debeda

Sorry wrong tense. Shoulda been "liked". Stupid auto correct...

debeda

Neither. I was commenting on the fact that the Russian people did not like living under c*******t rule and so would do what they could not to do so again.

son of witless

What exactly is your definition of Vlad Putin ? He is a former C*******t. He runs Russia pretty close to what the old USSR was. Perhaps we need to call him a Neo-C*******t. When ancient Civilizations fell and were later resuscitated by a remnant of their former selves, they were frequently referred to as Neo wh**evers. Neo Babylonians, Neo Assyrians, Neo Hittites. They have most of the features of their former selves, but are still separate from their former glory.

If we are to label Vlad as a Neo-C*******t , then we must be consistent with his good buddies the Democrats. I mean sure they are bad mouthing him now, but hey somebody had to take the blame for Hillary losing to the Barbarian Donald J. Trump. Vlad is a big boy. He has been around a long time. He knows the Democrats had to make him the fall guy. It's nothing personal. So what do we call the present day Democrats ?

Neo-Jackasses come to mind.

Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton

I'm not sure 'definition' would be the right word. He's something of an enigma politically, though this quote sheds a lot of light: "First and foremost we should be governed by common sense. But common sense should be based on moral principles first. And it is not possible today to have morality separated from religious values.". So he's a believer in religious morality "first and foremost".



You're way off with that one. Today's Russia looks nothing like the USSR did before it's demise. His nearly 40 year career in Russian politics has probably taught him more than most of us will ever know about political success and how it is achieved.



Which we are not. In fact, his education was in free market economics. I'm thinking he was successful as a KGB officer because he understood what was acceptable and what was not, rather than any specific 'love' for C*******m. More a pragmatist, perhaps?



I'm not so sure that Putin is 'buddies' with anyone in that sense. I think he sees them for what they are better than most Americans, after all, he survived their ideal utopia and came up smelling of roses.

How about we name them for what they are, Socialist fools?

son of witless

" So he's a believer in religious morality "first and foremost". "

I disagree. Vlad has retained the most important quality of his C*******t past. The need for absolute control over the Russian people. Vlad allows no dissension. Various political trouble makers have been murdered.

" You're way off with that one. Today's Russia looks nothing like the USSR did before it's demise. His nearly 40 year career in Russian politics has probably taught him more than most of us will ever know about political success and how it is achieved. "

I disagree for the reason I listed above.

" Which we are not. In fact, his education was in free market economics. I'm thinking he was successful as a KGB officer because he understood what was acceptable and what was not, rather than any specific 'love' for C*******m. More a pragmatist, perhaps? "

Centralized economic control was the great weakness of the old USSR. Only in espionage and the military did the Soviet system match up well with the United States. The need to tightly control the economy in order to maintain political control meant that the Soviets were doomed to always lag behind the United States in economics and technology. If not for their excellent economic espionage system the Soviets would have failed to keep pace with us in military technology. Not that they did not have equal or superior scientists to America.

Putin operates in a very similar way. He needs to keep a tight control over every aspect of Russian life. If he fails to do this he risks revolt. This in turn means he will always lack the technical innovation of America or even of the Chinese. He has removed and imprisoned any oligarchs heading the major Russian industries, if he deemed them a threat. Like Chavez in Venezuela, choosing loyalty over competence has consequences for a country.

Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton

Now, see? I used direct quotations and a brief bio to make my points. You have replied with what amounts to little more than opinion based on... What? I just don't know. Let me know when you have something a little more solid to offer...

son of witless

What are you disputing ? Do you dispute that Vlad murders political opponents ? Here is my evidence for that assertion.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/05/02/dozens-russian-deaths-cast-suspicion-vladimir-putin/100480734/

Do you dispute my assertion that Vlad so tightly controls the Russian economy that it cannot compete effectively or even cooperate effectively with the US ? Here is my evidence for that assertion.

http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/22/news/economy/russia-putin-economy-e******n-oil/index.html

Do you still assert that Vlad is a Free Market Pragmatist ?

Do you want more ?

Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton

Yes, I do "still assert that Vlad is a Free Market Pragmatist", as you put it. I never said he was your idea of political perfection. And yes, I would like to see more. I don't view USA Today and CNN as, how you say, 'reliable sources'.

son of witless

Vlad is not a good guy. I respect his intellect and guts. Compared to Obama he is very strong. He played a weak hand against our i***t ex President extremely well. However, he grew up in the C*******t System and in the KGB. He still has that mind set. He wants to put the Soviet Empire back together again. Because of that he is our enemy. It does not mean we cannot cooperate with him against such common enemies as Islamic Terrorists. We cooperated with Joe Stalin against Hitler.

I still do not understand where you get your stuff from. Putin is not a politician. He is a dictator.

I will try to find more acceptable sources to make my points. Those are not at hand at the moment. Would National Review be acceptable ? I get their physical magazine and they from time to time run articles on Putin's Russia. I have read about how Putin treats dissidents. It is an open question whether he is better or worse than the Chinese C*******ts.

S. Maturin

OK, now I can follow you and I agree..

Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton

Nothing could be further from the t***h. His only focus is on Russia, as it should be. He understands the need for a 'buffer zone' between Russia and the NATO forces, including the US. This is why he tends to try to 'annex' the smaller neighboring countries. In no way is he attempting to build a new Soviet Empire. And just to be sure, Putin is not 'our' enemy (mine or yours). He has nothing against us or our way of life. He does, however, take exception to those who think they have some right or privilege in interfering in his administration of Russia. Justifiably, that ticks him off. Wouldn't it you?

S. Maturin

Problem with Putin lies not in his caring for Russians.. but in his raw ambition to reinstate the USSR.. and that includes taking over the Balkans.

Look at that from his point of view.. his country has a small economy, the USA has retreated into the Obama shell, NATO is bumbling about like a head-struck duck, hell one could not offer more to Putin if one wished. Putin WILL take the lead... he will take the opportunity and guess what-- Nobody will do a damned thing about it. Because they cannot.

son of witless

Okay ? ? ? ? ? ? As you said to me, prove it . Don't give me your opinion, prove it. I do agree that Vlad is very pro Russian, however. He is no freedom loving Patriot. In Putin's Russia you will not find freedom. It is Vlad's way or the highway straight to jail or the grave. Maybe some Russians might just possibly object to his decisions. Maybe they might want to voice their opinions. Maybe some Ukrainians might want to remain independent of Russia. Does defending Russia mean crapping all over your weaker neighbors is okay.

Under our former College Professor President Obama Amerika fell all over itself not to offend Vlad. Not to help Poland, and the rest of Russia's neighbors stand up to it. He cancelled Bush's missile defense program and lost all leverage over Vlad.

No the best thing you can say about Putin is he is competent. He is still our enemy. It is nice that Democrats finally acknowledge that even if it is for the wrong reasons. That does not mean we cannot cooperate with Vlad when we need to. Nixon was smart enough to take advantage of the quarrel between China and the Soviets to open up relations with China. The US, Russia, and China all play each other off against one another. China and Putin are smart enough to play. We finally have a President who is as smart as them.