sought to understand the Scriptures on their own personal terms.

Thus came the doctrine of sola Scriptura. The Scripture was not there to conform to the early Church traditions, but to create the new Christian traditions.

Nor did Luther have the manuscripts the, "Didache."

Describing the Mass, baptism, the Eucharist, Sacraments and how the Catholic Community in the first century practice their faith?
a. https://www.onepoliticalplaza.com/t-139479-1.html
b. Free. https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04779a.htm



And it's not as easy as ABC, . . . mwdegutis:

Here is what I found in Gods truth and majesty which is always Love.

1. The Gift of Salvation: Protestant Evangelicals The Memo You missed ! Errors of their ways !
https://www.onepoliticalplaza.com/t-140560-1.html

2. Evangelicals & Catholics Together: The Christian Mission in the Third Millennium
http://www.leaderu.com/ftissues/ft9405/articles/mission.html

Here is 26 facts of Salvation and fundamental truths of Salvation and summary of the Article


Takes the wind out of their hatred of our Catholic church, by perpetrators the other protestant agitators on this site.

It shuts them up on all of self-made protestants objections and anti-Catholic personal beliefs.


A. The Gift of God's Salvation.

B. In justification we receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

C. The grace of Christ and the gift of the Spirit received through faith.

D. Faith.

E. Baptism.

F. Baptism into Death.

G. Law of love in obedience to Jesus Christ.

H. Sanctification. Scripture calls this the life of holiness.

I. Purify ourselves from everything that contaminates body and spirit.

J. Perfecting holiness out of reverence for God.

K. Sanctification, is progressively furthered as we struggle, with God’s grace and help, against adversity and temptation.

M. In humble repentance and confidently ask for, and receive, his forgiveness.

N. God heals our Suffering.

O. Faith we dare not presume, promise of God and about our eternal future, our firm hope, to encourage one another, in such hope we rejoice.

P. Believers, the coming of the salvation to be revealed as justified sinners we have been saved, this is the gift of God. Bearers of the good news, to serve one another, to evangelize.

Q. Evangelicals, and Catholics, speaking the truth in love with unity of the Holy Spirit in the bond of peace, that the body of Christ may be built up and we defend religious freedom.

R. Baptismal regeneration, the Eucharist, and sacramental grace.

S. Language of justification and transformative righteousness.

T. Justification is by faith alone, the faith that receives salvation is never alone.

U. Understandings of works, merit, reward, purgatory, and indulgences.

V. Marian devotion and the assistance of the saints in the life of salvation.

W. Bearing witness together to God’s gift of salvation in Christ.

X. Jesus said, No divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought.

Y. Affirm our unity in the Gospel that we have here professed, unity in the truth, pleasing to the Lord and Savior whom we together serve.

Z. For he is "The way, the truth, and the life.

Doc110


Jesus does-not teach or instruct, “Sola Scriptura.” This is “Man-Made Theology.”

Deep In History: Breaking through the Myth’s of Christian History
https://www.onepoliticalplaza.com/t-139582-1.html

a. ”To be “Deep In History” is to understanding the meaning of history and to understand it’s relevance to our present day lives."
Dr. Kenneth Howell

b. ”To be Deep in History, “To be deep in history, is to cease to be Protestant.”
Cardinal John Henry Newman


And yet mwdegutis, I see that you don't address or refute any of the factual responses.

Also you never give information of your evangelical Protestant background and your journey to you're religious path to the Church that you belong to.

I'm a easy target because I'm a cradle catholic, But I'm knowledgeable, on the Book of Mormon, Vedas religious books, Koran, and the Protestant reformers.


And you mwdegutis continue to take the OPP forum Low-Road low of over simplistic Protestant interpretive one-liner answers.

You have no reference, to your sola Scriptura answers to justify your argument means.

Also I find the disingenuous protestant lack of answers and never refuting the Religious facts.

Yes I did say the disingenuous Protestant Low-Road . . .

We are talking my Catholic Father's that you and others get completely wrong

Doc110

mwdegutis Loc: Illinois

I see...salvation is not as easy as ABC and is so simple that a child could understand it, it's as convoluted as A through Z and as you yourself said, "so difficult and complex," one needs 26 steps and a PhD to understand it...RIIIIGHT!

For God is not a God of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints. 1 Corinthians 14:33

Your posts are nothing but confusion and full of discord.

Lastly Doc, why don't you take me off ignore so we can openly debate these subjects without me having to resort to posting other threads to debate with you?