Russia bans Jehova Witnesses, how very Progressive of them.
Standard operating procedure for certain people on OPP.
[quote=son of witless]Standard operating procedure for certain people on OPP.[/quote
Why engage with a "witles person beyond a reasonable period who doesn't recognize the futility, the difference between what is and once upon a time? That's all.
[quote=padremike][quote=son of witless]Standard operating procedure for certain people on OPP.[/quote
Why engage with a "witles person beyond a reasonable period who doesn't recognize the futility, the difference between what is and once upon a time? That's all.[/quote]
That is right. Why engage? Why debate? Just declare the other guy stupid and yourself brilliant, declare victory, then you're done. I am intentionally specific in what I post. That way I can specifically defend what I say. You take the lazy way out. I find that to be a pattern with liberals on OPP. It is work to argue point by point. Some folks are just not up to it.
son of witless wrote:
That is right. Why engage? Why debate? Just declare the other guy stupid and yourself brilliant, declare victory, then you're done. I am intentionally specific in what I post. That way I can specifically defend what I say. You take the lazy way out. I find that to be a pattern with liberals on OPP. It is work to argue point by point. Some folks are just not up to it.
Attila The Hun I consider a liberal. There was no point in arguing/discussing a running commentary on applying American standards to Russia. Furthermore, I would rather have had a man like Putin representing American interest than Obama. Did you read last month's imprimis on Putin. Imprimis is a free publication published by Hillsdale College and easily accessible on line. Read it and if you care to continue get back with me please.
padremike wrote:
Attila The Hun I consider a liberal. There was no point in arguing/discussing a running commentary on applying American standards to Russia. Furthermore, I would rather have had a man like Putin representing American interest than Obama. Did you read last month's imprimis on Putin. Imprimis is a free publication published by Hillsdale College and easily accessible on line. Read it and if you care to continue get back with me please.
You argue like a Liberal. You defend Putin and Russia the way Liberals defended the old USSR. That makes you a Liberal in my book. You even assign me research to do instead of quoting what you wish to present or at least providing a link. How extremely Liberal of you. I decided to humor you and read a part of the article. It is longer than I need. I agree that Putin is smart, competent, strong, and has strengthened Russia. I agree that compared to an incompetent weakling like Obama, Putin has on the surface admirable strengths. I find the article glossing over his imprisoning and murdering of anyone who opposes him. Just as the Soviet system ultimately weakened itself by it's oppression, Putin's dictatorship holds Russia back. His goal of putting the Soviet Empire back together by annexing the old Soviet Republics is not good for the people of those Republics and is not good for American interests. He was aided by Obama and Obama cancelling of the American missile shield in easter Europe.
Defend him if you wish. Dismiss my arguments without addressing them, if you wish. I see both sides of Putin. You see what you want to see. You see it from an America is an imperial power, point of view. That is a Liberal mindset, that longs for a resurgent Russia to counter balance American power. I do not have a problem with American power, except when an i***t like Obama runs it.
son of witless wrote:
You argue like a Liberal. You defend Putin and Russia the way Liberals defended the old USSR. That makes you a Liberal in my book. You even assign me research to do instead of quoting what you wish to present or at least providing a link. How extremely Liberal of you. I decided to humor you and read a part of the article. It is longer than I need. I agree that Putin is smart, competent, strong, and has strengthened Russia. I agree that compared to an incompetent weakling like Obama, Putin has on the surface admirable strengths. I find the article glossing over his imprisoning and murdering of anyone who opposes him. Just as the Soviet system ultimately weakened itself by it's oppression, Putin's dictatorship holds Russia back. His goal of putting the Soviet Empire back together by annexing the old Soviet Republics is not good for the people of those Republics and is not good for American interests. He was aided by Obama and Obama cancelling of the American missile shield in easter Europe.
Defend him if you wish. Dismiss my arguments without addressing them, if you wish. I see both sides of Putin. You see what you want to see. You see it from an America is an imperial power, point of view. That is a Liberal mindset, that longs for a resurgent Russia to counter balance American power. I do not have a problem with American power, except when an i***t like Obama runs it.
You argue like a Liberal. You defend Putin and Rus... (
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And here I thought the gist of our dialogue was about Putin not allowing Jehovah's Witnesses into Russia since his conversion to Christianity (Russian Orthodox) and you thought he had no right to do that applying American standards to Russia. I do dismiss your arguments because the JW's are a cult and I'm confident he received counsel from some orthodox hierarchy to not allow their JW missionaries into Russia. In doing thus, Putin defended the faith and protected his people from a cult. I find that laudable. And I don't care what you think about this particular issue which was the original subject.
padremike wrote:
And here I thought the gist of our dialogue was about Putin not allowing Jehovah's Witnesses into Russia since his conversion to Christianity (Russian Orthodox) and you thought he had no right to do that applying American standards to Russia. I do dismiss your arguments because the JW's are a cult and I'm confident he received counsel from some orthodox hierarchy to not allow their JW missionaries into Russia. In doing thus, Putin defended the faith and protected his people from a cult. I find that laudable. And I don't care what you think about this particular issue which was the original subject.
And here I thought the gist of our dialogue was ab... (
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You have taken this discussion into a sphere I should have anticipated, but failed to do so. I do not know much about Jehovah Witnesses, but I doubt they are a cult. I see them as a Christian religion. You are saying that Vlad Putin is taking Russia back to Czarist Russia when Russian Orthodox was the official religion of that country. My point is that today it is Jehovah Witness, maybe tomorrow it is the Jews or someone else. Czarist Russia was better than the USSR, but still no shining star of a nation.
I doubt that Vlad the Impaler was protecting anyone from a cult. Your boy Vlad suffers from Joe Stalin disease. Clinically it is called paranoia. Vlad cannot abide having anyone in Russia gaining power or wealth that is not under his control. So label them a cult. Like Obamabots labeling all free speech they disagree with as h**e speech. Your boy Vladdy has Jehovah Witnesses classified in the same type of group as ISIS. Come on now. That's like calling Quakers N**is.
Putin is a strong man. Like Mussolini. He has strengthened his country, but do not rationalize his crimes. Stalin as an ally of Great Britain and the US helped defeat Hitler. That said, he was still a bastard.
son of witless wrote:
You have taken this discussion into a sphere I should have anticipated, but failed to do so. I do not know much about Jehovah Witnesses, but I doubt they are a cult. I see them as a Christian religion. You are saying that Vlad Putin is taking Russia back to Czarist Russia when Russian Orthodox was the official religion of that country. My point is that today it is Jehovah Witness, maybe tomorrow it is the Jews or someone else. Czarist Russia was better than the USSR, but still no shining star of a nation.
I doubt that Vlad the Impaler was protecting anyone from a cult. Your boy Vlad suffers from Joe Stalin disease. Clinically it is called paranoia. Vlad cannot abide having anyone in Russia gaining power or wealth that is not under his control. So label them a cult. Like Obamabots labeling all free speech they disagree with as h**e speech. Your boy Vladdy has Jehovah Witnesses classified in the same type of group as ISIS. Come on now. That's like calling Quakers N**is.
Putin is a strong man. Like Mussolini. He has strengthened his country, but do not rationalize his crimes. Stalin as an ally of Great Britain and the US helped defeat Hitler. That said, he was still a bastard.
You have taken this discussion into a sphere I sho... (
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I concede to your greater knowledge, especially and particularly in the theological arena. Of course Jehovah's Witnesses must be a Christian religion because opinion is more definitive than facts. It matters not that they believe Jesus is less than God the Father, a point that when this heresy first appeared it was soundly defeated by the entire church represented in one of the seven Ecumenical Councils. It matters not that they have t***slated and rewritten holy scripture to accommodate their own opinions either. It matters not that they have been declared a cult by practically every reputable scholar, clergy and theologian in every major Christian faith. You have set your opinion based on emotions and therefore are as qualified to address this issue as well as anyone else. You are also an expert based on your opinion opinion of Vlad the Impaler and understand his motives in defending the Russian people against traditional heretical Christian teachings. He is also against any faith that promotes homosexuality as normal, natural and healthy. I wonder how he would handle the American press that has become more a platform for the Marxist agenda than Pravda was at the heights of the old Soviet Union? Do we have a free press? He also told Obama he was a fool for promoting a Marxist agenda because it already failed Russia miserably. But, I concede to your superior knowledge and opinions and what you believe is better for the Russian people than they do. This ends our conversation.
padremike wrote:
I concede to your greater knowledge, especially and particularly in the theological arena. Of course Jehovah's Witnesses must be a Christian religion because opinion is more definitive than facts. It matters not that they believe Jesus is less than God the Father, a point that when this heresy first appeared it was soundly defeated by the entire church represented in one of the seven Ecumenical Councils. It matters not that they have t***slated and rewritten holy scripture to accommodate their own opinions either. It matters not that they have been declared a cult by practically every reputable scholar, clergy and theologian in every major Christian faith. You have set your opinion based on emotions and therefore are as qualified to address this issue as well as anyone else. You are also an expert based on your opinion opinion of Vlad the Impaler and understand his motives in defending the Russian people against traditional heretical Christian teachings. He is also against any faith that promotes homosexuality as normal, natural and healthy. I wonder how he would handle the American press that has become more a platform for the Marxist agenda than Pravda was at the heights of the old Soviet Union? Do we have a free press? He also told Obama he was a fool for promoting a Marxist agenda because it already failed Russia miserably. But, I concede to your superior knowledge and opinions and what you believe is better for the Russian people than they do. This ends our conversation.
I concede to your greater knowledge, especially an... (
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Technically all Protestant and even Catholic Churches are guilty of heresy against the Russian Orthodox Church if they operate in any Russian controlled territories. When will your boy Vlad move against them?
son of witless wrote:
Technically all Protestant and even Catholic Churches are guilty of heresy against the Russian Orthodox Church if they operate in any Russian controlled territories. When will your boy Vlad move against them?
I just knew you'd be the type of little boy who would need to show your ass with having to have the last word. So I'll do the same. FYI there have been many other protestant and Roman Churches in Russia for eons but they were not considered a cult like the Jehovah's Witnesses. You lack a certain quality of character that even Putin seems to possess more than you. It's called balance. Perhaps if you were as concerned with the huge problems we have here in America brought to us in spades with the advent of Marxism, the Marxism Russia rejected, and let the Russians deal with their own problems we wouldn't be in danger of losing our republic. And where did Marxism first begin to attack America? It was by intentionally diminishing and denigrating the spiritual traditions of America. Do you remember Madeline Murray Ohara and the taking of prayer out of school. Once schools celebrated Easter and Christmas vacations and now it's Spring break and Winter break. I don't have to tell you, if you're the least bit observant, how the Christian faith is constantly attacked in America. It is no accident and today the general public celebrates homosexual marriage and 61 million occasions of legally murdering unborn children. And it's going to get worse. Therefore, if Putin, regardless of what we may believe about him, wants to insure traditional Christian values for Russia and her people it's none of our damn business. One of the reasons he's in Syria was to provide cover for the Syrian Orthodox Church, an extremely old Christian communion, which was being persecuted by ISIS. Obama stood by pissing yellow lines in the sand doing not a single damn thing while thousands of Orthodox Christians were martyred. We've got enough to worry and be concerned with at home than with Putin kicking a cult out of his country. I'm sure you will agree!
padremike wrote:
I just knew you'd be the type of little boy who would need to show your ass with having to have the last word. So I'll do the same. FYI there have been many other protestant and Roman Churches in Russia for eons but they were not considered a cult like the Jehovah's Witnesses. You lack a certain quality of character that even Putin seems to possess more than you. It's called balance. Perhaps if you were as concerned with the huge problems we have here in America brought to us in spades with the advent of Marxism, the Marxism Russia rejected, and let the Russians deal with their own problems we wouldn't be in danger of losing our republic. And where did Marxism first begin to attack America? It was by intentionally diminishing and denigrating the spiritual traditions of America. Do you remember Madeline Murray Ohara and the taking of prayer out of school. Once schools celebrated Easter and Christmas vacations and now it's Spring break and Winter break. I don't have to tell you, if you're the least bit observant, how the Christian faith is constantly attacked in America. It is no accident and today the general public celebrates homosexual marriage and 61 million occasions of legally murdering unborn children. And it's going to get worse. Therefore, if Putin, regardless of what we may believe about him, wants to insure traditional Christian values for Russia and her people it's none of our damn business. One of the reasons he's in Syria was to provide cover for the Syrian Orthodox Church, an extremely old Christian communion, which was being persecuted by ISIS. Obama stood by pissing yellow lines in the sand doing not a single damn thing while thousands of Orthodox Christians were martyred. We've got enough to worry and be concerned with at home than with Putin kicking a cult out of his country. I'm sure you will agree!
I just knew you'd be the type of little boy who w... (
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Putin is ex KGB. During the Soviet era the KGB were obsessed with Jehovah Witnesses. Do you have a clue why? It was not because of the false reason you give for Vladimir Putin's current oppression of them, because the Soviets could not have cared less about heresy against the Russian Orthodox Church. It was because Jehovah Witnesses represented dissent. They still represent dissent.
I have not figured out why you have used American Marxism as an argument against me. If you were at all familiar with me on OPP you would know that I constantly rail against Marxism. I am intimately familiar with it and it's evils. I have argued with Marxists for decades on line. The ones who scare me are the ones who don't even know that they are Marxists. The hardcore Marxists with their dialectic materialism are the most honest debaters you will find any where.
Putin is an ex C*******t. The ex is silent and almost invisible. As far as your argument about letting Russia rule Russia. No ! In China they murder and oppress religious minorities that I would object to on religious grounds , but I would still defend those religious minorities. In Cuba the Castros torture and murder dissenters. I don't care whether they are Cultists, Christians, or Atheists. I support them. I see no difference with them and the Jehova Witnesses in Russia.
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