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The Bible Says Call No Man Father! Answers to Common Objections
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/scottericalt/call-no-man-father/?
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/scottericalt/

Odd it is that the same person who insists that “This is my body” is just a metaphor also insists that, “Call no man father” must be utterly literal.
www.patheos.com/blogs/scottericalt/catholics-pray-to-dead-saints/

What is a religious interpretive doctrinal metaphor ?
a. A figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance, as in “A mighty fortress is our
God.”Compare mixed metaphor, something used, or regarded as being used, to represent something else; emblem; symbol.
b. Mixed-Metaphor the use in the same expression of two or more metaphors that are incongruous or illogical when combined.

For example:

But no one really thinks that I can not call my dad “father.” No one really thinks I can not call George Washington “the father of his country.” (Well, maybe there are a few oddballs who do say such things, but the real objection is not to calling dads “father” or Washingtons “father” but to calling priests “father.” The objection is reserved for priests.)

And, to be fair, there is a certain logic in this particular limitation. Even though Christ says “call no man father,” the context is a discussion of religious titles. This is part of a longer biblical passage in which Christ condemns the Pharisees.
http://biblehub.com/matthew/23-9.htm

All their works they do for to be seen of men. They make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments, and love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues, and greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi. But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren. And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.

Of course, Christ does not just say “Call no man father,” but “call no man master” and “call no man teacher.” So must we not use the phrase “master craftsman”? Should I refrain from saying, “Dr. Allen is my piano teacher”? For that matter, should we stop giving anyone doctoral degrees? (“Doctor” means “teacher,” since it comes from the Latin docere, meaning “to teach.”)

Yes, I know the context is religious titles. And I am getting there. But John MacArthur, a noted anti-Catholic minister, is called Dr. MacArthur. No one cites Matthew 23:10.
No one cites that verse, either, against Dr.* James White being called “doctor.” The unaccredited diploma mill is enough of an objection where he is concerned.

So, again, this is all very selective. This is all about the Catholic priesthood. The one thing Christ really forbids, apparently, is to call priests “father.”

But we may certainly call our ancestors “father.” “Was not our father Abraham,” St. James asks, “justified by works?” (See what I did there?)
http://biblehub.com/james/2-21.htm

Now, Abraham was not merely the father of the nation of Israel. He was also the father of the faith of Israel. Indeed, Abraham, according to St. Paul, is the father of all who have faith:

Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all
http://biblehub.com/romans/4-16.htm

So here—and specifically in a religious context—Abraham is called “the father of us all.” Moreover, Paul frequently reminds us of his own role as a spiritual father. He is a father to Timothy
1 Cor. 4:17;
biblehub.com/1_corinthians/4-17.htm
1 Tim. 1:2;
biblehub.com/1_timothy/1-2.htm
Phil 2:22).
biblehub.com/philippians/2-22.htm

He is a father to Titus Titus 1:4.
biblehub.com/titus/1-4.htm

He is a father to Onesimus, Philemon 10.
biblehub.com/philemon/1-10.htm

And he writes to the Corinthians: “I became your father in Christ Jesus through the gospel”
1 Cor. 4:14–15.
http://biblehub.com/niv/1_corinthians/14.htm

So then, what did Jesus mean by “call no man father”? Matthew 23:9; 1 Peter 1:17
http://biblehub.com/matthew/23-9.htm
http://biblehub.com/1_peter/1-17.htm

I think the key to answering that is to note that, if he is speaking about religious titles, he is also speaking about conceit and pretentiousness.

He is speaking about people who love to lord their titles over others. They love to be called “father” and “master” and “teacher.” They love the chief seats, the upper rooms, greetings in the marketplace. Like Narcissus, they would gaze into the water upon their broad phylacteries. It’s not titles, per se that piques Christ’s ire, but pretense.

And this is why Christ decides to give his disciples a lesson, not about vocabulary, but about the fact that the source of all authority, the source of all fatherhood, and all knowledge, and all instruction, is in God. It’s not all about you, Pharisees; stop being so vain.

That’s the sense of what Christ says; “call no man father” is used constantly in contentious, and disputatious scholarly religious discussions with Independent and Evangelical Protestants.

*** Hyperbole, a typical single minded (literal device use), a deliberate religious tangent-mindset to derail all opposing points of views and understanding to the context of what was said and is implied.

*** Hyperbole is used to be argumentative or is used for exaggeration as a rhetorical device, a figure of speech for dramatic effect, usually in speech and writing; to make that point.
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=dramatic

That’s the sense of what Christ says; “call no man father” is hyperbole to make that understandable the literal religious biblical objection points some may have !

bahmer

Even though I am not catholic I enjoy your posts welcome back.

Doc110 Loc: York PA

Good to hear from you also bahmer, thank you for your Christian kindness and religious understanding.


bahmer, Unofficially your Catholic, but you still don't know it yet. :) smiles . . .


But do you reject or agree to the article posts and facts presented ? Tell me did you enjoy the factual articles and Catholic religious points and argumentation ? Is it Valid ?

i.e. "The Bible, Says Call No Man Father ! But is that a literal religious seriatim opinion" ?

Any thoughts on the subject or critique as to the pro's and con's foundational validity of the articles? And the historical timeline facts and the religious correction rebuttal by Catholic apologist Dave Armstrong ?


Say bahmer, when you get a chance please check out "The Coming Home Network Channel" and provided url links below, and are about religious conversion stories and personal testimony's that are spiritually uplifting.

The one hour television show is hosted by former Protestant Minister Marcus Grodi, who assists many Christian Protestants faiths ministers, Atheists, Buddhist, Jewish, Islam converts and Catholic reverts. About the gift seeds of the Holy Spirit guiding them on their spiritual journey.

This wonderful website aired Monday nights, weekly, and held on the EWTN Network for almost twenty years and is found on most cable stations. This television show is remarkable and is religiously tasteful and accurately portrays individuals and clergy from all walks of faith, and what they have learn on their "walk of "Faith." The guests discuss their spiritual backgrounds and journey to understand the authenticity of the Catholic faith, and who have journeyed home to the Catholic Church.

Marcus Grodi's show ending motto is, "Welcome Home" to the Catholic Faith and Church".

www.ewtn.com/TV/LIVE/JOURNEYHOME.ASP
https://chnetwork.org/journey-home/
https://www.youtube.com/user/ComingHomeNetwork


Here is a very poignant quotation by Cardinal John Henry Newman, and the focal point contention as to the theology, teaching and canonical authenticity of the Catholic Church.

“To be deep in history, is to cease to be Protestant.”

https://www.aquinasandmore.com/catholic-articles/41-famous-quotes-from-cardinal-newman/category/1/article/335

Venerable John Henry Cardinal Newman (1801-1890) was a convert to Catholicism from the Church of England, and one of the great minds of the 19th century. As a Roman Catholic priest he became one of the greatest Catholic recent apologists in the history of the Church. He was a prolific writer and persuasive preacher.


bahmer, I'd like to change the subject and the above topic, and would like to discuss my factual understanding as how we got our OT Greek translated Septuagint Bible by Jewish scholars, and was codified and accepted into the OT Christian Catholic Bible. I do strongly urge you to read all articles and url links below, to get a better understanding of the canonical book facts and how history and historians have totally change, Christian reality and understanding of the origins of OT and NT Bible formation and Cannon.

bahmer, When and if you do read, and do the research on the Early Church Fathers (ECF's). As to the authenticity, historical claims of the Christian Universal Catholic Church and it's unchanging 2,000 year Magisterial tradition's and Church teachings.

Your Christian understanding and viewpoint, may even change and move to the Catholic faith belief ?

Provided below is a Christian Historical timeline, url web pages, throughly researched articles by Catholic apologist Dave Armstrong who contradicts and disputes the 'Historical Timeline" of current Biblical historians, and the actual text writings of the Early Church Fathers (ECF's), i.e. Justin Martyr, Didache, the Shepherd of Hermas, Irenaeus, Tertullian, Clement of Alexandria.

An Example i.e. No Early Church Father writer got all the 72 books right (and excluded others, later decided to be uncanonical) until St. Athanasius in 367, more than 300 years after Christ’s death.

The famous Muratorian Canon of c. 190 excluded Hebrews, James, and 1 and 2 Peter and included The Apocalypse of Peter and Wisdom of Solomon. The Council of Nicaea in 325 questioned the canonicity of James, 2 Peter, 2 John, 3 John, and Jude. James wasn’t even quoted in the West until around 350 A.D.!

Revelation was rejected by Cyril of Jerusalem, John Chrysostom, and Gregory Nazianzen, and the Epistle of Barnabas and Shepherd of Hermas were included in the Codex Sinaiticus in the late 4th century.


With this said. Here's two articles and url links and a brief chronology of how we got the Gospels, (Godspell), The Good News i.e. 'The Good Book'
https://www.christianitytoday.com/history/issues/issue-43/how-we-got-our-bible-christian-history-timeline.html
www.patheos.com/blogs/davearmstrong/2018/07/development-of-the-biblical-canon-protestant-difficulties.html


In Armstrongs article, (ECF's) writings on Catholic Church history, such as oral Church tradition, accurately records the four Gospels and Acts of the Apostles, and past Septuagint actual canonical formation of the 72 New Testament Bible books, i.e. deuterocanonical books of 1600 years, written records of the Early Church Fathers (ECF's), vs the Protestant 66 New Testament Bible books, changes and subsequent removal of many verses in several OT removal of the “Apocryphal" books and NT Bible.

Presently there are 7 Protestants bible books missing for over 500 years, starting from 1517 A.D. which has been reject by the Protestant canon as “Apocryphal, i.e. "doubtful authorship" or "authenticity" by Martin Luther.

The seven books are, — Sirach, Tobit, Wisdom, Judith, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and Baruch, as well as longer versions of Daniel and Esther — that are found in the Old Testament canon used by Catholics

The Catholic Church councils at Hippo (393) and Carthage (397, 419) listed the deuterocanonical books (and the other 66 books) as Scripture, endorsing what had become the general belief of the universal Church. Pope Innocent I sanctioned the first two conciliar rulings in his Letter to Exsuperius in 405. The Council of Trent confirmed this canon in 1548.
a. https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/religion-and-philosophy/apologetics/5-myths-about-7-books.html
b. http://www.ncregister.com/blog/darmstrong/how-to-defend-the-deuterocanon-or-apocrypha


bahmer, I strongly urge you to read all articles below, to get a better understanding of the canonical book facts and how history and historians have totally change Christian reality and religious history.

Here is the current Protestant faith and independent's faith's dilemma regarding to 'Sola Scriptura," "The Bible Only," minus the history!

The task of the Protestant faiths is to come up with a consistent criterion of a legitimate Biblical cannon development. The biblical canon is a unique issue, since all Protestant parties agree that it is utterly absent from Scripture itself.

This creates great difficulties both for the "sola Scriptura" paradigm of formal authority, and also with regard to the Protestant polemic against and antipathy towards so-called “unbiblical” or “extra-biblical” Catholic doctrines which at least have some Old Testament biblical indication — however insignificant the Protestant critic thinks it is.

Moreover, the Protestant Church and laity individual has to explain how 400 years of Christian Biblical Church Tradition is wonderful and binding in one instance (the Biblical Canon) but in no other, i.e Sola Scriptura. These are serious Christian divisional issues, and highly problematic. Protestants canon accountability is missing 360 years, the One True Catholic Church and is guided by the Holy Spirit and Catholic Magisterium.


bahmer, for almost 360 years before the codification of the Bible cannon in Catholic Church, i.e. Councils at Hippo (393) and Carthage (397, 419) establishes orthodox OT & NT canon (47 & 27 books) confirmed at the "Council of Trent” 1545-1563.

The Holy Spirit then and now continues to inspire and guides the Catholic Church and Catholic Church 2,000 year Magisterium teaching, From Saint Peter and all the subsequent Pope's, the 11 Apostles, and the many Early Church Fathers (ECF's) writings, Bishops, Priest's, Deacon's and the Church laity. By the instruction's of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost and Jesus Christ's direct oral teachings, and written recorded in Catholic Church oral traditions.

There's no doubt to the Canonicity of the Catholic Bible of 2,000 years and the historical and written clarification by apologist Dave Armstrongs, url website articles.
a. https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/religion-and-philosophy/apologetics/5-myths-about-7-books.html
b. http://www.ncregister.com/blog/darmstrong/how-to-defend-the-deuterocanon-or-apocrypha.

During this early 360 years of the fledgling Catholic Church there were no Christian Churches and the celebrated Mass's, Where the Holy Eucharist, Blood, soul and divinity were practiced to the faithful daily and at Sunday worship were practiced in private homes, tunnels-caves and remote locations.

The beginning of Christian Percussion started with the death of John the Baptist and Crucifixion and Death of Jesus Christ in 33 A.D. By King Herod and (Herod Antipas-Herod Antipater) and the leaders of the Jewish leadership. The three Major Jewish religious and political sects i.e. The Pharisees, Sadducees, and the Essenes. We have documentation of Saint Paul's percussion of the early Christians and Apostle. With the first recorded martyrdom of deacon Saint Stephen condemned and stoned before the Jewish Pharisees and Sadducees.

The official Roman percussion of the early Church of Christians by the Roman government took place under the emperor Nero in 64 AD after the Great Fire of Rome. The Christian Church percussions ended with Diocletian and Galerius, 302–303 - The Diocletianicor or Great Persecution was the last and most severe persecution of Christians in the Roman Empire. In 303, the Emperors Diocletian, Maximian, Galerius, and Constantius issued a series of edicts rescinding Christians' legal rights and demanding that they comply with traditional religious practices.

Emperor Constantine of the Eastern Roman Empire is perhaps best known for being the first Christian Roman emperor. His rule changed the Church greatly. In February 313, Constantine met with Licinius in Milan where they made the Edict of Milan. The edict said that Christians could believe what ever they wanted. With the passage of this new law in 313 AD of the Edict of Milan, persecution of Christians by the Roman State ceased, and with Catholic direction of Saint Peter and subsequent Pope's, the 11 Disciples Apostles and Early Church Fathers (ECF's) teaching guided by the Holy Spirit to the Catholic Church, the OT & NT Bible, was somewhat unofficially Codified.

“A council probably held at Rome in 382 under St. Damasus gave a complete list of the canonical books of both the Old Testament and New Testament . . . which is identical with the list given at the "Council of Trent.” The Old Testament i.e The Septuagint books 250–200 B.C., was never in question, the 72 Jewish Greek scholar translation was accepted by the Jewish people and the Early Christian Catholic Church, but Martin Luther has several rewrites of many of the Old Testament Books and many book verses.
(The Oxford Dictionary of the Christian Church)

But the Codification of the New Testament Bible was in question from the first writings of the 4 Gospels and Acts of the Apostles i.e. Disciples of Jesus, Matthew, Mark, John, Saint Luke and Saint Paul. Regarding the Letters of the Apostles, were to address the problems that the early Catholic Church, discussion, Catholic Jewishness differences, schisims, interpretations and ongoing dividing Christian sects. Sadly this continues to this very day and

Jesus in his imfafous glory, splendor and teaching asked us all to remain as one, John 17:20-22.
Sadly their are now over 30,000 Christian sects and growing exponentially since the Protestant Reformation in 1517. In over five hundred years ago with Martin Luther, John Calvin, Huldrych Zwingli, Thomas Cranmer, William Tyndale, Michael Servetus, Henry VIII, Desiderius Erasmus and other Renaissance enlightened Christian reformers, we have seen ten's of thousands of Christian denominations, Reformed Churches and device Christian sects propagate.

John 17:20-22, Prayer for all Christian Believers, for all to remain as one.
20 I am not asking on behalf of them alone, but also on behalf of those who will believe in Me through their message,
21 that all of them may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I am in You. May they also be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me.
22 I have given them the glory You gave Me, so that they may be one as We are one

Jeremiah 32:39
I will give them one heart and one way, so that they will always fear Me for their own good and for the good of their children after them.

John 3:17
For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through Him.

John 10:30
I and the Father are one."

John 10:38
But if I am doing them, even though you do not believe Me, believe the works themselves, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I am in the Father."

John 11:42
I knew that You always hear Me, but I say this for the benefit of the people standing here, so they may believe that You sent Me."

John 17:3
Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent.

John 17:8
For I have given them the words You gave Me, and they have received them. They knew with certainty that I came from You, and they believed that You sent Me.

John 17:11
I will no longer be in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to You. Holy Father, protect them by Your name, the name You gave Me, so that they may be one as We are one.

John 17:20
I am not asking on behalf of them alone, but also on behalf of those who will believe in Me through their message,

John 17:23
I in them and You in Me--that they may be perfectly united, so that the world may know that You sent Me and have loved them just as You have loved Me.

1 Corinthians 6:17
But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with Him in spirit.

1 John 1:3
We proclaim to you what we have seen and heard, so that you also may have fellowship with us. And this fellowship of ours is with the Father and with His Son, Jesus Christ.

I'd like to hear your Christin thoughts and Religious critique ?


May God's blessing be upon your and your family.

Sincerely and in Christian Love,
Doc110