Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA

Opening across state lines is a good idea, but won't do that much.

son of witless

Even though we disagree, thank you for the discussion. I find it fun, but I have to tell you I do not like long replies. I would rather debate one or two or even three points per reply. I find that longer exchanges tend to take too much time and are not as readable. Now to address your current point, I totally agree with your Eminent Domain comment here. The necessity for it I understand, but like any power granted to government it will be and has been abused. And just to show you that I am not a brain dead partisan, I believe that in the past developer Donald J. Trump wrongly tried to get property condemned so he could build a parking lot in Atlantic City. He also tried to do it other places.

Now that said, the abuse of Eminent Domain cannot be compared to the outright lack of property rights in Russia. In the Trump- Atlantic City affair, Trump was defeated by a court, as he should have been. Vlad the Impaler in Russia would imprison and torture any judge stupid enough to try that with him.

The C*******t Party in China is no better than Vlad in Russia. If you anger the party they can take your property just for fun. You do have the right of a lawyer, but both you and your lawyer will be tortured in prison if you press your case too far.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

It is strange to me, how some will still defend c*******m.
and ignore the results of c*******m, and those behind C*******m.

Banking is institutionalized murder:

"As Bolshevism fastened its death grip over Russia, the parallel movement known as Globalism was gaining added momentum in the West. During this time, the Royal Institute of International Affairs (now Chatham House) was founded in London and the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) was established in New York City, with “Father of the Federal Reserve” Paul Warburg serving as CFR’s first Director. To this day, these influential “think tanks” work toward global economic and political integration. To that end, these same players set up the ‘League of Nations’ (forerunner of the United Nations) soon after the end of World War I.
"Chatham House Rules" of secrecy govern the members of both of these exclusive clubs. Membership is by invitation only. Members may discuss generalities of group meetings, but are expected to remain discreet concerning who attends the meetings and what is said.
Up until the present day, the membership roster of the CFR & Chatham has consisted of top names from politics, media, banking, business, and academia. Membership has included Finance Capitalists, C*******ts, “Neo-Conservatives”, ambitious careerists, and starry eyed academic types. The chosen few recruited by these G*******t groups often find themselves on a fast track to greater fame and fortune. Prior to the actual establishment of the CFR, these G*******ts had worked to destroy the Tsar. Today, their successors seek to destroy Putin."
Banking is institutionalized murder:
http://henrymakow.com/2014/07/banking-is-institutionalized-m.html

straightUp Loc: California

Go after any kind of fraud, absolutely, but removing state boundaries, no f@*king way. The heaviest reason why Obamacare is WORKING in California (just never seems I can say it enough) is because California has a government with the balls to stand up to corporate monopoly. As a result, there is more competition. Removing state boundaries castrates the balls... Get it?

If the red states want the competitive markets that the blue states have, they can always follow the better example and insure better markets of their own instead of allowing insurance companies to manhandle their own government, monopolize their market and then beg for access to other markets with better governments.

Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA

There is a big push for full Soviet Single Payer in California.

Either it's not working very well, or Left Coasters have a lousy view of "working".

The best reason not to have Interstate health insurance is because the lawsuit honey pots in California and other lawsuit mad states will bleed over into the other states plans.

straightUp Loc: California

Yeah, it's nice to be able to discuss. I can understand your feeling about the long replies. I would agree to a 1-3 point rule per volley. Might be harder to do than I'm thinking ;)


Aside from Vlad the Impaler being Romanian, not Russian, I'm confused about how you think c*******m was a factor in ANY ruler's policy in the 15th century.


I agree that China's government has little regard for individual rights, whether they are civil rights, property rights or human rights, so you don't have to sell me on how tyrannical the People's Republic of China is.

What I challenge is the automatic conclusion that it's because of c*******m. Try to understand that I am NOT "defending" c*******m. I *DID* say several times that I don't think c*******m is a good fit for America. So I'm not an advocate, OK? What concerns me is how the obsession with c*******m distracts us from the real threat of tyranny that is already taking over our country.

It's as if you just came downstairs to find two white guys carrying your TV out the door and they point to two black guys across the street and you start going ape-s**t about the black guys while the white guys get away. Honestly, this is exactly what's going on. Yes, China is c*******t AND tyrannical. But then, so is South Sudan in fact, it's worse than China. According to Freedom House, China scores a 15 out of 100 (the lower the number the less freedom). South Sudan scores 4 and what kind of government do they have? A Constitutional Republic.

Huh.

So... are you able to recognize the atrocities in South Sudan or is your c*******m litmus test insuring that you DON'T learn about how people in a Constitutional Republic can be oppressed by tyranny as Thomas Jefferson had warned... a century before Marx and his buddies invented c*******m?

I'm hoping you can see my point. I'm just a normal guy like you probably are... and when it comes to the REAL war that going on, I'm pretty sure you and I are on the same side, maybe without realizing it... The problem is we seem to disagree on who the other side is.

straightUp Loc: California

LOL... Well, it's not exactly Soviet, but it IS single-payer... like the system Newt Gingrich was pushing a few years back... Mitt Romney too... Several Republicans actually pushed for a single-payer system before right-wing media melted "single-payer" into the "c*******m" word, so all their followers can freak out.

SB 562 is in my opinion a good idea, but the legislators are struggling a bit with the funding aspect. Kind of like the Senate Republicans in D.C.


If the lousy view is based on the fact that cost escalation has come down and more people are covered, then sure. None of us were expecting the ACA to be perfect. Even Obama said that from the onset. But it's a start and in California it's been an improvement.


Yeah... it's usually, the patients filing the lawsuits Dave, not the providers and if the state boundaries come down, it will be a flood of Red State patients coming to Blue State providers, not the other way around.

straightUp Loc: California

That's an awesome quote. :)

straightUp Loc: California

I like Bernie... I always have. But I knew he wouldn't have a chance in the 2016 e******n. In a sense, he reminds me of Ron Paul on the other side. Both men are ahead of their time in the sense that they are ready to fight real issues but the American people just aren't ready for reality yet.

I mean c'mon... we got a TV sensationalist for a frickin' president.

Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA

No, Newt and Mitt did not push anything if the sort.Democrat love to insult Republicans by comparing then to Democrats, but I'm not buying.

Yes California was effected differently by Obamacare because they were closer to Obamacare before the law was passed because of their state Government. Californians don't desire as much Freedom as some people across the country do. As far as I'm concerned California can have Obamacare. Just don't force It on the rest of us.

There will be people going back and forth both ways to cross state lines but I suspect you'll see a lot of Californians bailing out quickly.

nwtk2007 Loc: Texas

It's working in California? I have an old friend who lives in the LA area, had obamacare. He couldn't find providers. Went back to regular insurance and has providers all over the place.

Per him, it's the stupidest thing he's ever seen. Just like Bill Clinton said.

son of witless

I acknowledge that Democracies and Capitalistic societies commit atrocities. The United States with s***ery and the way we murdered the Native Americans to get their lands are certainly examples. All human societies have those tendencies. Our Western European friends who like to slam America now, were some of the worst offenders in the second half of the 19th Century as they carved up Africa and Asia.

However, lets us stick with more modern times, the 20th and 21st Centuries. As I stated all societies and their rulers have selfish tendencies. Our founders had the wisdom to understand human nature. The structure they created set up competing power centers as the main curb to any one faction taking over. Then they put in guarantees like the Bill of Rights.

C*******t and other autocratic governments do not have guarantees or competing power centers to mitigate the tyranny of their leaders. I do not know why you bring up South Sudan. It is not an intact country. You have a civil war as a context for human tragedies. Yea that is bad, but in a disintegrating society where the goal is victory and murdering civilians is a proven way to win, I do not know why there are any other expectations.

The real comparison is between the United States and Western Europeans nations with their property rights and individual guarantees, against C*******t nations like China, Cuba, and neo C*******t Russia which have almighty Central Governments with no property rights and no individual freedom guarantees.

I suspect that even such good fellows as you and me would turn into tyrants if we we given unchecked absolute power. It is the distributed power of Capitalist Democracies against the concentrated powers of C*******t leadership. In a crisis concentrated leadership is frequently better. Democracies can be indecisive when they need to take action. Stalin tried in vain to mobilize France and Britain against Hitler and then concluded a non aggression pact with Hitler because of their pacifism and indecision.

Over long time periods of peace Capitalist Democracies out compete planned economies because no planners are that smart or free from cronyism.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

"Over long time periods of peace Capitalist Democracies out compete planned economies because no planners are that smart or free from cronyism." - son of a wise man

Yep

son of witless

Unfortunately this is not a universally accepted theory. I know many Americans and Canadians who prefer the predictability of planned economies. If you are part of the favored groups in those planned economies, such as government employees or part of the State Education apparatus, life can be amazingly good for you even as your country rots away. Declines can take a long time. Being a parasite on the body of a sick animal is what many people crave.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

"Declines can take a long time. Being a parasite on the body of a sick animal is what many people crave." - son of a wise man

I don't think parasites crave to be parasites. It is just the easy was out. Self serving; to heck with the long term results. A lack of integrity is the problem.
So we get those types that become Lawyers, Bankers and Politicians.